Tiger Barbs Hiding

Hello everyone,

This is a cross-post - I hope that's ok. Mods, please delete if not. The long version is on the Freshwater Beginner's forum.

I'm cycling a new 30 gallon tank with a school of 5 Tiger Barbs. The water parameters are: pH 7.0; Alk 80; Hardness 120; Nitrite 0; Nitrate 0; Ammonia <.25; 78 degrees F. 15% water change every 2-4 days (or more often, as necessary if ammonia builds up). I test daily. I'm not using any cycling boosters or anything like that. I do condition the water to detoxify it. Feeding lightly once a day using Tetra flakes, and frozen bloodworms every couple of days as a treat. Lights on for 12 hours a day total, but not continuously (we turn them off when we leave, or are not going to be in the room for a while).

Now my question. For the last 3 days, the Tiger Barbs do nothing but hide, pretty much all the time. At first, the Tiger Barbs acted like Tiger Barbs, swimming throughout the tank very actively in a school, and chasing each other around. Then they started fighting, which I assumed was a perfectly natural event to establish a pecking order. It does not appear that anyone got hurt (fins intact, etc.). Then for a day or so, the dominant fish would hang out in the open while the other four hid most of the time. Whenever one would come out, the dominant fish would chase him back into hiding. This went on for about a day. Now they seem to all hide all the time. I fed them last night and no one came out to eat! However, this morning the food seems to be gone. When you turn out the lights, two or three of them sometimes will come out. They seem to be very aware of what's going on outside the tank, and if they are out they will go into hiding if someone approaches the tank.

So, I'm thinking there are a couple of possibilities: (1) they are still getting used to their new environment, and this will all work itself out in time (they have been in the tank for 5 days); (2) there is some problem, possibly stemming from the aggressive behavior of the Alpha-fish, that has basically destroyed the playful schooling behavior that makes these fish so appealing in the first place.

I'm considering what, if anything to do, and I'm thinking that my first step may be to add a sixth Tiger Barb to see if that helps the social dynamic at all.

Thoughts are appreciated. Thanks.

--Adam

 

Adam I answered your other post and it's really hard to keep up with posts if there are two to check. So lets answer all your fishie questions here.
Here are some articles that will make your life a lot easier. Enjoy the reading!!

sounds like maybe your tank isn't cycled yes and that is stressful for your fish.
Carol

 

Thanks.

I'm surprised to hear you suggest that it's stress due to cycling, because at my pH and ammonia levels, there's really nothing about the water conditions that should be stressing the fish. I also do regular small water changes, and the tank's only been running for less than a week.

 

How big is your tank? I recently moved my tiger barbs out of a large community tank where they exhibited normal barb behavior and put them in a smaller tank by themselves and they are now behaving as you described, basically hiding. They are still eating and appear healthy so I'm just going to give them some time and I'll bet everything returns to normall.

 

Your tank has only been up for a week, it usually takes about 4-6 weeks to cycle. It takes at least that long to grow beneficial bacteria in your filter, on the gravel and on the decor in your tank. Keep a close watch on your ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Your ammonia is showing a slight reading, soon it will spike then you will see nitrites then you will see Nitrates. When you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and 20 or less in nitrates then your cycle will be over. What type of testing supplies are you using? Any ammonia will stress your fish, anything close to or ever 1 can kill your fish.
The only thing I know of that "instantly" cycles your tank is called Bio-spira and its hard to find. Although Chickadee orders it on line, if you want to try it she could give you the address to order it.
Although fishless cycling is recommended lots of people still use fish to cycle. Keep us posted and we will help in any way we can.
Carol

 

Copy of my reply from the other thread:

"I'm glad you took the fish home. And I am happy I never saw anything like this at any restaurant. If I saw fish in such conditions at some restaurant, they would have a big trouble trying to get rid of me! The management would have to deal with me until the fish got the home they deserved. Period.

Besides, if your ammonia is 0.25 this is what probably causes the shy behavior of your fish. Don't be surprised if they get sick. Any presence (even in smallest amounts) of ammonia and nitrite can make your fish sick, and even kill them. Please read about the nitrogen cycle on Fish Lore and many other articles for beginners. It's best not to add any fish to a tank until it's fully cycled. And even after it's cycled, it best to stock a tank gradually (and not adding many fish at once)."

