Losing Hope In The Hobby

[Molasses]

Hello FishLore,

I really don't know why I'm burdening you all with this, but I just have some stuff to get off my chest about the hobby. First, I love fishkeeping. It's a hobby I stumbled into randomly through YouTube over 2 years ago, and I've been fully indulged in it since then. I've had 3 tanks up at any given time, and I've spent thousands of dollars and what feels like hundreds of hours researching and learning about it. I'm looking back on these 2 years, and I have virtually nothing to show for it.

Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong for me. I've lost a dozen rainbowfish to an unknown disease in an established tank, I've had to take back 10 African Cichlid peacocks to the store for no credit after they started fighting each other to the death despite all the different techniques the LFS told me to do to prevent it. I've lost some of my favorite fish (Gourami & Angelfish) to finrot in an aquarium with less than 20 nitrates and no other bad chemicals. I've had 3 different plecos and roughly 40 schooling fish of mixed species die within a week of purchasing despite acclimating them carefully for hours without a trace, and no store credit. I've had to take back numerous fish that were deemed "compatible" with my tanks due to aggression and fighting for no store credit. I've even had a school of neon tetras chase and kill each other for no apparent reason.

Just recently I tried my hand with planted tanks and a fish that was deemed "plant safe" destroyed them. I then took it back for, you guessed it, no store credit! I replaced it with a community tank and replanted the tank. I bought fancy new lights and made sure to buy "easy" plants like anubias, swords, and java fern. I spent even more to get liquid fertilizer and root tabs, to ensure nothing went wrong, and now my plants are starting to turn black and yellow. On top of that, one of my neons randomly got ich AFTER quarantine (of course!), and that cross-contaminated to ALL of my tanks, and now I've been treating it for the past week as my plants continue to die.

I don't mean to sound stuck up or spoiled about any of this, but I feel like no matter what I do, no matter how much I research and prepare, I always fail in this hobby. I have dumped so much passion and money into this hobby only for it to all go wrong fast no matter what kind of stocking I have. The only setup that ever worked for me was my current South American Cichlid tank, but now they're all ich infested due to my other tank. I know I have myself to blame for some of my misfortune, and some of it is also on my LFS at times, but most of it is just pure dumb bad luck as far as I can tell.

If anybody's going to ask, my parameters are consistently 0-0-20, and my nitrates never get past 40. My pH is high, but consistent at 7.8 all of the time. A part of me feels like there's SOMETHING wrong with my setups that makes me fail so often, but I'm starting to run out of hope and money that I'm willing to continue to waste. I love fishkeeping so much, but it does not love me back. I'm not sure what I'm looking to get from all of you, but I hope at least somebody has something helpful to say that might be able to steer me back on track. Because right now, I think I'm close to quitting.

 

[MonsterGar]

I hope you get rid of the ick.

 

[NotSoAggressiveAquatics]

Hello FishLore,

I really don't know why I'm burdening you all with this, but I just have some stuff to get off my chest about the hobby. First, I love fishkeeping. It's a hobby I stumbled into randomly through YouTube over 2 years ago, and I've been fully indulged in it since then. I've had 3 tanks up at any given time, and I've spent thousands of dollars and what feels like hundreds of hours researching and learning about it. I'm looking back on these 2 years, and I have virtually nothing to show for it.

Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong for me. I've lost a dozen rainbowfish to an unknown disease in an established tank, I've had to take back 10 African Cichlid peacocks to the store for no credit after they started fighting each other to the death despite all the different techniques the LFS told me to do to prevent it. I've lost some of my favorite fish (Gourami & Angelfish) to finrot in an aquarium with less than 20 nitrates and no other bad chemicals. I've had 3 different plecos and roughly 40 schooling fish of mixed species die within a week of purchasing despite acclimating them carefully for hours without a trace, and no store credit. I've had to take back numerous fish that were deemed "compatible" with my tanks due to aggression and fighting for no store credit. I've even had a school of neon tetras chase and kill each other for no apparent reason.

Just recently I tried my hand with planted tanks and a fish that was deemed "plant safe" destroyed them. I then took it back for, you guessed it, no store credit! I replaced it with a community tank and replanted the tank. I bought fancy new lights and made sure to buy "easy" plants like anubias, swords, and java fern. I spent even more to get liquid fertilizer and root tabs, to ensure nothing went wrong, and now my plants are starting to turn black and yellow. On top of that, one of my neons randomly got ich AFTER quarantine (of course!), and that cross-contaminated to ALL of my tanks, and now I've been treating it for the past week as my plants continue to die.

I don't mean to sound stuck up or spoiled about any of this, but I feel like no matter what I do, no matter how much I research and prepare, I always fail in this hobby. I have dumped so much passion and money into this hobby only for it to all go wrong fast no matter what kind of stocking I have. The only setup that ever worked for me was my current South American Cichlid tank, but now they're all ich infested due to my other tank. I know I have myself to blame for some of my misfortune, and some of it is also on my LFS at times, but most of it is just pure dumb bad luck as far as I can tell.

If anybody's going to ask, my parameters are consistently 0-0-20, and my nitrates never get past 40. My pH is high, but consistent at 7.8 all of the time. A part of me feels like there's SOMETHING wrong with my setups that makes me fail so often, but I'm starting to run out of hope and money that I'm willing to continue to waste. I love fishkeeping so much, but it does not love me back. I'm not sure what I'm looking to get from all of you, but I hope at least somebody has something helpful to say that might be able to steer me back on track. Because right now, I think I'm close to quitting.

