Tubing Size Help / Hole Drill Size

Hello, hello everyone. for my 40 gal tank I am building a trickle filter sitting in a 10gal sump with a pump capable of 6ft hose rise. Reading online I cannot find a way to measure if I need a larger drilled hole for larger tubing to compensate how quickly the 320gph pump will be feeding water in. I imagine I need the output of water to match the input. Also if need a larger tube for output I would need a larger bulkhead and hole right? For the same reason idk how to figure out what size tube for the fitting is the same reason idk what size bulkhead and drilled hole size is needed.

Also the pump has a 3/5 fitting but online tubing of all sizes down to millimeter is offered. I'm not sure exactly what size tubing whether 1 mil larger or 2, 3 ect would work best.

Also The GPH is debatable and I basically took the popular vote. I've read higher gph is better for mechanical filtration and lower is better for biological filtration and it all seemed very confusing and opinionated. Its still in my checkout list so please any more info on that would put my mind at ease. Idk how to measure how strong GPH current is and would not want it to knock my baby turtle around. This pump has adjustable GPH so that should help but I feel there could be issues with too much or too little water in the sump. which hose size could play a factor in as well right?

Thanks for everything guys. I really want to make the right decisions but I'm having a hard time finding this information online.

Edit Note : Changed 400GHP pump to 320GPH pump. Textual error.

Pump:

 

People will adivse you on various parts of the questions in your post. I would like you to pay attention to your pump, as I assume it will be in the sump below the tank:

95 LPH @ 60 cm; Max Lift: 60 cm

i.e. if the pump has to life the water 60 cms high, then the flow will be 95lph i.e. 25ghp

I leave the rest for the sump experts

 

The overflow from your aquarium down into the sump must be able to drain water from the aquarium down into the sump faster than your pump can move the water back up into the aquarium from the sump. If it cannot, you could find your aquarium overflowing, and have a real mess.

So you want to make sure that your overflow/drain from the aquarium can accommodate the flow rate your pump is actually producing. That flow rate will depend on the pump, your tubing and fittings, and the "pump curve" for that pump (effective head versus flow rate). Remember that the height of lift or "static head" is only one factor in the "total head" or "effective head" (dynamic head).

What I've done in the past is to use a pump that can pump more than I need, then install a plastic valve in the line leading from the sump pump up to the aquarium so that I can throttle the flow down. This flow-control valve must be on the OUTLET side of the pump. Never restrict the inlet side of a centrifugal pump. Cavitation is not only noisy, but causes rapid wear and damage to the pump volute and impeller.

With that throttling valve, I can be sure I am not exceeding what the overflow can handle. Usually, you want the overflow from the aquarium to be massively oversized, in fact. Things can plug up, and you do NOT want your system to overflow! So you need to build in some safety margin. A LOT of safety margin!

I have also always installed a float switch, conductivity switch, or one of those optical diffraction sensors to shut off the sump pump if the aquarium water level rises too high. You just can't be too careful. I hate flooding my house with aquarium water!

Remember that most float switches cannot handle the full current of the pump motor, nor can they handle the inductive "kick" produced by the coil in the motor when you switch it off. So you need to set up an interposing relay and appropriate surge protection across the contacts of both the float switch and the interposing relay to protect them from the inductive spikes caused by their respective loads. Don't expect a little float switch's tiny reed-relay contacts to switch the full power of a pump by themselves. They're very tiny and meant only to act as a control signal, not to switch the full load on their own.

If you need help with that, let me know.

I've used siphon type overflows from the upper aquariums more often than I've drilled aquariums. Having the tank drilled is more convenient and positive. But the siphon systems I've made have always worked just fine, too. Just throttle your pump to get a safe flow that your overflow system can easily handle so you have a good margin of safety and plugging.


Edit to add:

While the Amazon ad shows a sheet giving some specs for the different pumps in that line, they do not show a family of pump curves. So there's no way to know how much water that pump is designed to deliver at various dynamic heads.

Also, without knowing how far the pump will actually be lifting the water in your particular setup, we are missing a vital piece of data. So we cannot really guess how much water that pump will move in your application.

 

Hello Jsigmo, Geez how could I forget to include that. The lift is 4ft. I will look into the Siphon method, If not that I'll indeed attach a ginormous overflow hose that would give a fire hydrant a run for its money. I will study up on float switches as well. I could not find information on pump curves or dynamic heads so i'm lost on that. Thanks a lot for your help. Whatever a pump curve is, if it is necessary to understanding whether or not a product will complete the task I need, then I indeed need to find a product with that information included right?

I did find a DIY that looks interesting, I'll keep on looking though.

