Pls assist: new fish dying

[KribensisLover1]

Tank
What is the water volume of the tank? 40 breeder
How long has the tank been running? 3 years
Does it have a filter? Yes
Does it have a heater? Yes
What is the water temperature? 77
What is the entire stocking of this tank? (Please list all fish and inverts.)
QT with 6 mollies and 25 tiny green neons
Maintenance
How often do you change the water? Weekly and I did yesterday before adding new fish
How much of the water do you change? 75 percent
What do you use to treat your water? Prime
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water? Both

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish? Yes
What do you use to test the water? Master
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.
Ammonia: tested four times; the first I had a dirty dropper (it had been used to feed brine shrimp the day before) and I shook the bottles prior and it looked up to .5. I’ve tested three times since and it’s been 0 every time.
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 10
pH:7.5

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? Daily
How much do you feed your fish? A little much for new fish but they ate it all
What brand of food do you feed your fish? NLS flakes and bug bites
Do you feed frozen? Yes yesterday brine shrimp
Do you feed freeze-dried foods? No

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? Yesterday
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? Today
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms?
So I had 10 green neons in QT for two weeks. All was fine. I got 15 more from the same tank at the same store and 6 mollies. Today I saw one dead neon and now the Mollies are being WEIRD. One was laying on the bottom but now isn’t. Two are being normal. The other four were doing this (see pics) at top near heater with the lights on. With them off two are. And one has clamped fins. I don’t think they’re gulping at the surface but one was gulping (mouth moving a lot) earlier and it might still be just not above the water. I am so confused. I worried it might be the lack of agitation (though my Python broke yesterday so I’ve not filled up to the tip top so the filter is dumping water a little) so I turned on an air stone near the top of the tank. The neons seem totally fine besides the one this am. Normally I would think it’s from adding a lot at once and my parameters shooting up but they’re actually perfect. I will say they almost look like they’re hiding and they are fighting a lot. And I feel bad but that’s also what mollies do and they’re usually still social and all over the tank. I don’t have another tank to put any in and I have an extra heater but no extra filter. I really don’t want my green neons to die or these mollies and the store is so far away if they all die to go back.

Have you started any treatment for the illness?
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase?
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all?

Explain your emergency situation in detail.
(Please give a clear explanation of what is going on, include details from the beginning of the illness leading up to now)

Include pictures

 

[RayClem]

Mollies and neons are not the best tank mates. Mollies like hard water, slight alkalinity, and a little salt. Neons like soft water that is closer to neutral or even acidic pH and no salt. Neons originally come from the waters of the Amazon in South America; mollies inhabit the tidewater swamps of Central America. Thus, they have adapated to different environments. That is not to say that they cannot live in the same tank, but getting both to thrive is going to be a delicate balancing act.

Your pH of 7.5 might work for both, but your API Master test kit does not test for hardness and alkalinity. You have to purchase an add on test kit to get those results.

Losing 1 green neon is not so unusual. The issue with the mollies is more concerning. I would suggest you find out the hardness level of your water. The mollies might settle down if you add a little aquarium salt to the water. Just be careful not to overdue it as the neons might not like it. You might check with your LFS to see if they are adding salt or minerals to the tank in which they keep the mollies. I realize that most mollies today will be farm raised rather than natural, so they might be better adapted to your water,

I used to live in Southeastern Virginia where the water was drawn from a deep aquifer. The water was very soft. I do not know anything about the city water in Baltimore.

 

[KribensisLover1]

Mollies and neons are not the best tank mates. Mollies like hard water, slight alkalinity, and a little salt. Neons like soft water that is closer to neutral or even acidic pH and no salt. Neons originally come from the waters of the Amazon in South America; mollies inhabit the tidewater swamps of Central America. Thus, they have adapated to different environments. That is not to say that they cannot live in the same tank, but getting both to thrive is going to be a delicate balancing act.

Your pH of 7.5 might work for both, but your API Master test kit does not test for hardness and alkalinity. You have to purchase an add on test kit to get those results.

Losing 1 green neon is not so unusual. The issue with the mollies is more concerning. I would suggest you find out the hardness level of your water. The mollies might settle down if you add a little aquarium salt to the water. Just be careful not to overdue it as the neons might not like it. You might check with your LFS to see if they are adding salt or minerals to the tank in which they keep the mollies. I realize that most mollies today will be farm raised rather than natural, so they might be better adapted to your water,

I used to live in Southeastern Virginia where the water was drawn from a deep aquifer. The water was very soft. I do not know anything about the city water in Baltimore.

