HITH or Swim Bladder Disease

[jryncarz]

Our betta is not eating (day 7) with boyancy issues (couple weeks). We tried treating constipation by feeding him peas last week. At best he ate 2 bites and snce has stopped eating altogether. We assume he has swim bladder disease. He is currently in an emptied out 3.5 gallon tank treated with 1.5 Tblsp of aquarium salt. This is day 5. We tried Erithromycin, no change. Today I noticed this spot on his head. Is it HITH? Any advice for all these symptoms? We had one snail in the tank last summer who turned out to be hermaphrodite and the babies took over so we returned them all back to the lake. I just don't feel like he ever recovered from then. Could they have given him a parasite he has been fighting all this time? If it was bacterial wouldn't the Erithromycin have handled it?
My heart breaks.. he is looking up at us hoping for relief and help!

 

[Madchild57]

Our betta is not eating (day 7) with boyancy issues (couple weeks). We tried treating constipation by feeding him peas last week. At best he ate 2 bites and snce has stopped eating altogether. We assume he has swim bladder disease. He is currently in an emptied out 3.5 gallon tank treated with 1.5 Tblsp of aquarium salt. This is day 5. We tried Erithromycin, no change. Today I noticed this spot on his head. Is it HITH? Any advice for all these symptoms? We had one snail in the tank last summer who turned out to be hermaphrodite and the babies took over so we returned them all back to the lake. I just don't feel like he ever recovered from then. Could they have given him a parasite he has been fighting all this time? If it was bacterial wouldn't the Erithromycin have handled it?
My heart breaks.. he is looking up at us hoping for relief and help!

Swim bladder disease isn't really a disease by itself (unless its caused by something like overfeeding etc) but rather a symptom of another disease. HITH is possible, as is a bacterial infection. Eithromycin may not work due to antibiotic resistant bacteria which are unfortunately becoming more widespread in the world. It's possible the snail can be responsible, how long ago was the snail added?

 

[tapwater]

Hi there, I'm not experienced in treating Bettas with HITH, but from the picture you provided I do see a little divot and pale spot on his head. When you're looking at him in person, have you noticed that this area is eroding, and isn't just a color change? Also, has he pooped at all recently? Is his feces white and stringy? Has he gotten paler since you started noticing symptoms?
Also, does any part of him seem distended, particularly near where his swim bladder is? Or has his over all shape remained the same.
[EDIT] Do you happen to have the water parameters of the water he is currently in? Poor parameters could make the healing process harder, and could be the catalyst of his sickness.

 

[Madchild57]

Hi there, I'm not experienced in treating Bettas with HITH, but from the picture you provided I do see a little divot and pale spot on his head. When you're looking at him in person, have you noticed that this area is eroding, and isn't just a color change? Also, has he pooped at all recently? Is his feces white and stringy? Has he gotten paler since you started noticing symptoms?
Also, does any part of him seem distended, particularly near where his swim bladder is? Or has his over all shape remained the same.

At this point, clear/white poop wouldn't necessarily mean parasite. It could just be from not eating for a week, so i don't think it would be too helpful. I agree w/ everything else though.

 

[butterflybetta]

Do you know what your water parameters are? (Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, etc) Do you have a filter and heater? What’s the water temperature?
Peas aren’t really good for bettas. They can cause more constipation and blockages because bettas can’t digest them. That might be what happened with your betta and it’s probably why he’s stopped eating after you fed him peas.
Try feeding frozen daphnia. Since he’s not eating, cut some garlic in half and roll the daphnia in the garlic to enhance his appetite. This website shows how to do this: Garlic for a Sick Betta Fish

Edit: I would also stop using the aquarium salt. It can make swim bladder disease worse. It would actually really help if you filled out the emergency template
I don’t really see any signs of HITH but it could be a possibility. Do you have any clearer pictures?

