Discus Gang Updates

[Onpots]

An update on fry growth.



Already showing bars.

I've tried to feed them frozen discus food but they were not very excited, they love a dry mix of different foods I grind.

Looking good so far. I wonder what colors will they get when they grow up. Mother is a diamond and father a turquoise.

 

[86 ssinit]

Looking good! Colors should be a mix.

 

[86 ssinit]

Well looks like all survived . Planted tank took a beating. Saved plants in another tank .and the other tank.red tigers laid eggs yesterday so things have improved .

 

[fa4960]

You seem to be a better fish doctor than me. I lose one or more every time illness strikes.... Keep going.

 

[Solomonsolomon]

Dinner

 

[nikm128]

Hey guys I'm back!

 

[86 ssinit]

Lol! Good to see ya! How ya doing?

 

[Solomonsolomon]

Just last night's pic

 

[Cheesecake]

Hey guys I'm back!

Its been a minute huh? Good to see you back .

 

[86 ssinit]

Well he was back for a minute anyway!

 

[nikm128]

Its been a minute huh? Good to see you back .

It certainly has been, hopefully I'll have a little more time to chat with everyone while I'm out of college for summer

 

[86 ssinit]

My breading setup consist basically on an about 800ml container for the fry with an air and water inlet that lets water flow trough a thin net into a 1.5L container with plants and again the water flows through a sponge out to the tank which has two internal filters and an external filter. The two fases makes cleaning easier as most of the dirt stays in one of the two containers and very little goes in the main tank.

Before feeding the fry I siphon the small container leaving about half of the water while they eat. I found that the fry eat much more this way as they are literally surrounded by bbs and I need to throw in very little food so the water stays cleaner.

I've been told that fry need space to develop... So my question here is: in about how many cl per Fish do you keep your fry over their development? Do you think that leaving the fry in a reduced space for too long , say more than one month, could affect their development?
View attachment 777965

Don’t know how I missed this!! That system looks great! Any chance I could get a pic looking down at it? Just to see the hook ups. Thanks.

 

[TheK79]

Hey gang, it’s been a while since I checked in. So the strangest thing just happened. My red melon laid some eggs and a few seconds later the panda came over and ate them. The red melon also doesn’t look like she’s paired up with anyone. I have a blue diamond in the tank and she pecks him every time he comes near so I’m not sure what to make of this. Do females lay eggs without being paired up with anyone? Also, in one of the pics you can see the blue diamond is performing a similar egg laying behavior on the breeding cone. Is he trying to fertilize?

 

[SouthAmericanCichlids]

Hey gang, it’s been a while since I checked in. So the strangest thing just happened. My red melon laid some eggs and a few seconds later the panda came over and ate them. The red melon also doesn’t look like she’s paired up with anyone. I have a blue diamond in the tank and she pecks him every time he comes near so I’m not sure what to make of this. Do females lay eggs without being paired up with anyone? Also, in one of the pics you can see the blue diamond is performing a similar egg laying behavior on the breeding cone. Is he trying to fertilize?

I here angels have very similar behaviors to angels, and my angels have laid multiple times without pairing up or even pairing up soon after.

 

[TheK79]

I here angels have very similar behaviors to angels, and my angels have laid multiple times without pairing up or even pairing up soon aftes

Shoot, I’m hoping that’s not what’s happening here. Got me excited for no reason then. Maybe she’s paired up with the blue diamond but it’s hard to tell.

 

[86 ssinit]

It will lay eggs again within the week. Once they start they usually continue for awhile. Could be a pair could be 2 females you just have to watch and wait. If it’s a pair and you want to try raising them you’ll have to remove the other discus. Takes about 5 days for the eggs to become wigglers than a few more days till they start swimming. For young fish it may take months to actually get wigglers. Good luck and enjoy!!

 

[TheK79]

It will lay eggs again within the week. Once they start they usually continue for awhile. Could be a pair could be 2 females you just have to watch and wait. If it’s a pair and you want to try raising them you’ll have to remove the other discus. Takes about 5 days for the eggs to become wigglers than a few more days till they start swimming. For young fish it may take months to actually get wigglers. Good luck and enjoy!!

