Stella And Jo's Gecko & Terrariums

Another critter stole our hearts today. Fishlore family, I would like to introduce you to our new Crested Gecko, who we are tentatively calling Pan for now. Pan, in reference to the ancient Greek god of wild nature, (because Pan's official owner, my boy Jo, is a big fan of Rick Riordan's books), and also in reference to Pantalaimon, companion of Lyra, both treasured characters in a favorite book series of my own. Because, of course, Pan has stolen my heart already too. And after all, I am the OG reptile keeper in this family. Jake the Snake (real original, huh?) was a ball python I got when I was 16, who I later brought into the relationship with my now husband, and we kept for many years until just before Jo came along. Anyway... shall I start at the beginning?

I started wanting a crestie, oh, probably about a year ago. Then my buddy Nart got one... then I started watching CanadianFishFan 's geckos here and on IG, then ValerieAdams brought home a couple of lovely ladies. Jealousy was rearing its big, ugly, green head so I started slowly planning. Jo, who had a couple of tanks of his own, lost his favorite fish last year and just wasn't excited about aquaria anymore... but he sure showed interest in reptiles. After the loss of his beloved George, we began seriously talking with him about the possibility of a crestie enclosure in his room, and boy did lots of work to get ready.

Today was the big day because there was a Repticon Expo about an hour and a half away. WIth preparations done, we headed up to find our new friend. I had a list...

Gecko
Springtails
Leaf Litter
Plants... (they're always on the list lately.)

I was prepared for the Gecko to be kinda pricey but was hopeful it wouldn't be too much and I definitely was not planning to buy the very first thing I saw upon entering the expo. But there it was, the enclosure we ultimately wanted for our new baby. He won't need it for a while yet, but dang... the price was too good to walk away from. The ExoTerra Small & Tall 18 x 18 x 24 vertical enclosure sure is a beaut and we kinda love it too. There were only three there for that excellent price, so I tagged it within 10 minutes of arrival.



Then we walked around. Found only one vendor with springtails and he only had 3 fairly small cups at that. Snagged those up next. One, for the 1 gallon jar terrarium that I will have done (and share) in the next few days. Another, for a master culture that we will maintain and grow for when the exoterra is ready, but also keep on hand afterward. The third... well, it's for this tiny grow out terrarium, which was just planted today after the expo.

I'm not sure what the big fern is but am confident that it's a tropical variety because I got it from my favorite orchid nursery. There are also a few cryptanthus, club moss, and a rabbit's foot fern that is pretty small and hiding for now, (looks like cilantro and is tucked in by the red crypt.) Pan will not enter this tank immediately either, and I do feel kinda guilty that we didn't turn this 5 gallon on its side to make it taller. That would have necessitated making a door for it, while we already have perfectly good glass and screen tops. Cresties should have tall enclosures, but he won't be in here forever, and I justified the decision by considering the shorter tubs some of these guys do alright in while under a breeder's care. Plus, we took care to provide plenty of spots to perch up off of the ground. Can't wait till he's big enough for the exoterra though. Otherwise, I'm quite proud of my first effort at a bioactive terrarium. It remains to be seen how successful I'll be at keeping plants indoors.







Back to Repticon... I believe this Gargoyle Gecko thought he was seeing water droplets on the outside of a bottle of sanitizer. Sorry for the quality! I was using burst shots to capture his tongue out.


When they weren't after sanitizer, they stood still as stone, (pun intended), even when Jo got eye to eye with him.


Gargoyle geckos are seriously cool but I also learned a bit about tiny uber cool mourning geckos and I'm pretty sure there'll be room for those guys after Pan moves into his big tank. These geckos are parthenogenic, (from the Greek for virgin creation), meaning the all-female species engages is pseudocopulation which leads to both females carrying viable eggs. MIND BLOWN! Do you want to know another family in nature that achieves reproduction via pseudocopulation? Orchids! Some of you will know how much I love my leafy girls.

And of course, I am who I am... so check the cutie River Cooters out!



But where's Pan??? He/she/it (won't know the sex for a while) is coming up in the next post.

 

There were many geckos here but those who know Jo and I will know that we fell in love with the very first one that we asked to hold.


Meet Pan the Pinstriped Crested Gecko!!! I cannot believe this guy was $60 from a respected breeder... which is the same price I see in Petco for cresties.



Pan came home in one of those little delI containers, which we put into his first enclosure here with us... a well vented plastic tub with fake plants, lined with paper towels, where he will eat from tiny bottle caps and the like. Being a tropical plant lover, I'm not lovin' the fakery here, but it is important to monitor his health, eating, and growth in the early days, especially with a little guy... and the plastic setup allows for ease of monitoring and also makes it very easy for our little baby to find food. He exited his delI container pretty quickly but we wanted to leave him to get comfortable and didn't remove it until offering him a tiny bit of Pangea Watermelon tonight.

LOL LOL LOL Here is Pan in his current enclosure, which is inside his someday terrarium. Can't wait to get on to the planting stage with this beast. I already have some of the plants and I'm SO excited!! I will happily tend to the plants alone in here while Pan grows... but first, gotta make a background because that one that comes with it simply won't do. Hopefully, that part of the big build starts in a week or two.

 

Pan is way tooo cute! It's so tiny!

Everything looks great so far. Can't wait to watch the progress.

 

For now Pan is female But give it a couple months. A very cute gecko and a nice setup! Enjoy the crestie life! Cant wait to see him as a adult!

 

Yasssssssssssssssssssss!!!!!!! Way too excited for you and your fam!!! After it settles in for a week. Don't be afraid to get it out the enclosure a few times a week for hand feeding and for it to just tolerate handling. Oh! Just be sure to be sitting on the ground or on the couch when handling them. Took me some time to get used to their suicidal leap of faith jumps lol. Scared the heck out of me the first time when Ducky had jumped out our hand and fell on the hard floor.