 

[tapwater]

Do you know what your water parameters are? (Ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, etc) Do you have a filter and heater? What’s the water temperature?
Peas aren’t really good for bettas. They can cause more constipation and blockages because bettas can’t digest them. That might be what happened with your betta and it’s probably why he’s stopped eating after you fed him peas.
Try feeding frozen daphnia. Since he’s not eating, cut some garlic in half and roll the daphnia in the garlic to enhance his appetite. This website shows how to do this: Garlic for a Sick Betta Fish

Edit: I would also stop using the aquarium salt. It can make swim bladder disease worse. It would actually really help if you filled out the emergency template
I don’t really see any signs of HITH but it could be a possibility. Do you have any clearer pictures?

Oh huh, I never knew you could use garlic juice to help out with appetite issues. Interesting! I'll be taking note of that for when I may need it, lol.

 

[jryncarz]

Swim bladder disease isn't really a disease by itself (unless its caused by something like overfeeding etc) but rather a symptom of another disease. HITH is possible, as is a bacterial infection. Eithromycin may not work due to antibiotic resistant bacteria which are unfortunately becoming more widespread in the world. It's possible the snail can be responsible, how long ago was the snail added?

That happened back in June, 2020. We have struggled with fin rot since.. now this boyancy and loss of appetite issue.

Hi there, I'm not experienced in treating Bettas with HITH, but from the picture you provided I do see a little divot and pale spot on his head. When you're looking at him in person, have you noticed that this area is eroding, and isn't just a color change? Also, has he pooped at all recently? Is his feces white and stringy? Has he gotten paler since you started noticing symptoms?
Also, does any part of him seem distended, particularly near where his swim bladder is? Or has his over all shape remained the same.
[EDIT] Do you happen to have the water parameters of the water he is currently in? Poor parameters could make the healing process harder, and could be the catalyst of his sickness.

He hasn't eaten in 7 days, so no poop. I was told checking the parameters of the water wouldn't be accurate due to the aquarium salt that's been added. The spot on his head seems to just be a color change. I cannot say with confidence that I see a true divot at this point.

Oh huh, I never knew you could use garlic juice to help out with appetite issues. Interesting! I'll be taking note of that for when I may need it, lol.

No parameters as I was told they wouldn't be accurate with the salt in his tank. Temp is 83. I tried a blood worm today but he wanted nothing to do with it. I will check out the link you sent me about the daphnea and garlic. ty!

Oh huh, I never knew you could use garlic juice to help out with appetite issues. Interesting! I'll be taking note of that for when I may need it, lol.

Yes fikter. Yes heater. Water temp is 83. No parameters abailable, I was told salt would make them inaccurate so I didn't buy a test kit. I tried a blood worm today which I have never tried before and he didnt want it. ty for garlic idea!

 

[Bettamay]

It could be HITH caused swim bladder... swim bladder can be caused by parasite infections too. Emergency Template would really be helpful.

 

[butterflybetta]

No parameters as I was told they wouldn't be accurate with the salt in his tank. Temp is 83. I tried a blood worm today but he wanted nothing to do with it. I will check out the link you sent me about the daphnea and garlic. ty!

Yes fikter. Yes heater. Water temp is 83. No parameters abailable, I was told salt would make them inaccurate so I didn't buy a test kit. I tried a blood worm today which I have never tried before and he didnt want it. ty for garlic idea!

How long have you been using the aquarium salt for? I don’t think aquarium salt will mess with water parameters, so I would recommend getting a test kit (not test strips bc they are inaccurate). If you could fill out the emergency template, like mentioned above, it would be really helpful

 

[jryncarz]

Update: Mapple (male half moon betta fish) ate a blood worm this morning! PTL! I found the emergency template and will fill out. Our pet store does not carry anything but test strips though.