Hey; thank you that helps. Hope your well. My first post on this thread was about a year or so ago when I first got my discus and now they’re laying eggs. How time flies! I’ve attached a picture. The red melon was the one laying the eggs and the panda is the egg eater. Any guesses on the sex of the blue diamond and red panda? These 3 have been close to each other for the past couple of days. Hope one of them is a male and the other female.

 

[86 ssinit]

Hard to tell. The next time you see the one laying eggs see if either of the other two have there tubes dropped. They will lay eggs weekly. Now you’ve got to decide what you want to do. It may take many times before the parents get it right. These guys have been at its for over a year. They just never let the fry attach.

 

[TheK79]

Hard to tell. The next time you see the one laying eggs see if either of the other two have there tubes dropped. They will lay eggs weekly. Now you’ve got to decide what you want to do. It may take many times before the parents get it right. These guys have been at its for over a year. They just never let the fry attach.View attachment 827422

Oh wow that’s a really long time. Have you tried using the net? Are they in a community tank? I had mine in a community tank and moved them to my grower tank when I noticed their behavior changing, body shaking, getting more aggressive and the second day after I moved them one ended up laying eggs. At least I know which one is a female now. I also got 4 white leopards in there that I was growing out. I’m considering putting them back in the main tank and wait for a pair to develop. Not sure if I should keep the small ones mixed in with the bigger ones. Saw a video from Jack Wattley about growth inhibiting toxins that affect juveniles.

 

[86 ssinit]

Not sure what a net is. But I tried for awhile earlier in the year. Put them in there own tank. Lowered the water whatever I could find info on. But they just kept eating the swimmers. So I also tried artificial. But still couldn’t get the fry to eat. Than reality hit as I asked lps’s if there’d be interested in young discus. And nobody was interested!! May try again just to see if I can go all the way. But it’s very time consuming!! That pair is a really nice pair! They are red tigers from Kenny. I’ve also got 3 other pairs laying eggs at different times in my tanks. But the combos are not anything that’s desired.

As to hormones with smaller fish. It only happened to me when growing out 8 2.5” Hans discus. Never happened with 4” fish. There’s a lot to growing out discus. Clean new water Is key!

 

[coralbandit]

Net would be the screen IMO .

 

[TheK79]

Not sure what a net is. But I tried for awhile earlier in the year. Put them in there own tank. Lowered the water whatever I could find info on. But they just kept eating the swimmers. So I also tried artificial. But still couldn’t get the fry to eat. Than reality hit as I asked lps’s if there’d be interested in young discus. And nobody was interested!! May try again just to see if I can go all the way. But it’s very time consuming!! That pair is a really nice pair! They are red tigers from Kenny. I’ve also got 3 other pairs laying eggs at different times in my tanks. But the combos are not anything that’s desired.

As to hormones with smaller fish. It only happened to me when growing out 8 2.5” Hans discus. Never happened with 4” fish. There’s a lot to growing out discus. Clean new water Is key!I

I agree, it’s very time consuming. I ended moving the larger ones back into the main tank and just got a few juveniles in there now. Wasn’t really sure what I was gonna do if the eggs did end up hatching. I think I just wanted to see the whole process unfold, I’ve seen videos of baby discus and they look so adorable and I wanted to see that happen in my tank. I hope I get a pair out of the juveniles, they’re white leopards from Hans. Really beautiful colors.

 

[86 ssinit]

My pair took those to wigglers. Than I think the other fish got them.
Yeah one day I’ll try. But no hurry.
As for the Hans I’ve got 13 of his discus. Had 2 white leopards. But neither grew. I got them at 2.5” they grew to 3.5. One died and the other never grew. Thing with Hans is you’ve got to buy the bigger discus.

 

[TheK79]

My pair took those to wigglers. Than I think the other fish got them.
Yeah one day I’ll try. But no hurry.
As for the Hans I’ve got 13 of his discus. Had 2 white leopards. But neither grew. I got them at 2.5” they grew to 3.5. One died and the other never grew. Thing with Hans is you’ve got to buy the bigger discus.

Hope I’m able to grow out mine. I had bad luck with Hans also, bought 6 and only 2 survived but I also think it partly due to putting them in the main tank with the bigger guys. The new ones I got are in a separate tank and get fed 3 times a day. So far theyre eating like a piranhas. I’ll update in 6 months. The 6 I got from Jack Wattley are all still alive and still growing. I think it’s difficult to replicate Hans water quality and care in a home setting.

