8 fish dead in a week, and I don't know what's wrong!

[Jahnelle]

Tank

What is the water volume of the tank? 40 gallon

How long has the tank been running? Tough question. It was originally a 30 gallon hex, but had an emergency move to a 40 long because the hex sprung a big leak. Used the original water, filter, plants and decorations. The only change was the substrate. Not sure if that matters. The change-over happened June 2020 (about a month ago).

Does it have a filter? Three - two water filters, 1 UV filter (two days old - new addition)

Does it have a heater? yes

What is the water temperature? 76

What is the entire stocking of this tank? (Please list all fish and inverts.)
1 X-ray tetra
1 Gold-skirt tetra
8 Brilliant Rasbora
3 female guppies
2 cherry barbs
1 mystery snail
1 assassin snail
handful of nuisance snails (pond, ramshorn)

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? twice a month
How much of the water do you change? 25%
What do you use to treat your water? Prime, Stability, Pristine
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water? Vacuum the substrate every time

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish? No
What do you use to test the water? API Master Freshwater, API GH/KH
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.

Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 20 - 40
pH: 7.4

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? once a day
How much do you feed your fish? two small pinches - approximately 1/8 of a teaspoon
What brand of food do you feed your fish? TetraMini tropical flakes, Hikari brine shrimp
Do you feed frozen or freeze-dried foods? No

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish?
I bought 6 cherry barbs July 12th. 4 died within 2 days.
I had two tetra that I've had for over a year that died July 14th and 15th.
I had a betta that I bought in October die July 17th.
I had a female guppy I've had for over a year that died July 19th (today)

How long ago did you first notice these symptoms?
Couldn't see anything wrong until July 17th - 3 days ago

In a few words, can you explain the symptoms?

The 4 cherry barbs that died, I didn't see anything wrong with them. Didn't have much of a chance.
The first tetra, there was nothing noticeably wrong.
The second tetra, his fins were gone, and there was white stuff on his tail. This happened within a period of three days.
My betta died - had white stuff on his mouth and on one gill. He went from healthy and eating to white mouth, not eating and lethargic over a single day. By the end of the day, he could barely swim and died the next day.
My female guppy followed the path of the betta - going from fine to lethargic to dead within 24 hours.

My two cherry barbs are still alive, but flashing on plants and (I think) fin clamping. I'm not sure, because I have no experience with barbs or fin clamping, so I'm not sure what it looks like. The male has started self isolation, but that could be because he lost all but one of his harem. He's still eating.

Have you started any treatment for the illness? Because of the above, I'm using Kanaplex mixed with Focus in the food. Not sure if I'm doing it right, though.
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No

Explain your emergency situation in detail. (Please give a clear explanation of what is going on, include details from the beginning of the illness leading up to now)
I had an established tank for over a year, but had to emergency move to another tank. Parameters have been good except for slightly high nitrates. I've had no problems until I introduced the cherry barbs Sunday.

LFS I bought the fish from said my nitrates were too high and that's what killed my fish. I haven't had any problems until I introduced their fish. I acclimated them, but maybe not long enough - over a half hour to an hour. At any rate, once I added them to my tank, I lost 4 of them, and I've lost 4 of my long-time established fish, including my beautiful betta, Baron.

I don't want to lose the ones I have left, but I don't know what to do. I'm assuming ich because of the flashing and clamping, but I don't see any white spots. It's almost like I added the new fish and anything that could attack my fish did. I can't help but blame the LFS, but I also had a fish the week before I bought them that died of dropsy.

What do I do? I can't treat the water because of plants and snails, but I'm not sure the Kanaplex is going to do what I need it to do. Thought about adding garlic oil to the water, but not sure how to do that without killing more of my fish. How do I fix my tank?

Also, I've changed my water twice since July 12th, at 10%, and vacuumed the substrate. I have a hospital tank, but it's only a 5 gallon and my betta died in it. Not sure how to take care of the water before putting something new in it. I've never had sickness in my tanks, so I'm really out of my league here.

 

[FishBoy101]

Did you quarantine? The white spots make me think ich.

 

[Jahnelle]

I don't currently have anything quarantined.

The tetra that was missing fins died before I had a chance. My betta I quarantined as soon as I could (had to get the hospital tank). I don't see any white spots on any of the others.

I was wondering: since my betta died in the hospital tank, can I still put the two cherry barbs (the only two that are flashing) in the hospital tank? If not, what do I need to do to the hospital tank before I put them in it?

 

[Jahnelle]

And if it's ich, I have read that I can raise the heat in the tank to speed up the process and add garlic, but I don't know if my current fish friends can handle 86 degree water.

