Uronema Marinum Tank Treatment

Jregister2

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I added some chromis too my system and noticed the next day one had a red blotch on his side. I already identified it as uronema marinum. I know there is very little I can do for the fish. So my plans are to set up a 20 gallon tank i have and take water out of my display tank and put it in that 20 gallon so i can transfer my fish into that tank. What i need help with is what should i do with my display tank break it down and disinfect the tank by bleaching my tank and all of my equipment if so how do I bleach my tank with the live rock in it and tank the sand out or what? My display tank is a innovative marine 25 gallon tank it's been running for 2 months I have 2 clowns and 3 chromis and 2 cleaner shrimp water parameters are all ideal. I really need some help. Thanks in advance
 

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This one is new to me, so I think I'll go ahead and call out my favorite fish doc... @KinsKicks

After some quick reading... First, let me say how sorry I am that you're dealing with this. ;( You sure have a nice tank there, and if it were me, I would do what it takes to stop this illness before moving forward.

I see that this is an opportunistic parasite, so will be able to feed off anything organic in your system, be it fish, beneficial bacteria or even detritus. So, if you want to be sure you have completely eradicated it from your system, you will have to do a bleach treatment or something equally harsh to the tank, all equipment, hardscape, and substrate. There's no easy way around it. You basically have to start over.

You can use bleach on rock and sand, but you'll have to take care to remove the bleach before using them again. Several rinses in very hot water should take care of most of it, but I would also soak it a couple of times in water heavily dosed with Prime, then soak it some more in regular dechlorinated water. Soaking may not be the best term, as you'll want to stir the sand a lot, and it would be great if you could use a spare pump to churn the soak water so it's flowing over and into the rock. I suppose you could do all of this in the tank, but be sure you're being extra thorough. I would probably remove the rock, sand, and equipment, as it would be easier to handle all of that without worrying about scratching or breaking your glass. I storage tub would be perfect for this, and rinsing the tank of bleach will be better without all that stuff in the way. It would be a process, but worth it in my mind, particularly with a tank as lovely as yours.

As far as the fish are concerned... Some say that formalin (formaldehyde) is an effective treatment for UM. Fish should be treated in a separate container before being placed into a clean qt. Keep your qt as bare as possible, as you may have to treat in QT as well.

Inverts cannot be treated for this issue as they cannot tolerate the strong medication that needs to be used for the fish. If you want to keep the inverts you'll have to always keep them in a separate tank, or risk transferring UM back to your DT.

Again, I'm so sorry. Good luck!
 
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Jregister2

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stella1979 said:
This one is new to me, so I think I'll go ahead and call out my favorite fish doc... @KinsKicks

After some quick reading... First, let me say how sorry I am that you're dealing with this. ;( You sure have a nice tank there, and if it were me, I would do what it takes to stop this illness before moving forward.

I see that this is an opportunistic parasite, so will be able to feed off anything organic in your system, be it fish, beneficial bacteria or even detritus. So, if you want to be sure you have completely eradicated it from your system, you will have to do a bleach treatment or something equally harsh to the tank, all equipment, hardscape, and substrate. There's no easy way around it. You basically have to start over.

You can use bleach on rock and sand, but you'll have to take care to remove the bleach before using them again. Several rinses in very hot water should take care of most of it, but I would also soak it a couple of times in water heavily dosed with Prime, then soak it some more in regular dechlorinated water. Soaking may not be the best term, as you'll want to stir the sand a lot, and it would be great if you could use a spare pump to churn the soak water so it's flowing over and into the rock. I suppose you could do all of this in the tank, but be sure you're being extra thorough. I would probably remove the rock, sand, and equipment, as it would be easier to handle all of that without worrying about scratching or breaking your glass. I storage tub would be perfect for this, and rinsing the tank of bleach will be better without all that stuff in the way. It would be a process, but worth it in my mind, particularly with a tank as lovely as yours.

As far as the fish are concerned... Some say that formalin (formaldehyde) is an effective treatment for UM. Fish should be treated in a separate container before being placed into a clean qt. Keep your qt as bare as possible, as you may have to treat in QT as well.

Inverts cannot be treated for this issue as they cannot tolerate the strong medication that needs to be used for the fish. If you want to keep the inverts you'll have to always keep them in a separate tank, or risk transferring UM back to your DT.