 

[86 ssinit]

Well that funny because Hans Stenker discus claim that they do not need the water changes and care that other discus do. They also claim that high nitrates won’t bother them. Funny stuff!!
I’ve bought Hans twice. 6 first time. 2.5” raised in a 125 planted tank. That group grew 3 to 6 1 5.5” and 2 to 4”. Water changed 50% 2-3x a week. Next group I got 8 2.5. Started them in a 45 doing 75% water changes daily. 6 quickly grew to 4” 2 stopped at 3”. Moved them into a 75 for a few months still doing the wc. 2 grew to 6” 4 to 5” and the last 2 stayed at 3. Next into a 125. All but the 2 grew a bit more.
For beginner discus they are great. Get your start with them. They are strong. But for me I can tell a Stenker discus from other discus. They just look different.
Hans Discusnotice the slope in the head.
Asian discusnotice no slope.

 

[TheK79]

Well that funny because Hans Stenker discus claim that they do not need the water changes and care that other discus do. They also claim that high nitrates won’t bother them. Funny stuff!!
I’ve bought Hans twice. 6 first time. 2.5” raised in a 125 planted tank. That group grew 3 to 6 1 5.5” and 2 to 4”. Water changed 50% 2-3x a week. Next group I got 8 2.5. Started them in a 45 doing 75% water changes daily. 6 quickly grew to 4” 2 stopped at 3”. Moved them into a 75 for a few months still doing the wc. 2 grew to 6” 4 to 5” and the last 2 stayed at 3. Next into a 125. All but the 2 grew a bit more.
For beginner discus they are great. Get your start with them. They are strong. But for me I can tell a Stenker discus from other discus. They just look different.
Hans DiscusView attachment 828543View attachment 828544View attachment 828545notice the slope in the head.
Asian discusView attachment 828546View attachment 828547View attachment 828548View attachment 828549notice no slope.

That’s so cool. I never noticed the slope before. It was probably my water changes then. For my main tank which is a 130 gallon I can’t do more than 50% per week and initially I didn’t have a second smaller tank. With the second tank the maintenance is much easier and I can do more water changes during the week. How do you they stopped growing? Do you take them out of the tank to measure?

 

[jpm995]

That’s so cool. I never noticed the slope before. It was probably my water changes then. For my main tank which is a 130 gallon I can’t do more than 50% per week and initially I didn’t have a second smaller tank. With the second tank the maintenance is much easier and I can do more water changes during the week. How do you they stopped growing? Do you take them out of the tank to measure?

I not sold on that idea. I do less water changes than you and my discus doesn't have that slope and i got him at 50 cent size. Genetics may play a bigger part. I'm no expert on discus just my best guess.

Well that funny because Hans Stenker discus claim that they do not need the water changes and care that other discus do. They also claim that high nitrates won’t bother them. Funny stuff!!
I’ve bought Hans twice. 6 first time. 2.5” raised in a 125 planted tank. That group grew 3 to 6 1 5.5” and 2 to 4”. Water changed 50% 2-3x a week. Next group I got 8 2.5. Started them in a 45 doing 75% water changes daily. 6 quickly grew to 4” 2 stopped at 3”. Moved them into a 75 for a few months still doing the wc. 2 grew to 6” 4 to 5” and the last 2 stayed at 3. Next into a 125. All but the 2 grew a bit more.
For beginner discus they are great. Get your start with them. They are strong. But for me I can tell a Stenker discus from other discus. They just look different.
Hans DiscusView attachment 828543View attachment 828544View attachment 828545notice the slope in the head.
Asian discusView attachment 828546View attachment 828547View attachment 828548View attachment 828549notice no slope.

Thats really strange. The fact that it's so many disks kind of eliminates it's just a bad luck thing. What's you're feeling on the cause?

 

[86 ssinit]

I’m not sure why it happened. I’ve seen many of his discus on Facebook that were bought at the 2.5 size and they look like mine. But I’ve also seen his grown discus from 5”-6+” and they don’t have it. Again I’ve seen stenker discus from oversees and theirs look more like the Asians.
Most of my Asian discus I bought at 4-5”. But the 2 orange ones in the middle were bought with 2 others at 3.5” from Dennis discus and all of these guys grew to 6” the same way I did the second set of Hans. So I don’t believe it’s my water.

