First marine setup!

[Michaelwolfe92]

changing my Freshwater 29 gallon to a Saltwater FOWLR setup! Going to use my canister filter with some live rock rubble, bag of carbon and a bag of phosgaurd. I've just painted the back and one side of it black and painted all my inlet and outlet black so they disappear into the background. Once I've cleaned it properly il be filling with RODI/salt water, live rock and sand and then the cycle can begin!! Il be using a nano internal skimmer and weekly 5 gallon water changes. Can't wait to get water in and get it cycled

 

[Ken Ooi]

Yes, Obi-Wan. Marine tank project looks great! Is the top white a plastic frame for the tank?

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

Yes unfortunately its not removable and I don't want to damage it trying. Plus the light sits on it as it came with it. I quite like the white framing with the black background tbf. Can't wait to get it filled and get some live rock and sand it and get my powerhead bought. What would you suggest to put in the 3 trays in my canister filter.

 

[ryanr]

Hi, looks good

Question: Did you paint the submerged parts of your inlet/outlets? If so, what type of paint? Not all paint is suitable to be submerged in a fish tank.

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

Yes I did and I used plastI dip which is suitable for submerged parts

 

[ryanr]

Yes I did and I used plastI dip which is suitable for submerged parts

OK cool. But keep an eye on it, Saltwater is quite corrosive. Most of those paints are suitable for Freshwater environments Not saying it won't work, just watch for peeling.

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

Yeah plastI dip is safe for SW, I've searched loads haha

 

[DocRick]

How is everything coming along?

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

Just waiting to get tonight over with and I'm going to buy all the stuff to start it cycling

 

[DocRick]

Nice.

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

it's been running with steriliser in it for about a week now so I'm going to completely empty it, order my powerhead, once that's arrived il buy the water/live rock and sand. My Lfs told me to add the water first then put the live rock in and then the sand? Wouldn't it be easier to buy it all at once sit the live rock on the bare bottom, add the sand around it and then pour the water in?

 

[DocRick]

Yes. Sand first then rocks then water. If you fill it up with water first you'll displace it all with new additions. You can slowly add the water using your water pump from the bucket and let it pour onto a rock.

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

That's what I was thinking, the water comes in 25litre tubs with a tap on the bottom so it's easy to pour into the tank

 

[DocRick]

Some people add rock first and then spread the sand around it. This is done to avoid the rock movement when you have a goby that like to lanscape for you. It's a personal preference. I placed them on top of the sand and gradually added water. You will still get the cloudiness, etc. But not as much.

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

Il probs add my two base pieces the. Put the sand in, then add the rest of the rock, then water. What sort of time window do you have before the live rock starts to dry out. Just so I know how long iv sort of got sorting my rock out before adding the water

 

[DocRick]

Mine were out about 2 hours after I got home, I don't even know how long they were out at the LFS before I picked them up. If you have hitchhikers they may die off, but surprinsingly some will survive. Are you picking them up? You can place them all in a bucket with some water while you do your landscapping. Or if being delivered by mail just keep them in container they arrived in while you do your thing. Some people clean them off when they arrive and even let them bask in the sun to kill off hitchhikers. I still find myself landscaping every time I get a couple of new additions. But only on the rock that's empty. Once I place my corals, I don't move those.

 

[Michaelwolfe92]

I'm picking it all up, sand, live rock and water on the same day. I want it to stay as live as possible

 

[aaron0g]

Put rocks and some water in a bucket whilst not using put the base rocks in and water to cover and add sand, then when you are happy with that build up the rest of the rocks and finish filling, this way they should be as live as possible, good luck

 

[Asomeone]

Just wanted to make a post. I'm super excited to try out saltwater. I got the fluval flex 15gal and figured I would give the salty fish a go. I am making a FOWLR tank. If it goes well, maybe convert a current tank to saltwater, we'll see.
Anyway I got 2 seeded live rocks from the LFS today and paired them with some dry rock I had. I have more semi-live rock I'm getting tomorrow. I say semI because its rock that's been in a saltwater tank without a heater, water movement, or water changes for about 2 months. I assume there's still some bacteria left on them but not much.
I read somewhere that adding too much live rock quickly can crash the tank. Is this true? in my experiences with freshwater I've never heard of this.
Also I did a very shoddy set up of the marine tank. I bought the live rock at 12pm today. Set up the tank with prime, Instant ocean, and tap water at 1:30pm, and built the stand at 4pm. So....been a busy day. I feel like with the way I did this I'll be running into issues...I've just been trying to research the types of issues I'll run into.
I didn't wash the sand which is "super naturals" sand I just plopped it in and assumed it would be alright. I didn't clean the live rock before I put it in, just figured any hitchhikers would add to the tank. I understand I didn't do this by the book and will have to wait and see what happens...but a little hint on the possibilities would be nice too.
I've also got a little hitchhiked coral and I'm wondering about its viability in the tank. I'm happy to just leave it and see what happens but if someone thinks it would cause issues I'll remove it.
Also! I'm a little confused about which levels are proper. I thought in saltwater it was supposed to be 0 nitrates 0 nitrites and 0 ammonia. But some of the videos I was watching said that it only has to be 0 nitrites for saltwater. That's just following the freshwater rules and doesn't make sense to me. Aren't all saltwater fish extremely intolerant of both nitrite and nitrate?
I know I just keep going on, lots of questions. I have freshwater nerite snails that do fine in my freshwater tanks. I'm in the process of getting a RODI system but...its a process. If my freshwater snails are not harmed by possible trace levels of metals like copper in the system will the saltwater also be fine? I know tap water is not optimal for saltwater but I figured give it a go and if I have to change it then I will.

I'm very excited about this tank. Once its all set up and levels are good maybe even some very hardy corals. Only a 10w light so only would be the hardiest of hardy.

