Upsetting behavior ....

divakeeks

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I put the Melafix in Raspy's tank and he was doing fine until a little bit ago when I went to feed him.

He is suddenly not interested in food -- tried to get one piece and spit it out (VERY rare for him ... he's always been a voracious eater!)

He is staying at the top of his tank, frequently "gulping" for air and when he does so, bubbles come from the underside of his "chin"... it's really hard to explain as I don't know the proper terms for anatomy of a betta but I hope someone knows what I'm talking about.



Thanks.
Kelly ???
 

friend_o_fish

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The fish is eather oxygen starved or has gill parasites. fish gulp for air at the surface when eather of these conditions acre. The bubbles are air that the fish is passing over the gills and complex organ (very primitive lungs they can help the fish breath but can not sustain it completely.) For oxygen starvation you should add a air stone and air pump. I'm not sure what to do for gill parasites though.
 

chickadee

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It sounds like Gas Bubble Disease. If you have bubbles on the wall of the aquarium it can indicate that there is a supersaturation of Nitrogen in the water. If this is not the case, take 2 dry fingers and put them into the tank and see if bubbles form on them. This is an indication of Nitrogen gas. The way to get rid of this is to stir or agitate the water to release the gas into the atmosphere. If this is not the case then I am afraid it may be gill disease and he is going to need stronger medication than the Melafix. You need a medication that contains FORMALIN. I keep Quick Cure on hand because it is good for Ich and a bunch of other things including the type of thing you are describing here. But anything containing Formalin should work on the problem here if the first thing with the Nitrogen bubbles is not the case. You might also check the Ammonia level of the tank just in case. Whatever you do though do not do a large water change unless the water is at least as warm as the tank water. Cooler water is only going to add to the problem. and no more than a 50% change if you do need to change the water for any reason.

Please let me know how the little guy is doing. I am sorry he is having a bad time. I will check back frequently to see if there is something I can do to answer any more questions.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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Thanks Rose.

I checked the fingers in the tank and there was not even one bubble. No bubbles on the side of the tank either.

The fungus was near his gills.. do you think that could have caused this too?


I don't get paid until Tuesday, so when I do I will go out and get him some medication with Formalin in it. When I get it, should I add it with the Melafix or let the Melafix go out of the tank with the carbon back in?

I sure hope he can hang on for me.
 

chickadee

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If you can get Quick Cure or a Formalin based product by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, Inc. I know the two medications are compatible. The Melafix would not need to be removed and it would be my recommendation that you keep Raspy in it until you can get something for him. It may not do the disease any good but it may keep any other problems from rearing their heads. I would get the Formalin as soon as it is possible and start it as soon as is possible. My good thoughts go to you and to Raspy and I do hope that all works out well. Please keep me informed of his progress. Keep the airstone running and keep him at least 83 degrees (but if he isn't there yet take it up slow)

I will be thinking of you both. Please let me know how he is as you can. I want to help if I can.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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I don't have an airstone for him :-\


I wish I had known all this earlier today before I spent my money :'( :'( :'(


I will not remove the Melafix. He seems ok ... just not interested in a whole bunch right now except the surface of the water, just floating there.

I'll let you know how he is as I know more. Thanks for the good wishes. We sure appreciate it!
 

chickadee

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Before you buy the medication for him get the airstone and the airpump and tubing. it may make all the difference. He may just be oxygen starved. I was under the impression he had an air stone running. It would not be a bad idea as you get a litte extra money to hook up an airstone to each of the tanks. If the tanks are close enough they can run off of the same pump. All you have to do is buy some elbows for the tubing (T shaped valves) and then you can run more than one line off the same small pump. I have had as many as 3 tanks on one pump when the bucket is the quarantine taank for the little Marty and it works. The whole works for the airstone and the pump and the tubing should cost about $12 or so.and you will have enough tubing and another air stone for another tank if you ever decide to get the T valves for another tank. Put it toward the back of the tank behind the side where the water comes out of the top of the filter that way the oxygen will circulate in the water faster. and get the smallest and cheapest pump you can buy it will be strong enough and there is no need to pay more. and the cheap little blue airstones that come 2 in a package are just as good as the more expensive ones.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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Ok, I'll definitely look into that before buying the medication.


What causes a fish to become oxygen starved? would it have anything to do with him being sick?
 

chickadee

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No the tall aquarium will not hold the oxygen the way a long will and then we raised the temperature when we starte the medication. Lowering the temperature may help a little but I hat to do that with the fin problem. Maybe you should though until you get the airstone. With every degree of heat the water can hold less oxygen and it can cause the oxygen level to fall. YOu can try bringing the temperature down to 80 degrees.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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I would lower the temperature but I'm not sure I can do that without a heater, right?

I'm not sure the temperature is the problem anyway though since he has always been in warmer water ...


The airstone I'll try though and Lilex might like it too since he is still unfiltered. Perhaps I can persuade my boyfriend to buy it for me tomorrow and I can pay him back...