First of all, THANK YOU!!!!!! Ok here are my tap parameters (photos below). And I just saw a molly on the tank floor—I went to scoop it out bc I was sure she was dead—and she swam away. I also got two GBR in another tank (got them yesterday) who are doing well. These mollies are bugging me out. How much salt should I add? I do need to do something! What’s funny is (and correct me if I’m wrong) the tests I posted below have half what the mollies want and half what the green neons want)! I asked the store about your questions and they said that they think they’re captive bred (not sure if that’s farm bred or store?) and that they add a little salt in the molly tanks. Their ph is 7.2. I called back and asked about green neons (like if for some reason they add salt to the green neons tanks and not just livebearers) and all the woman said was it won’t hurt the green neons to add 1 tablespoon for every five gallons. Is this what I should do? To be honest I care more about the green neons than the mollies; I don’t want anything to spread though and of course I don’t want fish to die if I can help it. But want to make sure green neons will be ok too!

 

[Blacksheep1]

Whoa ! Where did the rams come from ? impulse buy? ( we’ve all done that !) what type of

like said above by sparky you have two different tanks combined ! I thought the tetras and mollies were diff tanks. Or is this a qt? am I right in assuming all these fish came from the same store ? In which case , to me , no point qt’ing . Either treat the whole tank or don’t. If they aren’t wild caught ( which I doubt ) then you either treat the lot all at once or just do extra wc’s.

Technically , the rams and tetras will do well together , but that depends on the species of each involved. You have angels too right? Tetras , angels and rams will all appreciate the softer water , but rams and angels are a risk, aggression. Tetras and angels are a risk , expensive snacks. If large enough tetras and small enough angels it can work though.

Id personally not keep a standard mollie with tetras. Yea there’s an invetween where they’d live , but neither will thrive. They just want different water .

 

[KribensisLover1]

Whoa ! Where did the rams come from ? impulse buy? ( we’ve all done that !) what type of

like said above by sparky you have two different tanks combined ! I thought the tetras and mollies were diff tanks. Or is this a qt? am I right in assuming all these fish came from the same store ? In which case , to me , no point qt’ing . Either treat the whole tank or don’t. If they aren’t wild caught ( which I doubt ) then you either treat the lot all at once or just do extra wc’s.

Technically , the rams and tetras will do well together , but that depends on the species of each involved. You have angels too right? Tetras , angels and rams will all appreciate the softer water , but rams and angels are a risk, aggression. Tetras and angels are a risk , expensive snacks. If large enough tetras and small enough angels it can work though.

Id personally not keep a standard mollie with tetras. Yea there’s an invetween where they’d live , but neither will thrive. They just want different water .

Thank you so much for checking this out!
{By the way after writing this, I realized it’s long. if it’s too long and anybody is not wanting to read, you can skip to the bottom to the starred area bc that’s about questions about how to help them!}

explanations: I have yet another post where somebody had suggested rams as an option for the 64.8 gallon, and yes, impulse! I will say they were suggested at least (unlike my dumb impulse buy, the mollies). I just got the rams, mollies, and more green neons yesterday. I didn’t Qt the rams (for impulsive reasons—I thought they needed the high temps with the angels but forgot green neons in the qt tank would have high temps as well!). So here’s the two tank lists bc I’ve made this very confusing!

64.8 gallon: two small and docile angels, 11/12 red eye tetras, 8 koi swordtails, 6 emerald cories, 2 GBR. I panicked bc the GBR need such warm water but was told on here 80 would be ok.

Soooo here’s the other tank which presents the issue(s). 26–30 gallon flatback will have 25 green neons and 6 gold lyretail mollies. These fish only are all together now in the 40 breeder in QT. 10 green neons have been in the 40 breeder QT for two weeks and then yesterday I added 15 more green neons and the 6 mollies. Somebody else said what you said about the QT tank being fine for all the fish (old and new) together.
The store only sold mollies in pairs—I thought 4 too low and 6 too high. Point being, I wanted a bright dither fish that would bring the green neons out of hiding and also be very present and active as this tank is at my parent’s house and they want action (and it’s a black on black tank, again). IMPULSIVE! The store had some of the ideas people gave me as tankmates for the greens; tetras, pencilfish. One of the tetra tanks had ich, but there were certainly other already approved (on here) options.
The saleswoman suggested rasboras but I hadn’t seen that as an option from you all, so what do I do instead? Listen to her next suggestion of mollies—Mollies ALSO weren’t listed as an option on here! So my reasoning is not at all sound on how I came to this molly purchase. I don’t know what I was thinking.
Now somebody else did comment about the diff parameters needed by the green neons and the mollies. Now I’ll be honest, and this might make me a monster; I’ve never messed with the water parameters (making it harder or softer), so I guess I didn’t think it made a diff.? Bc I wouldn’t do anything anyway. But I didn’t know about the diff needs of the fish bc I didn’t CHECK! I did have mollies in a 20 long at that house, with that water, that I eventually rehomed.
I’m not saying I’m right—just bc I kept mollies before doesn’t make me an expert BY ANY MEANS, and I shouldn’t assume fish will adapt. So I’m all wrong here. You have a great point: they might all survive but they won’t thrive. I need to test the water at that house but I think it’s pretty similar to my house AND it won’t matter anyway bc what could suit the greens wouldn’t suit the Mollies.
I do like the mollies in general—I like how they’re social and not at all skittish. I cannot put the green neons in the 64.8 right (i know they’re too small, but even if they were larger, that tank can’t take any more fish can it?). So I need to return the mollies, right? When I called today the saleswoman said I could bring back the sick ones but I should just bring them all back shouldnt I?