Again, I'm so sorry. Good luck!
Thank you for the information. What I'm thinking about doing is taking my rock out and soak it in bleach for a week and soak it in freshwater like you mentioned and I'm going to throw away the sand and put new sand in the tank and rinse the tank with bleach as far as the fish I heard alot of people telling me there isn't much you can do for them.
 

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Ughh, I’m so sorry this happened!

As for treatment, the course of action would be to do either a formalin (this would be the first choice) or freshwater dip or a hypersaline dip (45-50ppt) followed by a round of nitrofurazone + methylene blue (be wary that blue does stain silicone, but it will go away in a couple months...just don’t look at it haha. You can run fresh carbon every few months to help clear it out over time). You may also use malachite green instead of meth blue, but mal green is more harsh.

After the first round, you’ll need to do a very large water change, run some carbon for 1-2 days, and do a second round of meds to live out the 21/22-day life cycle. You’ll want to slowly decrease the temp (warmer temps allow them to proliferate faster) a few degrees and slowly increase the salinity to 38-40ppt.

Shrimp won’t do well with either dip, so you may subjugate them to the medication rounds, but there is a chance that they won’t survive simply due to the strength of the concoction

There is a chance that you may be able to stop/slow it down if it’s in the early stages. It’s when the parasite becomes systemic and affects the organs that death is inevitable.

And @stella1979 is right about it being a facultative parasite. As for you’re cleaning method, the bleach soaking followed by a FW soak will work; I tend to allow mine to dry completely in the sun for a few days to help evaporate any of the bleach. Also, when you do your FW soak, you’ll want to change the water daily, and allow the rock to dry in the sun afterwards as well (if it rains or snows where you are, don’t forget to bring the rock inside!) A 5-10% bleach solution will work. Unfortunately, you’ll have to clean the tank and equipment as well, and definitely throw out the sand.
 

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You will need to nuke your tank which it looks like you are planning on doing already. Some people suggest running bleach to kill everything then allow everything to to dry out or use chloroquine phosphate (Ick shield) at a dosage of 80mg/gallon. All your other fish have been exposed, and it would be best to assume they have been infected. CP can be used at the higher dosage for the infected fish. I am not sure how you can treat your inverts with this disease though.

Good luck!!! While I have been extremely unlucky with fish and coral illnesses over the years, Uronema Marinum is one of the few I haven't dealt with first hand.
 
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Jregister2

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KinsKicks said:
Ughh, I’m so sorry this happened!

As for treatment, the course of action would be to do either a formalin (this would be the first choice) or freshwater dip or a hypersaline dip (45-50ppt) followed by a round of nitrofurazone + methylene blue (be wary that blue does stain silicone, but it will go away in a couple months...just don’t look at it haha. You can run fresh carbon every few months to help clear it out over time). You may also use malachite green instead of meth blue, but mal green is more harsh.

After the first round, you’ll need to do a very large water change, run some carbon for 1-2 days, and do a second round of meds to live out the 21/22-day life cycle. You’ll want to slowly decrease the temp (warmer temps allow them to proliferate faster) a few degrees and slowly increase the salinity to 38-40ppt.

Shrimp won’t do well with either dip, so you may subjugate them to the medication rounds, but there is a chance that they won’t survive simply due to the strength of the concoction

There is a chance that you may be able to stop/slow it down if it’s in the early stages. It’s when the parasite becomes systemic and affects the organs that death is inevitable.

And @stella1979 is right about it being a facultative parasite. As for you’re cleaning method, the bleach soaking followed by a FW soak will work; I tend to allow mine to dry completely in the sun for a few days to help evaporate any of the bleach. Also, when you do your FW soak, you’ll want to change the water daily, and allow the rock to dry in the sun afterwards as well (if it rains or snows where you are, don’t forget to bring the rock inside!) A 5-10% bleach solution will work. Unfortunately, you’ll have to clean the tank and equipment as well, and definitely throw out the sand.
Where can I get formalin? How long should the process take for the rock to be cured? I was planning on soaking it for a week in bleach then put it in a tub of freshwater for about a week and change water every day or every other day and let it dry out in the sun. Then rinse it and put it back in my tank.
 

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You're very welcome. I hope it helps a little. I have dealt with a lot of illness in this past year, so I can really sympathize with folks in your situation and try to help however I can. Not to be weird but... Through all the hardships of disease, I learned that we cannot ask for better advice than KinsKicks and SecretiveFish can give us. I know Kins is heavily experienced with disease and I would follow her instructions to the letter. SF is one of our most experienced salty members as well. I'm so glad they are both here.