 

Oh my gosh... the leap of faith already happened when Jo was handling him at Repticon. TikI assured us he was okay and we made sure by spending more time handling him and learning exactly how to before committing to the purchase. Now, all we want to do is handle him but we will not for at least the first week.

 

Yay!!!! I’m so glad to see people getting in to reptiles more and more these days and crested geckos seem to be everyone’s favorite! Pan is beautiful! A fantastic find for $60, she’s a partial pinstripe (I see two breaks near the tail) harlequin. She has a great base color too!

Pan will be fine in that temporary grow out container until the larger set up is ready. I breed them and we keep the hatchlings in plastic shoe box bins until they’re a bit bigger to be upgraded. If she’s still on the small side whenever you put her in the 18x18x24, offer multiple food dishes because sometimes they have trouble locating their food in large enclosures. Oh, and when you add your springtail culture to the tank I would dot some gecko food around the substrate so the springtails have something to feed off of while they establish their colonies. And once you have one enclosure established with springtails, you’ll never have to buy any more again. I took a small cup of substrate from a friend’s enclosure and I was able to establish springtails colonies in 8 different set ups I even put some in the flower pots around the house to keep pesky gnats at bay.

 

Yes!!! Thanks so much for the kind reply BReefer97 . You know, I didn't care what exact morph Pan is when I first saw the lovely little lizard for such a great price. Later, I wished I had asked more about the parentage, morph, and why so cheap in comparison to other lovelies. The seller (Tikis Geckos) has been pretty great but I haven't had much time to contact them today. I've wondered (and still do) if perhaps Pan had her tail nipped or something. I'm not experienced enough to tell, particularly without bugging her too much in the early days. It honestly makes no difference to me but I'd still like to know... ya know? Anyhow, school me anytime on geckos my friend.


Here's a few I grabbed today when I opened her up for light misting. So stinking cute!
Silly Pan thinks she's hiding under her very temporary food dish. For reference, that take and toss snack size lid is maybe 3 inches across.

 

Oh! Fun! Thanks for sharing this!

 

Yes!!! Thanks so much for the kind reply BReefer97 . You know, I didn't care what exact morph Pan is when I first saw the lovely little lizard for such a great price. Later, I wished I had asked more about the parentage, morph, and why so cheap in comparison to other lovelies. The seller (Tikis Geckos) has been pretty great but I haven't had much time to contact them today. I've wondered (and still do) if perhaps Pan had her tail nipped or something. I'm not experienced enough to tell, particularly without bugging her too much in the early days. It honestly makes no difference to me but I'd still like to know... ya know? Anyhow, school me anytime on geckos my friend.


Here's a few I grabbed today when I opened her up for light misting. So stinking cute!
Silly Pan thinks she's hiding under her very temporary food dish. For reference, that take and toss snack size lid is maybe 3 inches across.
View attachment 538475 View attachment 538476 View attachment 538478

Oooo!! I’m fimiliar with Tiki’s geckos, I’ve never heard an ill word of them Lineage and morph type isn’t all that important unless you’re planning on breeding in the future, but it’s cool to see what the mother and father looked like anyways. And I have no idea why Pan was so cheap! Sometimes you just get really really lucky. The tail was probably nipped by her clutchmate, a lot of breeders (myself included) will house clutchmates together until they get bigger, and sometime’s they mistake one another’s tails for a worm and they get nipped. Pan is relatively small, the tail may heal back to normal. If not, the occasional tail nip is common, nothing to worry about though!

Keep this thread updated with pictures of Pan! And I want to see how you’re enclosure turns out. I’m redoing my skyscraper tank here in the next few weeks and it’s nice to see what other people do with their tanks as inspiration

 

I am soooooooo jealous that you met Tiki's Geckos. Looking forward to following this journey! Even though I may miss a lot and have to catch up from time to time lol. Congrats on your new baby!

 

I am soooooooo jealous that you met Tiki's Geckos. Looking forward to following this journey! Even though I may miss a lot and have to catch up from time to time lol. Congrats on your new baby!

Agree! So jealous. I only got mine from a local breeder. (@Gecko_gals on Instagram)

 

Thanks guys! I am just lucky to live where I do when it comes to certain tropical growing 'things'... and what do I mean by things? Geckos, corals, and orchids of course! Florida does have some things worth bragging over.

I had no idea Tiki's was so well known! I mean, yep, they're on YouTube but I didn't know the reach they had. I came across them because as I was viewing the Repticon West Palm Beach vendor list, they were there, so I searched 'em up and found that they had quite the variety of Cresties at all different price points... while some of the other's websites only listed their fanciest like Lily Whites and such. There was no way I was going to spend so very much on a first Gecko. We liked the darker options anyway and in the end, we only wish to give one a good life, enjoy as a treasured four-legged family member, and feed my contained garden addiction while providing a good environment for our little love, (we're renters and I have no yard to speak of.:rolleyes

Anyway...

Keep this thread updated with pictures of Pan! And I want to see how you’re enclosure turns out. I’m redoing my skyscraper tank here in the next few weeks and it’s nice to see what other people do with their tanks as inspiration

I do tend to get behind on my own threads but I also plan on sharing every pic Pan lets me get. Today, for the first time, I removed all of her leaves in a search for... poop. Found a little! Idk, I can't say that's because she's eaten much under my care and I haven't done the research on their digestive systems yet. She's been in that bin since Sunday afternoon and the tiny poop was there early this morning. Next one though, I'll be very glad for that.

Enough of poop talk though. Here's the pic I grabbed while bothering my new best buddy this morning. Oh my goodness... such a CUTIE and I LOVE HER SO MUCH!! Look at her obstinate little butt, turned away from food like a picky kid with broccoli.

Now, I understand that it's still a little early to worry about her eating, and I also know she would prefer food off of the ground. So, here's my question BReefer97 . In a breeding environment, are they offered elevated food? I have a suction cup thingy to hold food cups but didn't imagine using it in the little bin. I could and the only problem may not be one at all. The feeder is big (the large Pangea clear feeder) so would take up some space... maybe that's a non-issue though since it would give her an elevated perch in there too... yeah?

Any advice for encouraging her to eat tonight guys? I'm gonna offer what I figure the tastiest option is... watermelon again. Early this morning, I used my pinky to dab a bit of last night's food on the side of her mouth but she didn't react and ran back to her leaves asap. I know it's common for new pets to not eat right away and I'm really trying not to sweat it just yet. Just want to do all I can to encourage eating... so tonight it's watermelon and I'll try dabbing her with the dull end of a skewer instead of my finger. If there's anything else you guys think I should try, please do let me know thanks.

As for the big build, (skyscraper BReefer97 ? I'll have to look for that!), well, Pan's not going in there anytime real soon, but I do feel the itch to get it done because my plant QT is quite full already. You can't see them all but there are 10 individual plants, 3 pots of moss, and a nice bunch of bark and sticks covered in lichen in there. The lichen wasn't really planned for Pan's tropical tank... it was planned for my little jar that I want to have a Blue Ridge Mountain theme. However, the seller (Theresa's Plants on Etsy) sent quite a LOT of lichen, and each of the three mosses I ordered too. The fairy fern moss (pic 4)... I thought it would be my favorite but it's way messier than the other two and they came this way, so I imagine the pillow and sheet moss have a denser growth habit?? Idk and I haven't grown temperate plants in a very long time, (tropical plants are so easy here), so we shall see how I do with these mountain mosses.

Sooo... here are the prequel pics to the ExoTerra build. Mosses are labeled as they were sold to me.

All plants are doing well... except for Begonia Rex. That's why you can't see them because they are limp, limp, limp right now, so are not showing themselves amongst the rest. I know they can do well in a terrarium environment and one trusted advisor tells me that it's not uncommon for plants to melt during the transition to a more humid environment... and that most come back, so I'm hopeful.


Sheet moss

Pillow moss

Fern moss... I read that this was the most finicky of the three and it looks to have quite a bit of dead in it, as well as tons of little sticks and debris. Is the debris from the dying moss? Idk but I did wash them all pretty good and most of the stick like things wanted to stay attached. Also, I could probably fill a container twice this size if I spread it out flat. The mat is bigger than this but I had to squish it to fit. We'll see how this goes.

Some big pieces of bark and 10 plus thin sticks covered in lichen. There's so much of it that I'll try a bunch in the ExoTerra too.


As you can probably tell, this Etsy seller definitely has my vote for mosses, lichen, and other forest floor type things.

Now, I just need to find leaf litter... because though it was available, that was the one thing I forgot at Repticon. Otherwise, I have quite a few plants, black spray foam is on the way, (I'll never use the lighter one again, it was hard to cover it completely and it's still showing in small spots in the tiny terrarium), I have one large gnarly piece of wood and am shopping for another as well as some cork, and the springtail master culture looks to be doing okay. I mean, they're still running around in there though I wouldn't say the population has increased yet but it's only been a couple of days. So... I am ALMOST completely prepared for the ExoTerra build.

 

Beautiful Crestie!! Did you happen to catch what the breeder was feeding specifically? I had one crestie who refused to eat a substantial amount(a few licks here and there) for over a month and a half until I realized that the one flavor of Pangea I didn’t try was what the breeder was feeding! And as soon as I offered that one he ate Immediately! They can be extremely picky.the last time I fed them crickets on of my cresties just stared at them for over 3 hours from the side of the cage never ate a single one

I can chime in on mourning geckos I picked mine up in January I originally had three however I could not get 2 to eat and eventually lost them however number three is going super strong. Luckily the breeder I purchased from was already feeding cgd as a sole diet so not hard to keep them eating it but they are escape artists. I’m currently in the process of building a bio active 12 by 12 by 18 for my mourning gecko and there’s more than a few spots that make me nervous. If you do end up getting them then I’d reccomend siliconing all of the electrical wire holes in the cage and as well as any other small loose spots you may notice. Their group interactions are quite interesting and the little chirping noises are adorable. The one that I have now appears to be almost ready to lay eggs so I’m hoping to be able to expand my colony soon without having to buy more! Gotta love that they breed so easily!

 

stella1979 what a wonderful set up and give it about 6mths then you can do the ID better...as I brought my blaze as a male when it was actually a female and I had the same tank as yourself, they're very addictive but after losing blaze after 9yrs I thought give fish a go

 

Beautiful Crestie!! Did you happen to catch what the breeder was feeding specifically? I had one crestie who refused to eat a substantial amount(a few licks here and there) for over a month and a half until I realized that the one flavor of Pangea I didn’t try was what the breeder was feeding! And as soon as I offered that one he ate Immediately! They can be extremely picky.the last time I fed them crickets on of my cresties just stared at them for over 3 hours from the side of the cage never ate a single one

I can chime in on mourning geckos I picked mine up in January I originally had three however I could not get 2 to eat and eventually lost them however number three is going super strong. Luckily the breeder I purchased from was already feeding cgd as a sole diet so not hard to keep them eating it but they are escape artists. I’m currently in the process of building a bio active 12 by 12 by 18 for my mourning gecko and there’s more than a few spots that make me nervous. If you do end up getting them then I’d reccomend siliconing all of the electrical wire holes in the cage and as well as any other small loose spots you may notice. Their group interactions are quite interesting and the little chirping noises are adorable. The one that I have now appears to be almost ready to lay eggs so I’m hoping to be able to expand my colony soon without having to buy more! Gotta love that they breed so easily!