Fish keeping is in my opinion the most rewarding but also the most difficult. This hobby is basically one thing in my opinion. Trial and error. It might take you a little while longer to figure out that balance of what works and what doesnt. But if there is one thing I want you to know is that later if you decide to stop keeping fish you will regret it. Every time I’ve given up on something because I thought it was hard or to much I regretted it a couple days later. I hope you do decide to stay in the hobby and you will find that perfect thing for you

 

[AvalancheDave]

Are you using a liquid carbon/"liquid CO2" product such as Excel?

Nitrogen is the only major nutrient cycle we routinely measure. Carbon and phosphorous are the others. High levels of dissolved organic carbon can cause fin rot and other diseases while ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate look fine.

QT doesn't guarantee disease-free fish. They can carry ich and many other things asymptomatically.

 

[EdieBadedie]

Hello FishLore,

I really don't know why I'm burdening you all with this, but I just have some stuff to get off my chest about the hobby. First, I love fishkeeping. It's a hobby I stumbled into randomly through YouTube over 2 years ago, and I've been fully indulged in it since then. I've had 3 tanks up at any given time, and I've spent thousands of dollars and what feels like hundreds of hours researching and learning about it. I'm looking back on these 2 years, and I have virtually nothing to show for it.

Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong for me. I've lost a dozen rainbowfish to an unknown disease in an established tank, I've had to take back 10 African Cichlid peacocks to the store for no credit after they started fighting each other to the death despite all the different techniques the LFS told me to do to prevent it. I've lost some of my favorite fish (Gourami & Angelfish) to finrot in an aquarium with less than 20 nitrates and no other bad chemicals. I've had 3 different plecos and roughly 40 schooling fish of mixed species die within a week of purchasing despite acclimating them carefully for hours without a trace, and no store credit. I've had to take back numerous fish that were deemed "compatible" with my tanks due to aggression and fighting for no store credit. I've even had a school of neon tetras chase and kill each other for no apparent reason.

Just recently I tried my hand with planted tanks and a fish that was deemed "plant safe" destroyed them. I then took it back for, you guessed it, no store credit! I replaced it with a community tank and replanted the tank. I bought fancy new lights and made sure to buy "easy" plants like anubias, swords, and java fern. I spent even more to get liquid fertilizer and root tabs, to ensure nothing went wrong, and now my plants are starting to turn black and yellow. On top of that, one of my neons randomly got ich AFTER quarantine (of course!), and that cross-contaminated to ALL of my tanks, and now I've been treating it for the past week as my plants continue to die.

I don't mean to sound stuck up or spoiled about any of this, but I feel like no matter what I do, no matter how much I research and prepare, I always fail in this hobby. I have dumped so much passion and money into this hobby only for it to all go wrong fast no matter what kind of stocking I have. The only setup that ever worked for me was my current South American Cichlid tank, but now they're all ich infested due to my other tank. I know I have myself to blame for some of my misfortune, and some of it is also on my LFS at times, but most of it is just pure dumb bad luck as far as I can tell.

If anybody's going to ask, my parameters are consistently 0-0-20, and my nitrates never get past 40. My pH is high, but consistent at 7.8 all of the time. A part of me feels like there's SOMETHING wrong with my setups that makes me fail so often, but I'm starting to run out of hope and money that I'm willing to continue to waste. I love fishkeeping so much, but it does not love me back. I'm not sure what I'm looking to get from all of you, but I hope at least somebody has something helpful to say that might be able to steer me back on track. Because right now, I think I'm close to quitting.

I have been exactly where you are. I started a 55 gallon, the biggest I ever dared to go, and it was a complete disaster (ich, plant death, invasive hitchhikers, mass deaths), and continues to have issues. It felt like it gave me more grief than anything else. The only thing to get me out of the funk was just to do everything I could to save the fish and take a break. Just kept the tank as is, didn't add anything, didn't re scape, didn't do a darn thing. I went from 3 tanks to 2, and that helped me a lot. After a few months, I began to just enjoy the fish I had. Now, it is finally somewhat stable (still have issues with the stand, but the fish themselves are good), and I am much happier. After 6 months, I am trying live plants again, and if they die, that is okay. Trial and error!
I don't think there is enough emphasis on how stressful this hobby can be! SO much can go wrong, and the problems can be hard to fix. It is okay to be frustrated, to want to quit, and to take a break.
For actual advice, I would try and get fish from somewhere else, maybe order online, but that can be a headache too. Don't set yourself up to have a perfect tank, perfect fish, and no issues.

 

[BigManAquatics]

Sometimes i think people dive in too fast, too soon. Doesn't take a lot to go wrong to get overwhelmed emotionally and financially. And there does seem to be a big part of a lot of it where luck comes into play. Sometimes people just need to step back or cut way down. Sounds like you are at a point for that. Hobbies are supposed to be fun distractions but if you get no joy or satisfaction from it anymore...is it worth it?