 

[Tony_097]

I know you are excited about your new salty tank but tap water is not the proper way to go as it's too unsafe (and causes alage too)for a marine enviorment. I see your into coral and that's were the fun starts. To start it off, yes saltwater is expenisve and a reef even more.
Do you have a small power head for thr tank ? I would add one as you can get a nasty case of cyano without one. Apart from that plan on getting an rodI system and you set.

And to end the essay I wrote I see you want hardy corals will you plan a fowlr ($) or a reef ($$) I know some people might say it's not exspensive but anyone coming from the fw side will find it exspenive.

My question is Reef or fowlr ?

 

[Asomeone]

I know you are excited about your new salty tank but tap water is not the proper way to go as it's too unsafe (and causes alage too)for a marine enviorment. I see your into coral and that's were the fun starts. To start it off, yes saltwater is expenisve and a reef even more.
Do you have a small power head for thr tank ? I would add one as you can get a nasty case of cyano without one. Apart from that plan on getting an rodI system and you set.

And to end the essay I wrote I see you want hardy corals will you plan a fowlr ($) or a reef ($$) I know some people might say it's not exspensive but anyone coming from the fw side will find it exspenive.

My question is Reef or fowlr ?

Well fowlr to start, probably about 6 months to let everything settle, add fish/shrimp/snails, then possibly add a couple hardy corals. The Ro system should come in next week and I'll be doing water changes with that from then on.
My flex tank has 2 heads for the output of the pump that allow me to shift direction of flow towards the rock. I thought it might be enough considering the size of the tank.
As far as expense goes, I'm hoping I'm past the expensive side since everything is in the tank aside from fish/cleanup crew.

 

[Tony_097]

Good choice to start but for a reef tank you will want to get a wave maker as flow is the backbone of a reef. My first coral would be a zoanthid or a Duncan coral as their are relatively fast growing and hardy.
Question #2 what’s your budget so people can recommend you to some equipment.

 

[Asomeone]

Good choice to start but for a reef tank you will want to get a wave maker as flow is the backbone of a reef. My first coral would be a zoanthid or a Duncan coral as their are relatively fast growing and hardy.
Question #2 what’s your budget so people can recommend you to some equipment.

tough question. If its absolutely necessary I'll buy it. If not its meehhhh. Maybe 100 bucks.

 

[Tony_097]

Since your tank is a nano water changes will be what keeps your system going but in an eventual reef you need 3 essential things 1)good flow 2)good water chemistry 3) good lighting so...

1: a jebao is pretty good inexpensive brand of wave makers and so is the koralia line don’t bother with those little suction cups ones they won’t stick if your life depended on it
2) as I said good salt and proper habits will keep this good
3) the light for a reef that I personally use an have see results is the hiparergo light for $60 on amazon. yes there are kessils which have used but you won’t want to break the bank it is a proven light for nanos

Here’s the link and here are some pics of the lights

 

[Jesterrace]

The wavemaker IMHO is absolutely crucial FOWLR or Reef. Saltwater tanks need much higher turnover rates. Even in FOWLR lack of flow at best can lead to unwanted algae growth and at worst Cyanobacteria (Red Slime Algae). For a 15 gallon something in the 800-1000gph range would be great.

 

[Asomeone]

A week in and I think it looks pretty good! I found a bristleworm in the tank. I'm not too concerned about it, we'll see if it survives for the couple months of cycling.
Should I be doing weekly 5 gallon water changes while cycling? Should I plop a carbon bag or Purigen in?

 

[stella1979]

Hey there Asomeone Congrats on the salty tank!!!

Thank you for bringing this to my attention Thedudeiam94

Asomeone , I am unsure what your current burning questions are so I just have a bit to add at the moment, but please feel free to ask away.

I see you got a wavemaker. That's great because you absolutely want your total flow rate to be at least 20x the tank's volume. The flow rate is sometimes hard to believe when you've come from freshwater but just think about how dangerous ocean currents can be for us! Anyway, I heartily agree that low flow will only cause problems and it's a very good idea to supplement your output's flow with a powerhead. For what it's worth, you may still want to look into Jebao powerheads someday. They are relatively cheap, come with a controller allowing the user to set a flow pattern, (which really is what makes them cheap because other controlled pumps can be quite expensive) and are quite a bit smaller than the one you've got.

Idk about too much live rock crashing a tank. The issue I think is being referenced here is when the 'live' part of live rock suffers some or total death. Live rock must be kept wet or the life begins to die, and what do dead organics give us? Just like in freshwater, dead organics mean ammonia spikes. Perhaps a large, established, strongly cycled tank could handle it, but a smaller water volume, and/or a less mature tank and cycle make ammonia spikes more dangerous. In fact, the biggest reason that bigger is better with any tank is that smaller tanks are more vulnerable to instability and in much greater danger with toxins... since those big tanks have all that dilution.

However... I'm a nano reef keeper myself. So, don't let that go big or go home thing put you off of reefing someday. It's really not that hard, I swear it! As has been said, your tank will rely on regular weekly water changes of about 20% for keeping the water clean and parameters stable.

As far as a cycle goes... I do not change water during a cycle unless ammonia or nitrites hit 4ppm or higher and/or nitrates hit 100ppm or higher. Your live rock may have given you an instant cycle... though I kind of doubt that given that you had the rock for several hours before the tank was running. Live rock really does depend on staying 100% wet as well as the oxygenation provided by flow. Soooo... take care that the semi-live rock doesn't make your nitrogen levels too high and to avoid the other bad news that comes from dead organics, you should probably get yourself a phosphate kit. Nitrates and phosphates feed algae. So, where do you want your parameters to be in a cycled salty tank?

