Lowering pH in Walstad Tank

[Justin I]

Hi Everyone,
Does anyone know an ideal way to lower the pH in a Walstad tank? I've got some EasyBalance, but the bottle indicates that it should not be used in tanks with little water flow (the bottle actually suggests an airstone, which is impractical for a Walstad setup). I've also considered an API water softener pillow, but I am seeing mixed reviews on those.

All water parameters are good. pH is currently at 8.0 - hardly an extreme, but I guess its the top boundary for the platys that are in the tank.
I'd appreciate any advice! Thank you all!
-J

 

[Freshfishguy]

Hi Everyone,
Does anyone know an ideal way to lower the pH in a Walstad tank? I've got some EasyBalance, but the bottle indicates that it should not be used in tanks with little water flow (the bottle actually suggests an airstone, which is impractical for a Walstad setup). I've also considered an API water softener pillow, but I am seeing mixed reviews on those.

All water parameters are good. pH is currently at 8.0 - hardly an extreme, but I guess its the top boundary for the platys that are in the tank.
I'd appreciate any advice! Thank you all!
-J

The best way would probably be incorporating the use of some RODI water. Are you using tap water?

 

[Nianichole]

Is it possible to find out the PH the fish were kept in before you bought them? It's possible they're already adjusted to a higher PH and you don't need to do anything. Most fish are captive bred and aren't coming from the wild anymore anyway, so their "ideals" aren't as applicable to some degree.

I'm definitely a newby, so feel free to ignore me but I think stable parameters might be better than chasing a PH that's difficult to maintain.

My substrate completely tanked my PH and trying to manually adjust it and then prevent swings was difficult.

 

[MasterPython]

If you are buying fish locally the store will probably use conditioned tap water in thier tanks so they would be used to it.

 

[Andres391]

Hi Everyone,
Does anyone know an ideal way to lower the pH in a Walstad tank? I've got some EasyBalance, but the bottle indicates that it should not be used in tanks with little water flow (the bottle actually suggests an airstone, which is impractical for a Walstad setup). I've also considered an API water softener pillow, but I am seeing mixed reviews on those.

All water parameters are good. pH is currently at 8.0 - hardly an extreme, but I guess its the top boundary for the platys that are in the tank.
I'd appreciate any advice! Thank you all!
-J

I would add a large almond leaf they will slowly release tannins lowering your ph safely!

 

[MacZ]

All water parameters are good. pH is currently at 8.0 - hardly an extreme, but I guess its the top boundary for the platys that are in the tank.

Nothing to change, it's perfect for livebearers. They need hard water and pH shouldn't fall below 7.5. Don't know who told you they need softer water or lower pH but that's nonesense.
Also artificially changing water chemistry in a walstad tank is a big no-go and goes against the whole concept.

I would add a large almond leaf they will slowly release tannins lowering your ph safely!

While botanicals are the safest way to lower pH, in a tank with a pH of 8 the KH is guaranteed to be too high for the humic acids from the leaves to change pH.

But again:
In this case not necessary at all.

Admittedly I'm a bit worried that Platies might turn over the whole concept anyway, as Walstad tanks are also conceptually designed to work with low stocking density and bioload.

 

[Andres391]

Nothing to change, it's perfect for livebearers. They need hard water and pH shouldn't fall below 7.5. Don't know who told you they need softer water or lower pH but that's nonesense.
Also artificially changing water chemistry in a walstad tank is a big no-go and goes against the whole concept.



While botanicals are the safest way to lower pH, in a tank with a pH of 8 the KH is guaranteed to be too high for the humic acids from the leaves to change pH.

But again:
In this case not necessary at all.

Admittedly I'm a bit worried that Platies might turn over the whole concept anyway, as Walstad tanks are also conceptually designed to work with low stocking density and bioload.

It's true there's no need to change the ph for platys there natural environments are found in ponds around souther Mexico and Central America with a ph between 6.8 to 8. But if you want to lower the ph for what ever reason thats up to you both botanicals and almond leafs will work in lowering ph that's why I said a large almond leaf vs adding 2 to 3 leaves vs 4 to 5 pieces of botanicals which if you buy bin a package they were rinsed boiled and some of those tannins are released before going to a package and not all botanicals are the same some will make you water dark but no change in ph. Almond leaves have never failed me but then again I never had a ph of 8 but 7.8 its a slow process if you want to do it the safe way. Walstad method to me is an Idea and just like anything it can be improved or Walstad method can be applied but with a little extra help of fertilizer or changing the ph of you water if you want them to have a natural environment or to breed them. In a natural environment the ph does change from time to time but it doesn't happen instantly its cool, warm, hot, rains water level drops and raises the whole thing is that it acclimate to its new environment not instantly were you can but them in shock. Again Walstad is a method and and Idea. I have a walstad method 10 gallon tank with 9 amber teras and 1 Endler live bearer with almond leafs and I do 10 percent weekly water changes and I add fertilizer no issues my filter is my deep substrate of 2.5 inches along with small lava rocks and 40 cherry shrimps and 2 amano shrimps no issues if this isn't walstad method thats okay its working.