 

Thanks - I didn't see your reply on the other thread. I read a lot about cycling before setting up the 30 gallon tank, but I guess I didn't realize that such a small amount of ammonia would have such a result on the fish. I'm using a test strip kit that I got at the LFS on both of my tanks, and the literature lists my ammonia levels as "safe" at my pH. The goldfish have higher ammonia (about .5) and seem perfectly fine, so I guess I thought that the water conditions were fine.

I read about fishless cycling, but I elected not to do it because there seem to be differences of opinion about it, with some saying that the best way to achieve a stable tank over the long term is to do it the old fashioned way using fish you intend to keep. No one seems to disagree that using fish to cycle the tank works well, so I decided to use that method. I will be sure to keep doing regular small water changes and hope the fish don't get sick.

I figured five little Tiger Barbs for a 30 gallon tank was a reasonable start, but I have no plans to add more fish until the cycle is complete. And when I do add, I'll take it slow.

Thanks again.

 

The reason I prefer fishless cycling is because ammonia and nitrite can make fish sick and even kill them while you're cycling your tank. To me, it is cruelty. I don't want any fish dying because of me.

You can cycle your tank adding fish food to it - which will also turn to waste and encourage the development of the nitrifying bacteria. Once the tank is cycled this way, you start to stock your tank gradually. "Gradually" is the keyword here. It means you start adding 1-2 fish at a time; say, 1-2 fish every week or so. This way, you give the beneficial bacteria the time to develop without the risk of killing your fish. You continue adding 1-2 fish every week or so, until your tank is stocked to the level you want it to be (of course, we don't want to overstock!).

Even though a tank seems cycled, when you add many fish at once, ammonia and/or nitrite can suddenly go up. This is because while the tank is cycled and it has the beneficial bacteria, it doesn't have enough of the bacteria to deal with an influx of so much waste. This is why it is important to stock a tank gradually.

No ammonia level is safe for your tank - as I have said, smallest ammonia (and nitrite) amounts can kill your fish.

 

The water testing kit made by aquarium pharmaceuticals is more reliable than the dip stick and are recommended for accurate testing.
as far as safe at your ph. Fish will acclimate to just about any ph as long as it doesn't fluctuate wildly, but any ammonia levels can affect your fish. Even your goldfish need lower ammonia levels, which is hard because even though their beautidul fish they are really messy.
But now you have them and lets get you and your fish through the cycle as safely as possible
Carol

 

I bought some Bio Spira (they carry it at a local Petco). I added it Saturday in the late afternoon to both my new tanks, and I already have some Nitrite and Nitrate readings in the small tank, so it seems to be doing the trick. I'll test again this afternoon when I do my scheduled water change. Marineland says it should make the tank "fish safe" within 24 hours. We'll see if it works as advertised. Marineland seems to be a pretty professional outfit, so I have high hopes. Wish I had done this sooner. I lost three of the barbs. Added four more at the same time I added the Bio Spira. All of the Barbs are acting very happy now. Out in the open almost all the time, chasing each other around a lot, but no real fighting. So far so good (except for the three fish that didn't make it).

 

BioSpira is meant to be added at the same time you add your first fish. since you all ready had fish in there and some ammonia readings I wouldn't add any more fish until the BioSpira catches up.
Your lucky to be able to get BioSpira locally, so many can't.
Carol

 

The Bio-Spira seems to work. All the fish seem happy. I wanted to describe what I am seeing in terms of water parameters to see if they are normal. Over the last few days, my ammonia level has stayed at .25. However, for the first time, I have seen low levels of Nitrite and Nitrate. Last night I tested again, and ammoinia was still at .25, but Nitrite was very close to zero, and Nitrate was 20. The thing that seems strange is that I added the Bio-Spira on Saturday, the fish seem happy, nitrification is occuring, but my ammonia level has stayed constant. I have done one 15% water change since adding the Bio-Spira. There are a total of seven fish in the tank (6 Tiger Barbs and 1 Electric Yellow Cichlid), about 8 to 9 fish-inches total. 30 gallons.

 

Give the BioSpira a chance to catch up. your other readings indicat things are moving right along. Keep us posted!
Carol

 

Thanks.

 

hI there Adam T I don't want to be the one to break the bad news to you but tigerbarbs can get to 3 inches each.so you have actully got 18 inches of tigerbarb alone. .I don't know how big Electric yellow chiclids get but I think you still won't be overstocked..unless the chiclid is a big big fish..but if your tigerbarbs are still hiding then there is something wrong..tigerbarbs are not the type of fish to hide from anything..mine don't even back down from my red tail black shark.. ;D ..

good luck anyway adam

 

HI David. I appreciate the post. I figure I'll have about 34 fish-inches at full maturity, so I'm a bit over the "rule of thumb," but I have a good filter system and I do weekly 15% water changes, so I think I should be ok. Do you agree?

BTW, I am figuring 2.5" on average for the Tiger Barbs. The Electric yellow should only get to be about 4", and the Rams only 3" It's possible that some fish may grow bigger than I am planning, in which case I'll have to adjust, but that will be quite a way down the road. For the immediate future, I'll be very understocked as none of my fish are even close to the full size I am planning for.

Since I added the Bio-Spira, the Tiger Barbs have come out of hiding. For the last several days they've been out all the time, eating enthusiastically, and chasing each other around. A real joy to watch. The electric Yellow Cichlid (which is the only other fish in the tank at the moment -- the others in my list will be added after my ammonia level is down to zero) is a really little guy at the moment (only 2"), but he's out all the time too. It's fascinating how the Alpha-Barb doesn't mess with the little Cichlid. In fact, I've seen the little Cichlid briefly pursue the Alpha-Barb on occassion! Those Cichlids don't take any guff!

Anyway, the tank seems to be doing very well now, and all the fish seem to be very happy. I plan to add another pouch of Bio-Spira when I introduce the remaining Cichlids, just to be safe. It's expensive, but it really seems to work, and I don't want to loose any more fish to ammonia.

 

55 gallon tank, my current stock is 1 bristle nose pleco, 9 small tiger barbs and 1 red tailed shark. Nitrates and stuff 0, ph 7.9

I not sure why but my tiger barbs are hiding behind the power head of my tank I recently introduced them about 2 weeks ago and they were all chill and doing their thing. Now their all cramped in the top corner of the tank, I think this is happening because I have a RTS and he's always chasing them around, it does have 2 cave structures and 2 pieces of driftwood but other then that its a very open tank. Also I left the RTS alone for 3 days would that be a problem.

Any suggestions I was thinking more hiding places would do the trick.

 

Are you sure your water parameters are correct? In a cycled tank, it is very uncommon to have 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrites and 0ppm nitrates. So if your test kit is faulty for some reason, they could be hanging in the corner because of that.

But if all parameters are good, I guess it could be the RTS scaring them, although I always thought tiger barbs were pretty brave and aggressive. Maybe they are just to young to know they are tuff guys.

 

I gotta say that I have a large tiger barb in with my black skirts and emerald corys and he hides most of the time actually. I think it could be the RTS keeping things in the corners.

Personally I would also retest the water and beat the heck out of that number 2 bottle for the nitrate test, and also make sure you are performing the tests according to the directoins, use a timer if necessary.

 

I would be looking at the RTS as well. 0 ammonia, nitrite and nitrate is generally what you want in a tank, sometimes people add nitrates for plants though. If everything is not 0 you might wanna do a water change. Of course... if your tap water is the problem....

 

Ladayen, nitrates are the end result of the nitrogen cycle. Ammonia gets converted into nitrites, nitrites get converted into nitrates. So as a constant supply of ammonia is being produced, you end up with a constant rise in nitrate levels. The reason for weekly partial water changes is to keep nitrates low. Unless a tank is lightly stocked and heavily planted, you will never be able to acheive 0ppm nitrates.

 

I have 0.05ppm ammonia I retested today, and my tank is very lightly stocked at the moment I have a ehiem 2215 and its rated up to 350l that might be why its so low. I'm also with jdhef I thought the tiger barbs were brave, I will try getting some pvc pipes for hiding places maybe that will calm them. Also I'm going to be setting up a planted tank after the summer!!!

 

0 ammonia, nitrite and nitrate is generally what you want in a tank, sometimes people add nitrates for plants though. If everything is not 0 you might wanna do a water change.

This is not correct and should not be handed out as advice. Please be sure to read jdhef's response to your post.

 

Ya I know that information didn't sound right

 

My grandad has a 24oL tank with 12 tiger barbs and a load of different catfish. He's had his Tigers for almost a year and we're doing absolutely fine. A healthy pecking order, it was clear to see who was the dominant fish, and they even stayed away from one of his long finned catfish. I don't know what species it is but he refers to it as a sailfin catfish.
He told me today that his tiger barbs have started hiding and haven't eaten for 3 days. They apparently dash around the tank for a while and then go back t hiding. I asked if they were headstanding as this is usually a telltale sign to the tiger barbs not being happy with the water conditions, but he said they aren't. They aren't hiding together, but individually at separate parts of the tank. What is going on??

 

Are these tigwr barbs mature adults? Has the water changed temp recently or was a decent sized water change done? Some times them breaking off into groups and hiding without headstanding is a sign that some females are egg heavy and about to lay. Several males (usually the most dominant) will usually chase an egg heavy female amd stay by her. Sometimes they don't eat during this process.

If they aren't eating try enticing them with live foods like shrimp. Usually that will get them interested. If not, recheck all water conditions and monitor to see if they are loosing weight or color. If they aren't they may, again just be breeding.

 

He's very thorough with his water parameters staying constant so if it was due to that I would expect he would know that's why.
They are all mature adults and he has been suspecting gravid females for a while, so this could be it. His males are all very colourful at the moment so I'll see how this goes and let him know

 

My 12 Tiger Barbs hide all day long in my planted 29 Gallon. They do how ever attack food when feed during the day. When lights go off they are out swimming around and schooling together looking normal. has anyone ever experience this with barbs and might know an answer to this? my new work schedule has me home most of the day and I now notice this tank looks empty all day long. They are awesome to enjoy but don't seem to like to do so during the day time...

 

This is very odd behavior. Do you have any pets or small humans that are moving about a lot and possibly scaring them?

 

This is very odd behavior. Do you have any pets or small humans that are moving about a lot and possibly scaring them?

Cat. She has been known to stare and claw at the glass. Quite comical to watch.

The more I watch the behavior I believe it could other things such as poor diet, some look bloated or full of eggs. Dull in color hiding in my plants breathing normal if not heavily. But they do become active right after lights out and surrounding lights of the house barely light the tank.

Now for my water I have no idea what I'm going to test it to make sure their isn't problems on that scale.

 

The cat could be part of the problem. Have you tried giving them some organic lettuce and blanched green beans or zucchini? Let us know how your water parameters are.

 

A year ago I took a tank after my friend’s father unexpectedly passed away.
My friend then talked me into taking the fish not rehomed through Craig’s List. Oh gosh, waaaay too many fish.
So I’ve been slowly separating them and I’ve lost several, sigh.
But, I originally had 6 Tiger barbs. They were active and lively.
Lost 2 and then moved other fish to another tank so that the 4 remaining Tigers were the only fish in the 29. They started hiding and seeming stressed, especially when the light was on.
I just moved them to my 75. They are so much happier with a couple more Tigers and some golden barbs.
But now ALL the barbs hide when the light is on. They are fine with just the room lights and the blue moon light.
I do want to add more plants so maybe that will help. I have no idea if it is a reflection or some other issue.
So let me know if you figure yours out!!

 

I am moving them to a friends 55 gallon to see if this gives them more space. I am completely clueless is to why they hide during day light. I did some looking in to breeding and I believe I have 10 female and 2 males by judging of the nose color. they all look full of eggs and hide in my aunbis all day. they do come out to feed when food goes flying by. my only guess is they keep droping eggs and tank mates and themselves would eat them.

 

Hmmm, strange. I have 5 tiger barbs in a 40 gallon with no plants. A few terracotta pots for them to run and hide if need be. They never hide, quite active and soons I approach the tank they go into a frenzy. Since I've had them they never hide.

 

Hmmm, strange. I have 5 tiger barbs in a 40 gallon with no plants. A few terracotta pots for them to run and hide if need be. They never hide, quite active and soons I approach the tank they go into a frenzy. Since I've had them they never hide.

That's how my 12 use to be. Drop food they would go crazy. After I feed them they would follow me around the house so to speak. Now I look at empty tank with beautiful plants growing well.

 

That's how my 12 use to be. Drop food they would go crazy. After I feed them they would follow me around the house so to speak. Now I look at empty tank with beautiful plants growing well.

Oh no! Maybe something's changed in the tank? Water parameters? New addition?

 

Oh no! Maybe something's changed in the tank? Water parameters? New addition?

My filters only hold sponges that are years old. Ive been weekly doseing flourish and excell and have seen much success in growth of plants. Change the water once a week two years never missed a maintenance day. I use tap with prime. Never had isses or fish losses so I'm not leaning on water problems but could be possible.

They will love their new 55.