Plant help

[Beermann]

This is my wysteria and my amazon sword

Rooted in 1" soil no tabs (should i use tabs) and an auto fertilizer (potassium, iron and micronutrients), co2 injection (co2 was down for a couple weeks due to a power outage and no realizing the smart plug was off) this is 4 weeks post hooking co2 back up and also post treatment for my discus ick, all fish are doing well now and I'm focusing on the plants.

I'll be adding more soil in the next few days and possibly adding more iron and potassium per dosage.

Micro nutrients 4ml per day
Potassium 5ml per day
Iron 1ml per day

65gallon, regular water changes and an inline uv for 2hrs a day.

Looking for a bit of input as my wysteria is rooting from the stem and my sword is curling. Wysteria has been rooting like this pre medication and the sword has been looking lack luster pre medication as well, i ran tetra guard to treat the tank over a month ago.
My buce is looking unwell as well, not a rooting plant and feeds off the column

There are also about a lot of pothos rooted in my aquarium, perhaps my fertlizer isn't high enough to keep hp with the demands of everything rooted?

 

[Fishfur]

The Hygrophila is growing adventitious roots, which is normal & to be expected. Any emergent stem plant will grow adventitious roots though species vary some when it comes to the numbers of them.

These roots grow from non-root tissues & help the plant feed.

The curling of the Echinodorus leaves is likely due to stress - new growth should be normal now the CO2 problem has been addressed.

Just so you know, having a UV device turn on & off daily will greatly shorten the useful life of the bulb, which isn’t all that long to begin with, plus it defeats the purpose of having a UV device.

They work best when left on 24/7 & the bulbs last longest if they are on 24/7.

They are not designed to be turned on and off frequently. As it is they need replacing annually.

 

[Beermann]

The Hygrophila is growing adventitious roots, which is normal & to be expected. Any emergent stem plant will grow adventitious roots though species vary some when it comes to the numbers of them.

These roots grow from non-root tissues & help the plant feed.

The curling of the Echinodorus leaves is likely due to stress - new growth should be normal now the CO2 problem has been addressed.

Just so you know, having a UV device turn on & off daily will greatly shorten the useful life of the bulb, which isn’t all that long to begin with, plus it defeats the purpose of having a UV device.

They work best when left on 24/7 & the bulbs last longest if they are on 24/7.

They are not designed to be turned on and off frequently. As it is they need replacing annually.

Ok I'll adjust the uv to run longer as mentioned

What about the buce?

Appreciate the info



I also have a lot of pothos rooted in the aquarium, do you think they are starving the column of fertilizer?

 

[Fishfur]

Suddenly stopping CO2 when it’s been injected previously could be responsible for most of the changes in the submersed plants.
The Epipremnums (pothos) look ok to me - they are single vines that virtually never branch so if you want a lush thick lot of them you need to either plant more stems or twist & loop the vines so they look fuller.

Buce grows natively in fast flowing water, clinging to rocks. It doesn’t need a lot of light but it appreciates a lot of current.
How long have you had it in the tank?

 

[Beermann]

Buce grows natively in fast flowing water, clinging to rocks. It doesn’t need a lot of light but it appreciates a lot of current.

How long have you had it in the tank?

Buce about a year, its been struggling since, there is no current at the bottom but maby I could place it by the bubbler?
Would lack of current really cause it to deteriorate like that?

 

[Fishfur]

Buce about a year, its been struggling since, there is no current at the bottom but maby I could place it by the bubbler?


Would lack of current really cause it to deteriorate like that?

Has it looked this ragged for most of the time? They are slow growers so they aren’t heavy feeders but a combination of factors seems most likely.

What is the lighting like? They don’t like strong light and it looks like there may be some diatoms growing on the leaves and on the swords too. Is there?

 

[Beermann]

Has it looked this ragged for most of the time? They are slow growers so they aren’t heavy feeders but a combination of factors seems most likely.

What is the lighting like? They don’t like strong light and it looks like there may be some diatoms growing on the leaves and on the swords too. Is there?