 

[BWIT]

I’m really sorry about the issues you are having. What is the longest you’ve had a single tank running? I have also been in it for two years and I am on my third tank. With each tank setup, I went to so much trouble each time. The 55 (my second) was the worst. I had Columnaris in the tank that seemed like it would never go away. It took me at least two months to get rid of it. Also a gourami had a seriously weird parasite or something. When it died, it looked like something was growing in his belly to where he almost burst open. I still have a photo of if you’re interestedNot to mention this was my second 55 gallon. On the first one, I had just finished cycling. The morning of the day I had planned on to go get fish, I came downstairs and the tank had cracked and was half empty. Some say it was half full, but it looked half empty to me.

On my 90 gallon, I went through two Oscars. Both died. One I tried so hard to keep it alive but nature took its course. The third Oscar, the one I currently have, got really severe ich within a few days of having him. When you look up pictures of ich, you see some pretty severe cases. This was worse. I did daily water changes, applied Ich-X and aquarium salt and in five days, he was better. That was less than two weeks ago. Now I am dealing with hair algae in the tank On the plus side, my 55 is doing great! I just have to focus on the 90 at this point.

Aquarium troubles can be the most stressful thing and there were a few times where I was almost brought to tears from the stress and wanted to give up. I know hearing about my troubles doesn’t help your situation, but I guess just to let you know that you’re not alone.

 

[Molasses]

Fish keeping is in my opinion the most rewarding but also the most difficult. This hobby is basically one thing in my opinion. Trial and error. It might take you a little while longer to figure out that balance of what works and what doesnt. But if there is one thing I want you to know is that later if you decide to stop keeping fish you will regret it. Every time I’ve given up on something because I thought it was hard or to much I regretted it a couple days later. I hope you do decide to stay in the hobby and you will find that perfect thing for you

Thanks. Trust me, I don't want to quit over things not working. It's more so the toll it's taking on me mentally seeing so many animals die or suffer under my watch, and it's also taking a toll on me financially. I appreciate the advice though, I hope it does end up working out, but I don't know how much longer I can go.

Are you using a liquid carbon/"liquid CO2" product such as Excel?

Nitrogen is the only major nutrient cycle we routinely measure. Carbon and phosphorous are the others. High levels of dissolved organic carbon can cause fin rot and other diseases while ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate look fine.

QT doesn't guarantee disease-free fish. They can carry ich and many other things asymptomatically.

No, I've only used Easy Green.

I’m really sorry about the issues you are having. What is the longest you’ve had a single tank running? I have also been in it for two years and I am on my third tank. With each tank setup, I went to so much trouble each time. The 55 (my second) was the worst. I had Columnaris in the tank that seemed like it would never go away. It took me at least two months to get rid of it. Also a gourami had a seriously weird parasite or something. When it died, it looked like something was growing in his belly to where he almost burst open. I still have a photo of if you’re interestedNot to mention this was my second 55 gallon. On the first one, I had just finished cycling. The morning of the day I had planned on to go get fish, I came downstairs and the tank had cracked and was half empty. Some say it was half full, but it looked half empty to me.

On my 90 gallon, I went through two Oscars. Both died. One I tried so hard to keep it alive but nature took its course. The third Oscar, the one I currently have, got really severe ich within a few days of having him. When you look up pictures of ich, you see some pretty severe cases. This was worse. I did daily water changes, applied Ich-X and aquarium salt and in five days, he was better. That was less than two weeks ago. Now I am dealing with hair algae in the tank On the plus side, my 55 is doing great! I just have to focus on the 90 at this point.

Aquarium troubles can be the most stressful thing and there were a few times where I was almost brought to tears from the stress and wanted to give up. I know hearing about my troubles doesn’t help your situation, but I guess just to let you know that you’re not alone.

I'm sorry you've had struggles too. Thanks for sharing. The longest tank I've had set up is my 29g starter tank for 2 years. I just recently emptied its stock and I'm looking to take it down. My other tanks are a 55g that have the planted tank issues and the community fish, and my 75g tank is my South American Cichlid tank. That one was actually doing well up until the ich outbreak.

 

[Mandy627]

Hello FishLore,

I really don't know why I'm burdening you all with this, but I just have some stuff to get off my chest about the hobby. First, I love fishkeeping. It's a hobby I stumbled into randomly through YouTube over 2 years ago, and I've been fully indulged in it since then. I've had 3 tanks up at any given time, and I've spent thousands of dollars and what feels like hundreds of hours researching and learning about it. I'm looking back on these 2 years, and I have virtually nothing to show for it.

Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong for me. I've lost a dozen rainbowfish to an unknown disease in an established tank, I've had to take back 10 African Cichlid peacocks to the store for no credit after they started fighting each other to the death despite all the different techniques the LFS told me to do to prevent it. I've lost some of my favorite fish (Gourami & Angelfish) to finrot in an aquarium with less than 20 nitrates and no other bad chemicals. I've had 3 different plecos and roughly 40 schooling fish of mixed species die within a week of purchasing despite acclimating them carefully for hours without a trace, and no store credit. I've had to take back numerous fish that were deemed "compatible" with my tanks due to aggression and fighting for no store credit. I've even had a school of neon tetras chase and kill each other for no apparent reason.

Just recently I tried my hand with planted tanks and a fish that was deemed "plant safe" destroyed them. I then took it back for, you guessed it, no store credit! I replaced it with a community tank and replanted the tank. I bought fancy new lights and made sure to buy "easy" plants like anubias, swords, and java fern. I spent even more to get liquid fertilizer and root tabs, to ensure nothing went wrong, and now my plants are starting to turn black and yellow. On top of that, one of my neons randomly got ich AFTER quarantine (of course!), and that cross-contaminated to ALL of my tanks, and now I've been treating it for the past week as my plants continue to die.