*********But in the meantime (and I owe you 200 McDonald’s fries for reading this way too long monologue of self bashing) what should I do to help these fishes? I just looked and three mollies are at the heater. The lights are out the airstone is on. The temp is 78. I am very concerned for the green neons so I want to make sure they’ll be ok but a bunch of the mollies will die if I don’t do something. Should I add salt or meds? I have a lot of meds so I could have whatever you all suggest. I could do general cure or just salt. Please let me know as I feel bad for them even if I do return them! Thank you thank you thank you. *************
Edit: is 1 tablespoon of aquarium salt for every 5 gallons correct? So 8 tablespoons for a 40 breeder? I’m scared to do anything and scared to do nothing!
Edit: I did four tablespoons bc I am scared to do 8
And unplugged the airstone in case they were scared. The filter is dumping water in so that’s good.

 

[RayClem]

It has been so long since I have attempted to keep mollies that I have forgotten how much salt to add. I was never successful keeping mollies with other fish in a community tank, so I gave up on the mollies decades ago.

 

[KribensisLover1]

UPDATE: added 4 tablespoons of salt to the 40 breeder last night. 5 mollies seem good one doesn’t. Can or should I add the final 4 tablespoons!
Shall I add two more instead of four more tablespoons?
UPDATE
One died. Here’s a pic. I’m adding 2 more tblspns of aq salt for a total of 6 added for 40 gallons. One mollie is still not good. Four other mollies seem WAY better. Could it have been shock bc salt is usually added to their tanks at the store? But then why did the one die after salt was added? Did I not acclimate well?
Also I just went to add the two more tablespoons of salt and I thought it was dissolved and tossed it in and some of it was NOT. Huge rocks fell to the bottom of the tank. The neons swam to it so I covered it with sand and show a pic below . Eek. I am a mess.
ps the mollie might look bloAyed but she was not.

 

[SparkyJones]

I never had luck with mollies either, I'm assuming my GH and KH are too low for them long term. Cories don't do well for me either. Some fish just don't work out for me.

Swordtails, platies work for me, Mollies don't ever do well and eventually die off in about a month. never really totally adjusting.

 

[KribensisLover1]

I never had luck with mollies either, I'm assuming my GH and KH are too low for them long term. Cories don't do well for me either. Some fish just don't work out for me.

Swordtails, platies work for me, Mollies don't ever do well and eventually die off in about a month. never really totally adjusting.

I just can’t figure out why two would die (well one has but the other is acting like he will), two got way better, and two were never sick. They all (all five left) went nuts when I fed so that was good. I haven’t gotten new fish in a very long time (I mean I just got a ton but prior to that it’s been years) so I might just have a bad few and that’s that. But if it’s bc I didn’t add salt I would love to know! I doubt the not great conditions would kill them this quickly (like not hard water). Or would it? Could it kill the weaker ones and that’s why not all are sick? And last thing I promise: should I add the final two tablespoons of salt to the tank? To make it the one tablespoon for five gallons? Or just leave it at 6 (instead of 8). Dosed four last night and two this am. And again two are way better but one actually died but I do think the salt is maybe helping.