Tank
What is the water volume of the tank? 3.5 gallons
How long has the tank been running? 14 months
Does it have a filter? yes
Does it have a heater? yes
What is the water temperature? 80 at night, 82 during the day.
What is the entire stocking of this tank? (Please list all fish and inverts.) 1 male half moon betta

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? inconsistent, aimed for 1 or 2 gallons every 2 weeks.. sometimes full tank change, sometimes missed tank change, (embarrassed).. but now learned weekly 1 gallon change is best. currently in hospital tank I change 2 gallons of saline water daily.
How much of the water do you change? 1, 2 or 3 gallons (was inconsistent) but now 1 gallon weekly.
What do you use to treat your water?
Prime concentrated conditioner for marine and freshwater
API Stresszyme+
Started using API Ammolock for a while, then he got sick and we stopped bc we were told it could have neutralized the Erithromycin treatments causing them not to work. Is that true?
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water?
We vaccum the gravel, although he is in a hospital tank without gravel right now.

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish?
I don't understand what cycling the tank is.
What do you use to test the water?
No, our pet stores only sell test strips. Any recommendations?
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.
Ammonia:
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
pH:

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? x2 per day
How much do you feed your fish? Literally 1/4 of the "nip" measuring spoon
What brand of food do you feed your fish? We were feeding him Fluval Bug Bites (with shrimp)
Do you feed frozen or freeze-dried foods? Not until he got sick and I started reading more about their dietary needs. I had no idea and need to learn more. I recently bought frozen blood worms. Any advise on what else to buy? I heard Daphnea, brine shrimp and mosquito larvae are natural food choices for them?

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? 14 months.
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? He hasn't been the same since we added one snail from my parents lake 8 months ago. It turned out to be a hermaphrodite. They took over the tank. It took a couole of weekly changes to clear them out and releaae them back into the lake.
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms? boyancy issue, fin rot and not eating after a week - except today (!) - we got him to eat a blood worm. I have never fed him anything except pellets. This has been a learning experience I hope doesnt cost him his life.
Have you started any treatment for the illness? 3 weeks ago we tried Erithromycin with little to no change. I was told by a pet store clerk that ammolock may have neutralized the ER. Not sure thats true.
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No.
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all? Ragged fins, dot on head, can swim but lays on bottom of tank all day amd night. Will come to top for air. Will look at us when we visit him. Does wave the fins on his side.

Explain your emergency situation in detail. Mapple has been floating, tilting sideways for a couole weeks - progressively getting worse. He started skipping 1 of his 2 meals a day. We added ammo lock to water treatment routine. Then we gave him Erithromycin (for bacteria) with little to no change. After that, he stopped eating for 2 days - we then put him in a hospital tank to fast for 1 more day.. making 3 days total so we could try the crushed pea method to rule out constioation (as most websites recommend). He ate 1 maybe 2 bites during a couple of days, then stopped eating altogether. After 2 days of not eating since his last pea, we started an aquarium salt water treatment of 1 Tblsp per 2 gallons. That was 6 days ago. He was offered a higher quality food (....) but did not eat during that time (8 days long). I heard they like blood worms so enticed him yesterday and he did not want it. I tried again this morning and was persistent with by dangling it in front of his mouth with tweezers and he grabbed it. (PTL!) I did not feed him more than 1 as I read 1 or 2 is more than enough. I plan on going to the store again for brine shrimp or some other meaty food to get him nutrition as I understand blood worms are more of a treat (?).

I would like to try API General Cure for parasites as that is the only thing we havent tried treating this far, esp with that dot on his head. I was told he could stay in the saltwater treatment until improved. i was also told it stresses him more. I do t k ow what to kisten to.

 

[butterflybetta]

Update: Mapple (male half moon betta fish) ate a blood worm this morning! PTL! I found the emergency template and will fill out. Our pet store does not carry anything but test strips though.