People will adivse you on various parts of the questions in your post. I would like you to pay attention to your pump, as I assume it will be in the sump below the tank:

95 LPH @ 60 cm; Max Lift: 60 cm

i.e. if the pump has to life the water 60 cms high, then the flow will be 95lph i.e. 25ghp

I leave the rest for the sump experts

The rise will be 4-4.5 ft. I'm not understanding your formula though. With the formula i'm sure I could apply it to this chart and figure which model will be necessary to obtain 320 ish gph with a 4ft lift 4ft=122CM

 

The rise will be 4-4.5 ft. I'm not understanding your formula though. With the formula i'm sure I could apply it to this chart and figure which model will be necessary to obtain 320 ish gph with a 4ft lift 4ft=122CM


View attachment 386763

Daniel,

The chart does not show you the ghh at the max lift height. It shows you gph max at 0 lift height because that is how pump manufacturers provide tech parameters. If you go to amazon on the link you provided earlier, you will see an annotation about how gph drops when the lift height is max.

 

Daniel,

The chart does not show you the ghh at the max lift height. It shows you gph max at 0 lift height because that is how pump manufacturers provide tech parameters. If you go to amazon on the link you provided earlier, you will see an annotation about how gph drops when the lift height is max.

Well ****.. All in all I know I need to find a pump that displays what the gph is at specific lift hights. If only there were any on amazon with that info. Ebay either.

Edit: 30 minutes in....None of the products gave this information available...

 

Pump:

Go to the link that you posted and in the description of the pump and to the right of the picture you will see this text:
Uniclife 300 L/H Submersible Water Pump for Fish Tank Aquarium Water Features Fountain Hydroponic

by


16 customer reviews

| 3 answered questions

Price: £4.99 & FREE Delivery in the UK on orders over £20. Details



In stock.


This item does not ship to Poland. Learn more
Sold by PAWFLY Utop and Fulfilled by Amazon. Gift-wrap available.


Note: This item is eligible for click and collect. Click and Collect with Amazon Pickup Locations<\/b>","position":"triggerBottom"}" style="box-sizing: border-box;">Details
1 new from £4.99

• Indoor & Outdoor Freshwater or Marine use. Great for Bird baths, Fish tank, Water feature & Vase fountains and Aquariums alike.
• NdFeB Magnets, aluminum oxide ceramic impeller shaft and epoxy resin guarantee the pump can work over 20,000 hours. Comes with 12 months guarantee.
• Includes 1.8 m waterproof power cord with UK 3 pin plug, adjustable regulator and 2 Nozzles for 8 mm and 13 mm id hose.
• Detachable pump head, easy to clean without using any tools. 3 Strong suction cups hold the pump steadily and keep it quiet.
• Flow Rate of 300L Per Hour@ 0 cm; 190 LPH @ 30 cm; 95 LPH @ 60 cm; Max Lift: 60 cm, 3 watts, 220-230 V ac, Pump Dims: 48 x 46 x 34 mm.

 

Forgive me for being uneducated on this. Liters Per Hour in your product is 95. 4liters = 1 gallon 95/4 = 23GPH at a 2ft lift for this 25gph product? The max lift of 4ft there would be virtually no gph if 2ft leaves me 23gph out of 100L = 25gph So there is no way this product would work for 4 ft. I'm really struggling here. I don't Believe this information nor the title of the product match my posted link. Maybe this is a new product to show what info needs to be in a description? I'm also not sure if all pumps equal out the same for lift. Do you know of any pumps that would work that have information like this in the description? I'm not finding any online that have the spec information on flow rate per ft of lift.

Everything i'm finding searching 320 GPH submersible pump or 320gph sump pump only lists stuff like this
=========================================
Max Flow: 320 GPH (1200L/H), H-Max: 6.2Ft

Maximum flow rate: 660GPH

• ENERGY EFFICIENCY and HIGH LIFT--8.2ft High Lift

==========================================

But doesn't say how much Gph will be at the max 6.2 ft you see? So i'm not sure how to measure the difference between 2ft or 4ft lift. I've clicked on the first 20 pumps that came up in the search and none have information like your product does... what the heck do I do? I will keep looking though.

What are the specs i'm looking for in a pump or even buying two smaller pumps that will average 320GPH at a 4ft lift?



This is the link I posted right?

Uniclife 80 - 400 GPH Submersible Water Pump Indoor Outdoor Fountain Pool Aquarium Quiet Pump with 6' UL Listed Power Cord


Googling the title you posted I came up with a separate product in the United Kingdom.
Uniclife 300 L/H Submersible Water Pump for Fish Tank Aquarium Water Features Fountain Hydroponic


I'll create a new post for this. I'm super rushed as my amazon prime 30 day trial ends in 2 days and need this before Christmas and feel the title now misleads from the information at hand.

I'm simply not finding ANY products with that listed information in the description leaving me unable to calculate. I've been through OVER 100. if they are all trying to scam me by leading me to assume it would be 320 with lift I HAVE NO CLUE where to find a product that has the flow rates on it.
Forgive me for being uneducated on this.
I don't Believe this information nor the title of the product match my posted link. Maybe this is a new product to show what info needs to be in a description?