 

[mattgirl]

I am no good at diagnosing or treating fish but wanted to put your mind at ease about the nitrates. They are not high enough to cause what you are experiencing so please don't let what they said make you think what is happening as your fault. I have to think these fish came to you already infected with something even if the folks at the store would like you to think that isn't the case.

I do hope someone here will be able to answer your questions and can help you save the remaining fish.

 

[e_watson09]

I don't know if I'd immediately blame the LFS. You mention you had a fish die from dropsy right before you added the new fish. Dropsy can be caused by a lot of things so its possible you already had something going on when you added them.

How are the rest of the fish in the tank doing? Can you take photos of them?

 

[Jahnelle]

The two betta pictures are before he died, just so you can see what he looked like. Barbs have been nose down since day one, including in the LFS tank. Figured that was normal, but now it has me wondering. Only two missing from pics are two guppies that are malformed, but are still hardy little things and are too spastic to get a picture of. Not sure I got a good pic of my poor little silver tetra - always the smallest out of his school.

 

[angelcraze]

I'm no disease pro either, but have seen my fair share of disease in the aquarium. Whatever it is is very fast acting, which makes me think columnaris. You would see cottony mouth or fins or white patches on the skin (commonly on the back referred to as saddleback). I also noticed sick fish couldn't keep up with the school and swam with lethargy or completely seperate from the school and isolate. There are at least 4 strains of columnaris, one of them kills in less than 24hrs.

Kanamycin was a good choice imo. It is readily absorbed thru the skin, so you don't need to add in a food soak, but I think it can be done. The other synergistic med to use with kana is furanol (Furan2). Furan2 is dosed in the water and treats more the outward symptoms of columnaris and kana does both including anything internal.

I feel the new barbs from the LFS must have bought it in. It happened to me once with rummynose. I dosed paraguard and moved the sickest fish to a hospital tank and my own fish in the tank never got sick luckily. I did lots of water changes (every other day 50%) for a week or two. Just sharing what worked for me.

 

[Lordofwar]

Are the bellies of the fishes somewhat in concave shape? It seems that there is some sort of protozoan or bacterial disease. You may opt for Seachem Garlic guard alongwith Seachem Metroplex & Focus. Mix it in food in such a way that they are no longer visible (the medicine). You need to do this for couple of weeks.

 

[Jahnelle]

angelcraze looked it up and found this:

That looks exactly like what was on my betta's mouth, and on the back of my tetra that died, and their actions (floating up to the top of the tank, gills moving faster) were just like that.

Lordofwar I don't see concave - if anything, they're all a bit rounded. I've been treating with Kanaplex & Focus for the last three days. Should I switch to Metroplex?

 

[Jahnelle]

Lordofwar Also, Seachem says snails are sensitive to Kanaplex and Metroplex, so I've only been dosing the food. I can't tell if there are any that are worse than others, so I'm dosing the whole tank instead of trying to quarantine. Thought about moving the snails to the quarantine tank and dose the water, but I don't want to kill my plants, either.

Finally, I think angelcraze is right - looks like columnaris - does that change the Metroplex recommendation?

 

[angelcraze]

Kanaplex in the water should be ok for your plants. I've dosed it in a planted tank. Metro I always add in a food soak anyway. Metro treats Hexamita, so if ypur fish are losing weight despite a healthy appetite, isolating and facing walls, clear stingy poop, that's when Metro can help.

 

[Jahnelle]

@angelcraze Is Kanaplex safe for snails? We have a mystery snail that my dad is really fond of, and an assassin snail that has done me some serious favors getting rid of pest snails

 

[Lordofwar]

Finally, I think angelcraze is right - looks like columnaris - does that change the Metroplex recommendation?

If its to do with columnaris then go for Kanaplex.

 

[angelcraze]

@angelcraze Is Kanaplex safe for snails? We have a mystery snail that my dad is really fond of, and an assassin snail that has done me some serious favors getting rid of pest snails

Tbh not sure. I think I had snails then but not 100%. Can you temporarily remove the snails into another bin? Also feeding it could be ok. I don't mean to push dosing it. Just with feeding it it can be hard to make sure every fish gets its share. When they are feeling ill, oftentimes they won't eat well. Not that you can't make sure they all eating it, and I do know that ingesting the meds is generally the more effective treatment (especially for internal issues.)

 

[lojack]

If it’s Columnaris I’ve had luck with two rounds of Maracyn 2 (minocyline). That cleared up the less horrible fish. The remaining 6 that still showed symptoms (were the worst looking) are currently in quarantine for a third round of Maracyn 2 and this time Furan-2 for an extra punch. They are responding really well halfway through.

Maracyn 2 is invert safe. I’ve read user experiences that Furan-2 was invert safe but I didn’t want to try it.

Just giving you some options.

 

[angelcraze]

How are the fish now?