AWESOME!! I hope to find reptile threads by you too when I have time to look.

Thanks for the kind words. It's nice to know it's not only my own bias calling Pan beautiful. I did ask what they fed but geesh... they feed everything. Tiki's says they alternate Pangea and Repashy, but they also switch up the flavors of each and thus feed quite the variety. With an operation like they've got, and the feeding routine they follow, they couldn't tell me which specific foods Pan likes best. So far, I've got Pangea Watermelon, Fruits & Instects, and Breeding and Growth formulas. First feeding was watermelon since I've heard so many say their Cresties love it, second was fruit and insects since that also seemed to me to be a common and well-liked staple. I'm not opposed to mixing flavors and do plan to make a larger batch and keep it in a squeeze bottle in the fridge... but I'm kinda waiting to see which she likes the best first. Tiki's told me my small variety would be just fine, and it's only been a couple of days, but I'm already thinking about ordering up some Repashy. If she loves any, even just one, I can use that as the bulk flavor and still incorporate the others by mixing them in with the favorite a little at a time.

As for the mourning geckos... they are definitely on the someday list, but knowing me, it'll be quite a while before I'm confident enough with one lizard and I won't be getting more before that day comes. However, lol, the fish stand the exoterra sits on is longer than the 20 gallon long that used to sit there... meaning, there's room for a 12 x 12 x 18 to sit right next to the 18 x 18 x 24.

Thanks, Tez You know something, I've seen you around quite a bit lately and in my head, when I quickly see your username, I keep hearing Tex instead of Tez. That will be remedied now that I've typed it out and noticed that your location isn't anywhere near Texas. Sounds like you gave Blaze a great life, enjoyed her a lot, and I'm sorry you lost her... though glad that an interest in fish arose out of it and brought you here. This is not unlike my own situation. Pan became a real thought and possibility after the loss of our oldest fish last year, a goldie named George who my 12-year-old got when he was 4. George was sick a few years ago and that illness brought me to Fishlore. Fishlore saved him! Things were good for a long time but his loss was sudden and terribly sad. Though, I think of George with a smile now and think he'd appreciate all the greenery I have going on in his old spot.

 

You know something, I've seen you around quite a bit lately and in my head, when I quickly see your username, I keep hearing Tex instead of Tez. That will be remedied now that I've typed it out and noticed that your location isn't anywhere near Texas. Sounds like you gave Blaze a great life, enjoyed her a lot, and I'm sorry you lost her... though glad that an interest in fish arose out of it and brought you here. This is not unlike my own situation. Pan became a real thought and possibility after the loss of our oldest fish last year, a goldie named George who my 12-year-old got when he was 4. George was sick a few years ago and that illness brought me to Fishlore. Fishlore saved him! Things were good for a long time but his loss was sudden and terribly sad. Though, I think of George with a smile now and think he'd appreciate all the greenery I have going on in his old spot.

Stella if you called me Tex I wouldn't be offended because i'm easy going regarding that
I brought her a tank big enough to house 4 but the worst mistake I made was changing where we brought the locusts from, last year she dropped 10 gallon in weight through the summer and with high humidity here which can stress them can cause weight loss because she still shredded regular and had 6 locusts daily and she died a death of a parasite in the body and it's down to what the breeders feed the locusts apparently, so I had my hubby smash the tank as I wouldn't sell it to nobody else because parasite can lay eggs which the human eye can't see apparently.
Sorry about your loss and I bet your son felt having George such a long time through his growing years

I'll look forward to watching Pan develop and you'll enjoy when your able to weigh him and see the weight coming on, I used to do blaze every 2wks and soon take advantage when your able to hold him so he'll get used to you...oh bless he's so tiny

 

AWESOME!! I hope to find reptile threads by you too when I have time to look.

Thanks for the kind words. It's nice to know it's not only my own bias calling Pan beautiful. I did ask what they fed but geesh... they feed everything. Tiki's says they alternate Pangea and Repashy, but they also switch up the flavors of each and thus feed quite the variety. With an operation like they've got, and the feeding routine they follow, they couldn't tell me which specific foods Pan likes best. So far, I've got Pangea Watermelon, Fruits & Instects, and Breeding and Growth formulas. First feeding was watermelon since I've heard so many say their Cresties love it, second was fruit and insects since that also seemed to me to be a common and well-liked staple. I'm not opposed to mixing flavors and do plan to make a larger batch and keep it in a squeeze bottle in the fridge... but I'm kinda waiting to see which she likes the best first. Tiki's told me my small variety would be just fine, and it's only been a couple of days, but I'm already thinking about ordering up some Repashy. If she loves any, even just one, I can use that as the bulk flavor and still incorporate the others by mixing them in with the favorite a little at a time.

As for the mourning geckos... they are definitely on the someday list, but knowing me, it'll be quite a while before I'm confident enough with one lizard and I won't be getting more before that day comes. However, lol, the fish stand the exoterra sits on is longer than the 20 gallon long that used to sit there... meaning, there's room for a 12 x 12 x 18 to sit right next to the 18 x 18 x 24.

Thanks, Tez You know something, I've seen you around quite a bit lately and in my head, when I quickly see your username, I keep hearing Tex instead of Tez. That will be remedied now that I've typed it out and noticed that your location isn't anywhere near Texas. Sounds like you gave Blaze a great life, enjoyed her a lot, and I'm sorry you lost her... though glad that an interest in fish arose out of it and brought you here. This is not unlike my own situation. Pan became a real thought and possibility after the loss of our oldest fish last year, a goldie named George who my 12-year-old got when he was 4. George was sick a few years ago and that illness brought me to Fishlore. Fishlore saved him! Things were good for a long time but his loss was sudden and terribly sad. Though, I think of George with a smile now and think he'd appreciate all the greenery I have going on in his old spot.

A 12 by 12 by 18 will be perfect for them!! They’re so much smaller than I ever expected but very entertaining. I have one thread about them right now from the day I got them. I should have a new thread up Friday with them and the new enclosure but catching her is gonna be real fun. She finally decided to settle on a new hiding place which is in between two pieces of cork! As for your feeding issues I would give the new gecko a bit of time and not be too alarmed if they don’t eat right away. I do think that trying repashy can’t hurt though. I’ve heard the same thing about the watermelon and it’s the favorite of my mourning geckos and one crestie the other 4 turn them noses up at it.

 

Do you have Pangea Insects by chance? My geckos all seem to turn their noses at any of the fruit flavored ones besides banana apricot and insects (I believe it’s because Pangea Insects is banana flavored). But keep trying the watermelon, she’ll eventually eat it she’s probably stressed from the move. And yeah, whenever you have the permanent set up you can use the food ledge, but until then Pan will be fine eating her food from the dish on the ground. All of our hatchlings have dishes on the ground because the bins are simply too small to fit a ledge. Try mixing your food a bit thicker too! Some prefer different consistencies, mine prefer a thin pudding like texture. If she doesn’t eat within the next week, try holding the dish in front of her face. I had a problem gecko that would refuse to eat and I had to hold the dish in front of his face for a few feedings. I then started putting it in front of his face, getting him to take a few licks, and setting it down in front of him so he knew where I was putting his food. He would eat the entire dish after that. You could also try adding some crushed up bee pollen to stimulate appetite, but it’s reallt sugary so only use it sparingly. This is probably all unnecessary though, Pan is most likely just a little confused and settling in.

 

Funny how things can be so different across the pond. Now, I'm certainly no expert but have been doing lots of reading about cresties and their needs lately, and this is the first I've heard of feeding locusts. Mostly I've seen live feedings to consist of crickets, worms, and dubia roaches, the last of which would be a HUGE no in my house, lol. I'm tolerant of most things but have a roach phobia almost akin to others with phobias against spiders or snakes. Works out fine for me though because the dubia roach, like so many other creatures, can absolutely thrive in hot, humid, tropical Florida. For all I know, they already do, like many other invasive creatures here. Soooo... dubias are illegal here. In fact, there was a news report recently about a guy getting arrested for bringing some into Florida.

That reminds me!! I forgot to tell you guys... On our way home from Repticon, flying down the turnpike at 75mph (speed limit's 70mph), we see a HUGE iguana right on the shoulder of this fast, busy road. He appeared to be watching traffic and waiting for his chance to cross. I do hope he survived that day... mostly. I do not have it in me to really hate an animal, much less kill one, but iguanas are also invasive, have put a real dent in native flora, and thus the population of native critters that also eat the same things. In other words, the iguana is a no-no here, yet thrives and it is perfectly legal and accepted to hunt them. Many nature and animal lovers like myself will do just that... and though I'm no vegetarian, I have never purposely killed an animal and never want to. Anyhow, that (big) little lizard had the look of one who knew what he was doing and was master of his domain... and though I feared for his safety, I found it kinda cool to capture that site on the way home with our own lizard.

Thanks so much BReefer97 . I think I do have the Pangea Insects, that is, if you mean the one that says Fruit and Insects on the package. That's what we offered her yesterday evening. Not sure if she ate any... lol, though I do what I can to try and tell if food's been taken. Meaning, I smooth the top of it as much as I can before putting it in the bin, in an effort to check for dents from lizard licks in the morning. This morning, I forgot to check before sticking my pinky in it so I could rub some on her snout.

I have good news though folks! Tonight, we mixed up the watermelon but wanted to change her liner anyway, so before putting the food in, I removed a couple of her leafy stems (since I would be doing so anyway), and when we found her, Jo dipped a skewer into the food and offered it. No reaction for several seconds so he dabbed a bit on her mouth... AND THEN SHE LICKED THE SKEWER a few times. Our hearts just about melted. A few licks isn't much, but it was enough for her right now and though Jo offered seconds, she soon turned away. Then we proceeded to remove the rest of the stems and her paper towel. Poor thing didn't know what to do with herself in the empty bin and started trying to climb the walls and escape into the big tank, (yes, her bin in still inside the exoterra). Quickly, we placed a new paper towel in as well as her leaves, the food dish, popped on the lid and lowered the room's lighting. At last site, my poor confused little lizard was still trying to climb the bin walls. Guess we threw her for a loop and I don't like doing that... but the liner was dirty because twice, Jo had wiped uneaten food off of his finger onto the paper towel. Well, that won't happen again because I dread throwing her for any more loops than are necessary. All in all, those few licks made tonight feel like a win. Hoping she liked it enough that I'll find a dent in her food in the morning.

 

I’m not sure how much value I can contribute to this thread but I must say that I am thoroughly enjoying you documenting this new journey of yours and am so excited for you!

 

I'm so glad you like it Lchi. You know me... when I'm excited, the words just flow and posts get rather long. I feel a lil bad about that but it's great fun sharing this experience with fishy friends. Don't worry about contribution. I'm just glad you're here... and you started Page 2!! Thought of you yesterday when Jo put on lizard Tube to listen to while doing some chores. That video introduced us to the Leachie Gecko.