Diatoms, those brown/black root things? Yes they are developing those

It's been a slow decline for the buce, it was in amazing condition when I got it

 

[Fishfur]

Diatoms (brown algae) look like a light brown coating on leaves & surfaces and is quite soft & easy to wipe off.

I can’t understand what that graph says so how many hours is the light on per day, at what percentage and what brand/model is it?

 

[_Fried_Bettas_]

I recognize the Fluval app, is this the 2.0 or 3.0 light? Also, even though I am familiar with it, from the graph it is hard to count how many hours, especially with that semi-siesta in the middle. I have seen in many guides on this light the suggestion to run the blue at only 20% and more for green and red to limit algae. Do you have a rationale for the settings you are using? I do know that some plants react to siestas in different ways, but I have never researched any particular species as I don't use that strategy.

 

[Beermann]

It's on for 10hrs a day and just a super dim light for a few hrs

Main reason for siesta is that the location of my tank gets pretty good light from the living room and back door and dining area windows so I tone it down mid day

 

[Fishfur]

Even with presumably dim light, once algae is growing it doesn’t take all that much to sustain it.

 

[Beermann]

That algea isn't really on anything else but I'll change up the % and do some research

 

[ruud]

Either don't use a CO2 system or use it in a very consistent, natural manner. Unnatural variation stresses the plants' machinery big time. They start leaching organics, combined with strong light, regardless of the color spectrum, sees algae on leaves.

PS Some perspective on light; I only use aquarium lights for my planted tanks in the basement. On ground level, ambient light / windows is sufficient to keep plants healthy in fall and winter and see them growing in spring and summer. The sun is on for 16 hrs and doesn't take a siesta...

 

[_Fried_Bettas_]

ruud has different expectations for plant growth than I have. Everyone has something they have found that works for them. Healthy aquariums have algae in them. If the nutrients, light, CO2, and plant growth are in balance, it will just be a bit of nuisance that you have to clean off your glass each week. You don't appear to be dosing any nitrogen. I would test nitrates and make sure you have some. But don't add any if you have more than 5 ppm. I have a low-light tank where the plants zero out nitrates, and I have to add quite a bit, and I get more algae when they don't get enough. I find that if you have some algae eaters, they will eat just enough that you won't have enough on your plants to require intervention unless you have some real slow growers. I would do away with the siesta, with the outside light, it should just mimic the noon sun, and if you think you need less light, I would just lower everything across the board. Strong lights for 8-10 hours straight, like in many aquariums, favor algae in my opinion, where a short peak at midday should favor the plants. Don't change anything too rapidly or all at once; this is usually when people get algae blooms. For me, the key is keeping things in balance. Some people seem to do well overdosing everything (EI method), but I suspect we don't see all the instances when this blows up on them.

 

[ruud]

The EI method works fine. The correlation between germination of algae spores and minerals (nitrates, potassium, etc) is weak. On the other hand, the correlation with organics, ammonia and strong light intensity is very high. Hence, those working with planted tanks with CO2 and strong lights are diligent in performing frequent and large water changes. Not to remove minerals, but to remove the organics. Plants in high energy mode produce a lot of organic waste.

Planted tanks running on indirect sunlight or weak artificial light are algae free. Plants typically develop a deep green color as weak light is compensated by higher chlorophyll concentration.

 

[SeattleRoy]

This is my wysteria and my amazon sword

Rooted in 1" soil no tabs (should i use tabs) and an auto fertilizer (potassium, iron and micronutrients), co2 injection (co2 was down for a couple weeks due to a power outage and no realizing the smart plug was off) this is 4 weeks post hooking co2 back up and also post treatment for my discus ick, all fish are doing well now and I'm focusing on the plants.

I'll be adding more soil in the next few days and possibly adding more iron and potassium per dosage.

Micro nutrients 4ml per day
Potassium 5ml per day
Iron 1ml per day

65gallon, regular water changes and an inline uv for 2hrs a day.