Tank
What is the water volume of the tank? 3.5 gallons
How long has the tank been running? 14 months
Does it have a filter? yes
Does it have a heater? yes
What is the water temperature? 80 at night, 82 during the day.
What is the entire stocking of this tank? (Please list all fish and inverts.) 1 male half moon betta

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? inconsistent, aimed for 1 or 2 gallons every 2 weeks.. sometimes full tank change, sometimes missed tank change, (embarrassed).. but now learned weekly 1 gallon change is best. currently in hospital tank I change 2 gallons of saline water daily.
How much of the water do you change? 1, 2 or 3 gallons (was inconsistent) but now 1 gallon weekly.
What do you use to treat your water?
Prime concentrated conditioner for marine and freshwater
API Stresszyme+
Started using API Ammolock for a while, then he got sick and we stopped bc we were told it could have neutralized the Erithromycin treatments causing them not to work. Is that true?
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water?
We vaccum the gravel, although he is in a hospital tank without gravel right now.

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish?
I don't understand what cycling the tank is.
What do you use to test the water?
No, our pet stores only sell test strips. Any recommendations?
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.
Ammonia:
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
pH:

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? x2 per day
How much do you feed your fish? Literally 1/4 of the "nip" measuring spoon
What brand of food do you feed your fish? We were feeding him Fluval Bug Bites (with shrimp)
Do you feed frozen or freeze-dried foods? Not until he got sick and I started reading more about their dietary needs. I had no idea and need to learn more. I recently bought frozen blood worms. Any advise on what else to buy? I heard Daphnea, brine shrimp and mosquito larvae are natural food choices for them?

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? 14 months.
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? He hasn't been the same since we added one snail from my parents lake 8 months ago. It turned out to be a hermaphrodite. They took over the tank. It took a couole of weekly changes to clear them out and releaae them back into the lake.
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms? boyancy issue, fin rot and not eating after a week - except today (!) - we got him to eat a blood worm. I have never fed him anything except pellets. This has been a learning experience I hope doesnt cost him his life.
Have you started any treatment for the illness? 3 weeks ago we tried Erithromycin with little to no change. I was told by a pet store clerk that ammolock may have neutralized the ER. Not sure thats true.
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No.
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all? Ragged fins, dot on head, can swim but lays on bottom of tank all day amd night. Will come to top for air. Will look at us when we visit him. Does wave the fins on his side.

Explain your emergency situation in detail. Mapple has been floating, tilting sideways for a couole weeks - progressively getting worse. He started skipping 1 of his 2 meals a day. We added ammo lock to water treatment routine. Then we gave him Erithromycin (for bacteria) with little to no change. After that, he stopped eating for 2 days - we then put him in a hospital tank to fast for 1 more day.. making 3 days total so we could try the crushed pea method to rule out constioation (as most websites recommend). He ate 1 maybe 2 bites during a couple of days, then stopped eating altogether. After 2 days of not eating since his last pea, we started an aquarium salt water treatment of 1 Tblsp per 2 gallons. That was 6 days ago. He was offered a higher quality food (....) but did not eat during that time (8 days long). I heard they like blood worms so enticed him yesterday and he did not want it. I tried again this morning and was persistent with by dangling it in front of his mouth with tweezers and he grabbed it. (PTL!) I did not feed him more than 1 as I read 1 or 2 is more than enough. I plan on going to the store again for brine shrimp or some other meaty food to get him nutrition as I understand blood worms are more of a treat (?).

I would like to try API General Cure for parasites as that is the only thing we havent tried treating this far, esp with that dot on his head. I was told he could stay in the saltwater treatment until improved. i was also told it stresses him more. I do t k ow what to kisten to.

Thanks for filling out the emergency template!
So you should be doing water changes every week especially since 3.5 gallons is pretty small. It is not recommended to do 100% water changes because they are stressful, usually unnecessary, and can mess with your cycle.
I unfortunately don't know about using API Ammolock and Erithromycin together, so I don't have any advice on that. Prime is a great water conditioner, so it's great you have it. You also don't have to use API Ammolock if you're using Prime.
Are you able to get a test kit online? If you can't, then using test strips is better than nothing! Knowing what your water parameters are is really important.
Here's a link to how the nitrogen cycle works: Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle It may seem confusing at first, but after you understand it, it's really simple Is the tank he's currently in, his main tank?