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm (yes, just like with fw, ammo and nitrite are toxic to salty critters)
Nitrate - 0 -15ppm
Phosphates - below 0.5ppm

Why the range on nitrates? Well, also like fw, nitrates are less toxic than ammo or nitrites, but marine creatures are sensitive to higher levels of nitrates. 15ppm doesn't sound so bad coming from freshwater but consider the vastness of the oceans and the dilution that takes place there. Despite pollution and all the rest, the oceans still provide very good water quality for the most part.

Errmm, we didn't wash our sand either. What's the point of buying live salty sand if you're gonna rinse it with tap water?

The coral pictured here...

Here’s the link and here are some pics of the lights

is a leather coral called a Toadstool. Very cool! It's extended (the stringy things, called polyps) in the pic too and that's great! PE (polyp extension) is a sign of happiness in corals and happiness means they're comfortable and assumedly healthy. Leathers are considered the hardiest of hardy and most species do okay in very low light indeed, (by reef standards that is.)

Phew... that was more than a bit. Nice to meet ya, I'm Stella... the author of very looong posts all too often. Hope this helps! Lastly, stop beating yourself up. We all start somewhere and all will make their mistakes, (a couple of mine have been BAD.:eek You're doing great!

 

[Asomeone]

Phew... that was more than a bit. Nice to meet ya, I'm Stella... the author of very looong posts all too often. Hope this helps! Lastly, stop beating yourself up. We all start somewhere and all will make their mistakes, (a couple of mine have been BAD.:eek You're doing great!

Wow thank you for such a detailed response! That is exactly what I needed. I'll pick up a jaebo since I apparently like blowing money and already purchased a coral light, Ro system, ato, skimmer, I can go on. Point is I blew way too much on prime day. At least I'm ready for whenever I keep corals down the road.

If I add a light designed for corals in a FOWLR tank will that harm anything or just be overkill? I already bought it so I'm just wondering if I should wait to use it or not.

Well I'll have to do some tests to see how my tank is actually doing...shipment with the test kit was supposed to come yesterday but whose counting.
So when the levels stabilize in the proper range for say a week the tank is cycled like freshwater?

That coral piece turned white and curled up so I cut it off. Maybe I should have left it longer, woops.

I did get one piece of live rock that I kept completely submerged (the red rock) so maybe that one made it home...the bristleworm survived on that piece so maybe a good chunk of bacteria did too.

Again I appreciate the extremely detailed response, it all helped greatly.

 

[stella1979]

Wow thank you for such a detailed response! That is exactly what I needed. I'll pick up a jaebo since I apparently like blowing money and already purchased a coral light, Ro system, ato, skimmer, I can go on. Point is I blew way too much on prime day. At least I'm ready for whenever I keep corals down the road.

If I add a light designed for corals in a FOWLR tank will that harm anything or just be overkill? I already bought it so I'm just wondering if I should wait to use it or not.

Well I'll have to do some tests to see how my tank is actually doing...shipment with the test kit was supposed to come yesterday but whose counting.
So when the levels stabilize in the proper range for say a week the tank is cycled like freshwater?

That coral piece turned white and curled up so I cut it off. Maybe I should have left it longer, woops.

I did get one piece of live rock that I kept completely submerged (the red rock) so maybe that one made it home...the bristleworm survived on that piece so maybe a good chunk of bacteria did too.

Again I appreciate the extremely detailed response, it all helped greatly.

Bahahaha... If I were in the setup phase, I would've gone crazy on Prime Day too! Don't worry too much... reef tanks are not very cheap to maintain, but the real kick in the wallet is at startup. I've never spent as much at once on my reef tank since. Besides, that's AWESOME that you'll have all that gear soon. You'll be a pro reefer in no time my friend.

Nothing will be harmed by using reef lighting before you have corals but there is something to keep in mind. Algae too enjoys light, so I would keep it set just high enough for viewing pleasure because at this point, that's all the light is for. Someday, you may want or need to turn it up for corals. Someday... doesn't sound so far away, YAY!!

Indeed, a cycle is the same among fresh and saltwater. You just need an ammonia source, and when nitrogen levels show you are cycled, you are.

Bummer about the Toadstool leather. Turning white is a very bad sign but at the same time... corals are hardier than we automatically think. In other words, give a coral a good long time to try to recover before decided all hope is lost.

Well then, perhaps you will get a quicker cycle due to the red rock.

No problem. I am very happy to help a new reefer when I can. Spreading the hobby just feels good!

 

[Asomeone]

Jaebo is in and pulsing away. Lomine light is buzzing. Cooling fans setup. I gotta say it's impressive how much my fan cooled my tank. Went from 80-75 in about an hour. Aside from waiting for my levels to stabilize I'd say I'm about ready.
One thing if anyone reading this could clear up for me is. I have a Coral life biocube skimmer. It's an airpump powered skimmer. I have the bubble level about halfway down in the collection cup and it still fills up daily with a semI yellowish liquid. Is this what I want? I thought it would be more....cruddy looking. It's difficult to tell since the collection cup is also tinted. I pour it into a cup before I decide to throw it down the drain. If it's yellow I toss it. I just thought it would be less water and more junk.
Edit: also RO water. I got my system today. And made 2 buckets of that nice pure water. But since I'm cycling should I do that 25% change or wait until the cycle is complete to do so.

 

[xiholdtruex]

Nice little setup you have there. Skimmers usually take some time to break in and need to be adjusted. You have what is called a wet skimmate. Those bubble driven skimmers are not all that great they usually produce pretty wet skimate. Try adjusting it to produce a more foam driven skimmate to the top edge of the cup. dump any skimate wet or crudy in the cup. it can take a few weeks for it to work correctly due to a film developing on the skimmer. I had a diy one for around 6 months and you have to change the airstone every few months for it to work properly due to it clogging.

as for water changed if my ammonia is not past the 2.0 ppm mark and my nitrates is not pased the 40%+ mark I would not do a water change.

