Velvet or ich

Nanettefox4

Member
Tank

What is the water volume of the tank? 5 gl
How long has the tank been running? 8 months
Does it have a filter? Yes
Does it have a heater? Yes
What is the water temperature? 82.6
What is the entire stocking of this tank? (Please list all fish and inverts.) 1 betta

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? Every 2 werks
How much of the water do you change? 50%
What do you use to treat your water? Stress coat
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water? Top of the substrate

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish? Yes
What do you use to test the water? API mater test for fresh water
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.

Ammonia:0
Nitrite:0
Nitrate:5-10
pH: 7.6

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? 2x per day
How much do you feed your fish? 6 -8 little pebbles
What brand of food do you feed your fish? Bug bites
Do you feed frozen or freeze-dried foods? No

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? 8 months
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? 1.5 week?
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms? Started with jerky swimming, jumping in the water, losing scales or losing color, some iridescence
Have you started any treatment for the illness? General cure
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all? Just started the cure today

Explain your emergency situation in detail. (Please give a clear explanation of what is going on, include details from the beginning of the illness leading up to now)
A cpl weeks ago, I switched out his decor to this little Asian house and I think it cut him. I pulled it out, cleaned his tank, put the old fake driftwood back in and a new almond leaf that I had just gotten and a dose of betta fix.. I first saw him kinda jumping around then he seemed to be losing color or scales, wasn't his manic self and began hiding. Which he never does.. did. He is gasping for breath at the bottom of the tank. Now he only comes up for air or a few pieces of food after you call him a few times. I'm desperate. I think he is dieing.

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A201

Member
Looks like the Betta might be in the later stages of an Oodinium infestation.
Judging from the pic, it looks like excess slime is coating most of the body, which is a precursor to the tissue actually peeling away.
It's usually too late at this stage to cure Velvet but you might try dosing Coppersafe or Cupramine.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
I have another pic
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
Looks like the Betta might be in the later stages of an Oodinium infestation.
Judging from the pic, it looks like excess slime is coating most of the body, which is a precursor to the tissue actually peeling away.
It's usually too late at this stage to cure Velvet but you might try dosing Coppersafe or Cupramine.
What will coppersafe do?
 

A201

Member
Coppersafe & Cupramine are Copper Sulfate based meds. Coppersafe is chelated, a more stable product. Cupramine isn''t chelated, but is easier to remove from the water column.
Both are quite effective in treating Oodinium / Velvet.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Nanettefox4 said:
Does this come on for no reason? I mean where did it come from? Is he beyond hope? I can't get coppersafe till monday. 2day delivery. Should I put him down? Ugh!
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
Coppersafe & Cupramine are Copper Sulfate based meds. Coppersafe is chelated, a more stable product. Cupramine isn''t chelated, but is easier to remove from the water column.
Both are quite effective in treating Oodinium / Velvet.
Since I added the general cure, do I need to do another water change before I add the coppersafe IF I can get it tomorrow from somewhere?
 

A201

Member
I'd do a WC before starting a new med. The poor Betta looks pretty far gone. You'll know better tomorrow if the situation merits trying a new med.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Ugh. How will I know.... He still eats...
 

A201

Member
Oodinium is a relatively quick killer. I dealt with an outbreak 8 y.o. in two tanks. Lost numerous prized fish, many of which I'd kept for years. Coppersafe quickly eliminated the Oodinium.
If the Betta is still alive Monday, the problem likely isn't Velvet.
Euthanasia is your call. You are in a better position to judge the Betta's overall condition.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Should I turn the temp up in his tank while using general cure? Would it help anything? I'm sorry. I just can't handle losing him.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A
A201 said:
Oodinium is a relatively quick killer. I dealt with an outbreak 8 y.o. in two tanks. Lost numerous prized fish, many of which I'd kept for years. Coppersafe quickly eliminated the Oodinium.
If the Betta is still alive Monday, the problem likely isn't Velvet.
Euthanasia is your call. You are in a better position to judge the Betta's overall condition.
Also, if he is still alive, how much of a water change would I do?
 

A201

Member
Heat is very effective against Ick, not sure about Velvet. 50% WC. These situations are always unpleasant. Thankfully they are few & far in between.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Thank you very much for your help. If I lose him, I don't think I will get another. Too heart wrenching.
 

A201

Member
Hang in there, things will get better.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
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Nanettefox4

Member
Nanettefox4 said:
Thanks...
Welp, he is still alive. I did a 50% WC and added the coppersafe. I guess it's a waiting game now. The instructions say it is a treatment for a month? Do I not do a wc for 30 days? Reminder, the filter is only moving water. All the filter stuff is out of it.
 

A201

Member
I dosed Coppersafe for 10 days & did two WC's during that time. Estimate the amount of gallons removed & redose Coppersafe proportionately. I kept the filter media in, no carbon.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
I dosed Coppersafe for 10 days & did two WC's during that time. Estimate the amount of gallons removed & redose Coppersafe proportionately. I kept the filter media in, no carbon.
Ok. So every 10 days you added coppersafe and did 2 water changes in 10 days. Am I understanding correctly?
 

A201

Member
The entire treatment was 10 days.
When you do a WC, estimate the gallons removed, then treat the replacement water with the appropriate dosage of Coppersafe.
I did 2x WC's while treating my tanks.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Oh! So you added it 1x and did 2 WC in 10 days. I understand the retreatment in those 2 water changes. Thank you! I don't know if he will make it but I sure hope he does.
 

A201

Member
I hope so too. Good luck.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Nanettefox4 said:
Oh! So you added it 1x and did 2 WC in 10 days. I understand the retreatment in those 2 water changes. Thank you! I don't know if he will make it but I sure hope he does.
I think I will do a wc in 5 days then another on day 10 adding the appropriate amount of product to match the new waker amounts. He is still iridescent. Fingers crossed.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Nanettefox4 said:
I think I will do a wc in 5 days then another on day 10 adding the appropriate amount of product to match the new waker amounts. He is still iridescent. Fingers crossed.
Water*
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
He was acting so much better yesterday. Even made a bubble nest! I caught him swimming around a few times but, mostly laying at the bottom. His hide is so raw looking and the few scales he has left are still iridescent. My husband said that he is so lethargic. Couldn't get him to come up and when he finally did, he just got a breath and went back down. I will be doing a 50% WC today and adding half of a full dose of copper safe. One question, when I add the new water, I add stress coat to declorinate the new water and on the bottle it says it removes heavy metals. I also add the coppersafe in the same bucket. Am I defeating my purpose using the stress coat? Sorry so lengthy.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Can I send a video to your email? It's too large for the forum.
 

A201

Member
I googled the Stress Coat issue. According to the instructions, It's okay to use the Stress Coat during WC's, but wait 2 - 4 hours after the WC to redose the Coppersafe.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Thank you. Can I send a video to your email?
 

A201

Member
Sure, go ahead & send the video.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
What's your email. It's too large for the forum.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
Sure, go ahead & send the video.
it's too large. I did send pics though. Not as enlightening
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
More pics
 

A201

Member
In the last stages of Velvet / Oodinium, the infested fish secretes excess slime coat & actual tissue begins peeling away from the body. Hope its not too late. Keeping fingers crossed.
 

jake37

Member
If you took all the filter stuff out of the filter; feed very minimal and watch for ammonia spike.

Nanettefox4 said:
Welp, he is still alive. I did a 50% WC and added the coppersafe. I guess it's a waiting game now. The instructions say it is a treatment for a month? Do I not do a wc for 30 days? Reminder, the filter is only moving water. All the filter stuff is out of it.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
I can't figure out where he got it. The ONLY thing I put in there was a almond leaf from a different supplier. But it was in the cupboard for a good 5 months. Could parasites live on one that long???
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
In the last stages of Velvet / Oodinium, the infested fish secretes excess slime coat & actual tissue begins peeling away from the body. Hope its not too late. Keeping fingers crossed.
Would adding more stress coat help add slime?
 

A201

Member
Probably best to just depend on the med.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Hi. He is still alive but I don't know if I am just avoiding the inevitable or if he will get better. His skin is pretty red in some areas. I just don't know if he should be euthanized or if he has a chance...
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Nanettefox4 said:
Hi. He is still alive but I don't know if I am just avoiding the inevitable or if he will get better. His skin is pretty red in some areas. I just don't know if he should be euthanized or if he has a chance...
Most recent pics. Can his scales grow back? I just don't know if this has gone on long enough and it will kill him eventually or if there is still possibility. What is your opinion?
 

A201

Member
More & more certain the problem was Velvet / Oodinium. As long as the Betta continues to eat there is still hope.
Euthanasia is just a necessary part of the hobby. If you decide to go that route, no fault, no guilt.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Oh there would be guilt! He only comes out of his log when I call him. He eats about 5 to 6 pellets a day. Do you think he is in pain? I worry about an ammonia spike to burn his raw skin. I just don't know what the best think for HIM is. What would you do?
 

A201

Member
The coppersafe should rid the tank of Oodinium. I've seen some pretty miraculous fish recoveries. A healthy appetite is a good sign of a possible recovery.
I euthanized an old blind Peacock Cichlid this morning. He had been in my tank nearly four years. Sometimes you just have to make unpleasant decisions.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Ok. Thank you.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
He's still living and has a great appetite. He doesn't swim much, sits at the bottom alot, and scales are still flaking. BUT there is no new blood and I am starting to think he might make it. Tomorrow is day 10. Do I do a 50% change and add more Coppersafe or do a 50% change and get his filter going again?
 

A201

Member
If he pulls through this plague, your thread needs to be somehow marked, as to give instruction and hope to other fish keepers.
Just follow the dosing instructions. At some point the parasites will be eliminated, the medicine should be discontinued, but the Betta will still look rough for a while.
 

jake37

Member
Good luck. Be sure to post updates as we are curious how he does and if he fully heals.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
Thank you!
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
If he pulls through this plague, your thread needs to be somehow marked, as to give instruction and hope to other fish keepers.
Just follow the dosing instructions. At some point the parasites will be eliminated, the medicine should be discontinued, but the Betta will still look rough for a while.
Thank you!
 

Rally

Member
we are hoping for your fish's recovery. I am glad to see this thread hasn't ended yet. It's definitely sounding promising.
 
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Nanettefox4

Member
A201 said:
If he pulls through this plague, your thread needs to be somehow marked, as to give instruction and hope to other fish keepers.
Just follow the dosing instructions. At some point the parasites will be eliminated, the medicine should be discontinued, but the Betta will still look rough for a while.
Coppersafe dosing instructions....Use 1 tsp/5 ml per 4 U.S. gallons (15 L), 1 cup (8oz) per 190 U.S. gallons (337.5 L). Treats water for one month. Treat replacement water.

This doesn't give me specifics. It doesn't tell me how often to do a wc. It sounds to me like they want me to add it 1x and nothing else for a month. Do you recommend 50% WC every 5 days and then replacing the lost product. And to do that repeatedly for a month or until he seems to be back to his old manic BA self?
 

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