Tbh it wasn't a great idea adding a wild snail into your tank, but it's okay! It might of not been the snails fault. Infrequent water changes could of caused the fin rot and possibly swim bladder disease. Could you describe how the dot on his head looks like or post a picture of it?
Have you tried rolling his food in garlic? I heard it can also help with parasites. Does he have any symptoms that might lead you to suspect parasites?

What I would do is:
- Get a test kit (any one that you can get) and test your water to make sure this isn't a water parameter issue
- Stop using aquarium salt (Aquarium salt can make swim bladder disease worse!!)
- Do frequent water changes (Every other day or 2-3 times a week, whatever works best for you); Frequent water changes will help with the fin rot
- Add tannins to his tank (Indian almond leaves or 100% pure rooibos tea work well); Tannins will also help with his fin rot and his overall health
Tbh I wouldn't start treating him with any more medications until you know it's definitely not a water quality issue. How bad would you say his swim bladder disease is? You try treating him with Epsom salt baths. I'm currently treating my betta with Epsom salt baths, so I can help explain how to do them

 

[jryncarz]

Thanks for filling out the emergency template!
So you should be doing water changes every week especially since 3.5 gallons is pretty small. It is not recommended to do 100% water changes because they are stressful, usually unnecessary, and can mess with your cycle.
I unfortunately don't know about using API Ammolock and Erithromycin together, so I don't have any advice on that. Prime is a great water conditioner, so it's great you have it. You also don't have to use API Ammolock if you're using Prime.
Are you able to get a test kit online? If you can't, then using test strips is better than nothing! Knowing what your water parameters are is really important.
Here's a link to how the nitrogen cycle works: Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle It may seem confusing at first, but after you understand it, it's really simple Is the tank he's currently in, his main tank?

Tbh it wasn't a great idea adding a wild snail into your tank, but it's okay! It might of not been the snails fault. Infrequent water changes could of caused the fin rot and possibly swim bladder disease. Could you describe how the dot on his head looks like or post a picture of it?
Have you tried rolling his food in garlic? I heard it can also help with parasites. Does he have any symptoms that might lead you to suspect parasites?

What I would do is:
- Get a test kit (any one that you can get) and test your water to make sure this isn't a water parameter issue
- Stop using aquarium salt (Aquarium salt can make swim bladder disease worse!!)
- Do frequent water changes (Every other day or 2-3 times a week, whatever works best for you); Frequent water changes will help with the fin rot
- Add tannins to his tank (Indian almond leaves or 100% pure rooibos tea work well); Tannins will also help with his fin rot and his overall health
Tbh I wouldn't start treating him with any more medications until you know it's definitely not a water quality issue. How bad would you say his swim bladder disease is? You try treating him with Epsom salt baths. I'm currently treating my betta with Epsom salt baths, so I can help explain how to do them

I took a sample of the water to Petsmart today. They do it for free. I saw her use strips. Is that ok? Keep in mind this is the salt treated water. Here are the numbers:
pH 7.2
Alkalinity 80
Hard Water 150 gh (she said that is normal for our county)
Nitrates 0
Chlorine 0
Alkalinity 80
Ammonia 0

Do they look ok? If so should I do API General Cure for HITH? See attached pic.

I am not doing Epsom Salt baths, he is just in a saltwater solution. it has been 1 week.

So far he ate 1 blood worm yesterday morning, 1 yesterday night and 1 this morning. I didn't offer 2 bc I don't want to over feed. In that light he is eating which is improvement. However, he doesn't seem to be able to get himself off the bottom corner of the tank without help today, which is not good. I also see a gold coloring on him behind the gills and the side of his head that match the color of the dot on top of his head. Here is a picture. I used the flash bc it made those areas stand out more. I was ready to begin the API General Cure to treat HITH, but am second. Now that you see the water perimeters, do you think thats a good move? I worry that we are running out of time. Is it possible for him to come back from this?
(Thank you!!)