 

I've heard of feeding locusts

Evening Stella...yes the main variety here is Locusts...mine used to love at least 5-6 in a day they come in small / medium and large and aquarium shops here have young feed off them besides crickets and worms...but twice a week for blaze I used to bag them and shake them in calcium powder and once a week in nutrition powder.

 

We'll be trying crickets sometime soon I hope.

Pan seems comfier today. Prior to today, we could not find her, even in the tiny bin... unless we really got in there and started moving things around. Today though... today she has stayed out in the open. As far as I know, she has slept in the open all day today and I couldn't be happier about that because it shows that she is getting more comfortable here.

Will you just look at those eyelashes??? And I just love the pattern between her ridges. I LOVE ALL OF HER!! SO STINKIN CUTE!!!

 

We'll be trying crickets sometime soon I hope.

Pan seems comfier today. Prior to today, we could not find her, even in the tiny bin... unless we really got in there and started moving things around. Today though... today she has stayed out in the open. As far as I know, she has slept in the open all day today and I couldn't be happier about that because it shows that she is getting more comfortable here.

Will you just look at those eyelashes??? And I just love the pattern between her ridges. I LOVE ALL OF HER!! SO STINKIN CUTE!!!
View attachment 539151 View attachment 539152

Stella how adorable and such cute markings...I feel like popping my hand in the screen and adding mascara

 

Geesh... I've really gotta learn to save Instagram videos. I was so excited to share the great news with close friends that I took the short video and sent it without saving. Words and a pic will have to do I suppose. The great news is... Jo offered bits of food on a skewer again tonight and Pan licked it off, then waited for 2nds, 3rds, 4ths, and 5ths. Guess that was enough excitement for one night because she then turned away. We are beside ourselves with glee and this Momma is glad that she took Pangea Growth tonight instead of Watermelon. Of course, I realize that fruit makes up the bulk of a Cresties diet but a little folic acid is a great thing too.


My goodness, she looks tiny here in comparison to Jo'd hand. Such a little cutie!!

Guess I could explain what's going on in the setup. Well... I thought we wouldn't need a heater in good ol' SoFlo, but I must be crazy because I do like my air conditioning. The first night, Pan's temp reading got down to 68° and though I've read that nights below 70° aren't a problem... I could hardly sleep that night. She's just so little!

Next day, I headed to Petco and picked up the smallest heat mat they had with the thought that we didn't need much for the current enclosure, nor the next on, a small terrarium. Hrmm, I was freaking a little and not thinking straight. Of course, there must be a barrier between Pan and the heater. So, I stuck the little heater to the bottom of the ExoTerra, then dumped about an inch of EcoEarth inside, then placed her bin on top, directly over the heater. Well, Jo's room stays pretty cool, and the heater says it may take 6-8 hours to heat the terrarium. So I waited but even with these efforts, the bin wasn't getting over 72°... during the day! That was no improvement at all and even though that night she didn't get below 70°, I was feeling like a bad gecko momma. Next morning, before the sun was up, I was hunting through the light bulb stash and actually found an old but unused incandescent. YAY, lol. Who know's why we had a 60W Rough Service Garage bulb since we've never had a garage. Sometimes it's good that I loathe throwing things away if there's even the slightest chance of future use.

A few weeks ago, when ordering Pan's food, I needed to spend about $7 more to get free shipping... otherwise, shipping was $9. So, I got one of these lamp thingys with a ceramic socket, unsure if we'd use it for Pan, but knowing I could throw it over my jar terrarium if not.

The lamp and that 60W incandescent saved the day. With the lamp over the ExoTerra and the tiny heat mat underneath, day time temps are staying around 77° and that warmth stays with the tank enough that, with the heat mat too, the night temp doesn't get below 73°. Perfect! And this explains why Pan is inside a bin, which is inside the ExoTerra, which contains EcoEarth that will later be used to cover the foam background for the ExoTerra.

EcoEarth is simply finely milled coconut husk which is not only good for backgrounds but is also an ingredient in a tropical substrate mix I'll make myself according to SerpaDesign's recipe. That recipe worked out great for me since the other ingredients are... sand (which I washed and saved from the two fish tanks that came down over the last several months), sphagnum moss, horticultural charcoal, and orchid bark, (all of which are kept on hand for my orchids.) Only thing I messed up on in making this tropical mix... using primo sphag, long strand New Zealand extra fluffy stuff. Think I'll pick up the HomeDepot special (lower grade sphag) before making the big batch for the ExoTerra... because the NZ stuff is so long and fluffy that it kinda floats? Probably the wrong term but it just doesn't mix as well as Serpa's does in his videos.

 

HI stella1979 gecko's love heat and I used to have mine set at 76 and used an electric thermostate which is great for adjusting in summer months then she had a red bulb at 60w for basking in as the red light helps them shred their skin with the correct supplements...your heading in the right direction but what will help Pan is when he's able to catch his food himself

 

In to follow these exciting and fun filled adventures!

I love the enclosures

Cresteds are such neat creatures
I have more of them then I do any other pets

 

Thanks, Gamer ... it's been a while since I felt like such a newb and this, of course, leads to feeling unsure of myself.
(Edit: Meaning, the support of you all is calming and comforting, so thanks.)

So yeah, a thing happened today which was exciting and rather nervewracking. In the mornings, Pan's light goes on, her bin moves to the left (off of the heat mat), and the leaves get sprayed to keep up humidity and make sure she has water available. She also has a 2nd Gatorade cap with water but idk if she'll use it. Naturally, I take this opportunity to have a look at her if I can easily find her.

On that note, 3 or 4 times since she ate well off of Jo's skewer, we have later found her underneath the paper towel. The couple of times we've found her and offered the skewered food since the time that went well... well, it hasn't gone so well and she just wants to get away. Sooo, it feels like the more we approach, even though we do not touch her, the more she wants to hide.

