Tetra safestart Q.. add fish or TSS first..(another TSS Q) sorry

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Royal pleco

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So I read on the sticky with the Qn A with Tetra by the user "Shawnie" that you should put the fish in first, then wait a few hours and then use TSS...On the back of the bottle it says add TSS first, then add fish a few hours later. I think I understand both philosophies, but which one is best? Does anyone have personal good results in adding the fish first then TSS? Sorry again for another TSS thread.. but it's a mother day gift, and these big fancy goldfish cost a pretty penny, I want to get it right for many reasons. Thank you,
Royal pleco
 

jetajockey

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I'd follow tetras instructions to the letter, although in this particular instance I believe either are ok. Tss claims to be stabilized in a solution that includes ammonia (from what I remember), not that 2 hours with or without fish is going to make any serious difference.

One far more important thing that tetra doesn't specify on in that q and a is you need to wait to use tss a minimum of 24hrs after using water conditioners, including their own (aquasafe). I was told that in an email from tetra.
 
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Lucy

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jetajockey said:
One far more important thing that tetra doesn't specify on in that q and a is you need to wait to use tss a minimum of 24hrs after using water conditioners, including their own (aquasafe). I was told that in an email from tetra.
From:
Q & A With Tetra about Tetra SafeStart

In regards to ammonia products, yes, they kill TSS. Any type, whether a
chloramines remover or detoxifier, etc, anything that says it locks up
ammonia or removes ammonia. Do not add TSS for 24 hours after using
such a product, and do not add such a product for at least 7 days after
using TSS.
 

jetajockey

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Thanks Lucy I've read the Q&A up and down, I was referring primarily to Aquasafe, which is not an ammonia detoxifier, so I emailed them to clear up some confusion.
 
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Lucy

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If Aquasafe removes chloramines (most conditioners do) it would be included in their statement about waiting.

It's always best to double check, though.
 

jetajockey

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Lucy said:
If Aquasafe removes chloramines (most conditioners do) it would be included in their statement about waiting.

It's always best to double check, though.
that was what the confusion was about, in the way that the customer service rep answered, there was a very small mention of chloramines but then a paragraph about ammonia.

The bacteria is housed in a special stabilized solution of
ammonia, so if you remove/lock up the ammonia, you remove all of the
food the bacteria require to live.
I don't know exactly what aquasafe does chemically, but if it removes the chlorine part of chloramine and leaves the ammonia, then I don't see how it would be an issue in regard to the quote I just put up.

One day I'd like to see a collaboration of all the stuff that is known by people legitimately using the product, the tetra reps, and the people with the biology degrees, that way we can cut out some of the mysticism and hearsay behind the whole process, and instead give a rational explanation of why certain steps must be taken. (this applies to all of the different type of bacteria products not just TSS, a nice breakdown and comparison of them all in a concise writeup would cut out alot of q&a sessions.)

I really don't understand why they don't clarify more of the technicalities behind using their product in plain view, like on their site, unless its just another method for them to make money when someone screws up the process and has to buy another bottle.
 
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Lucy

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The directions on the bottle is pretty vague too.
Shawnie has had good results using it, and as you saw in the link, added her experience to what was said by Tetra.

Tetra had said they would add that info (in the Q & A) to their site, but I have yet to see it.
 

jetajockey

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or at least a warning not to use their own brand of water conditioner within 24 hours of using TSS, lol. Most run of the mill first time fishkeepers come home with a tank and a bag of fish at the same time, so that kind of information is imperative to success.
 

Kunsthure

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Here's my three experiences with using TSS:

My daughter's 20 gallon had three platys in it for 2-3 weeks before I added double the amount of TSS for a 20 gallon and it cycled the tank in less than a week.

I added a bottle to my 37g about the same time that I added four cherry barbs. I added another bottle about a week later because I had exchanged several fish and the tank is still not cycled maybe 3 weeks after that second bottle.

I added a bottle to my 5 gallon the day after moving five fry to it with the thought that the fry wouldn't make enough ammonia right away to feed the bacteria. I added 12 red cherry shrimp later that same day. All the shrimp are dead and the tank is still not cycled two weeks later.

I am convinced that the success in the 20 gallon is because the fish had been in there for some time and there was sufficient ammonia and some good bacteria already built up. I am similarly convinced that the two failures had to do with adding TSS and fish at about the same time.

I was thrilled at the idea that I could stock my tank almost immediately because I'm impatient ( ;D ) but in my experience, a new tank with new fish doesn't cycle quickly with the TSS but an already-cycling tank will finish rapidly.

-Lisa
 

jerilovesfrogs

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i think there should be be a big red warning label on the tss saying, do not use any water conditioners, ammonia detoxifiers etc.

i've used tss 3 times and had good results. i put the tss in first, waited maybe an hour or less, then added the fish, and left it alone for a week...then tested. all were cycled in that week. but i think adding fish first, then tss wouldn't be a bad thing. they are pretty much the same thing.
 
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