Should I remove all ammonia?

Silly question, I know. But here we go...

First time fish keeper here.

This all started with my 3 y/o seeing his cousin's fish and wanting some...

Long story short we now have 4 fish in a 3 gallon tank we are desperately trying to keep alive. Yes, we've made mistakes and I've learned a lot. This last week has been a lot of "oops" and "wow, I didn't know that" as I have googled my way from thinking it was okay to put 8 fish in a bowl with no filtration, heater, etc, to finally realizing how much more there is to fish keeping.

I'm determined to do a good job with the 4 fish who have survived our debut into the world of fish.

As stated, I have a 3 gallon tank (hoping to upgrade soon). I have a Tetra Whisper filter and a heater. I do water changes every day that are treated with a water conditioner to remove ammonia and chlorine.

I have 1 killi, 1 platy, 1 clown loach and 1 silvertip tetra. (Yes, I know that the clown loach and platy need SERIOUSLY bigger tanks but didn't know that when they were first purchased and put in the tank)

The tank has been going for two weeks now.

I just bought some water testing equipment and have tested ammonia levels every day for two days. Yesterday it was 4 and today it is 2 (after the water change).

I was curious as to what our tap water was and tested it and found out that our tap water contains at least .25 of ammonia. Once treated with the water conditioner I can take that down to 0.

I know that my tank is cycling. I am currently in the white haze, bacteria bloom phase. The fish that have survived my first week knowledge dump seem happy. They are active, not gasping or distressed and seem to be okay. Yes, I did lose 4 fish, 3 of which were eaten by the other fish because I didn't know they were incompatible with the others already in the tank and one just plain died the day I found out about the nitrogen cycle and that I actually have to do water changes (oops).

Here's my question:
If I can treat with the water conditioner to remove all ammonia should I do so in my tank or will that ruin the cycle? Should I be treating my water at all? I know that bacteria need to start working to convert the ammonia into nitrite and nitrate and then that will go down as well and balance out my tank. Right now my nitrate and nitrites are both 0 and my water is PH balanced.

Should I leave the ammonia level alone and let nature take its course or treat the water to bring the ammonia down to help my fish until I can get a bigger, better tank?

 

From my understanding removing all the ammonia could interrupt your cycle as it is the beginning of it. Are you testing for nitrites and nitrates?

 

Are you using prime or something else? If you are using prime it just locks the ammonia and nitrites for 24 hours to make it safe for the fish. The bacteria can still access it but it won't harm the fish

 

Let the ammonia be unless it gets above 4, is my understanding. Now whether that's correct is up for debate (I'm pretty new myself). However, if you use Seachem's Prime water condioner, it should detox the ammonia and nitrites while still allowing the bacteria to eat it.
If you decide to use a product like Tetra's SafeStart to kickstart your cycle, do not use any water conditioners for at least 24 hours beforehand and if I'm correct you're not supposed to change your water for 14 days after that, as well.

 

Let the ammonia be unless it gets above 4,

If there are any fish in the tank ammonia that high could kill the fish if she isn't using prime daily to detox it. It should be at 0 when cycled anything else means that there is still a cycle going.

 

I'm beginning to realize I shouldn't have said anything at all. I've been a bit idiotic the last couple of days. DUH. Right. Use the Prime. What I said about SafeStart stands, but I messed up on the rest of it. