Whose Responsibility Is It?

Jellibeen

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It would be sweet if employees tried to sell people books along with tanks! Then they can make more money and spread accurate information.
 
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AquaticJ

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This may or may not be true...But! I know, seen and have read a lot of things from people saying things for a fact that isn't a fact lol. Some say you have to throw tons of meds in a tank right off the bat and some say you either "have" to do it this way or your gonna kill all your fish. So the person buying the animal should know what they are getting. I'm just saying some people just know they are right lol. So I don't think it's the stores responsibility at all, it's the buyer. Buyer beware and all that stuff lol.
This reminds me of a thread the other day asking what you’ve learned from the hobby, in which I included, “fish keeping is an art, you either get it or you don’t” in my reply. Medicine is one of those things that you HAVE to understand, or you can easily kill your fish.


When I worked at the LFS, there were two types of customers.. those who want to learn, and those who don’t. I loved it when customers genuinely wanted to know the information, and I would gladly talk their ear off about it. I also wouldn’t let them buy something they didn’t need. However, if people clearly weren’t listening and thought I was just saying stuff that wasn’t important, or just disregarded anything I said, I’ll ring you up for whatever you bring to the front.
 

scarface

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Yes! People contradict eachother on the internet, thats why people make mistakes. Those mistaked should be corrected by the store in my opinion.
Not really. My way of doing things is different from other people’s. There are more than a few ways to skin an animal; it doesn’t mean one method is wrong or even better than another. It’s about what works for the person.
 

Crazycoryfishlady

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Why?
There are books not just the internet. When I started keeping fish I pretty much taught myself. I read as much that was available. I never depended on the sales person. When I kept a reef tank I had a salesman tell me a certain coral was easy. But I knew better because I had read up on coral. So I didn't buy it.
No offence towards anyone but I think people now days expect to much. They want the store to hold their hands and tell them exactly how and what to do. Next people will want the stores to cycle and set the tank up for them lol.
Hope I didn't anger any one but come on people lol .

I half agree with half the statements used by everyone, but the one thing I don't agree eith here, comes with the expecting too much, and the guy telling you the coral was easy.

Chances are the guy who said the coral was easy has NEVER grown his own coral.
Chances are he probably doesn't have a fish tank, or even if he does, it's not saltwater.
Most people don't do saltwater.
I know personally about the lives of all my petco workers, I know who works with salt and who doesn't, so I know who is lying and who isn't.
But a regular joe who has never met these people before has no idea who to trust, so they unintelligently trust them all.
If you didn't know better and a guy told you a coral was easy, chances are he could've convinced you to buy it if he acted like he was really knowledgeable.

I have a friend from school who works at my lfs, she's an intelligent girl, but not so intelligent that she doesn't hold her tongue before spouting information.
Ropefish only get to 2 ft or less in tanks, and don't even get so monstrous in the wild, yet when I purchased their two ropefish, she told me they will both get 4, almost 5 feet long!!
Then when other new customers came in interested in the fish, she again lied to them!
I had just looked it up and told her they only get max of 2, and she still lied!
I told her how to do the tests for the water, because she was doing them wrong and their test paper was faded, and she even lied to her manager saying she shook the bottles and I watched her!!!

If they don't know what they're talking about, they need to shut it! They're going to misinform on fish size, care requirement and lifespan, they've even lied about pleco and shark diets.
And brackish fish....
They sell brackish fish and crabs in freshwater with the claim they will thrive in it....

It's not right to lie or actively mistreat animals whether you know about them or not.
But if you are selling something to the general public, I feel it is your responsibility to at least KNOW WHAT YOU'RE SELLING!
If you're mistreating an animal or misinforming people and you are corrected, you shouldn't be spreading that misinformation unless you know it's true.
I know you're supposed to make sales, but you're also not supposed to false advertise as that is a form of fraud.

Take my goby/bichir situation.
I thought I was buying a bichir, but was sold a goby instead.
This was both mine and fish stores fault.