 

[SparkyJones]

I just can’t figure out why two would die (well one has but the other is acting like he will), two got way better, and two were never sick. They all (all five left) went nuts when I fed so that was good. I haven’t gotten new fish in a very long time (I mean I just got a ton but prior to that it’s been years) so I might just have a bad few and that’s that. But if it’s bc I didn’t add salt I would love to know! I doubt the not great conditions would kill them this quickly (like not hard water). Or would it? Could it kill the weaker ones and that’s why not all are sick? And last thing I promise: should I add the final two tablespoons of salt to the tank? To make it the one tablespoon for five gallons? Or just leave it at 6 (instead of 8). Dosed four last night and two this am. And again two are way better but one actually died but I do think the salt is maybe helping.

well they are livebearers, could be females and adulthood changes going wrong, or poorly farmed and inbred genetics. kind of hard to say. I know with corydoras, my problem was mostly the source, they came from a local breeder that basically just inbred into infinity with the same related batch. and replacing adults with their offspring when the need arose, Didn't find that out until much later though when like 10 years later he still had the same fish sterba's for sale, and I asked specifically if that was the same genetics, he seemed pretty pleased with his answer as he said "same genetics for the last at least 20 years!" with a smile.

 

[Blacksheep1]

Did you acclimate at all? It could be the shock of different water parameters in already weakened fish.

 

[KribensisLover1]

Did you acclimate at all? It could be the shock of different water parameters in already weakened fish.

I did acclimate to some degree but not well. And the salt even tho I didn’t do the full dose (and still wonder if I should—thoughts?) seems to have worked wonders. On one fin (get it, instead of on one hand!?) I think well they were just suck a mess let’s finish dosing. On the other I think let’s not add more if not needed esp with the green neons. Any thoughts? And SparkyJones that’s so bad Lolol. Sheesssh.

 

[Blacksheep1]

I always expect losses , buying from big box stores is a given , but even from lfs that care , the whole process fish go through to get to the shop it really isn’t surprising they are weakened .

Don’t add more salt if the neons are with them. Also to take note of here , is that salt doesn’t evaporate, it’s only diluted by water changes. You’ll have to work that out by what’s dosed and removed . The neons won’t do well with salt at all, so you’re at the point of choosing one species over the other . Water changes will be your best bet here . You can’t do too many ! Just don’t touch the filter media , fresh water is key. You can do 50% per day and I bet any fin rot issues or general ailments will correct themselves.

 

[KribensisLover1]

I always expect losses , buying from big box stores is a given , but even from lfs that care , the whole process fish go through to get to the shop it really isn’t surprising they are weakened .

Don’t add more salt if the neons are with them. Also to take note of here , is that salt doesn’t evaporate, it’s only diluted by water changes. You’ll have to work that out by what’s dosed and removed . The neons won’t do well with salt at all, so you’re at the point of choosing one species over the other . Water changes will be your best bet here . You can’t do too many ! Just don’t touch the filter media , fresh water is key. You can do 50% per day and I bet any fin rot issues or general ailments will correct themselves.

Thank you! Phew to only adding 6 tablespoons of salt so far rather than 8. Thank you! I finally got my piece for the Python so I’ll likely be doing the change first thing tomorrow or even tonight. Their lights are out so I hate to turn them on and upend their world—what do you think? It’ll either be at 8 pm Friday or 9 am sat? Also, I buried some salt in the sand bc it was actual rocks. I won’t add more salt after the water change and hopefully that will evaporate and eventually disappear with numerous changes!!
Edit I would normally say always do the water change no matter what time of day but the parameters are solid and the fish are already so stressed. But I want that salt out bc as mean as it sounds, I choose the neons.

 

[KribensisLover1]

I always expect losses , buying from big box stores is a given , but even from lfs that care , the whole process fish go through to get to the shop it really isn’t surprising they are weakened .

Don’t add more salt if the neons are with them. Also to take note of here , is that salt doesn’t evaporate, it’s only diluted by water changes. You’ll have to work that out by what’s dosed and removed . The neons won’t do well with salt at all, so you’re at the point of choosing one species over the other . Water changes will be your best bet here . You can’t do too many ! Just don’t touch the filter media , fresh water is key. You can do 50% per day and I bet any fin rot issues or general ailments will correct themselves.