Looking for a bit of input as my wysteria is rooting from the stem and my sword is curling. Wysteria has been rooting like this pre medication and the sword has been looking lack luster pre medication as well, i ran tetra guard to treat the tank over a month ago.
My buce is looking unwell as well, not a rooting plant and feeds off the column

There are also about a lot of pothos rooted in my aquarium, perhaps my fertlizer isn't high enough to keep hp with the demands of everything rooted?

Hi Beermann,

Based upon the cupped leaves of the cryptocoryne (margins turned downward) and the loss of older leaves on your Pothos I suspect there insufficient magnesium in your tank. The overall loss of dark green on the new leaves of the Pothos could be magnesium but I am more inclined to think nitrogen (nitrates). If you have a nitrate test kit please test your water, if you don't I suggest you pick one up.

If you would like guidance on how to dose magnesium please reach out. Hope this helps! -Roy

 

[ruud]

But be careful with interpreting new growth. New leaves can look different due to 1) temporary under development, and 2) their exact position (typically higher up, closer to light).

But having a bottle containing dissolved potassium-nitrate salts and some magnesium-nitrate salts or epsom salts, should be the main supplement for 99% of planted tanks.

I'm not sure if I understand the OP's recipe. If you have fish swimming around (releasing indirectly all the minerals plants need, albeit in odd quantity ratios) and you are working with source water that contains all the minerals plants need (albeit in low quantities), micros are seldomly an issue.

Funny anecdotes of a few of my current tanks:

My high energy tank (high CO2/high light) has no fish, 'inert sand' and diluted tap water, still getting the micros from the tap source + natural decomposition taking place, as I'm not providing.

My black water tank runs on 100% pure water and has plants growing close to the waterline amongst the wood. There are black water fish swimming around. I add zero plant food. The fish and natural decomposition should be the sources for plant growth. I do see leaves sometimes getting yellow and wither away, but I deliberately dont take these out. Let nature figure it out.

Tells you something about the ease and minimal needs plants have for minerals, especially in tanks without a CO2 systems.

 

[_Fried_Bettas_]

I have a low-tech 9-gallon tank that I need to supplement with nitrogen and phosphates, as the plants use up these compounds. I was only adding potassium plus micros thinking the fish would provide the rest but the plants were zeroing out the results. The more fertilizers I add, the less algae I get, and I still haven't been giving them enough to have any measurable quantity by the end of the week. The plants seem to do ok regardless, but I assume that adding more fertilizers is allowing them to outcompete the algae.

 

[ruud]

Unlike plants, algae don't require terrestrial structures, which means minerals are readily available to them. Algae aren't patiently waiting for plants to use up minerals before they get their turn.

I believe the competition is direct and surely this requires giving plants the means or conditions to develop biochemical mechanisms inhibiting algae.

Cheers.

 

[sarito]

This is my wysteria and my amazon sword

Rooted in 1" soil no tabs (should i use tabs) and an auto fertilizer (potassium, iron and micronutrients), co2 injection (co2 was down for a couple weeks due to a power outage and no realizing the smart plug was off) this is 4 weeks post hooking co2 back up and also post treatment for my discus ick, all fish are doing well now and I'm focusing on the plants.

I'll be adding more soil in the next few days and possibly adding more iron and potassium per dosage.

Micro nutrients 4ml per day
Potassium 5ml per day
Iron 1ml per day

65gallon, regular water changes and an inline uv for 2hrs a day.

Looking for a bit of input as my wysteria is rooting from the stem and my sword is curling. Wysteria has been rooting like this pre medication and the sword has been looking lack luster pre medication as well, i ran tetra guard to treat the tank over a month ago.
My buce is looking unwell as well, not a rooting plant and feeds off the column

There are also about a lot of pothos rooted in my aquarium, perhaps my fertlizer isn't high enough to keep hp with the demands of everything rooted?

You're on the right track, especially after bouncing back from the CO2 and ick issues.