I don't mean to sound stuck up or spoiled about any of this, but I feel like no matter what I do, no matter how much I research and prepare, I always fail in this hobby. I have dumped so much passion and money into this hobby only for it to all go wrong fast no matter what kind of stocking I have. The only setup that ever worked for me was my current South American Cichlid tank, but now they're all ich infested due to my other tank. I know I have myself to blame for some of my misfortune, and some of it is also on my LFS at times, but most of it is just pure dumb bad luck as far as I can tell.

If anybody's going to ask, my parameters are consistently 0-0-20, and my nitrates never get past 40. My pH is high, but consistent at 7.8 all of the time. A part of me feels like there's SOMETHING wrong with my setups that makes me fail so often, but I'm starting to run out of hope and money that I'm willing to continue to waste. I love fishkeeping so much, but it does not love me back. I'm not sure what I'm looking to get from all of you, but I hope at least somebody has something helpful to say that might be able to steer me back on track. Because right now, I think I'm close to quitting.

Unfortunately I think your LFS not giving you credit is more of a problem than anything. Sorry you have had a such a hard time. I feel your pain, the first couple years oh hobby I was where you are now. First lesson to be learned is never listen to LFS about stocking/fish care and "tips for aggression". Their job is to sell fish and make store money, not make sure everybody has a perfect/peaceful tank. Community tanks are often described as "easy" , but when you keep labyrinth fish like guarami, it starts to get sticky because personalities of fish are different than expected sometimes. Lesson two would be buying fish too often, and replacing those we lost too soon. It's hard to get a balanced ecosystem if it was created in a couple months. I just think it's a shame that your LFS hasn't given you any store credit after spending so much money in store. Not sure if you have other options, but I would look elsewhere even if it's further away

 

[ProudPapa]

I'm sorry it's not going well, and can certainly understand why you're getting frustrated. I'd suggest cutting back to one tank for a while. Get that one dialed in and working well, then decide if you're ready for another one.

 

[Fisch]

Are you using a liquid carbon/"liquid CO2" product such as Excel?

Nitrogen is the only major nutrient cycle we routinely measure. Carbon and phosphorous are the others. High levels of dissolved organic carbon can cause fin rot and other diseases while ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate look fine.

QT doesn't guarantee disease-free fish. They can carry ich and many other things asymptomatically.

Also, look at Deficiency List for Plants | Aquarium Plants Forum | 168302
I used Flourish and root tabs beside Excel (for Staghorn algea), and my plants started dieing at an alarming speed.
Changes to Thrive as I had a Nitrogen deficiency, and now after four weeks everything is green and growing.

 

[Molasses]

Unfortunately I think your LFS not giving you credit is more of a problem than anything. Sorry you have had a such a hard time. I feel your pain, the first couple years oh hobby I was where you are now. First lesson to be learned is never listen to LFS about stocking/fish care and "tips for aggression". Their job is to sell fish and make store money, not make sure everybody has a perfect/peaceful tank. Community tanks are often described as "easy" , but when you keep labyrinth fish like guarami, it starts to get sticky because personalities of fish are different than expected sometimes. Lesson two would be buying fish too often, and replacing those we lost too soon. It's hard to get a balanced ecosystem if it was created in a couple months. I just think it's a shame that your LFS hasn't given you any store credit after spending so much money in store. Not sure if you have other options, but I would look elsewhere even if it's further away

Thanks for your thoughts. I probably do work too fast to make things work out. I don't change things so fast that it causes ammonia spikes, but it is definitely often. I should clarify it's not solely the LFS that does this. It's also all of the online articles and media, whether it be FishLore, YouTubers, or other sites that tell me it's safe to do something and then it fails more often than not. I didn't mean to bash my LFS because they're actually pretty knowledgeable and care for their fish, but they have given me poor advice at times. I have two other LFS's nearby as well but their fish aren't the best of quality. Still better than a PetSmart or Petco though.

Also, look at Deficiency List for Plants | Aquarium Plants Forum | 168302

I used Flourish and root tabs beside Excel (for Staghorn algea), and my plants started dieing at an alarming speed.
Changes to Thrive as I had a Nitrogen deficiency, and now after four weeks everything is green and growing.

Yeah, I use Thrive for my root tabs. Doesn't seem to be helping me right now.

 

[DuaneV]

Im going with Betta'sAnonymous idea. Ive been keeping fish my entire life. 44 years. I was born in a house that had a 220, a 125 and a few 55's. All my childhood memories revolve around watching those tanks. There are pics of me at a year old standing in front of the 220 and watching our Bala Sharks. Ive never been without a tank. Right now Im only running 7 tanks, and its the fewest Ive ever had going at one time. I had a period of 2 years where my only source of income was breeding and selling Guppies and Oscars. I had 40 tanks running in my basement during that time.