However, if it was the otherway around and I had reason to believe that this animal was indeed a goby and not a bichir, and I took home a predatory bichir instead and it ate all my profits, there's a chance in an outlandish court that you could get the company in trouble for your loss of wages based on their misinformation and misleading false advertising.
It's not likely that someone will go through with that case, but people have gone through with lesser offenses and won.

We have a responsibility to know what we're buying, but they have the responsibility not to misinform and possibly cause death, disease, loss of wages and even injury to ones personal self.
 

Annie59

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Chances are the guy who said the coral was easy has NEVER grown his own coral.
Chances are he probably doesn't have a fish tank, or even if he does, it's not saltwater.
Oh, he knew lol. He had is own set ups. He was actually the owner of the store and had many reef tanks himself. I didn't hate him for it, matter of fact I liked him and yes I continued to go to his store after that. He tried, he failed to sell me something. I don't hold it against him at all.

My point is just do our research Be like me, trust no one and just research, research and research. Listen to what others have to say then do your own research on it also.
 

Crazycoryfishlady

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Oh, he knew lol. He had is own set ups. He was actually the owner of the store and had many reef tanks himself. I didn't hate him for it, matter of fact I liked him and yes I continued to go to his store after that. He tried, he failed to sell me something. I don't hold it against him at all.

My point is just do our research Be like me, trust no one and just research, research and research. Listen to what others have to say then do your own research on it also.

I kinda assumed it was more like a petco.
But either way I still think it's wrong for employees to lie to customers (though this wasn't exactly what he did saying the coral was easy)
 

Cicca

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I totally agree with that but you are not legally allowed to just allow that "kid" to die because of bad maintenance and inadequate feeding. People can pretty much get away with the utter and reckless abuse of animals but not the same with human children. And sometimes buying the wrong animal for your situation is a kind of animal abuse. For instance, you can't (or shouldn't) buy a horse if you plan to keep it in a 400 square foot studio apartment in New York City. It would also be abusive if you decided that the horse would be eating only hot-dogs. You could do it in certain hypothetical extensions of property rights, but really, should you?
Did you see the chick who is actively killing her fennec fox by forcing it to eat vegan?
I like animals, just usually not ones of the human variety.
 
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AquaticJ

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This actually reminds me of how much customers expect you to do for them, I cannot tell you how many times we didn’t have a product/fish and I told them another place probably would, followed by them asking me for a phone number or directions to the place like I memorized it. Just take out your phone, google it, there it is!
 

Dave125g

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In a perfect world, people who work in the field should learn about it to be able to do there job to the best of there ability. That being said if your bringing something in your home, you should take the time to learn about it before bringing it in your home.
 

BrandedUW

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I would say the ultimate responsibly is on the buyer, BUT if the buyer of given incorrect information by the store, it is reasonable that an inexperienced fish keeper would believe what they are told. Even now I ask for advice from the people at my LFS and often take their advice into consideration because I know all the people at this particular store are into fish themselves and "in the hobby" hardcore. That being said, it seems that many things in the hobby are subjective and there are many varying opinions, caveats, exceptions, etc., so I still try to do some research so I can get a more complete picture. But when I was stocking my first tank 6 years ago, I thought that asking the guy at Petco for advice WAS doing my research. When you're a complete novice and everyone knows more than you, so it seems reasonable to listen to the employee in that situation. Also, I don't think I was able to look stuff up on my phone as easily back then as I can now, as someone else pointed out.
 

Annie59

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Even now I ask for advice from the people at my LFS and often take their advice into consideration because I know all the people at this particular store are into fish themselves and "in the hobby" hardcore
This hits the nail right on the head. You take their advice into consideration then research more on your own.