Root Tabs:
For your Amazon sword, I'd recommend adding root tabs. Even with soil, swords are heavy root feeders, and tabs could help with the curling.

Nutrient Dosing:
Your dosing seems solid, but with lots of rooted plants and pothos in the tank, your current ferts might be getting outpaced. Consider bumping iron and potassium a bit.

Wisteria Rooting from Stem:
Not unusual—usually a sign it's trying to propagate or search for nutrients. If it's otherwise healthy, it's not a big concern.

Buce Issues:
Buce is sensitive and feeds from the water column. Slightly increasing micros and ensuring no leftover med residue could help.

Pothos Impact:
Established pothos can suck up a lot of nutrients. You might either prune it back or dose more across the board.

Let us know how it progresses—would love to see updates!

Unlike plants, algae don't require terrestrial structures, which means minerals are readily available to them. Algae aren't patiently waiting for plants to use up minerals before they get their turn.

I believe the competition is direct and surely this requires giving plants the means or conditions to develop biochemical mechanisms inhibiting algae.

Cheers.

You're right—algae don't need the same structures as plants and can quickly take advantage of available nutrients. The idea that plants "outcompete" algae purely by consuming nutrients first is oversimplified.

I agree that the real competition is more complex and probably involves allelopathy (chemical inhibition), shading, and creating stable conditions that favor plant metabolism over algal growth. Giving plants optimal conditions—CO2, light, and balanced fertilizers—lets them thrive and possibly suppress algae indirectly through stronger growth and biochemical processes.

It's not just about starving algae, but empowering plants to do the job right.

 

[_Fried_Bettas_]

The fact that EI dosing works, where everything is grossly overdosed, both in the AquaSoil and water column, demonstrates that the idea of plants winning some battle over available nutrients isn't correct, as with EI dosing, there is an oversupply of nutrients for everyone. It is just empirically evident that when plant growth isn't limited by a shortage of resources that algae growth is limited. It would be interesting to know what the precise mechanism at play is here.

 

[ruud]

The core principle of EI is that mineral management for planted tanks is overrated. While minerals are essential, the extent to which they need to be managed is the questionable part. Hence, the approach is to provide minerals in abundance and let the plants figure out the rest.

So, it's not so much about 'overdosing,' but rather ensuring all the essentials are always readily available. I don't fully understand the disproportionate amounts of iron and magnesium in Tom Barr's recipe, but there's no real practical reason to question it.

Many people don't subscribe to EI, of course, often pointing to studies showing the correlation between nitrogen and phosphate influx from agricultural practices and subsequent algae blooms in lakes. But as is often the case, the equation is grossly oversimplified. The nitrogen and phosphate influx merely acts as fuel for a small, existing fire.

Phosphates, in particular, appear to be the limiting factor for plant growth in nature, acting as super oil when artificial amounts are provided. Which is also the reason for my preferred method for inhibiting plant growth in tanks. When you've been keeping planted tanks for three decades, as I have, the last thing you want is more plant growth , which is why I never supplement phosphates.

If one keeps a tank in high energy mode (high CO2/ high light intensity) without taking care of organic waste management, plants having access to unlimited minerals are capable of deterring algae from their leaves (through allelochemicals), but algae will invade your tank nonetheless.

Algae appear when spring season arrives: high intense light, warm water, organics and ammonium. When they arrive, any minerals present supports further growth, whereas light intensity and water temperature matters much less from there on.

 

[_Fried_Bettas_]

When I had a lot of tanks, large and small, I experimented with both EI and lean dosing and with dry ferts and liquid fertilizer. In my experience, they all work, but I prefer leaner dosing as I don't care for the high level of maintenance required, large water changes, and managing excessive growth. I would rather test my water frequently than do 50% weekly water changes. It also works well for me regardless of light level, CO2, fish load, or plant density. I get a reasonable amount of algae that I have to remove from the glass, but I don't try to control it elsewhere in the tank, except by having some algae eaters in the tank. I haven't had problems that required major intervention in a long time. When I did, it was when I failed to do the routine required by whatever method I was using.