My thoughts on the fish? Well, what if you move them all to qt, and some of them never exhibit symptoms? I know it's unlikely, but you never know. If some of them are symptomless right now, there is also probably a better chance of saving those fish. Either way, you will probably never be comfortable moving survivors back to the DT without some kind of treatment.

Formalin isn't as easy to get as it used to be. One product that has formalin along with malachite green is Rid Ich Plus by Kordon. I believe Hikari has similar ingredients in IchX, but I am not sure.
 
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SecretiveFish said:
You will need to nuke your tank which it looks like you are planning on doing already. Some people suggest running bleach to kill everything then allow everything to to dry out or use chloroquine phosphate (Ick shield) at a dosage of 80mg/gallon. All your other fish have been exposed, and it would be best to assume they have been infected. CP can be used at the higher dosage for the infected fish. I am not sure how you can treat your inverts with this disease though.

Good luck!!! While I have been extremely unlucky with fish and coral illnesses over the years, Uronema Marinum is one of the few I haven't dealt with first hand.
This is my luck..... first saltwater tank first fish added to the tank and already got a disease that seems like it's going to be a pain in the rear. Now I got to go all the way back to square one and start all the way back over. But this time I know the importance of a qt and to stay away from chromis
 
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Jregister2

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stella1979 said:
You're very welcome. I hope it helps a little. I have dealt with a lot of illness in this past year, so I can really sympathize with folks in your situation and try to help however I can. Not to be weird but... Through all the hardships of disease, I learned that we cannot ask for better advice than KinsKicks and SecretiveFish can give us. I know Kins is heavily experienced with disease and I would follow her instructions to the letter. SF is one of our most experienced salty members as well. I'm so glad they are both here.

My thoughts on the fish? Well, what if you move them all to qt, and some of them never exhibit symptoms? I know it's unlikely, but you never know. If some of them are symptomless right now, there is also probably a better chance of saving those fish. Either way, you will probably never be comfortable moving survivors back to the DT without some kind of treatment.

Formalin isn't as easy to get as it used to be. One product that has formalin along with malachite green is Rid Ich Plus by Kordon. I believe Hikari has similar ingredients in IchX, but I am not sure.
Like you just said I wouldn't feel comfortable adding them back to the tank at all even if I dose them with formalin. I just think it's to risky to break down the tank and let it cycle again just to add them back in to it and possible catch it again.
 

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Jregister2 said:
This is my luck..... first saltwater tank first fish added to the tank and already got a disease that seems like it's going to be a pain in the rear. Now I got to go all the way back to square one and start all the way back over. But this time I know the importance of a qt and to stay away from chromis
Not necessarily the chromis’s fault! I’d definitely check out your fish source and inquire about it...if it indeed came in through the chromis, their whole system may be infected as well. However, it’s sort of an odd parasite that could have been brought in by another fish, and didn’t really show itself until the damselfish showed up (Ive seen people totally go nuts over the fish source only to find that it had existed prior to adding a new fish (and new fish tend to be the most stressed and susceptible)).
 

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Jregister2 said:
This is my luck..... first saltwater tank first fish added to the tank and already got a disease that seems like it's going to be a pain in the rear. Now I got to go all the way back to square one and start all the way back over. But this time I know the importance of a qt and to stay away from chromis
I feel ya... Learned my lesson a year ago when I lost more than 30 fish in a 2 month old freshwater community. It seems ridiculous, but I have 6 tanks and only 3 fish. 2 are qt's, one of them is salty. 3 fish have died in the salty qt and it's been sterilized twice. Better there than in the DT though. My little reef is a year old and still only has one fish in it. It's aggravating at times, but I dread the idea of illness in a tank with corals.
 
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KinsKicks said:
Not necessarily the chromis’s fault! I’d definitely check out your fish source and inquire about it...if it indeed came in through the chromis, their whole system may be infected as well. However, it’s sort of an odd parasite that could have been brought in by another fish, and didn’t really show itself until the damselfish showed up (Ive seen people totally go nuts over the fish source only to find that it had existed prior to adding a new fish (and new fish tend to be the most stressed and susceptible)).
I just don't understand. I added the clownfish right after my cycle and they are doing great added the chromis about 6 days ago and they was doing great as well eating and have very nice color. Than I got home from work yesterday and noticed the red blotch on the smallest chromis first thing I done was test my water everything was ideal my ph was a little low, but nothing bad. I did notice the bigger chromis picked on the smallest for a while when i first got him. But they eventually calm down it just puzzles me last night before I went to bed I noticed that chromis was hiding and lost his color. That's when i figured it is uronema
 