Ive gotten many people into the hobby over the years and some of them have had similar stories to yours. One buddy of mine dove in head-first, got a 75 gallon and started filling it. He had fish dying left and right. All he was interested in was large fish: Oscars, Jack Dempseys, Jaguars, Bala Sharks, Tiger Barbs, Convicts, Pacu and even Piranhas (which are illegal here but he went out of state to get because he thought they were "cool"). That tank ALWAYS had someone dying, someone sick, someone killing others, etc. No matter what I told him he wouldnt listen. He ONLY listened to the people at the pet shop even when I tried to tell him it was their job to sell fish and how did he know what their experience level was. He never came around and after a couple years of having multiple large tanks with all sorts of fish, he got rid of everything. I was just talking to him a couple days ago and he said he has never had fish since then (20 years ago). I actually felt bad for him.

I dont know, maybe Im rambling here, but I think you might try cutting back a LOT and starting out a little. Get a nice 20 gallon running with some simple fish. A large school of Guppies or easy Tetras (Ive NEVER seen or heard of Neons attacking one another). Also, I would take whatever the fish store people say with a grain of salt. They are NOT the end all/be all to the hobby. Places like this are great because people have REAL experience. People on Youtube are worse than aquarium shops in my opinion, because if they arent getting views they arent making money. I dont watch ANYONE on youtube for this reason.

Talk to some people with real experience. See if theres an aquarium club in your area. Hang out with others who have fish and have been keeping fish. And lastly, research, research, research with people who have real experience.

Good luck with whatever you choose to do, but I think throwing in the towel completely would be a real shame.

 

[Mandy627]

Thanks for your thoughts. I probably do work too fast to make things work out. I don't change things so fast that it causes ammonia spikes, but it is definitely often. I should clarify it's not solely the LFS that does this. It's also all of the online articles and media, whether it be FishLore, YouTubers, or other sites that tell me it's safe to do something and then it fails more often than not. I didn't mean to bash my LFS because they're actually pretty knowledgeable and care for their fish, but they have given me poor advice at times. I have two other LFS's nearby as well but their fish aren't the best of quality. Still better than a PetSmart or Petco though.

Yeah, I use Thrive for my root tabs. Doesn't seem to be helping me right now.

The plants you have prefer getting most of their nutrients out of water column, which is why anubias likes rhizome exposed and java fern can grow on anything... I dont even think you need root tabs in my opinion. Maybe 1 or 2 in tank but I learned early on that in some cases it's not necessary unless you have high tech/ fussy plants. Also, I'm dying to know what fish ate your plants that you were told was safe??

 

[Molasses]

Im going with Betta'sAnonymous idea. Ive been keeping fish my entire life. 44 years. I was born in a house that had a 220, a 125 and a few 55's. All my childhood memories revolve around watching those tanks. There are pics of my at 1 year old standing in front of the 220 and watching our Bala Sharks. Ive never been without a tank. Right now Im only running 7 tanks, and its the fewest Ive ever had going at one time. I had a period of 2 years where my only source of income was breeding and selling Guppies and Oscars. I had 40 tanks running in my basement during that time.

Ive gotten many people into the hobby over the years and some of them have had similar stories to yours. One buddy of mine dove in head-first, got a 75 gallon and started filling it. He had fish dying left and right. All he was interested in was large fish: Oscars, Jack Dempseys, Jaguars, Bala Sharks, Tiger Barbs, Convicts, Pacu and even Piranhas (which are illegal here but he went out of state to get because he thought they were "cool"). That tank ALWAYS had someone dying, someone sick, someone killing others, etc. No matter what I told him he wouldnt listen. He ONLY listened to the people at the pet shop even when I tried to tell him it was their job to sell fish and how did he know what their experience level was. He never came around and after a couple years of having multiple large tanks with all sorts of fish, he got rid of everything. I was just talking to him a couple days ago and he said he has never had fish since then. I actually felt bad for him.

I dont know, maybe Im rambling here, but I think you might try cutting back a LOT and starting out a little. Get a nice 20 gallon running with some simple fish. A large school of Guppies or easy Tetras (Ive NEVER seen or heard of Neons attacking one another). Also, I would take whatever the fish store people say with a grain of salt. They are NOT the end all/be all to the hobby. Places like this are great because people have REAL experience. People on Youtube are worse than aquarium shops in my opinion, because if they arent getting views they arent making money. I dont watch ANYONE on youtube for this reason.

Talk to some people with real experience. See if theres an aquarium club in your area. Hang out with others who have fish and have been keeping fish. And lastly, research, research, research with people who have real experience.

Good luck with whatever you choose to do, but I think throwing in the towel completely would be a real shame.

Thank you. Wow, 44 years. That's awesome. Like I replied to somebody else, I should restate that I do NOT get my info from just the LFS. I've spent countless hours on all sorts of platforms like here on FishLore. My bigger gripe with them is they never gave me store credit. Also, I don't think the root of the issue is the type of fish I'm keeping. Before ich cross-contaminated my 75g, I've had big fish in there (Severum, Blood Parrot, Convict, & a Festivum) all living in harmony with no algae issues or fighting. I hope I can get it back to that point but they're hit pretty hard. I guess it was just a bummer seeing something that actually worked out for me end up turning sour. I've actually had more issues with those 20g simple fish than these bigger fish. Don't know why.

I do think you're right about cutting back though. I've already started the process of taking down one of my tanks. Thanks for your wisdom!

The plants you have prefer getting most of their nutrients out of water column, which is why anubias likes rhizome exposed and java fern can grow on anything... I dont even think you need root tabs in my opinion. Maybe 1 or 2 in tank but I learned early on that in some cases it's not necessary unless you have high tech/ fussy plants. Also, I'm dying to know what fish ate your plants that you were told was safe??