 

[Asomeone]

Nice little setup you have there. Skimmers usually take some time to break in and need to be adjusted. You have what is called a wet skimmate. Those bubble driven skimmers are not all that great they usually produce pretty wet skimate. Try adjusting it to produce a more foam driven skimmate to the top edge of the cup. dump any skimate wet or crudy in the cup. it can take a few weeks for it to work correctly due to a film developing on the skimmer. I had a diy one for around 6 months and you have to change the airstone every few months for it to work properly due to it clogging.

as for water changed if my ammonia is not past the 2.0 ppm mark and my nitrates is not pased the 40%+ mark I would not do a water change.

Thank ya! I'm quite annoyed by the skimmer. I can clearly see a lot of particulate matter in the tank. Just tiny little particles and film I try to break up on top of the water. I feel like the skimmer should suck it up....Guess I'll drop another $100 on a decent needle wheel skimmer....Jeez this nano tank was supposed to cost me less than setting up a heavily planted tank with co2....Right now I"m at about $450 deep. Cant really go back now...but I kinda wish I did.

 

[xiholdtruex]

Thank ya! I'm quite annoyed by the skimmer. I can clearly see a lot of particulate matter in the tank. Just tiny little particles and film I try to break up on top of the water. I feel like the skimmer should suck it up....Guess I'll drop another $100 on a decent needle wheel skimmer....Jeez this nano tank was supposed to cost me less than setting up a heavily planted tank with co2....Right now I"m at about $450 deep. Cant really go back now...but I kinda wish I did.

The skimmer skims the water for broken down organics not particulates some times it will catch some but ita not its purpose. If you want to filter particulates you just need a piece of filter floss and for the water to flow through it and you replace it every three days. I personally would not put a skimmer on it yet. Take it slow. Nano tanks don't usually need them just wcs and filter floss work wonders. But youbhave to replace it every 3 daysto prevent thw organics from braking down.

To break the film at the top of the water you need surface agitation.

Ok so I took a look at your tank specs. For surface film I would aI'm one of the return pump nozzles higher to the surface so it just slightly breaks up the film. How high is your water level?

In the rear are you still using the big foam sponge filter? You can either make a diy filter floss holder in that compartment or get a media basket and the first part of it use filter floss.

Keep it simple you do not need to dump a bunch of money for a simple salty setup.

Skimmers are not necessary. A roll of filter floss is like 10$ and lasts about 4-6 months replacing it every 2-3 days.

 

[Asomeone]

Ok so I took a look at your tank specs. For surface film I would aI'm one of the return pump nozzles higher to the surface so it just slightly breaks up the film. How high is your water level?

In the rear are you still using the big foam sponge filter? You can either make a diy filter floss holder in that compartment or get a media basket and the first part of it use filter floss.

Keep it simple you do not need to dump a bunch of money for a simple salty setup.

Skimmers are not necessary. A roll of filter floss is like 10$ and lasts about 4-6 months replacing it every 2-3 days.

Ah gotcha. Thank you, I was a bit confused since I see pictures of other peoples skimmate just looking black and disgusting. Not just a little yellow.
I do have one nozzle pointing up to the surface to help break it up. It kinda works.
Yep, still using the foam block. I was thinking about purchasing some filter blocks of various porosity so I don't have to bother with floss. Been running 3 blocks of foam in my fw sump for close to 3 years. Rinse and repeat.
I'll have to make a custom holder so I can stick the floss in after the foam and not fight to take it out.

I had a good amount of evap (maybe 5%) so I sucked out about 4 gallons of water to clean the top of the sand, which was pretty dirty from stuff falling off the rock. Now at least it has some RO water in it. I'll test in 2 days to see if it messed anything up. My levels have been pretty stable for the past 4 days so as long as things don't change I'll be adding maybe 2 shrimp and some sand sifters later this week.

 

[xiholdtruex]

What I find with filter blocks is they clog over time. What you want to do is remove the organics. With a small piece of floss you trash it every 2-3 days and add another small piece. With the foam no mattwr how much I have rinsed more crud comes out lol

What I have is a piece of foam cut out to fit my media are snuggly. 3inches thich. Ontop of that I place a piece of filter floss. If I want ro polish the water really good.I add a 50 micron sheet of floss then the normal floss. Ill take a pic when I do my wc tommorw

 

[Asomeone]

Since my levels have been stable for the past 5 days and within the parameters laid forth by Stella...we have our first addition to the tank! This is my tester addition...not a cheap one I might add. If mr shrimp makes it I'll proceed to add fish in the next week or so. If not then I'll go back to the drawing board. I'm aware I may have added shrimplypibbles a bit prematurely. I think we all get overly excited at times. I'm hoping for the best in shrimpsters survival. It was drip acclimated for about an hour. Shrimpkins is hiding right now but I'll be keeping a close eye.

What I find with filter blocks is they clog over time. What you want to do is remove the organics. With a small piece of floss you trash it every 2-3 days and add another small piece. With the foam no mattwr how much I have rinsed more crud comes out lol

What I have is a piece of foam cut out to fit my media are snuggly. 3inches thich. Ontop of that I place a piece of filter floss. If I want ro polish the water really good.I add a 50 micron sheet of floss then the normal floss. Ill take a pic when I do my wc tommorw

I buy my foam from swisstropicals. They sell various porosites of foam that I use for my Freshwater tanks. I'll be picking up some of their 30-20-10ppm foam to use in the place of the foam block. Obviously I'll leave the block in until the new foam is properly coated with biomedia. I find the 10ppm foam is just as efficient as filter floss and is reusable. I know its time to clean my one fw tank when the first sump chamber starts overflowing from the impregnated foam. It works wonderfully and the when rinsed the waste water is so dark and gross. My Freshwater tanks are crystal clear with this foam. High initial cost but definitely worth it, you should check them out!