 

[sarito]

Thanks for sharing your experience—it's always helpful to hear real-world feedback on different dosing methods. I’ve experimented with EI and lean dosing too, and I totally understand the appeal of a leaner approach, especially when it comes to lower maintenance and avoiding the “jungle” effect from excessive growth.
One thing I’ve personally leaned into more recently is using artificial plants in some of my setups. While they obviously don't contribute to nutrient uptake or water chemistry, they've been a great way to reduce overall tank maintenance and still provide structure and hiding places for fish. For tanks where aesthetics and ease of care are my priority (like in an office or guest room), pairing artificial plants with lean dosing—or even no dosing—has made things really manageable.
I still enjoy live planted tanks too, but it’s nice to have options depending on how much time and effort I want to invest. Curious if you’ve ever tried mixing artificial and live plants, or considered going fully artificial in any of your setups?

 

[ruud]

Lean or EI - minerals don't drive plant growth; they are merely prerequisites. If CO2 concentration is the default 3 ppm in the average planted tank, you can dose all you want, but it won't matter. Surplus macro's will be stored in plant tissue, but that's about it. If one does see a difference, it simply means a certain mineral was lacking, i.e. a prerequisite wasn't met.

Regarding maintenance; people's typical aim is 'plant growth'. My aim is 'plant death prevention'. This changes everything. Including maintenance.

Think of a planted tank as a giant vase holding water and plants, and top off the water as it naturally decreases. Not that different from how I maintain the houseplants located next to the tanks.

Cheers.

 

[Beermann]

Wow great replies, ill do what's suggested and jeep you guys updated. I wasn't getting notifications so didn't check in on the thread.

I've been letting it idle for now to see how it bounces back with co2 but its lacking in recovery

 

[sarito]

Recently, I decided to enhance my setup by adding a few new artificial plants. They've elevated the overall look of my tank, providing a realistic feel without the hassle of constant pruning or nutrient concerns. The new plants are perfect for my low-maintenance tanks, where I’m focused on aesthetic appeal and ease of care. It’s been nice to see the fish enjoy the added hiding spots, and they don't require the upkeep that live plants sometimes need.

 

[Beermann]

You're on the right track, especially after bouncing back from the CO2 and ick issues.

Root Tabs:
For your Amazon sword, I'd recommend adding root tabs. Even with soil, swords are heavy root feeders, and tabs could help with the curling.

Nutrient Dosing:
Your dosing seems solid, but with lots of rooted plants and pothos in the tank, your current ferts might be getting outpaced. Consider bumping iron and potassium a bit.

Wisteria Rooting from Stem:
Not unusual—usually a sign it's trying to propagate or search for nutrients. If it's otherwise healthy, it's not a big concern.

Buce Issues:
Buce is sensitive and feeds from the water column. Slightly increasing micros and ensuring no leftover med residue could help.

Pothos Impact:
Established pothos can suck up a lot of nutrients. You might either prune it back or dose more across the board.

Let us know how it progresses—would love to see updates!


You're right—algae don't need the same structures as plants and can quickly take advantage of available nutrients. The idea that plants "outcompete" algae purely by consuming nutrients first is oversimplified.

I agree that the real competition is more complex and probably involves allelopathy (chemical inhibition), shading, and creating stable conditions that favor plant metabolism over algal growth. Giving plants optimal conditions—CO2, light, and balanced fertilizers—lets them thrive and possibly suppress algae indirectly through stronger growth and biochemical processes.

It's not just about starving algae, but empowering plants to do the job right.

I apologize for the late response, I had to travel for a bit and had someone else tending to my tank

I've just increased micro and potassium by +2ml per day and iron +1 (my micro doses small amount of iron so this lower iron dose offsets the amount of iron i need to dose per shot)

I use a diy mixture of fertilizers and I also added some extra soil yesterday for things to root into

Will work on getting tabs this week