Uh oh. So. Blacksheep1 and SparkyJones as of yesterday one molly had died and then four neons (including the one I mentioned before). I did a water change and today everybody seems great. Except, I found the one molly (the fifth one), who had still been sick near the heater, suicided onto the lid. So four left. All doing really well. Ok. So that didn’t mess up the tank parameters. BUT I’m running an Ac 50 on the tank that I had stopped using on main tanks bc it would sometimes not work. It’s been great. But I realized bc of the pre filter sponge, since yesterday around 1 pm (it’s the next day at 5:30 pm that I realized this) the filter has been running that very low amount that AC’s do, when it’s very thin trickling from gravity. I couldn’t hear the lower flow bc the water level is high and it wasn’t JUST a trickle or I would have seen it. It’s that situation where when you lift the filter up it’ll flow properly but doesn’t when sitting on the tank. So now it’s fixed. Took the pre filter off and started it and then replaced it. BUT how bad is this? The fish are all being so active and wonderful. I would normally do a quick water change but I am hosting my husband’s entire family in 10 min and am racing around but really just worrying about the fish. They (the family) won’t leave until late late. How bad is it if I don’t change the water until tomorrow morning (Monday) at 10 am (it’s now 6 pm Sunday night). Do I need to put prime in? I changed a ton of the water yesterday bc of the dead fish. Thank you! This seems silly but I truly cannot tell these people who traveled a few hours here that I have to drag a hose through their dinner area. I would if I could! ALSO the tank is at a temp of 79.5. That could explain the action. Is that too high? Thank you all. New fish are a pain!
another neon BIT THE dust. Is this normal? None of the original ten died but 5 of the new 15 died. So I have 20 left. And two mollies died. The rest look good I THINK!

 

[SparkyJones]

I personally believe these random deaths are "new tank syndrome" and fish failing to acclimate and adjust to the new tank, individuals failing to thrive from various causes.

You keep a really clean tank, cleaner than I do, and could be detrimental. When fish aren't eating or stressed and won't eat they will generally pick around and biofilm and algae, easy pickings to get by when things are nice and quiet.
I don't see a need for yet another water change, if the filter is running right again that should be all it takes.

I can't guarantee others won't die, but sometimes doing less is the best course of action instead of doing more.

Hang on back filters, at least to me, are notoriously unreliable and I don't use them anymore. All the types of filters have their pros and cons though.
I'd say if you are going to have a HOB filter and it gets wonky on you from time to time, spend the $20 or so on a sponge filter and air pump and run that in there as a secondary backup for peace of mind. Cheap and effective and easy to maintain.

 

[KribensisLover1]

I personally believe these random deaths are "new tank syndrome" and fish failing to acclimate and adjust to the new tank, individuals failing to thrive from various causes.

You keep a really clean tank, cleaner than I do, and could be detrimental. When fish aren't eating or stressed and won't eat they will generally pick around and biofilm and algae, easy pickings to get by when things are nice and quiet.
I don't see a need for yet another water change, if the filter is running right again that should be all it takes.

I can't guarantee others won't die, but sometimes doing less is the best course of action instead of doing more.

Hang on back filters, at least to me, are notoriously unreliable and I don't use them anymore. All the types of filters have their pros and cons though.
I'd say if you are going to have a HOB filter and it gets wonky on you from time to time, spend the $20 or so on a sponge filter and air pump and run that in there as a secondary backup for peace of mind. Cheap and effective and easy to maintain.

That’s so true. Thank you! This tank is actually my nastiest with a lot of biolflm and algae and I JUST wiped some off yesterday! Ok so I’ve been back and forth on canisters. I would love a canister with a built-in heater and clear tubes (might be extra purchase) so I have as much width as possible in my narrow tank. I’ve heard there are leaking issues with canisters and it freaks me out, bc I have flooding issues, and can see me ruining a lot and breaking a lot. I just did some research, and see that you use wet dry. Is that easy? Or do you overall recommend sponges? How many would you rec for a 65 gallon that’s long? I feel like the larger sponges are SO huge and the tank is super narrow so not sure I have space.

 

[Blacksheep1]

I agree. Don’t over do or think things , simple is best here. Again the stress fish go through to get to the store is a lot , plus neons are mass produced thus weakening immune systems.

Don’t add extra prime , there’s no need. Try cardinals next time

 

[SparkyJones]

A wet dry filter is great for oxygenation, but bad on keeping carbon dioxide in the water for plants, because of the volume of media space and that the water trickles over the biomedia it's why is really effective at oxygenation and pushing out co2.

On the negatives side, you can overstock pretty easily, but unless you do a lot of water changes and stay on top of it, it's really effective at breaking ammonia and nitrates can build up quickly. Unless it's a drilled tank, it's gravity siphon that is taking water to the wet/dry and a pump to put it back into the tank, and with a prefilter box instead of the tank being drilled, it functions as a surface skimmer.
Meaning it leaves the heavy waste in the tank that doesn't float to break down unless you vacuum.