 

[stella1979]

YAY!!! Congratulations! Shrimpster ought to do great because you are on top of things.

Yes, we do all get over-excited and/or push our luck sometimes and I've sure been there, (how about 7 zoa purchases in the first six months, at least a few of which were after I started losing the first ones... took our tank a year to host zoas properly but that didn't stop me from trying too many times while the tank was young... oh Rastas, how I miss you.:rolleyes I do not think you've made a mistake in trying. Without trying, we wouldn't know the particulars of our unique little ecosystems. Never did learn why zoas failed in the first year while LPS and SPS thrived and I had given up on them completely... until a good friend kinda pushed me into it by giving me some. Those are my Eagle Eye zoas who entered the tank in month 12 with 8 polyps. They've grown like mad and I don't even try to count them anymore. It sounds a little harsh since we're talking about living creatures but experience truly is the best teacher.

You've piqued my interest about this foam. Generally speaking, I buy the cheapest filter floss/padding/micron pads as I can get because I follow the floss and toss method. The reef tank gets floss changed 2 - 3 times per week and the fluff and micron pad in the nano Freshwater gets tossed and replaced at every weekly water change. I too enjoy superior clarity in tanks and Purigen helps me with that in Freshwater but... if I could waste less I would. Idk though because I truly thank the frequent floss & toss for helping keep the reef tank almost algae free. Anyway, what I'm trying to say is, your foam solution sounds worthy of checking out for whatever application I can successfully put in place, so... thanks for the recommendation.

 

[xiholdtruex]

Since my levels have been stable for the past 5 days and within the parameters laid forth by Stella...we have our first addition to the tank! This is my tester addition...not a cheap one I might add. If mr shrimp makes it I'll proceed to add fish in the next week or so. If not then I'll go back to the drawing board. I'm aware I may have added shrimplypibbles a bit prematurely. I think we all get overly excited at times. I'm hoping for the best in shrimpsters survival. It was drip acclimated for about an hour. Shrimpkins is hiding right now but I'll be keeping a close eye.



I buy my foam from swisstropicals. They sell various porosites of foam that I use for my Freshwater tanks. I'll be picking up some of their 30-20-10ppm foam to use in the place of the foam block. Obviously I'll leave the block in until the new foam is properly coated with biomedia. I find the 10ppm foam is just as efficient as filter floss and is reusable. I know its time to clean my one fw tank when the first sump chamber starts overflowing from the impregnated foam. It works wonderfully and the when rinsed the waste water is so dark and gross. My Freshwater tanks are crystal clear with this foam. High initial cost but definitely worth it, you should check them out!

I wish mrshrimp luck , He should be fine his bio load is low.

I love me some foam its always good to have spare amounts. in my fw tanks I use them on all my intake tubes it works wonders but clog super fast for me need to get more pore foam. I run purigen in both salty and fresh and it seems to help also. lasts about 5 months before it needs to be regenerated.

 

[Asomeone]

I wish mrshrimp luck , He should be fine his bio load is low.

I love me some foam its always good to have spare amounts. in my fw tanks I use them on all my intake tubes it works wonders but clog super fast for me need to get more pore foam. I run purigen in both salty and fresh and it seems to help also. lasts about 5 months before it needs to be regenerated.

I suppose I'll add in some purigen to this etup since I have excess lying around from my fw tanks. The shrimp...which I think is a skunk/scarlet shrimp? Is out and about on the rocks today. Has been sitting in the same couple spots every time I come to check. Seems to enjoy the highest flow areas of the tank. Watched it get one of its antenna smacked by the wave pump blades and it seemed to have a seizure as it ran away...maybe it'll learn.
I retested today and were sitting pretty.
Just for reference if anyone else is going through the same process with their tank Be mindful I am still in the process of changing to RO water. The first water change was performed with it but obviously there's still a good 70% of the water that was from the tap. Algae issues are currently minimal.
Temp-74 to 74.5
PH-8.0
ammonia 0 to .1
nitrite 0
nitrate 2.5
phosphate 1.0-1.2
salinity 1.025-1.0255
Also, on the note of helping another in the same situation. I have found that I like to use various companies kits for testing. I have the API master kit but also use salifert nitrate/nitrite kits as well as the fluval phosphate kit. I test them all against eachother if there's a question so I can have redundancy in my testing. I know it would probably be easier to pick up computerized testers...but I'd rather spend 50 bucks on a new light or pump.
I use the inkbird heating/cooling unit to keep my temps in check. I have a backup standard stick thermometer I use to double check that everythings in order. it does require at least a 1 degree shift to activate the heater or fans. So far its been accurate.
Given that this is a small tank, evap does have a large effect on salinity levels and it seems to be a constant battle to keep it steady. I swing about .005 every 2 days. Not really a worry just mentioning it.
Figure I'd add that this corallife skimmer has so far proven itself useless. I will be taken the advice of xiholdtruex and not worry about it. If it decides it wants to work in time I'll update if not then to you corallife biocube skimmers.

I wish mrshrimp luck , He should be fine his bio load is low.

I love me some foam its always good to have spare amounts. in my fw tanks I use them on all my intake tubes it works wonders but clog super fast for me need to get more pore foam. I run purigen in both salty and fresh and it seems to help also. lasts about 5 months before it needs to be regenerated.