Back to this morning. Humidity drops like a rock overnight. This morning it was 30%, so after spraying her bin, I wanted to see that she was somewhere where she might find water, hopefully before daytime sleep. She was under the liner again and when I barely brushed against her to try to get her on top and in the leaves, Pan jumped (quick as you please) right onto the very edge of the bin. Couldn't get the lid on like that, so again, gentle, gentle touches trying to corral her inside.

Nope! She scampered around the edge and hopped onto the background. Every approach, still slow and gentle, had her fast, tiny, and delicate little butt running straight up. Ever seen videos our perhaps your own cresties chillin' in the tiny gap between the ExoTerra's frame and the included foam background? I dreaded having to get her out of that situation. Thankfully I didn't have to but yeah, it was close and felt like quite an adventure... and then she went back in the bin. Now I'm kinda sad because it sure seems like she wants to climb and find high hiding spaces. Of course! I want to let her out of there soooo bad, but won't until I see some weight gain. Guess it's about time we get her on the scale this weekend. Good news though... we found poop today. I'll take it!

Of course I stepped back and took a pic during her big escape!

 

Update time! Sorry folks, no new pics of Pan atm. She's still so very timid and though we want to acclimate her to a human presence and feel it's important to make our presence known regularly, we do not wish to dig her out of hiding every day. So, feeding, misting, cleaning of the bin are all taking place as they should but we disturb her as little as possible. For now, we feel it's enough that she must be exposed during cleanings and handled for once a week weighing. My, but she's still so little. As she gains a little weight, the handlings will increase.

On that note, I know this is not unusual, but it was disappointing that at her first weigh-in, she was 5 grams, then last Saturday she was weighed again. A week had passed and she had gone down to 4 grams. She's eating pretty good and we have learned that she does not like Pangea Watermelon but does enjoy Fruits and Insects as well as the Breeding & Growth formula. How very strange, since every report I've seen suggests that cresties like the sweeter foods better... and the sweetness is reduced in the foods she likes because of the addition of protein. I've also discovered that figs are a common fruit they find in the the wild. Can't remember the brand right now... maybe Repashy or this other brand I'm forgetting the name of... at least one of them makes a fig based food. Idk if it'll be a complete diet formula but I do think that'll be the next fruity food purchase.

Pan does NOT like weighing or handling thus far. Immediately after the 2 weigh-ins, she went off food for two days. Hated that! However, I insist on having this data and that she is exposed to handling once a week. It's also time to finally get her some crickets. I have questions about that...

Most vivarium keepers feed live foods outside of the tank so the gecko will more easily find the food and will not risk impaction from accidentally eating substrate along with the hunted insect. Pan is terrified when she's removed from her bin. I think I should let her eat in the bin, removing all but one stem of leaves so she's more likely to see what's been offered. I won't let the crickets stay in overnight. Sound good? Considering that we won't go through more than a few crickets per week and that Pan is still so small, I am reluctant to keep a cricket keeper and culture my own. I fear the crickets would grow too big for her and think it's best to just buy a few of the tiniest I can find each week for now. I've already got a calcium/D3 supplement to dust them with... but I've seen advice saying that the crickets should be gut loaded for at least 3 days here at home before feeding them to Pan. Questions...

1. Is this really necessary given that she's eating Pangea complete diets?
2. If gutloading is necessary, what should I feed the crickets?
3. If I must keep crickets for a few days, what would the suggested enclosure include?

There's a bit more to talk about regarding temperature control as well as the plants and terrarium builds, but this post is getting long enough and I have a busy day to prepare for. I'll be back! And I hope to have new pics soon.

 

Hey M - what are you using to measure your humidity? message me the info on IG.
and a lot of breeders only use Pangea/Repashy powdered food to raise their cresteds. I personally wouldn't be too worried as ya'll recently got her and she's still probably adjusting to everything. Also, let me know how are you feeding her?

 

I’m useless for advice but am sending you, Jo and Pan good vibes for continued success and hopefully weight gain! Wish it was easier on all of you.

 

1. Yes because the gecko is still growing.
2. Yes because you have a baby and feeding crickets is like eating popcorn. Fills you up after many but does nothing to you.
3. I used a small 1 gallon betta kit thing with the purple lid. It keeps them in well. Once I got 80 cause petsmart can't count and they went into a large tall container with a DIY screen lid. Long story short they chewed through it and I found crickets around the house. The best one is the cricket keeper. I got mine for free cause some one wanted to return it at petsmart because it had a crack. Some duck tape and pressure and bam! Free cricket keeper.

 

My BEST to them!!!

 

Thanks guys!

I'll answer my buddy Nart on IG but for the sake of thoroughness and posterity, I'll outline the current Pan routine here. As always, I welcome everyone's thoughts and suggestions.

Every evening, about an hour after lights go off, Pan is given a new dish of food. We are definitely using too much food and have to rethink our delivery plan. Currently, 1/8 teaspoon of either Pangea Fruits & Insects or Pangea Breeding & Growth is mixed with 1/4 teaspoon RO water. It's offered in clean Gatorade caps, which are a little large, and that's why we mix as much food as we do... so the mix will fill the bottom of the cap. Hrmm, I don't use water bottles, but may need a few for their caps.

So, if Pan has not been bothered by getting weighed or getting the liner changed, or the bin cleaned, aaannd, the food is not Watermelon, she will eat up to 1/4 of the food, sometimes a bit less. By morning, whatever is left is pretty dried up and it can be hard to be sure how much she's eaten. However, we're finding poop regularly so that's good.