 

[NotSoAggressiveAquatics]

I took a sample of the water to Petsmart today. They do it for free. I saw her use strips. Is that ok? Keep in mind this is the salt treated water. Here are the numbers:
pH 7.2
Alkalinity 80
Hard Water 150 gh (she said that is normal for our county)
Nitrates 0
Chlorine 0
Alkalinity 80
Ammonia 0

Do they look ok? If so should I do API General Cure for HITH? See attached pic.

I am not doing Epsom Salt baths, he is just in a saltwater solution. it has been 1 week.

So far he ate 1 blood worm yesterday morning, 1 yesterday night and 1 this morning. I didn't offer 2 bc I don't want to over feed. In that light he is eating which is improvement. However, he doesn't seem to be able to get himself off the bottom corner of the tank without help today, which is not good. I also see a gold coloring on him behind the gills and the side of his head that match the color of the dot on top of his head. Here is a picture. I used the flash bc it made those areas stand out more. I was ready to begin the API General Cure to treat HITH, but am second. Now that you see the water perimeters, do you think thats a good move? I worry that we are running out of time. Is it possible for him to come back from this?
(Thank you!!)

Where do you see HITH? I just see finrot and possibly diamond eye (somethings up with his eye I just can’t tell what.) that spot on his head in your first pic just looks like a missing scale to me because there’s no hole unless the picture just doesn’t show it.

 

[jryncarz]

Where do you see HITH? I just see finrot and possibly diamond eye (somethings up with his eye I just can’t tell what.) that spot on his head in your first pic just looks like a missing scale to me because there’s no hole unless the picture just doesn’t show it.

The gold shiny sections on the side of his head nd behind his gill. An online fish vet said it looks like keratin is missing which could be indicative of HITH. You don't seem to agree(?).

 

[butterflybetta]

Where do you see HITH? I just see finrot and possibly diamond eye (somethings up with his eye I just can’t tell what.) that spot on his head in your first pic just looks like a missing scale to me because there’s no hole unless the picture just doesn’t show it.

I think his eyes look like that because he's just looking down, but I don't see the HITH either though.

The gold shiny sections on the side of his head nd behind his gill. An online fish vet said it looks like keratin is missing which could be indicative of HITH. You don't seem to agree(?).

It looks like there's color missing, but I don't see the HITH. Could it maybe be columnaris? I hope it's not, but I think that's what it looks like. I found this website to be really helpful:
Btw do you know what your nitrite level is?

 

[jryncarz]

Update: I have been able to feed Mapple 1 blood worm for breakfast and 1 for dinner for two and a half days by using tweezers and dangling it in front of his mouth.
I see tiny parts of what I think are his fin in the water. I believe we have moderate fin rot and a dangerously close to beimg untreatable.

I am completely puzzled right now as to what I should do. I took advise from this thread and other sites that explain SBD will be worsened with aquarium salt. I took out 2 of the 3.5 gallons of aquarium salt treated water and replaced it with regular treated freshwater yesterday afternoon at 4 pm. Then, I prepared a second tank by cleaning it with a 1:1 ratio of white distilled vinegar / water, rinsing thoroughly and air drying for a few hours.. and added 1 gallon. (6") of dechlorinated freshwater so he could come up for air easier. I dipped him in a freshwater bath to get rid of anything on him as much as I could, then floated him in a freshwater cup (dechlorinated) in the new freshwater tank (dechlorinated) until temperatures matched. The tank is heated but not filtered (since it doesn't reach that low).
Now when he swims he is no longer sideways. I almost want to say the SBD Is greatly improved in the freshwater, but he is still very lethargic (from swim rot?). He stays on the bottom now upright and no longer on his side. He doesn't swim on his own though unless I disturb him. When he does swim it is much straighter.