I've found that my sponges work best when exposed to high pressure. To put into perspective in my canisters I only run 30-50ppI foam because I find that it clogs too quickly with lower numbers and water finds its way around it. In my sump I have 2 overflows that jet water right onto foam cut right to the size of the 1st chamber of my sump. I think this is relevant because if you used a 10ppI piece in say...a marineland HOB or a canister with pressure relief systems the water would never get filtered and would simply run around it. I think the difference to the filter floss would mainly be surface area. A 1 inch thick piece of 10ppI foam will imo catch a lot more junk (for longer) than filter floss would.

I am seeking professional help from the company I hired to care for my Freshwater tanks in my last absence. They did a wonderful job and I figured I'd give them a shoutout here if anyone is in the pittsburgh area. Premium Polys, based in ohio, run by David smith was fantastic with my fw tanks. The company specializes in marine tanks....especially reef tanks. I can purchase all my coral cheaper from them and they also breed clowns so I can get a pair of snowflake clowns. Cheapest reputable place I've found in my area sells frags for $26 a plug....If I do a consult I get free frags and free followups to ensure their health. I'll pay for that insurance
I figure I don't know much about corals and there's so many different types that flourish under different conditions, why not pay a little more to make sure my tank is happy. Yes of course I can research myself but it'd still different since my tank is its own unique system.

I'm having my nice brown algae bloom currently. I hate how fast it overtakes everything. Cutting back on lighting and will be performing another RO water change tomorrow. Shrimpster is still content...I almost bought a coral banded shrimp today (I love them) but after checking into compatibility decided against it. This cleaner shrimp doesn't eat anything. I drop in a pellet of marine food every once in a while. With my Freshwater cherry shrimp its game over when its feeding time. Anything put into the tank will be eaten...not this guy. It's okay about the coral banded shrimp I'll just have to setup another tank down the road. I absolutely love how much color even a shrimp has. I also saw an urchin today for 10 dollars....ugh my dreams. So far aside from cost I love the marine environment. Yes it definitely is more involved and more costly. But once its all said and done and the equipment is in its fun! I feel like with Freshwater its much simpler which is nice at times but its also nice to be carefully managing an ecosystem entirely dependent on what you do next. With freshwater I have a much larger cushion. My tap water keeps them happy, if I neglect them every once in a while my plants clean up for me...in my shrimp tank if I forget to feed them they just eat my plants. Wish my dog did that. Well he'd probably resort to eating my couch so maybe not...anyway
Overall its great to have a really pretty tank just with rock. The coral are just gonna make it more beautiful. I'll be switching from the regular instant ocean to the instant ocean reef brand soon.
Edit:also my skimmer is finally functioning as it should. I guess it built up that biofilm. Now it churns out a proper tower of very loose foam that makes the skimmer cup very yellow and disgusting. Since I discovered it actually works I'll be modifying the skimmer to drain into a big bottle so I don't have to empty it daily.

 

[xiholdtruex]

Good stuff. In my planted. Shrimp tanks I have not done a wc in 8 months those plants soak up all nutrients and grow lol

Good stuff on that skimmer, just remeber every 3 months or so you will need to replace the airstone.

When it comes to instant ocean vs instant ocean reef crystals, I habe heard that it makes the ph and alk high so I would keep a eye on more throughral testing just inncase since it does come with more minerals. Was thinking of switching myself but as long as the regular instant ocean meets my needs Its all good.

 

[Asomeone]

annndd I killed my shrimp with a water change. !
The shrimp was fine until I scrubbed the algae and swapped about 30% of the water...I obviously did something wrong. Took all of 45 minutes for it to literally keel over on the rock. The tank is next to my computer so I'm sitting here and just watch it tip over and now its twitching. Man. Time to test.
Edit:tested Everything is pretty much the same. The PH in the tank did change since I last tested. 7/25 it was 8.0 7/30 after water change it was 8.4 Aside from that I see nothing else that would have killed the shrimp. I matched temp and salinity. But I did just suck out water and dump in the new water instead of slowly adding it....but It matched the tank parameter so I don't understand why it killed the shrimp. The only other thing I can think of is something contaminated the water being added and I didnt notice. I put it in 2 buckets I strictly use for RO then dump water from those buckets into specific mixing buckets. I add salt and let it sit with a heater and pump overnight.

 

[stella1979]

I'm so sorry to hear about Shrimpster. I cannot imagine what got him but it is often said that marine inverts are very, very sensitive critters. Here's what sticks out to me...

You mention RO several times when RODI is much preferred. Do you have a TDS meter? Do you have an RO system alone (without one or more DI stages)? If you do not have DI, you'll want to install that stage, more than one if you'd like. (When you have downtime, check out a little about oh, idk... everything on the 52 Weeks of Reefing on the BRStv YouTube channel. This is also the channel to watch to decide on how you want to **** your water filtration system.)

Inverts are particularly sensitive to heavy metals even in trace amounts. TDS stands for total dissolved solids and the source water (your RO) which you mix with marine salt should have a TDS of absolute zero. Media in RO/RODI filtration units are what strip all or most of the TDS from our tap water... my RO stages consist of a particulate filter, 2 carbon stages, then the RO membrane, and finally, the DI stage. All stages are refreshed as necessary to keep the unit in top order with DI resin needing replacement the most often (less than twice a year though.) So here are my TDS numbers from my own tap and filtration unit (which delivers RO and RODI water. By the way, I also use remineralized RO water for our drinking water as well as the nano freshwater tank.)

Tap - 350ppm
RO - 30ppm
RODI - 0ppm

From use, the media in the filtration stages will become exhausted and need replacing. When the RO TDS increases, the media in those filters are replaced, same with DI. This is why it's advised to frequently check the TDS of our water... which is easy as pie for me since I also use the TDS meter on RO/feed water for orchids a few times a week. As you can see from my numbers, the first few stages of my own system take care of the majority of the TDS but there is that little bit left. What is it? Well, idk everything that's in it but I can measure 3ppm nitrates. What's the other 27? Because idk, I cannot say my RO system makes water completely safe for the reef tank without also putting the water through the DI stage.