I forgot to mention I have crypts in there as well. I use the tabs for those and the swords. The crypts are doing fine but not the swords. I use my Aquarium Co-Op Easy Green for the water column feeding plants. The fish that destroyed my plants was a gold gourami.

 

[BlackOsprey]

Aquatic pet health is a total crapshoot. It's probably the single most unpredictable and inconsistent factor of fishkeeping that I have dealt with, and it accounts for the majority of lost money on my part. It's something I've kind of come to expect: fish die for no apparent reason, or reasons we can't really help even if we knew about them. A lot of species are really weakened either by wild capture or inbreeding, and the latter reason is why I refuse to own betta fish anymore. Stupid things die if you look at em funny.

It's a bit odd to say, but I think the fishkeeping aspect can be kind of overrated in the aquarium hobby, and it causes no small amount of grief for a lot of people. I think there's something to be gained by taking a step back from the animal-keeping aspect to focus on other things.

I've personally found that fish and other animals do much better in planted tanks, and that planted tanks do much better when you don't stock them right away. Planted tanks have their own ups and downs (I've had to toss amazing moss formations due to hair algae, it was heartbreaking) but they tend to be a lot less luck-based than fish health. Far more stable too, they generally won't randomly die on you. I've found methods that consistently yield good results, and that has allowed me to create some nice planted tanks that I am proud of.

I still keep fish though. It doesn't always work out. I've wasted a lot of money on trying to keep panda cories, for example. I've kind of accepted that they aren't for me, and that's fine. I've still got other things that are working alright.

Success in aquariums isn't contingent on fish survivability alone. Were that the case, I'd have quit a long time ago. And sometimes taking fish out of the equation can make aquarium keeping a lot less stressful and more enjoyable. I'd recommend you try out naturalistic planted tanks, maybe start with a very small one using the Walstad method as a test project. I've always had more success with starting one up using nutrient rich soil than any root tab or liquid fert.

 

[Bettybrown922]

Hello FishLore,

I really don't know why I'm burdening you all with this, but I just have some stuff to get off my chest about the hobby. First, I love fishkeeping. It's a hobby I stumbled into randomly through YouTube over 2 years ago, and I've been fully indulged in it since then. I've had 3 tanks up at any given time, and I've spent thousands of dollars and what feels like hundreds of hours researching and learning about it. I'm looking back on these 2 years, and I have virtually nothing to show for it.

Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong for me. I've lost a dozen rainbowfish to an unknown disease in an established tank, I've had to take back 10 African Cichlid peacocks to the store for no credit after they started fighting each other to the death despite all the different techniques the LFS told me to do to prevent it. I've lost some of my favorite fish (Gourami & Angelfish) to finrot in an aquarium with less than 20 nitrates and no other bad chemicals. I've had 3 different plecos and roughly 40 schooling fish of mixed species die within a week of purchasing despite acclimating them carefully for hours without a trace, and no store credit. I've had to take back numerous fish that were deemed "compatible" with my tanks due to aggression and fighting for no store credit. I've even had a school of neon tetras chase and kill each other for no apparent reason.

Just recently I tried my hand with planted tanks and a fish that was deemed "plant safe" destroyed them. I then took it back for, you guessed it, no store credit! I replaced it with a community tank and replanted the tank. I bought fancy new lights and made sure to buy "easy" plants like anubias, swords, and java fern. I spent even more to get liquid fertilizer and root tabs, to ensure nothing went wrong, and now my plants are starting to turn black and yellow. On top of that, one of my neons randomly got ich AFTER quarantine (of course!), and that cross-contaminated to ALL of my tanks, and now I've been treating it for the past week as my plants continue to die.

I don't mean to sound stuck up or spoiled about any of this, but I feel like no matter what I do, no matter how much I research and prepare, I always fail in this hobby. I have dumped so much passion and money into this hobby only for it to all go wrong fast no matter what kind of stocking I have. The only setup that ever worked for me was my current South American Cichlid tank, but now they're all ich infested due to my other tank. I know I have myself to blame for some of my misfortune, and some of it is also on my LFS at times, but most of it is just pure dumb bad luck as far as I can tell.

If anybody's going to ask, my parameters are consistently 0-0-20, and my nitrates never get past 40. My pH is high, but consistent at 7.8 all of the time. A part of me feels like there's SOMETHING wrong with my setups that makes me fail so often, but I'm starting to run out of hope and money that I'm willing to continue to waste. I love fishkeeping so much, but it does not love me back. I'm not sure what I'm looking to get from all of you, but I hope at least somebody has something helpful to say that might be able to steer me back on track. Because right now, I think I'm close to quitting.

If you're someone who's into reading, I have found this site absolutely invaluable. The author of the site has, admittedly, some unpopular opinions on fish keeping. But, I found his views incredibly supported by science. I think the realization that bacteria plays the biggest part in fish health has helped me tremendously. Good luck!

 

[PhillyJawn]

I think everyone whose in this hobby knows the pains you're going through. I hope they do get better for you soon!

I would also like to just say, sometimes it's okay to take a break. A lot of people in this hobby take breaks and come back, and start fresh with new ideas. It's a good refresher. I myself took a long break and got back into the hobby having learned about planted tanks. My first attempt was 7+ years ago and all the plants died cause I didnt know what I was doing.