Anywho, I'll keep you posted.
 
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divakeeks

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Rose,

Do you think that you could provide me with some links as to what I need for the airstone and such?

When I was in the pet store I saw what I thought was tubing and such for an airstone but it was almost $20. I sure want to get what you have if it's only $12!!!


Thanks!
 

chickadee

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http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=12738&N=2004+113800  the one for $6.99 is plenty big

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=6124&N=2004+113403   25 feet of this will last you a long time

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=3725&N=2004+113405  the 99 cent ones one for each tank will do fine

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=3707&N=2004+113403  this is what you need to put in the airline to use the pump for more than one tank  just one will do.

hope this helps.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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Thank you so much. I apologize if that was a tall order. Perhaps I should have searched for it myself. I do appreciate you.


Just an update, not much is happening. Raspy is still staying at the surface, not swimming around, and not eating.


:'(
 

chickadee

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Have you tested for ammonia? I know the chances are slim but just in case something has gone wrong with your cycle, it is worth a try. Let me know the readings for Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate if you please. It may help here.

Don't worry about asking for links for items, ever. I have all the vendors speed linked to my computer and just open a new window and copy and paste and it is done. I got the request done in a couple of minutes and no problem. I kind of like to look at the new items in the books while I am at it so it is always okay.

Please send those test results if you can.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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A test kit I don't have yet, but I am hoping to be able to get one this week.

My boyfriend (graciously) purchased the airstone and supplies for my darling Raspy (and even one for Lilex, too!!)


How long should it take before I notice a difference (if one is to be found)? Also, it is normal for Lilex to appear off balance with the new "current" of the water since he has always had still water? I just want to make sure he isn't being stressed. He appears to be playing in it ... just wanted to be sure.


Raspy is a bit more active, but still staying at the surface and not interested in food. He takes it in his mouth and spits it out. I can't tell if he doesn't want it or if it hurts him to eat.
 

chickadee

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Could Raspy be constipated? Sometimes when they are all plugged up the little guys cannot eat. It could also just be that he is having a problem with his internal chemistry due to being sick. Have you ever been sick and really wanted to eat but it just didn't want to go down? Well this could be what he is having right now.

You should see a difference in the oxygen levels in a couple of hours if that is the trouble. If he is going to start swimming normally at other levels, he should be doing it by the time you go to bed. But the airstone and pump is never a waste as they really should have one anyway as it will help break down some of the toxins in the water.

Lilex playing in the water is okay as long as he has a few quiet places to go to if he wants to. He has choices but if he wants to be in the current that usually means he is having some fun or is very curious so he will quit when he gets tired or is done inspecting this new thing. They are indeed funny fish. Raspy would probably be doing the same thing if he were feeling better. As long as he is not being actually thrown around, don't worry about it. He will not let it hurt him.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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Good. I think Lilex is enjoyng his airstone. He likes to stick his nose into it. ??? ;D Silly Lilex!


I haven't really noticed a change in Raspy as of yet, but perhaps it will take a bit longer. I sure can tell he wants to eat but he just can't. When that pellet goes in the water he practically dives after it but spits it out and goes to sulk since he can't eat.


I sure do hope this airstone will help him become more active. If not, I'll get that medicine and try that as well.

I just want my baby better.
 

chickadee

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Have you tried Peas yet? If you make the pieces small enough he may be able to get one or two down and then if constipation is part of the problem he will have a bit of help. I am at this point just throwing things out that may help as the little guy has me stumped. I am sorry. ???

Do let me know how he is tomorrow if you have the time.

Rose
 
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divakeeks

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Rose,

I really wish I could tell you how Raspy is, but I just don't know! He seems to be breathing better with the airstone (I haven't seen the extra bubbles) but I don't think he likes it AT ALL. He is hiding in the back by the filter and won't come out. He still won't eat. I haven't tried the pea thing yet, have to go to the store tonight and get some. I am also going out tonight to get that medicine you talked about (Formalin, I think it was) and see if that will help him.

As far as the airstone, I haven't taken it out ... I had a larger one in there but he was hiding so I tried a smaller one that I had gotten for Lilex and he still hides. I think Lilex wants his back, too! do you think there is too much movement of the water for Raspy and he's just not feeling well enough for it right now?

I know you are stumped, and I am, too. I just don't know what else to do.

Kelly
 
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divakeeks

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Alright. I think things are looking up.


I went to the fish store this evening and bought some Quick Cure and added it to the tank. Raspy seems to be a little more active tonight even though he still seems to like the surface of the water. Hopefully this medicine will help him feel better.

I also purchased a couple Otos for the tank. (I finally found a store that had some healthy non "giant" ones!) They are happily chowing away at the algae in the tank and Raspy is none the wiser. He is paying them NO attention. He was curious about the bag in the tank but as soon as I let them out, he went about his business.

We'll see... Thanks everyone for putting up with my worries
 
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