QUESTIONS:

1. Since fin rot is treated with aquarium salt and SBD is treated with Epsom Salt, what should I do as they cannot be mixed and aquarium salt makes SBD worse?

2. Which would I treat first?

3. He was in aquarium salt treated tank for seven days with a 1Tbl per 2 gallons solution. Could that be enough to help cure his fin rot? How do I know?

3. My plan was to slowly switch to Epsom salt to treat the SBD but it seems the SBD is improving. I assume from the frequent water changes and removing the aquarium salt (?). He is still lethargic. I don't know how to tell if fin rot improved but I do see tiny pieces of something in the water (maybe his tail?) What should I do next? (API Furan 2? API Pimafix?)

Here is a current picture. Thank you for any and all help! God bless you for caring!

 

[butterflybetta]

Update: I have been able to feed Mapple 1 blood worm for breakfast and 1 for dinner for two and a half days by using tweezers and dangling it in front of his mouth.
I see tiny parts of what I think are his fin in the water. I believe we have moderate fin rot and a dangerously close to beimg untreatable.

I am completely puzzled right now as to what I should do. I took advise from this thread and other sites that explain SBD will be worsened with aquarium salt. I took out 2 of the 3.5 gallons of aquarium salt treated water and replaced it with regular treated freshwater yesterday afternoon at 4 pm. Then, I prepared a second tank by cleaning it with a 1:1 ratio of white distilled vinegar / water, rinsing thoroughly and air drying for a few hours.. and added 1 gallon. (6") of dechlorinated freshwater so he could come up for air easier. I dipped him in a freshwater bath to get rid of anything on him as much as I could, then floated him in a freshwater cup (dechlorinated) in the new freshwater tank (dechlorinated) until temperatures matched. The tank is heated but not filtered (since it doesn't reach that low).
Now when he swims he is no longer sideways. I almost want to say the SBD Is greatly improved in the freshwater, but he is still very lethargic (from swim rot?). He stays on the bottom now upright and no longer on his side. He doesn't swim on his own though unless I disturb him. When he does swim it is much straighter.

QUESTIONS:

1. Since fin rot is treated with aquarium salt and SBD is treated with Epsom Salt, what should I do as they cannot be mixed and aquarium salt makes SBD worse?

2. Which would I treat first?

3. He was in aquarium salt treated tank for seven days with a 1Tbl per 2 gallons solution. Could that be enough to help cure his fin rot? How do I know?

3. My plan was to slowly switch to Epsom salt to treat the SBD but it seems the SBD is improving. I assume from the frequent water changes and removing the aquarium salt (?). He is still lethargic. I don't know how to tell if fin rot improved but I do see tiny pieces of something in the water (maybe his tail?) What should I do next? (API Furan 2? API Pimafix?)

Here is a current picture. Thank you for any and all help! God bless you for caring!

1. You can use tannins instead of salt. Tannins will treat the fin rot and help his fins regrow. You can use Indian almond leaves or 100% pure rooibos tea if you can't get the Indian almond leaves.

2. Since water changes seemed to help with his swim bladder disease, continuing the frequent water changes and adding tannins will help with both the swim bladder disease and fin rot.

3. You'll know that his tail is getting better when the fin rot stops progressing and you start to see new growth. New growth usually looks transparent. Indian almond leaves will also help his fins regrow.

4. You cannot use Epsom salt the same way you use aquarium salt. This is the website I used when I was treating my betta with Epsom salt baths: Salt Baths
If the swim bladder is getting better, I would hold off on doing Epsom salt baths. Also, just a heads up, any medications that have "fix" in the name, like pimafix, aren't good medications for bettas because they can damage a betta's labyrinth organ. I'm not sure what you mean by tiny pieces of something in the water?

 

[jryncarz]

1. You can use tannins instead of salt. Tannins will treat the fin rot and help his fins regrow. You can use Indian almond leaves or 100% pure rooibos tea if you can't get the Indian almond leaves.

