Tetra Safestart and dechlorinator confusion

coderedjulia

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I’ve decided that since I can’t properly cycle a tank for the life of me that I will try using Tetrasafe start plus for my 3 tetra glofish in a 10 gallon tank.. When I use a aqua safe do I have to wait 24 hours to introduce the fish and use the TSS? I heard it has something to do with some dechlorinators locking up the ammonia so the bb will have nothing to process and it will die off?
 

Celestialpearl

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TSS only takes a couple minutes to work. Most people splash it in and add fish immediately. I've been guilty and never had any negative outcome.

TSS actually doesn't bind to ammonia, but rather chlorine, chloramines and some heavy metals.

Is your tank cycled? Ideally you'd have a cycled tank before adding fish. If you do not, Prime is the product you are looking for that binds ammonia.

To my understanding, products like Prime bind to toxic ammonia to keep it from harming fish. This doesn't make it unavailable to bb to process.
 
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coderedjulia

coderedjulia

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Celestialpearl said:
TSS only takes a couple minutes to work. Most people splash it in and add fish immediately. I've been guilty and never had any negative outcome.

TSS actually doesn't bind to ammonia, but rather chlorine, chloramines and some heavy metals.

Is your tank cycled? Ideally you'd have a cycled tank before adding fish. If you do not, Prime is the product you are looking for that binds ammonia.

To my understanding, products like Prime bind to toxic ammonia to keep it from harming fish. This doesn't make it unavailable to bb to process.
So I can use prime and TSS together at the same time and it won’t harm the BB?
 

Blueberrybetta

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coderedjulia said:
So I can use prime and TSS together at the same time and it won’t harm the BB?
Neither products will hard Beneficial Bacteria,but TSS doesnt instantly cycle the tank either, it only adds the bacteria needed but you still need an ammonia source to keep the BB 'fed'. You'll still need to cycle the tank, either fishless with Ammonia or fish-in and use the fish waste.
 

Celestialpearl

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Blueberrybetta said:
Neither products will hard Beneficial Bacteria,but TSS doesnt instantly cycle the tank either, it only adds the bacteria needed...
I didn't realize TSS was bacterial starter. I was thinking of AquaSafe Plus.


In this case, using both if you do not have a cycle is the go to method. Ammonia will build up from fish waste and uneaten food until the bacteria take hold.
 

mattgirl

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coderedjulia said:
I’ve decided that since I can’t properly cycle a tank for the life of me that I will try using Tetrasafe start plus for my 3 tetra glofish in a 10 gallon tank.. When I use a aqua safe do I have to wait 24 hours to introduce the fish and use the TSS? I heard it has something to do with some dechlorinators locking up the ammonia so the bb will have nothing to process and it will die off?
I have never used any of the bottled bacteria but have read up on it. Most folks that have been successful with it say wait 24 hours after adding a water conditioner before adding the TSS+. I think to be on the safe side that is what I would do should I ever decide I need to use it.

It is possible that all this has been said because Prime detoxes ammonia and supposedly interferes with TSS so the word has been spread that one should wait 24 hours after adding any of the other water conditioners.
 

Celestialpearl

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mattgirl said:
It is possible that all this has been said because Prime detoxes ammonia and supposedly interferes with TSS so the word has been spread that one should wait 24 hours after adding any of the other water conditioners.
That’s the thing I don’t get. Nitrosomonas bacteria can use ammonium, which is what Prime converts free ammonia into.

I’ve use bottle bacteria to start three of my tanks. I don’t dose with prime however. I set up the tank in advance of getting the fish, or they stay in quarantine until the cycle has taken hold in the new tank. To get the bacteria to take hold I dose with straight ammonia. I start with a larger 2mL dose, let levels reduce by half and hold it there for a week. Then I let it go to zero. Then I dose again with 1 mL. When the tank is able to reduce to 0 overnight it is ready for fish. This is usually a 10-14 day process if I don’t have any spare cycled filter media on hand. If I have a little bit of cycled media the fish are added immediately without ammonia. Meanwhile the new fish haven’t been picked up yet or they are in quarantine which is cycled and established.
 

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Celestialpearl said:
That’s the thing I don’t get. Nitrosomonas bacteria can use ammonium, which is what Prime converts free ammonia into.

I’ve use bottle bacteria to start three of my tanks. I don’t dose with prime however. I set up the tank in advance of getting the fish, or they stay in quarantine until the cycle has taken hold in the new tank. To get the bacteria to take hold I dose with straight ammonia. I start with a larger 2mL dose, let levels reduce by half and hold it there for a week. Then I let it go to zero. Then I dose again with 1 mL. When the tank is able to reduce to 0 overnight it is ready for fish. This is usually a 10-14 day process if I don’t have any spare cycled filter media on hand. If I have a little bit of cycled media the fish are added immediately without ammonia. Meanwhile the new fish haven’t been picked up yet or they are in quarantine which is cycled and established.
I actually agree. Like you I don't understand the reasoning behind waiting 24 hours after adding Prime but it is what the makers of TSS say so who am I to question it. I feel we will have the best success if we follow the directions on the product. If we don't then we just have ourselves to blame if something goes wrong.

I think but of course can't say for sure that waiting 24 hours after adding any water conditioner has been said so many times it is now seen as fact. I would think as long as the water conditioner doesn't change the chemistry of the ammonia it shouldn't interfere with the TSS but I can't know that for a fact. .
 

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mattgirl said:
I actually agree. Like you I don't understand the reasoning behind waiting 24 hours after adding Prime but it is what the makers of TSS say so who am I to question it. I feel we will have the best success if we follow the directions on the product. If we don't then we just have ourselves to blame if something goes wrong.
Bacteria can degrade sulfur-based dechlorination agents. There are probably many other degradation pathways. I'd be surprised if any dechlorinator lasts long.
 

goldface

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If you're that paranoid, then wait at least 30 minutes after dechlorinating, before adding TSS+. But it shouldn't take even that long to fully dechlorinate.
 

AvalancheDave

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goldface said:
If you're that paranoid, then wait at least 30 minutes after dechlorinating, before adding TSS+. But it shouldn't take even that long to fully dechlorinate.
Isn't the concern that the dechlorinator binds ammonia in a way that the bacteria can't use it rather than TSS+ preventing the dechlorinator from neutralizing chlorine?
 

goldface

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AvalancheDave said:
Isn't the concern that the dechlorinator binds ammonia in a way that the bacteria can't use it rather than TSS+ preventing the dechlorinator from neutralizing chlorine?
All I know is when I used TSS+, the directions never mention anything of the sort in regard to its efficacy when used together with dechlorinator. So I always added it after a water change, soon after adding dechlorinator. It's been a while, but I posted pics of before and after results of using TSS+ in a new aquarium with Amazonia soil that released ammonia, as well as even nitrite and nitrate. From my tests, it showed that bacteria in a bottle can work instantly. The company is using the same aerobic bacteria that are found in our filters, so why wouldn't it? Regardless, I think the whole dechlorinator debate is a moot point; for if this is true, then this should also affect the bacteria in our filter media as well, I would think.
 

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