After a lot of research, I got back into the hobby last year and have a successful basicallly self maintained planted tank.

It does take a lot of trial and error, and you learn from the failures, which is why as @AggressiveAquatics said, this can be one of the most rewarding hobbies.

 

[Mustangjenni]

I don’t think I can add much to what has already been said by people with more experience than me. I have only recently gotten into fishkeeping, and I planned to keep things nice and simple- a medium sized tank for my daughter. Things went a little sideways. I did my best - I read up about fish, I learned about planted tanks (I love gardening, so this was super exciting)... I pre-established the tank and let it sit for weeks before adding fish. The fish came with Ich. The rainbow fish like to eat the plants. I got a mix of fish that like completely different water parameters. Now I have 5 tanks ranging from a nano tank to a 50 gallon. And things are getting pretty good. I still have one fish in QT that I cannot figure out. I somehow ended up with fry in both my plant tanks. And the fish I like the most (mollies) seem to be the hardest to keep happy so far. (I’ve lost 5 in 3 months) But I have learned that despite our best efforts, we cannot control living environments. And I focus on the parts I get right, and try to work on one thing at a time instead of everything at once.
And really, take a break if you need to. But don’t get rid of your setup. Leave it so you can come back to it. Slow down and get to a place where you can sit and enjoy your fish.

 

[Pfrozen]

Are there other stores in your area? My LFS gives me a credit for fish I got somewhere else lol. honestly I would feel pretty discouraged too if I spent good money somewhere and got nothing out of it.

I kind of think there might be something in your water too tbh. a lot of those problems are strange. what area of the world are you from? I'll do a little googling for you lol. I found out a lot about my cities tap water just from looking online and there were some surprises

 

[Molasses]

Are there other stores in your area? My LFS gives me a credit for fish I got somewhere else lol. honestly I would feel pretty discouraged too if I spent good money somewhere and got nothing out of it.

I kind of think there might be something in your water too tbh. a lot of those problems are strange. what area of the world are you from? I'll do a little googling for you lol. I found out a lot about my cities tap water just from looking online and there were some surprises

I'm in the Chicagoland area. As far as I'm aware other keepers around here don't have issues with their water.

 

[Pfrozen]

I'm in the Chicagoland area. As far as I'm aware other keepers around here don't have issues with their water.

here's Chicago's most recent water quality report, some of it might surprise you. lot of big numbers

https://www.chicago.gov/content/dam/city/depts/water/WaterQltyResultsNRpts/ccReports/CCA-2020-12.pdf

 

[Aquariumlover1357]

This is kinda late, but have you maybe thought of getting just a few fish in a species only tank? If you only have, say, a betta or something, you might have an easier time taking care of it/treating any diseases that might come along. Instead of having the pressure of quite a few fish on your shoulders, maybe you should try just having one or two fish, and when you feel comfortable, and that tank's coming along pretty well, you can start up another tank again. Now, I don't know your situation or anything much about your tanks, but if I were you, this would make me feel a lot better if a tank failed but I still have another one running smoothly that I know I made well on.

The thing with community tanks is that once one fish gets some sort of disease or parasites, it takes a toll on more or less every other fish in the tank. That's super hard, and some fish doesn't have the same strong immune system as others, which leads them dying in waves, which can be stressful for the human taking care of them. I'd say to cut down on the number of fish so that it's overall easier to take care of and easier to treat any diseases and, if it come to it, easier to bear the loss of them.

Since you've already invested so much on this hobby, maybe you could keep trying, and maybe get less fish/get rid of some tanks? Anyways, I hope you're happy with whatever decision you make. I'm sure it'll be good either way!

 

[SouthAmericanCichlids]

I am really sorry to here all this happening to you. Fish keeping can be really, and I mean REALLY hard. But my advice would be. If you need a break from big tanks, take one. If they are too much work try maybe a 10g, or a couple 5g. And especially when trying a new thing, like plants. Start your first planted tank as a 5g, and then once you feel like you've mastered it, go for bigger tanks. That way, if something goes wrong, it isn't as hard of a hit. And you can try again and keep going. And I agree, ditch that fish store, they are really bad. Also from the bad advice you've been getting from them. I would ask on here, do some research, etc. Before getting fish.

No, I've only used Easy Green.

Sometimes you are naturally high in certain trace nutrients or nitrates, through your tap and in that case you should just dose certain things, there are ways to test these things. Also o newly added plants, if grown before emerged can molt and brown. Also many medication will kill plants. So I would advise, putting all your plants in 1 tank and moving the fish to others until the disease is gone. That is another reason why your plants might be blackening. I looked at the report and it says you have a high amount of natural Nitrates, so you wouldn't have to dose as much of that. I didn't look at many others, but you may want to just dose certain things. I am sure people on here could walk you through, based on that, what you need to dose.

Fishkeeping has it's ups and downs, but eventually it will be okay, you'll learn many things and be very experienced. Also if your south American cichlids tank is working, than maybe you have a particular skill with them (Probably just luck between the tanks but), come to the South American cichlids side of the Fishkeeping. It truly is great, I mean just look at GBR!

 

[AvalancheDave]

Fish keeping was a lot harder than I thought it would be. Those early years were rough...