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Jregister2

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stella1979 said:
I feel ya... Learned my lesson a year ago when I lost more than 30 fish in a 2 month old freshwater community. It seems ridiculous, but I have 6 tanks and only 3 fish. 2 are qt's, one of them is salty. 3 fish have died in the salty qt and it's been sterilized twice. Better there than in the DT though. My little reef is a year old and still only has one fish in it. It's aggravating at times, but I dread the idea of illness in a tank with corals.
So even if they do pull through I'll be iffy out putting them back in the tank. Might just set that 20 gallon up just for them and if they survive they will stay in there until they die of old age or natural causes. Than break that tank down and disinfect it with bleach I guess that's a option
 

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Jregister2 said:
I just don't understand. I added the clownfish right after my cycle and they are doing great added the chromis about 6 days ago and they was doing great as well eating and have very nice color. Than I got home from work yesterday and noticed the red blotch on the smallest chromis first thing I done was test my water everything was ideal my ph was a little low, but nothing bad. I did notice the bigger chromis picked on the smallest for a while when i first got him. But they eventually calm down it just puzzles me last night before I went to bed I noticed that chromis was hiding and lost his color. That's when i figured it is uronema
Hmm...did you happen to take any photos?
 
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KinsKicks said:
Hmm...did you happen to take any photos?
No I didn't. I'm at work so I can't take any now. I can try to describe it the best I can. What it looks like to me is he scraped against a rock his scales is pushed up the red mark is behind his gill it goes from the top of his dorsal fin down to about the bottom of his gill. I noticed last night before I went to bed it got darker almost like a dark red color and the fish was losing his color he still had some of a green tint to him but he was almost a silver color he came out to eat but as soon as he got done eating he went back to hiding. That's about the best I can tell you
 

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Jregister2 said:
Heres a picture of my set up and theres a screen shot off of google of what it look likes
Beautiful set-up!

It does happen pretty quickly when it is present; these parasites are stupidly quite resilient and they grow fast. It’s one of those “it happens” things where you sorta just want to go crazy. If it’s any silver lining, at least you’re system wasn’t too developed; if this had broken out with corals and such, I’d think it be much more heartbreaking. If anything, getting these diseases always proves to be a learning point to everyone at some point in the fishkeeping lives haha.

Oh, and that reminds me, for you’re QT tank, you’ll want to add tons of aeration; both for the medication as well as respiratory distress the parasite normally causes.
 
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KinsKicks said:
Beautiful set-up!

It does happen pretty quickly when it is present; these parasites are stupidly quite resilient and they grow fast. It’s one of those “it happens” things where you sorta just want to go crazy. If it’s any silver lining, at least you’re system wasn’t too developed; if this had broken out with corals and such, I’d think it be much more heartbreaking. If anything, getting these diseases always proves to be a learning point to everyone at some point in the fishkeeping lives haha.

Oh, and that reminds me, for you’re QT tank, you’ll want to add tons of aeration; both for the medication as well as respiratory distress the parasite normally causes.
I'm glad I dont have corals in there its heart breaking for me to tear it down now. Really just feel like it takes the life out of you knowing that I tried my best to have a great set up and do everything to the letter. Just to have to tear it down and start back over.
 

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Indeed... it's a sad yet important lesson that many of us have had to learn for ourselves.

Sounds like a good plan for the fish. If keeping a 20 on top of the IM is as many tanks as you can fit, don't forget that a quick and dirty qt can be set up for future fish. When you're ready to re-cycle the IM, perhaps you can throw a sponge filter in it so you cycle that at the same time. I've had such bad luck with new fish being sick this past year that I won't even introduce the first fish to a new system without a qt period in a bare and easy to sterilize tank.

I have a 20g reef and will only house nano fish, so a 5g qt works for me, though it does take up shelf space when other options can more easily go on the floor. A quick and dirty qt can be as cheap and simple as a Sterlite bin, sponge filter, spare heater, aeration via an airstone or perhaps a nano pump or two near the surface, which is my preferred option. I've had very good luck and lots of uses for these little $9, (used to be $7) pumps you can get on Amazon. I've found them to be so handy, that I now have four of them and they're all currently running.



Edit: Just want to say it again... I've been where you are and you have my utmost sympathy. It is heartbreaking, but you'll soon be over the hump and hopefully find some joy in the options you'll have with a fresh start.
 
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