Mine never leaks but it could leak from a hose if one failed. My wet dry box is 40 gallon size, if the hoses didn't fail but the pump did and it didn't return water back to the tank, over half of the tank could go to the wet dry and not flood the floor, and the tubes won't allow it to go that far before it starts sucking air and stops draining from the tank.
Wet drys aren't cheap. Probably the most expensive way to filter besides a sump which is similar in components.You have the prefilter and then the wet/dry box which is like an aquarium under the tank those parts are acrylic, then the hoses you'd have with a canister filter types set up.
After the initial cost of the wet dry,replacing the pump is like $50-$100 depending on the flow rate you want. Doesn't happen often I've just replaced the pump once in 20+ years.
A complete wet dry filter set up is gonna cost $300-$600 depending on size, then the pump. It's not the cheapest way to do things, and a lot of aqariums sizes cost less than that, making it kind of crazy to spend that much on filter.

What you lose in mechanical filtration, you gain in biological filtration and oxygenation, allowing to stock kind of crazy if you want to and if willing to do water changes to keep things nice.

Because it tends to oxygenate heavy it doesn't hold co2 good and kind of tough to grow plants.

Everyone is different and have different goals. Someone like me that kept African cichlids for a while and stocked heavy it worked, and no plants. Same goes now with my angelfish and heavy stocking, also no plants and I do the water changes to keep it good. A person with discus might do wet dry also since they will be doing the water changes, and allows them to stock heavy and maybe keep minimal plants that aren't CO2 heavy users.

Sponge filters are cheap, simple and effective. It's just a viable backup for peace of mind without breaking the bank. I use them in my smaller tanks, like now I have 2 in my 20g and shut down my 10g. If I want to I could fill the 10g, dechorinate and move one sponge filter and put fish in immediately. If the power is out I could put a sponge on a battery air pump and run the filter still. Other filters are dead without electricity, or a generator or Uninterrupted power supply to take over.
People plant around the sponge filter and hide it with leaves usually making it less visible.

When I was doing various HOB filters, they'd reduce flow or jam up and get stuck all the time on me. Get one and within a year buying another and another and another. Always problems for me. I understand some people like them and have good luck with them but that wasn't my experience with them.

 

[KribensisLover1]

A wet dry filter is great for oxygenation, but bad on keeping carbon dioxide in the water for plants, because of the volume of media space and that the water trickles over the biomedia it's why is really effective at oxygenation and pushing out co2.

On the negatives side, you can overstock pretty easily, but unless you do a lot of water changes and stay on top of it, it's really effective at breaking ammonia and nitrates can build up quickly. Unless it's a drilled tank, it's gravity siphon that is taking water to the wet/dry and a pump to put it back into the tank, and with a prefilter box instead of the tank being drilled, it functions as a surface skimmer.
Meaning it leaves the heavy waste in the tank that doesn't float to break down unless you vacuum.

Mine never leaks but it could leak from a hose if one failed. My wet dry box is 40 gallon size, if the hoses didn't fail but the pump did and it didn't return water back to the tank, over half of the tank could go to the wet dry and not flood the floor, and the tubes won't allow it to go that far before it starts sucking air and stops draining from the tank.
Wet drys aren't cheap. Probably the most expensive way to filter besides a sump which is similar in components.You have the prefilter and then the wet/dry box which is like an aquarium under the tank those parts are acrylic, then the hoses you'd have with a canister filter types set up.
After the initial cost of the wet dry,replacing the pump is like $50-$100 depending on the flow rate you want. Doesn't happen often I've just replaced the pump once in 20+ years.
A complete wet dry filter set up is gonna cost $300-$600 depending on size, then the pump. It's not the cheapest way to do things, and a lot of aqariums sizes cost less than that, making it kind of crazy to spend that much on filter.

What you lose in mechanical filtration, you gain in biological filtration and oxygenation, allowing to stock kind of crazy if you want to and if willing to do water changes to keep things nice.

Because it tends to oxygenate heavy it doesn't hold co2 good and kind of tough to grow plants.

Everyone is different and have different goals. Someone like me that kept African cichlids for a while and stocked heavy it worked, and no plants. Same goes now with my angelfish and heavy stocking, also no plants and I do the water changes to keep it good. A person with discus might do wet dry also since they will be doing the water changes, and allows them to stock heavy and maybe keep minimal plants that aren't CO2 heavy users.

Sponge filters are cheap, simple and effective. It's just a viable backup for peace of mind without breaking the bank. I use them in my smaller tanks, like now I have 2 in my 20g and shut down my 10g. If I want to I could fill the 10g, dechorinate and move one sponge filter and put fish in immediately. If the power is out I could put a sponge on a battery air pump and run the filter still. Other filters are dead without electricity, or a generator or Uninterrupted power supply to take over.
People plant around the sponge filter and hide it with leaves usually making it less visible.

When I was doing various HOB filters, they'd reduce flow or jam up and get stuck all the time on me. Get one and within a year buying another and another and another. Always problems for me. I understand some people like them and have good luck with them but that wasn't my experience with them.