2. Since water changes seemed to help with his swim bladder disease, continuing the frequent water changes and adding tannins will help with both the swim bladder disease and fin rot.

3. You'll know that his tail is getting better when the fin rot stops progressing and you start to see new growth. New growth usually looks transparent. Indian almond leaves will also help his fins regrow.

4. You cannot use Epsom salt the same way you use aquarium salt. This is the website I used when I was treating my betta with Epsom salt baths: Salt Baths
If the swim bladder is getting better, I would hold off on doing Epsom salt baths. Also, just a heads up, any medications that have "fix" in the name, like pimafix, aren't good medications for bettas because they can damage a betta's labyrinth organ. I'm not sure what you mean by tiny pieces of something in the water?

Thank you.

1. You can use tannins instead of salt. Tannins will treat the fin rot and help his fins regrow. You can use Indian almond leaves or 100% pure rooibos tea if you can't get the Indian almond leaves.

2. Since water changes seemed to help with his swim bladder disease, continuing the frequent water changes and adding tannins will help with both the swim bladder disease and fin rot.

3. You'll know that his tail is getting better when the fin rot stops progressing and you start to see new growth. New growth usually looks transparent. Indian almond leaves will also help his fins regrow.

4. You cannot use Epsom salt the same way you use aquarium salt. This is the website I used when I was treating my betta with Epsom salt baths: Salt Baths
If the swim bladder is getting better, I would hold off on doing Epsom salt baths. Also, just a heads up, any medications that have "fix" in the name, like pimafix, aren't good medications for bettas because they can damage a betta's labyrinth organ. I'm not sure what you mean by tiny pieces of something in the water?

There are literally pieces of his fin coming of in the water from time to time. I was able to take a good picture of him tonight. (The picture of him looking more purple is with the flash. The other is without.) He is back to laying on his side again.

1. He did eat his blood worm for dinner. The brine shrimp was too difficult to hold with tweezers. Is there a different healthier food I can feed him like that?

2. How progressed is his fin rot?

3. I will look at the tannins to treat the fin rot and SBD. Do you think API Fin & Body Cure would be a good option at all? I have some of that on hand already. I says it treats fin rot. Is it (doxycycline hyclate) dangerous? We tried Erythromycin 4 weeks ago, little to no change.

Thank you.
There are literally pieces of his fin coming of in the water from time to time. I was able to take a good picture of him tonight. (The picture of him looking more purple is with the flash. The other is without.) He is back to laying on his side again.

1. He did eat his blood worm for dinner. The brine shrimp was too difficult to hold with tweezers. Is there a different healthier food I can feed him like that?

2. How progressed is his fin rot?

3. I will look at the tannins to treat the fin rot and SBD. Do you think API Fin & Body Cure would be a good option at all? I have some of that on hand already. I says it treats fin rot. Is it (doxycycline hyclate) dangerous? We tried Erythromycin 4 weeks ago, little to no change.

Also.. what about API Furan 2?

 

[jryncarz]

Took a not so good turn today. He is losing color. Day 1.5 of fresh water is proving to be not as beneficial as I hoped. I didnt feed him today bc he hasn't pooped. Could it be constipation?

I took our 3 of the 6 inches of water and added 3 gallons back so I could use the filter again since he isn't coming up for air on his own anyway. How often should they do that? I list him up and he swims to get some and floats or swims back to lay on bottom.

Simce there was so much handling today, I thought I will hold off on Epsom dip until tomorrow for SBD and constipation. Was that wise?

 

[jryncarz]

Looks like everyone has abandoned this post anyway.. but Mapple has passed. Thank you for trying.

 

[butterflybetta]

Looks like everyone has abandoned this post anyway.. but Mapple has passed. Thank you for trying.

I'm so sorry to hear that. I have been busy and I wasn't able to check up on this thread. I wish I could of helped more.