 

[jpm995]

I thought it wasn't hereditary because their different strains but what else could it be? If it was just pictures i'd say camara angle or something weird but you see these fish live every day. I doubt diet, possible water quality when their fry affects how they look when grown? Or maybe this is common in many discus but it's not apparent until their grown?

 

[86 ssinit]

Hereditary would be one line. But how can all his lines show the same? For me I believe the smaller the discus the more likely this will happen. They sell off the worst first and keep the best to grow out. Why I say to buy bigger. Yes it’s fun to grow out but I’d advise just doing it once. I now have 5 Hans fish in secondary tanks. On the other site these would be considered culls. It’s a shame out of 14 only 5 came out good. 3 from the first group and 2 from the second. 3 more from the second have grown to 4-5” but all have the slope. The ones pictured are the first 2 6+” and the third a German wonder at about 5”.


When you said you grew 1 from the fifty cent size were you referring to a Hans? In my group I’ve also got 7 from pets warehouse. All bought at the quarter size. All but one of these grew to 5”. They were my first new discus. None of them have the slope. Though this guys does have a little off the norm headbut this is expected from store bought discus.

TheK79. Yes I do measure them when I move them from tank to tank. I have a container with inches marked off. I full it with water and add the fish to see the size. As to stopping growth they grow for around 18 months.

 

[jpm995]

No, my little discus was bought from Pets Warehouse just before they moved the Copiague store. They were selling as much stock as possible before the move. I had no idea he would look so good when he grew. I got him [think he's a Pidgeon Blood] for $14. He's the centerpiece of my 55 gallon. I never bought from Han's, i was planning to when i go to a bigger tank. Your analysis seems reasonable but disappointing as i like to get fish when small and see them flourish as they grow. Edit to ask do you think this trait would be recognized when there small [2.5-3"] if you knew to look for it?

 

[86 ssinit]

Thing is you’d have to see them. Here’s the first 6 I got from Hans and the second 8of all in the first pic the one in the front came out the best

 

[jpm995]

I'm shocked, i've never heard anything but glowing reviews about Han's. Hard to believe it's seems to be all of them. It will be some time before i can upgrade looks like i have some research to do.

 

[86 ssinit]

Again it’s his small discus. Like you I do enjoy growing them out. It was fun. But since buying his ive now bought bigger discus. Yes more money but less work . Hans 4+” discus are usually great! Of the 14 I’ve bought only one died. And you’ve got to understand in the end you get what you pay for. In the end they all cost the same. Hans is probably the only one who sells small discus other than local pet stores. He’s survivablity is why we buy them.
But I now recommend bigger discus.

 

[jpm995]

Your logic sounds really solid. Plus price is important but far from the top priority. Healthy, beautiful fish would be # 1 for me. I just like seeing them go from small nice-looking discus to beautiful showstoppers. I'm old school so i'm more accustomed to the days when discus were wild caught and the bigger ones were very picky about feeding and the younger were easier to adapt to tank life. The 4" discus are sounding like the way to go. I just love some of the strains Han's sells, especially the German Wonder discus.

 

[coralbandit]

One of my Hans German Wonder ;

 

[jpm995]

Wow that's a beautiful fish.

 

[TheK79]

No, my little discus was bought from Pets Warehouse just before they moved the Copiague store. They were selling as much stock as possible before the move. I had no idea he would look so good when he grew. I got him [think he's a Pidgeon Blood] for $14. He's the centerpiece of my 55 gallon. I never bought from Han's, i was planning to when i go to a bigger tank. Your analysis seems reasonable but disappointing as i like to get fish when small and see them flourish as they grow. Edit to ask do you think this trait would be recognized when there small [2.5-3"] if you knew to look for it?

Yes, I agree. It’s disheartening to hear that the worst ones are picked out of the pack to be sold. Hoping the ones I got grow out to be nice and healthy. I feel like I got them on a pretty good diet with the vitamins and different varieties of food. My previous mistake with the ones that dies was feeding only Sally’s beef heart so I don’t think they were able to build up a proper immune system. I’ve attached a few pics, let me know what you guys think. Also, not sure if you can notice that stomach bulge but is that from overeating? I’m hoping it’ll go away as they get older. The bigger ones don’t seem to have it and they’re on the same food and schedule.

 

[86 ssinit]

These guys are from Wattleys? Funny they look like Hans.