YES to the hob buying another and another and another etc etc esp with sand. I like the wet dry idea but I would need to save up! That’s def a future project but to be able to run for so long and replace a pump every twenty years? Wow. So is it in the stand under the actual tank? Sound like a simplistic question but my current stand (came with tank second hand) wouldn’t fit or hold something like that. Do you need to build something very sturdy? I know this sounds silly to ask but I’m serious!

I agree. Don’t over do or think things , simple is best here. Again the stress fish go through to get to the store is a lot , plus neons are mass produced thus weakening immune systems.

Don’t add extra prime , there’s no need. Try cardinals next time

I JUST wrote on here last week that quote the times I leave tanks alone the fish thrive and vice versa.
I lost another neon but yea agree with what you say^^. I’m going to do hands off. Feed, keep the air stone in, and weekly water changes. I haven’t lost any of the firsy round of new fish three weeks in (the 8 swordtails 3 red eyes and 10 green neons) yet I’ve lost 8 overall of the 15 green neons and 6 mollies I got last week (6 neons two mollies). My tank hasn’t changed. So thank you! Hands OFF! Lolol!

 

[KribensisLover1]

Update: everybody looks better but how sketchy is this: I look in and see no dead fish. And I know fish can eat others but I’ve never seen a fish completely gone from other fish eating it simply bc I check the tank so often. But look at these spots of neon. So weird. It looks like a lump under it like a fish but it is NOT. I looked directly from the top and it was a flat spot. So it’s not a lump of dead fish. What is it? And no I can’t count them. I tried. And again it looks like a lump but it’s not and not one of the 6 dead neons that I’ve found was touched or picked at at all.


tried.
Well now guess what. Turns out somebody unplugged the filter a full 24 hours ago. I need to lower the water so I know these things. So now I must do a water change. Ugh.

 

[KribensisLover1]

Final comment: I work remotely and it was a slow day so I emptied the tank like 80%. Not on purpose. My boss called and I got distracted. Then I couldn’t refill for TWO hours or more bc he kept me on the phone. The water was 75.7 by the time I refilled with 79 degree water. Poor fish. They aren’t as active now. They did eat tho when I fed them after and the lights are out. I’m a realllll great mother.

 

[Whitewolf]

Sulfaplex is a broad spectrum antibiotic that u can add to the water and should not kill nitrifyinging bacteria. Or you could just buy tablets online human grade bacterum and stir (sulfamethoxazole-trimethoprim)

 

[KribensisLover1]

Wow I just checked my tank and the temp was 82.4. Fine for the green neons. Turned it down for the mollies. I am a wreck!

 

[hevvyc]

UPDATE: added 4 tablespoons of salt to the 40 breeder last night. 5 mollies seem good one doesn’t. Can or should I add the final 4 tablespoons!
Shall I add two more instead of four more tablespoons?
UPDATE
One died. Here’s a pic. I’m adding 2 more tblspns of aq salt for a total of 6 added for 40 gallons. One mollie is still not good. Four other mollies seem WAY better. Could it have been shock bc salt is usually added to their tanks at the store? But then why did the one die after salt was added? Did I not acclimate well?
Also I just went to add the two more tablespoons of salt and I thought it was dissolved and tossed it in and some of it was NOT. Huge rocks fell to the bottom of the tank. The neons swam to it so I covered it with sand and show a pic below . Eek. I am a mess.
ps the mollie might look bloAyed but she was not.
View attachment 875109View attachment 875111

It might have been sick when you got it from the store or just weaker than the others. The salt should be fine in there but just remember it doesn't dessipate over time, the only way to take it out is water changes so keep a record of how much you put in so you don't overdose.

Final comment: I work remotely and it was a slow day so I emptied the tank like 80%. Not on purpose. My boss called and I got distracted. Then I couldn’t refill for TWO hours or more bc he kept me on the phone. The water was 75.7 by the time I refilled with 79 degree water. Poor fish. They aren’t as active now. They did eat tho when I fed them after and the lights are out. I’m a realllll great mother.

Excuse me for stating the obvious but just in case you forgot, if you've done a water change you can add more salt to compensate.

 

[KribensisLover1]

It might have been sick when you got it from the store or just weaker than the others. The salt should be fine in there but just remember it doesn't dessipate over time, the only way to take it out is water changes so keep a record of how much you put in so you don't overdose.

Excuse me for stating the obvious but just in case you forgot, if you've done a water change you can add more salt to compensate.