I feel it's really important to offer her crickets. For one, according to Tiki, Pan was already introduced to crickits while under their care. Also, most of the advice I've seen states that live insects are fabulous for growth, and some hard data I've seen shows that the diet of wild cresties is at least 50% insects... pretty sure it's a bit more. So, I will devise how to best keep a few crickets long enough to gutload them, but not so long that they will grow much. Still need to do some research because I've no idea what to feed the crickets so they are loaded up with good stuff for Pan.

Okay, so the other part of her daily maintenance has to do with temperature and humidity levels. In a nutshell, the bin is sprayed twice a day for humidity, and we're using both an undersized heat mat on the bottom glass and a dome light up top for temp regulating. For monitoring... we started out using a Zoo Med combo meter but needed another to put on the 5 gallon tank to make sure it's safe for Pan's eventual move. Because we recently purchased the ExoTerra light housing/hood (there's two 6500K CFL's in it for a couple of plants that live next to Pan's bin for now), I went ahead and got an ExoTerra combo meter... simply because it attaches to the light housing. I'm unsure about either meter being precisely correct, but figure it's close enough.

As of a few days ago, we added a thermostat that is controlling the 60W incandescent in the dome lamp we're using for additional heat during the day. On one side of the ExoTerra, there is the tiny heat mat... which is not strong enough by itself to do much but is good for nighttime temp control... as long as Pan's is directly over it with substrate in between. We're looking for temps not to exceed 77 during the day, but let it get down to 72-73 at night. This is accomplished by having her bin directly over the heat mat only at night when the heat lamp will not click on.... then in the mornings when plant lights come on, her bin is moved over, off of the mat, and the heat lamp + thermostat is connected to maintain a temp of 75-77... lamp comes on at 75, off at 77. The plant lights are on for 10 hours a day, but alone, they do not keep Pan warm enough. The incandescent bulb works but is not ideal and neither is the automation of this setup... but it will be fixed in the future.

One day soon, we'll get a ceramic heat emitter to replace the incandescent. Also, by the time Pan moves to the ExoTerra, we'll probably have an Inkbird ITC-608T, which is a combo thermostat and humidity controller, (though we'll likely just use it for heat and humidity monitoring.) Maybe it's a bit much, but what can I say... Inkbirds have me spoiled and I want one here. When adding the Inkbird to the cheaper thermostat and the 2 combo meters we already have, we'll end up with 4 temp monitors and 3 hygrometers to measure at different levels within the big tank. Maybe it's overkill and we probably won't use all of them all of the time. I sure wouldn't mind one on my plant qt if you see what I'm saying.

Also, in case my reptile friends don't know this... hubs is great at DIY projects, particularly those involving electronics. In other words... I don't need no MistKing. We'll have an auto mister with plumbing parts from Home Depot and a control box designed and made by hubs. At it's simplest, it will mist on a daily schedule, but I wouldn't put it past him to throw a sensor on it and add some kinda 'if/then' electronic control so it will mist at intervals determined by the humidity reading. (Stella gives a shifty grin thinking... if we nail the environmental automation of this tropical tank, maybe someday, years from now, we'll set up a full-on rain forest tank for some sweet little frogs.:wacky

 

Have you though about using a contact lens case for her food bowl(s)? Seems to be the right size and the plastic won’t degrade like a bottle cap would?

 

Have you though about using a contact lens case for her food bowl(s)? Seems to be the right size and the plastic won’t degrade like a bottle cap would?

I have not thought of that but it sure sounds perfect! I know nothing of these cases as neither myself nor anyone I've ever lived with has ever used contacts. Do you just buy these things at places like Walgreens? Lol, idk because I've never had to look. Also, I would never have thought about the degradation of the plastic. Thanks for the great idea!

 

I have not thought of that but it sure sounds perfect! I know nothing of these cases as neither myself nor anyone I've ever lived with has ever used contacts. Do you just buy these things at places like Walgreens? Lol, idk because I've never had to look. Also, I would never have thought about the degradation of the plastic. Thanks for the great idea!

Yes, look at any drug store or Walmart etc. in the section with contact lens supplies. That's where I get my new cases.

 

There has been a lot of updates on here since I last checked!! You can order “beer savers” on Amazon and use those are food dishes. They’re smaller than Gatorade caps and they’re silicone so you can wash and reuse them. I buy a few any time I go to a reptile show. I also forgot to tell you that I would limit handling while Pan is small - a few minutes every day is perfectly fine. But handling small crested geckos for too long can cause them to overheat because our body temperature is much much higher than theirs. Adult crested geckos can even over heat and die as well, it just takes longer than it would with a baby.

I would also strongly suggest taking the heat mat off. Even if you’re just using it at night, 77 degrees is a bit high. 80 degrees has the capabilities of killing a crested gecko. Your average room temperature should be perfectly fine - a temperature in the higher 60s seems safer than high 70s. Ideally should be MID 70s (ours is 71-72 consistently). I know you’re trying to do the absolute best for Pan, but I think you’re doing a little too much and thinking in to it more than you need to

 

Oh and before I forget, since you’re going to be using live plants in Pan’s big enclosure, I would definitely suggest you water your plants with the water you take out of your freshwater fish tanks! Your plants will absolutely love it and explode with growth. Coconut fiber doesn’t have much in terms of nutrients for plant growth, so sometimes they’ll do amazing and other times they’ll just die in a week. The nitrates from the fish tank water give them a healthy boost though I use it in my house plants too and they can’t get enough.

I would only do this if you use a water conditioner like Prime though. Nothing with added oils like almond leaf oil. I’m not exactly sure if it will cause them any harm, but most if not all essential oils are harmful for reptiles so I wouldn’t take that chance. I use Prime for my fish and my reptiles though so I know that it’s safe (it’s also way cheaper than reptile water conditioners - which are the same exact thing).