 

[TheK79]

They’re from Hans. These guys are from Wattley, I think they’ve reached their max growth.

 

[jpm995]

Yes, I agree. It’s disheartening to hear that the worst ones are picked out of the pack to be sold. Hoping the ones I got grow out to be nice and healthy. I feel like I got them on a pretty good diet with the vitamins and different varieties of food. My previous mistake with the ones that dies was feeding only Sally’s beef heart so I don’t think they were able to build up a proper immune system. I’ve attached a few pics, let me know what you guys think. Also, not sure if you can notice that stomach bulge but is that from overeating? I’m hoping it’ll go away as they get older. The bigger ones don’t seem to have it and they’re on the same food and schedule.

I don't know, in the third pic the blue one [sorry i don't know the strains] seems to have a more 'rounded' look from the top fin to the mouth. The orange/yellow in front of him seems to be almost a straight line from his top fin to his mouth. 86ss would probably have a more reliable opinion as he's seen this in person. I'm undecided.

 

[86 ssinit]

Well I did ask if they were Hans.
TheK79 yeah there Hans. The pigeons are allready showing lots of peppering. The one with the stripes I bought as a silver pigeon but when fully grown was a dark angel. (It was 3yrs old and just died). My advice is change water daily at 50% a day till around 4”. Get yourself a second tank. If any stop eating move into the second tank. I found at about a month from getting them I started have problems with not eating. When moved all but 1 started eating again. Some say it’s hormones. Sure seemed like it to me. First the wonders stopped eating than the white leapords. Of those 4 only one grew to 5”. Of the other 3 1 died 1 maybe 3” and the other 4”. The other 4 2 hit 6” 2 5”. That was my second group from Hans. I bought 8 at 2.5”. Pictures earlier on this page.
Jim on the other site there’s a good thread Shan’s journal. He’s bought all Hans discus.

 

[TheK79]

Anyone here feed live black worms to their discus? What has your experience been so far? I seen so many different opinions where people swear by them and others tell you stay away. I recently started and have noticed a extremely positive behavior change in my discus.

 

[86 ssinit]

I haven’t this time around. Did years ago and they were bad than. Was said they carried all sorts of bad bacteria,parisites. Discus used to turn black and die. Things are different now. All of that could have just been cross contamination from the stores putting all the discus in one tank. I see Cary Strong and Stu both feed live black worms and many others on the Facebook sites. One guys growing his own culture. I know this the discus got huge eating them back when I used them. I havnt read any bad results yet so go for it and if you can let me know how it goes. When you get them rinse them in cold water to get whatever’s in there that doesn’t belong out. Used to find leaches with them. Back than I also used to add vitamin liquid vitamins to the water they were in.

Where did you get yours? Local pet store or mail order?

 

[TheK79]

I haven’t this time around. Did years ago and they were bad than. Was said they carried all sorts of bad bacteria,parisites. Discus used to turn black and die. Things are different now. All of that could have just been cross contamination from the stores putting all the discus in one tank. I see Cary Strong and Stu both feed live black worms and many others on the Facebook sites. One guys growing his own culture. I know this the discus got huge eating them back when I used them. I havnt read any bad results yet so go for it and if you can let me know how it goes. When you get them rinse them in cold water to get whatever’s in there that doesn’t belong out. Used to find leaches with them. Back than I also used to add vitamin liquid vitamins to the water they were in.

Where did you get yours? Local pet store or mail order?

I bought them from my LFS. I wonder how long it took for the fish to get sick. I’ve been feeding them for about a week now and it’s a once a day thing, usually in the morning. I started to culture the black worms also, found a few videos on YouTube and seems pretty easy, I’m dropping in spriluna shrimp with some dry foods that contain all the vitamins so that should gut load the worms properly. Since I started, I’ve noticed a difference in their behavior also, less aggressive, less frightened and definitely more active throughout the day. I also figured it’s better for my tank as the worms don’t decay and if they do the plants can use them up as natural nutrients. Once my culture starts going, I’m thinking of only feeding black worms and spriluna shrimp and getting rid the of beef heart.

 

[86 ssinit]

I rarely feed beefheart. Maybe once a week. Instead of the live blackworms I feed the freeze dried black worms (fdbw). It does get expensive though. I also feed sera discus granules and a flake mixture. They eat it all.