Thank you! The reason I haven’t is bc the two mollies that were super sick already passed and when I did add salt I lost 6 greens. Now that could be unrelated but bc the fish all seem better now and I haven’t added salt in two water changes k feel like it’s ok now!! Thank you! I just am a mess with the tank being so hot Lolol. But I haven’t lost any fish since last Sunday I think? So that’s great!

 

[RayClem]

Your experience just confirms what I stated in my earlier post. Trying to keep neons and mollies in the same tank is going to be a challenge as they prefer different conditions.

 

[KribensisLover1]

Your experience just confirms what I stated in my earlier post. Trying to keep neons and mollies in the same tank is going to be a challenge as they prefer different conditions.

Touché! I need to take the mollies back but I felt bad bc they were so sick. I know the store would have taken them but I truly think the long drive would have killed them. So I’m not opposed to returning them I just didn’t want to yet. This is probably a stupid question but I have a single yellow lab I was going to put in the 40 breeder alone bc he killed 24 pristella tetras (along with some other labs that died or were rehomed). There’s no way the mollies could be with him right? He was in a main tank and actually bothered the Kribs he was with but not the angels or the red eyes. I kind of know I should return him but he’s been with me so long. I do know the mollies and labs need diff parameters and it’s a stupid question but I just wanted to ask!!

 

[hevvyc]

Thank you! The reason I haven’t is bc the two mollies that were super sick already passed and when I did add salt I lost 6 greens. Now that could be unrelated but bc the fish all seem better now and I haven’t added salt in two water changes k feel like it’s ok now!! Thank you! I just am a mess with the tank being so hot Lolol. But I haven’t lost any fish since last Sunday I think? So that’s great!

Aww, bless you. It's horrible when you lose fish, but it's happened to us all some point or another, fishkeeping has a steep learning curve. I hope the rest of your tank will be okay, it sounds like you have it under control.

 

[KribensisLover1]

Aww, bless you. It's horrible when you lose fish, but it's happened to us all some point or another, fishkeeping has a steep learning curve. I hope the rest of your tank will be okay, it sounds like you have it under control.

Thank you! I always forget how hard it is to get new fish. I know that many people don’t have issues but I haven’t gotten new fish in a few years and it’s so much easier to maintain than to get new! But yes I am still on that steep learning curve a few years in! Thank you!!

 

[RayClem]

I have had a number of fish over the years that just were not suitable in a tank with other fish. In most cases I set up a new tank to house a single fish. One such case was when I was in high school. I purched a pink convict cichlid because it was an interesting fish, an albino. It attacked any fish I tried to keep it with, even those that were bigger. I set up a tank for the sole fish. That fish survived all the way through my college years and became my first fish when I moved into my first apartment.

More recently, I had to set up a tank to house a common pleco. For the first 5 year of his life, he lived in a community tank, but got too large. He lived alone in a 29 gallon tank for the final 10 years of his life. He died last week. I think he lived longer than any fish I ever owned. I was sorry to see him go, but also relieved that I did not have to maintain a tank just for him.

If you want to keep both neons and mollies, you need to figure out how to maintain them in separate tanks. That is the only way they will both thrive. Mollies can be kept with othre livebearers such as guppies, platies and swordtails that will tolerate similar water quality. They just do not do well with South American species.

 

[KribensisLover1]

I have had a number of fish over the years that just were not suitable in a tank with other fish. In most cases I set up a new tank to house a single fish. One such case was when I was in high school. I purched a pink convict cichlid because it was an interesting fish, an albino. It attacked any fish I tried to keep it with, even those that were bigger. I set up a tank for the sole fish. That fish survived all the way through my college years and became my first fish when I moved into my first apartment.

More recently, I had to set up a tank to house a common pleco. For the first 5 year of his life, he lived in a community tank, but got too large. He lived alone in a 29 gallon tank for the final 10 years of his life. He died last week. I think he lived longer than any fish I ever owned. I was sorry to see him go, but also relieved that I did not have to maintain a tank just for him.

If you want to keep both neons and mollies, you need to figure out how to maintain them in separate tanks. That is the only way they will both thrive. Mollies can be kept with othre livebearers such as guppies, platies and swordtails that will tolerate similar water quality. They just do not do well with South American species.

Thank you! So basically I’m planning to have the green neons in the flatback hex still and either keep the mollies in the 40 breeder WITH the lab, or rehome one or the other. It’s easier that way and it’s already set up as my QT tank, and so why not. I’ll choose something else for the green neons to be with, and potentially get more mollies for the 40 breeder (unless they are with the lab and I have to see how they do) or again just return them and have a single lab for a bit. But I am grateful for all of your help and I’m lucky I have enough places to house the fish until I return or if I want to keep!