Everything i'm finding searching 320 GPH submersible pump or 320gph sump pump or fountain pumps ect only lists stuff like this without any flow rate information. And I've been through over 100 now.
=========================================
Max Flow: 320 GPH (1200L/H), H-Max: 6.2Ft

Maximum flow rate: 660GPH

• ENERGY EFFICIENCY and HIGH LIFT--8.2ft High Lift

==========================================

 

Sorry Daniel - didn't mean to stress you out.

You are right - it is very hard to find the full characteristics for the pump in the description.

Personally I would go for a pump like this one in your situation.

It has three times the lift you require and double the water flow. The good thing is that you can adjust the flow, so effectively you will be able to set the flow at your required rate.

I have never use this brand before, however I cannot find any negative remarks about the pump, so it should be on the "better side of good"

Good luck - let me know what decision you make. I am really keen to see your build.

 

One thing to also keep in mind is that you should set things up so that the end of the hose coming up from your sump to fill the aquarium should NOT be positioned below the surface of the water in the aquarium, or if it is, it should still be positioned up fairly high in the aquarium so that when you have a power failure, and the pump stops, water (or at least too much water) cannot siphon back down the "up hose" and overfill/overflow your sump as the aquarium drains!

Water will immediately start siphoning back down the "up" tube if the pump stops and the end of the "up" hose is below the water line of your aquarium.

So keeping that in mind:

Without actually having pump curves for the pumps, it's hard to know what they will actually do pumping into various dynamic heads.

But as I and RSababady have recommended above is to just get a pump that can pump into a much higher head than what you anticipate and then throttle the flow down to what you want using a valve. Some pumps have that throttling adjustment valve built right into them. But in any case, the idea is to get a pump that is larger than what you need so that it can easily pump more water than you need into the total dynamic head in your system. In other words, get a pump that's oversized for your job and choke it off as needed.

So, let's say you think the static head (height difference between the level of water in the sump and the height of the discharge opening feeding your aquarium) is four feet. Add in a couple of feet to account for friction losses in the tubing and any elbows or other fittings. And then get a pump rated to pump up into a head of that total.

So, for you, I'd get a pump that claims to pump up into a head of 8 or 10 feet. What they're calling "Max Lift" in the table of pumps you show above.

Get a UL550 or UL800, and you should be good to go. If the pump you choose has a built-in flow adjuster, you can just use that to throttle the flow down to something your overflow can handle. If the pump doesn't have a built-in flow adjuster, then just get a plastic ball valve at the local home store, and the appropriate fittings to go from thread to hose barb, and then you can insert that ball valve in the hose leading up from your pump to the aquarium, and adjust the flow rate down to what you want with that.

It seems like a lot of these inexpensive pumps don't bother to publish pump curves, so you can't really know how much they'll pump into different dynamic heads. But as cheap as they are, you can just get an oversized one, and throttle it down with a valve, and be good to go.

 

One thing to also keep in mind is that you should set things up so that the end of the hose coming up from your sump to fill the aquarium should NOT be positioned below the surface of the water in the aquarium, or if it is, it should still be positioned up fairly high in the aquarium so that when you have a power failure, and the pump stops, water (or at least too much water) cannot siphon back down the "up hose" and overfill/overflow your sump as the aquarium drains!

Water will immediately start siphoning back down the "up" tube if the pump stops and the end of the "up" hose is below the water line of your aquarium.

So keeping that in mind:

Without actually having pump curves for the pumps, it's hard to know what they will actually do pumping into various dynamic heads.

But as I and RSababady have recommended above is to just get a pump that can pump into a much higher head than what you anticipate and then throttle the flow down to what you want using a valve. Some pumps have that throttling adjustment valve built right into them. But in any case, the idea is to get a pump that is larger than what you need so that it can easily pump more water than you need into the total dynamic head in your system. In other words, get a pump that's oversized for your job and choke it off as needed.

So, let's say you think the static head (height difference between the level of water in the sump and the height of the discharge opening feeding your aquarium) is four feet. Add in a couple of feet to account for friction losses in the tubing and any elbows or other fittings. And then get a pump rated to pump up into a head of that total.

So, for you, I'd get a pump that claims to pump up into a head of 8 or 10 feet. What they're calling "Max Lift" in the table of pumps you show above.

Get a UL550 or UL800, and you should be good to go. If the pump you choose has a built-in flow adjuster, you can just use that to throttle the flow down to something your overflow can handle. If the pump doesn't have a built-in flow adjuster, then just get a plastic ball valve at the local home store, and the appropriate fittings to go from thread to hose barb, and then you can insert that ball valve in the hose leading up from your pump to the aquarium, and adjust the flow rate down to what you want with that.

It seems like a lot of these inexpensive pumps don't bother to publish pump curves, so you can't really know how much they'll pump into different dynamic heads. But as cheap as they are, you can just get an oversized one, and throttle it down with a valve, and be good to go.

Indeed, Yes I've decided to simply go big and measure down rather than spend so much time trying to find what will fit the exact needs. Thanks for looking out about flooding. The sump will have 10 gal in it but its a large 30gal container so I have a lot of room for major accidents to occur