It's true there's no need to change the ph for platys there natural environments are found in ponds around souther Mexico and Central America with a ph between 6.8 to 8. But if you want to lower the ph for what ever reason thats up to you both botanicals and almond leafs will work in lowering ph that's why I said a large almond leaf vs adding 2 to 3 leaves vs 4 to 5 pieces of botanicals which if you buy bin a package they were rinsed boiled and some of those tannins are released before going to a package and not all botanicals are the same some will make you water dark but no change in ph. Almond leaves have never failed me but then again I never had a ph of 8 but 7.8 its a slow process if you want to do it the safe way. Walstad method to me is an Idea and just like anything it can be improved or Walstad method can be applied but with a little extra help of fertilizer or changing the ph of you water if you want them to have a natural environment or to breed them. In a natural environment the ph does change from time to time but it doesn't happen instantly its cool, warm, hot, rains water level drops and raises the whole thing is that it acclimate to its new environment not instantly were you can but them in shock. Again Walstad is a method and and Idea. I have a walstad method 10 gallon tank with 9 amber teras and 1 Endler live bearer with almond leafs and I do 10 percent weekly water changes and I add fertilizer no issues my filter is my deep substrate of 2.5 inches along with small lava rocks and 40 cherry shrimps and 2 amano shrimps no issues if this isn't walstad method thats okay its working.

Almost forgot I only feed once a day since they are fully grown. Thats the key to having a filterless tank with a full stock is not over feeding them weekly 10 percent water changes to add more dissolved oxygen to support a full stock and shrimps to help break down any waste from food, poop and dead plants. Thats what worked for me.

 

[MacZ]

But if you want to lower the ph for what ever reason thats up to you both botanicals and almond leafs will work in lowering ph that's why I said a large almond leaf vs adding 2 to 3 leaves vs 4 to 5 pieces of botanicals which if you buy bin a package they were rinsed boiled and some of those tannins are released before going to a package and not all botanicals are the same some will make you water dark but no change in ph. Almond leaves have never failed me but then again I never had a ph of 8 but 7.8 its a slow process if you want to do it the safe way.

The KH has to be reasonably low for the botanical method to work significantly. I know very much what I'm talking about. All the basics are behind the link I posted.

 

[Andres391]

The KH has to be reasonably low for the botanical method to work significantly. I know very much what I'm talking about. All the basics are behind the link I posted.

It can be done maybe not significantly but within 2 to 3 weeks I'm sure that would do the trick. Rain water has a ph of around 5 thanks to co2 so co2 can lower your ph also.

 

[MacZ]

It can be done maybe not significantly but within 2 to 3 weeks I'm sure that would do the trick. Rain water has a ph of around 5 thanks to co2 so co2 can lower your ph also.

Botanicals will lower the pH, when used in high enough amounts a. only by a low margin and b. most likely switch bach with a waterchange replenishing the carbonates while removig H+.
Rainwater has no KH, just as RO. That's why it works. Now going by a starting pH of 8, the water of the OP definitely has a significant KH, which humic acids are too weak to neutralise before changing pH.
And yes, there is the connection of KH, pH and CO2, but using CO2 requires a steady supply, and failsafes for the event of the CO2-supply running out, as water with a significant KH will turn to the pH the KH is basically presetting quite fast. A friend tried running his tank with low pH using CO2. Worked until it ran out while he was at work. pH went up from 5.6 to about 8 within hours.
There's your reason why I am not a friend of any method that doesn't lower KH first, as those are prone to a lot of unwanted fluctuations. And please don't try to tell me in nature there are fluctuations, too: In nature the fish have many options to evade those fluctuations by moving to other water layers or to other parts of a river or lake. A fish tank is a closed environment and steady levels are much more important in a closed system.

I've been going through the pros and cons of different methods of changing pH for quite a while now, experimenting myself and taking experience from observing others as well.

So in my opinion it is important to answer questions like in this threat thoroughly and with the necessary info, otherwise either the person that asks the question gets a wrong impression and makes mistakes that would have been preventable or may even (been there here on the forum) angry with reason for being advised wrong.