Also, I don't think I was able to look stuff up on my phone as easily back then as I can now, as someone else pointed out.
Neither was I, but I made sure if I saw something I liked, I would then leave the store and do all the reading on it before I decided if it worked for me or not
 

Jellibeen

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That book would go flying into the ceiling. Don't got time for that :emoji_smile:
At least then people wouldn't be able to blame pet store employees for not giving accurate information. Okay, at least then when people still blamed store employees, we would be able to remind them that they were literally handed accurate information and chose not to pursue it.
 

wodesorel

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Not really. My way of doing things is different from other people’s. There are more than a few ways to skin an animal; it doesn’t mean one method is wrong or even better than another. It’s about what works for the person.
I agree with this completely. It seems people want the answers to be black or white, but there is a ton of grey in the middle that works just as well. That's why there is so much variation in the information given.

A friend of mine owns a fish store. I trust her to give good advice, but that's the issue - it's advice. When she tells me something is easy, it's because for her it has been, and for people she knows it has been, and from the research she's done it's known to be. Doesn't mean that it will be for me! I've killed plants that were supposed to be simple and she gets so surprised by it. I still know it's all on me and not the plant or the advice.

And yet I was surprised when we were talking one day and I mentioned about how I love brackish because it's so stinking easy, and her reaction was that she hated brackish because it was so hard and she'd never had a successful tank. The gal who can grow and keep anything, while I kill and fail at everything, couldn't do the one thing I was great at!

Hence, the variations in advice and information that is out there.
 

Crafty Cichlid

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Who are we saying is selling the fish, and LFS, or Petco? I expect more from the LFS, regarding advising buyers, and less from a big box pet store. However, it's all on the consumer. If I bring home a Saint Bernard puppy, to live in a small studio apartment with no areas to frolick, it isn't the fault of the pet shop when the dog outgrows the space.
 

wodesorel

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Who are we saying is selling the fish, and LFS, or Petco? I expect more from the LFS, regarding advising buyers, and less from a big box pet store. However, it's all on the consumer. If I bring home a Saint Bernard puppy, to live in a small studio apartment with no areas to frolick, it isn't the fault of the pet shop when the dog outgrows the space.
I think that's actually a good analogy - if you had tried to buy that hypothetical dog from the breeder directly they would have told you no, if you had tried to adopt it from a shelter for sure they would have told you to go pound pavement, and yet if you were to go to a pet store that sells dogs they would have handed it over happily in exchange for the money. Same thing happens with fish.
 

Wraithen

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I think that's actually a good analogy - if you had tried to buy that hypothetical dog from the breeder directly they would have told you no, if you had tried to adopt it from a shelter for sure they would have told you to go pound pavement, and yet if you were to go to a pet store that sells dogs they would have handed it over happily in exchange for the money. Same thing happens with fish.
Sorry, just reminded me of my first dog as an adult living on my own. Got an english mastiff and people were shocked when they found out I lived in an apartment.

I have actively looked up, identified, and purchased mystery fish at my lfs. I also never trust their advice. Not because its not usually good advice, but because everything always works out for them. They will put fish that "can not peacefully exist together," in the same tank, no decorations, and have zero issues for a year. They know they are breaking the conventional rules, but it works out for them.
 

jenmur

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Big dogs CAN live in apartments IF they are properly exercised.
I would say that if I buy a fish not appropriate for my tanks it is my fault for not doing the research. I do have a fish book but it has such a small amount of information about each species. I do research on the internet (including here) and ask my LFS guy questions. And he knows my tank sizes. If I see an interesting fish at the LFS, I take a picture of the list of fish in the tank and research them! I am not changing the stocking plans.
 

Wraithen

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Big dogs CAN live in apartments IF they are properly exercised.
I would say that if I buy a fish not appropriate for my tanks it is my fault for not doing the research. I do have a fish book but it has such a small amount of information about each species. I do research on the internet (including here) and ask my LFS guy questions. And he knows my tank sizes. If I see an interesting fish at the LFS, I take a picture of the list of fish in the tank and research them! I am not changing the stocking plans.
Most of the giant breed dogs dont need much exercise. A great dane wouldnt be appropriate, but most of the molasser breeds are pretty lazy. A 15 minute walk a day and they are pooped.
 
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