Here's an example I like to give when folks ask if they can use tap water, and... sometimes you CAN but it's infrequent and is solely dependant on what's in that water. There once was a reefer who had very, very low TDS straight out of his tap (somewhere south of 60ppm.) He did his research, started his reef tank, cared for it very well, and all was well for more than a year. He had fish, inverts, and corals. Everyone was happy for a good long time but somewhere in year 2, suddenly, corals were a little upset and the reefer couldn't figure out why. Before long, inverts started dying more corals were upset and some were dying. He kept plugging along, trying to figure out what in the world was going on. Finally, there was little left alive in the tank and even fish were dying. He had a major test done on his source water (tap) and the tank's water. What they found was very low-level tin in the tap, which over time, had built up to higher levels within his tank. The tank went through a slow but complete crash as what was still a very low level of tin accumulated in his reef tank.

Now, perhaps Shrimpster had a shrimpy illness from the get and it was impossible to see. Perhaps he has been stressed more than was apparent and didn't eat enough. Often, we are left wondering just what the heck caused a certain issue, (like for me, and why zoas died in year 1 but thrived in year 2) but the very first thing we look at is water quality... which you have done by running tests. However, I don't remember us talking much about source water and TDS, which is something you should also be monitoring. TDS meters are cheap online.

Now, that deal with your local guy sounds totally AWESOME!! If only for the coral deals and care alone. I think this is a very good way for a busy person (who... is maybe away from home frequently?) to get started. However, once that tank is fully established and thriving, and if you can spend a little time on the tank each week, well, you could save the fee because, in the end, reefing really isn't so hard, especially when a tank is mature.

 

[Asomeone]

I do have a RODI system which ive been using...I just say RO I'm lazy and those 2 extra letters really add up . I picked up a tds meter to check everything. It is important to mention this tank still has a good bit of tap water in it from the initial setup. I would just suck it all up and replace the water but I have a good feeling that would make something bad happen. Since the shrimp died I'll probably do a 50% change in a day or two and get the amount of RODI water (I said it that time) increased.
When I tested right after the shrimp died my ph was at 8.4 now it is back down to 8.0. I assume this is due to the dinural cycle of the tank but it definitely was higher when the shrimp died. It has been between 8.0-8.4. Maybe its nothing.
Either way the shrimp was either sick to start with or the water used to change wasn't similar enough and the stress from the water change killed it. As far as I could tell it wasn't eating much in the tank and wasn't particularly active throughout the week I had it. It was out and about but didn't remind me much of my Freshwater shrimp which are constantly scavenging, just kinda sat around.

I'll be placing in the a cheap fish like a blue chromis or a neon goby. I'll revisit the shrimp when I have all this figured out. I figure to avoid this problem in the future instead of dumping I'll pump in water like I do with my Freshwater shrimp tanks at a rate of about 1gal every 10 minutes or so. Its a pain but its better than losing inhabitants.

Oh it would only be a consult about the tank. Help me get started into reefing. Otherwise, unless I'm gone for an extended period, it'll just be me.\

Edit: would you guys purchase a decent looking inhabitant from a subpar tank? This one petco I went to had a large marine section and the fish and inverts were really cheap...but algae was rampant like soooo bad I didn't know it could get so thick. The Freshwater sections I wouldnt touch since Ich was apparent on many of the fish. But the marine filtration is different and it hadn't hit them yet.
The fish were just super cheap. Like a coral banded shrimp for 10 bucks or a clown for 20.
I'm looking for cheap cause I need something to tell me if the tank is safe without breaking the bank. Yea I know that's a little crappy of me...but I don't know how else to tell, cause from my perspective, my shrimp shouldnt have died.

 

[Asomeone]

TDS for my RODI water is 4ppm. So the system is doing its job. Another water change was done. Been testing daily and everything is as it should be. Soooooooo the company I'm working with sold me 2 clowns. Snowflake clowns.
Got them earlier today and they hid under a rock for a bit. then, for the next 10 hours of so they have been swimming against the highest flow current area in my tank. I attempted feeding but they seemed distracted so I'll try again tomorrow. I did have one clown eat a pellet so that's good news. Theyre tiny! Maybe an 3/4 of an inch. Considering how long theyve been swimming against maybe 400gph of flow I'd say theyre rather healthy. There is other quieter areas of the tank...but they haven't moved from this one spot.
I did an hour drip acclimation. These are my main stays of the tank so I do hope for the best.
As they grow they should show their black colors more brightly. I like the red but it isn't what I wanted.
I'm telling you guys I've been trying to tire these fish out. I want them to explore the tank and move from this one spot so I cranked my jaebo up to full power and nope....still just fighting the current in the same spot. Be mindful that's about 1000gph for a 15gal tank. I was like, okay if you guys just wanna work out then so be it and turned it back down to about 300gph.
I was advised that the reason for my shrimp death was the PH difference of my tank vs change water + and a slight difference in salinity and temp. Brought my salinity down to 1.0245 and will try to keep it there (before fish arrived) Reason being, the evap of my tank causes swings into 1.026 and that's just too high for my liking. If I am to keep corals I don't want them struggling before the ATO kicks on. As far as my tank goes I cut a piece of plexI and glued it over the bottom intake of the flex tank. I used seachem reef glue. This will allow the back portions of the tank which function as a sump to fluctuate in level while keeping the main tank stable in water level.
The clowns were shipped in separate bags but I'm glad I got 2. I feel like a single clown would just be a lonely guy. So far they seem to enjoy eachother, not leaving ones side for a second.
re

 

[Tony_097]

The tds should be 0 you should figure what's up. Maybe you need a new dI resin ? Either way congrats on the clowns !