 

[Cherryshrimp420]

It could be low KH in your water that's causing troubles. It means fluctuating pH, low buffering capacity, easy for things to go wrong....

Also, my advice is to never buy into advertisement.... All those chemicals, expensive equipment and products cause more harm than good when used without purpose....

 

[phnx314]

I think pouring your love and passion into a single tank is something that feels so different to MTS. It’s hard for me to keep up with even two tanks, and I only have so much love to give! So when I focus it all on one tank it makes it that much better and that much easier. You suddenly have the time and energy for the little things that make a big difference.

This hobby has a lot of struggles. Some people need to take breaks from it which is understandable. But, I personally would nurture your SA cichlid tank, and try something else when you’re ready.

 

[tomiyama]

Awww, don't give up Molasses! At least you didn't start like me, buying a 10 gallon fish tank with 2 African dwarf frogs for my kids with zero knowledge of the nitrogen cycle and killing both frogs in less than a week.... I was traumatized but then studied up on fishkeeping. Adopted an Oscar which came from someone who sold us his 55 gallon and he became a beloved family pet.
It's definitely not easy.... perhaps go with one tank of a hardier species that like the 7.8 ph and do not need well established tanks for the next year or so? You may have been suffering from a bit of new tank syndrome like I did where I couldn't keep a corycat alive in my 45 gallon (because corycats like well established minimum 1 year old tanks). It was very traumatic.
My local water is soft with currently a pH of 6.5. Now, one of my false julii corycats (after a disastrous year of killing several corycats within the first 6 months) is 10 years old and going strong (knock on wood). And I now have about 30 six month albino aeneus corycats when my albinos laid eggs . And this is only after I killed the first 2 batches of eggs (and after the 3rd batch where only 3 corycats hatched and made it to a year and a half old, and they died after a water change).
Fishkeeping is kind of like life, with ups and downs and the odd curveball....

 

[Fisch]

Thanks for your thoughts. I probably do work too fast to make things work out. I don't change things so fast that it causes ammonia spikes, but it is definitely often. I should clarify it's not solely the LFS that does this. It's also all of the online articles and media, whether it be FishLore, YouTubers, or other sites that tell me it's safe to do something and then it fails more often than not. I didn't mean to bash my LFS because they're actually pretty knowledgeable and care for their fish, but they have given me poor advice at times. I have two other LFS's nearby as well but their fish aren't the best of quality. Still better than a PetSmart or Petco though.

Yeah, I use Thrive for my root tabs. Doesn't seem to be helping me right now.

How long are you using it. Took 4 weeks for the liquid to kick in, everything goes bonkers in my tank except Vallinseria.

 

[Molasses]

This is kinda late, but have you maybe thought of getting just a few fish in a species only tank? If you only have, say, a betta or something, you might have an easier time taking care of it/treating any diseases that might come along. Instead of having the pressure of quite a few fish on your shoulders, maybe you should try just having one or two fish, and when you feel comfortable, and that tank's coming along pretty well, you can start up another tank again. Now, I don't know your situation or anything much about your tanks, but if I were you, this would make me feel a lot better if a tank failed but I still have another one running smoothly that I know I made well on.

The thing with community tanks is that once one fish gets some sort of disease or parasites, it takes a toll on more or less every other fish in the tank. That's super hard, and some fish doesn't have the same strong immune system as others, which leads them dying in waves, which can be stressful for the human taking care of them. I'd say to cut down on the number of fish so that it's overall easier to take care of and easier to treat any diseases and, if it come to it, easier to bear the loss of them.

Since you've already invested so much on this hobby, maybe you could keep trying, and maybe get less fish/get rid of some tanks? Anyways, I hope you're happy with whatever decision you make. I'm sure it'll be good either way!

Sound advice, thanks. I'm in the process of taking one down right now. And yeah, love South American Cichlids, see you do too haha.

I think pouring your love and passion into a single tank is something that feels so different to MTS. It’s hard for me to keep up with even two tanks, and I only have so much love to give! So when I focus it all on one tank it makes it that much better and that much easier. You suddenly have the time and energy for the little things that make a big difference.

This hobby has a lot of struggles. Some people need to take breaks from it which is understandable. But, I personally would nurture your SA cichlid tank, and try something else when you’re ready.

Yeah, I can understand that. I personally have no issues keeping up with multiple tanks in terms of work, I enjoy it. But yeah, I'll probably focus on the SA's assuming they get better.

How long are you using it. Took 4 weeks for the liquid to kick in, everything goes bonkers in my tank except Vallinseria.

I've only had the tabs in for about a week, but my plants have not responded well at all. The liquid fertilizer has been in for two weeks. I've used the Easy Green on my 75g for about 6 months and my one anubias in there has doubled in size, so there's something. I don't think the constant water changes for the disease is helping keep the fertilizer in.

 

[Aprilbeingbasic]

Sometimes I think its best to completely strip back. Stop trying to add tech and and products to get a result. What is a river? Its dirt and water. It only supports what it can, not extra. I highly recommend looking into the walstad method. Its simple, you creat a slice of nature and just let it go. I have found it relaxing to see snails and algae and larvae and instead of freaking out over everyone on the internet saying its the worst thing ever I just sit back and watch it. Everyday its changing. Had hundreds of snails last week, now I can see 10. Didnt do anything. Had murky cloudy water, did nothing, it cleared. Had dying plants, did nothing, they're coming back. Simplify