 

[Jesterrace]

The OP, out of curiosity how long are you running your lights?

 

[Asomeone]

The OP, out of curiosity how long are you running your lights?

I run the fluval flex light (10w) on the blue setting night and day. During the day I turn on the whites to a low setting. I was using the coral light with dimmed settings for a bit but it seemed unnecessary and promoting brown algae growth.

The tds should be 0 you should figure what's up. Maybe you need a new dI resin ? Either way congrats on the clowns !

I tested the water in a bucket that had been sitting for a bit. I'll check what comes out of my unit directly. Either way 4ppm is next to nothing is it really a concern? Its just a cheap aquatic buddy RODI system but its pretty new. Only made about 30 gallons with it so far.

Edit: As I thought it was likely a little residue from something in the bucket. Into a cup is 0ppm. Considering my source water is well over 260tds even if it was 4ppm out of the rodI I'd be content.

 

[Asomeone]

I feel like this jaebo might be a bit much. I know the ocean is a dangerous place and such but When I turned off both my pumps my fish finally came out from their little corner and explored a bit. The one has definitely set his hiding place to be in that corner but the other one is still swimming against the current. The one that isn't in the hole pins itself against a rock later at night and seems to use that to try to help with the flow. They seemed more active and "happier" with the pumps off. Obviously I need flow so I turned the filter pump back on and they seemed content with that. Still exploring and not just holed up in the rock. I have the jaebo on the lowest setting for flow. So I guess that would make it 132gph since that's the lowest advertised flow...and it seems like they don't like it. Am I just off here or should I shut off/re position this wave maker.

 

[Thedudeiam94]

Hey there Asomeone Congrats on the salty tank!!!

Thank you for bringing this to my attention Thedudeiam94

Asomeone , I am unsure what your current burning questions are so I just have a bit to add at the moment, but please feel free to ask away.

I see you got a wavemaker. That's great because you absolutely want your total flow rate to be at least 20x the tank's volume. The flow rate is sometimes hard to believe when you've come from freshwater but just think about how dangerous ocean currents can be for us! Anyway, I heartily agree that low flow will only cause problems and it's a very good idea to supplement your output's flow with a powerhead. For what it's worth, you may still want to look into Jebao powerheads someday. They are relatively cheap, come with a controller allowing the user to set a flow pattern, (which really is what makes them cheap because other controlled pumps can be quite expensive) and are quite a bit smaller than the one you've got.

Idk about too much live rock crashing a tank. The issue I think is being referenced here is when the 'live' part of live rock suffers some or total death. Live rock must be kept wet or the life begins to die, and what do dead organics give us? Just like in freshwater, dead organics mean ammonia spikes. Perhaps a large, established, strongly cycled tank could handle it, but a smaller water volume, and/or a less mature tank and cycle make ammonia spikes more dangerous. In fact, the biggest reason that bigger is better with any tank is that smaller tanks are more vulnerable to instability and in much greater danger with toxins... since those big tanks have all that dilution.

However... I'm a nano reef keeper myself. So, don't let that go big or go home thing put you off of reefing someday. It's really not that hard, I swear it! As has been said, your tank will rely on regular weekly water changes of about 20% for keeping the water clean and parameters stable.

As far as a cycle goes... I do not change water during a cycle unless ammonia or nitrites hit 4ppm or higher and/or nitrates hit 100ppm or higher. Your live rock may have given you an instant cycle... though I kind of doubt that given that you had the rock for several hours before the tank was running. Live rock really does depend on staying 100% wet as well as the oxygenation provided by flow. Soooo... take care that the semi-live rock doesn't make your nitrogen levels too high and to avoid the other bad news that comes from dead organics, you should probably get yourself a phosphate kit. Nitrates and phosphates feed algae. So, where do you want your parameters to be in a cycled salty tank?

Ammonia - 0ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm (yes, just like with fw, ammo and nitrite are toxic to salty critters)
Nitrate - 0 -15ppm
Phosphates - below 0.5ppm

Why the range on nitrates? Well, also like fw, nitrates are less toxic than ammo or nitrites, but marine creatures are sensitive to higher levels of nitrates. 15ppm doesn't sound so bad coming from freshwater but consider the vastness of the oceans and the dilution that takes place there. Despite pollution and all the rest, the oceans still provide very good water quality for the most part.

Errmm, we didn't wash our sand either. What's the point of buying live salty sand if you're gonna rinse it with tap water?

The coral pictured here...

is a leather coral called a Toadstool. Very cool! It's extended (the stringy things, called polyps) in the pic too and that's great! PE (polyp extension) is a sign of happiness in corals and happiness means they're comfortable and assumedly healthy. Leathers are considered the hardiest of hardy and most species do okay in very low light indeed, (by reef standards that is.)

Phew... that was more than a bit. Nice to meet ya, I'm Stella... the author of very looong posts all too often. Hope this helps! Lastly, stop beating yourself up. We all start somewhere and all will make their mistakes, (a couple of mine have been BAD.:eek You're doing great!

Hey! stella1979 will this work on a hose for my 20 gal long? Just hooking it up whenever I need to change water?

 

[Asomeone]

Hey! stella1979 will this work on a hose for my 20 gal long? Just hooking it up whenever I need to change water?

lol hijacked my thread for a response from her. She normally responds quickly in private messages. But since you posted that I went with the aquatic life RODI its the same gpd and has more reviews and ease of purchasing new cartridges.
But the unit you posted will work fine, you'll just have to let it run the day before you want to do the water changes. Mine takes about an hour and a half to fill a 5 gallon bucket.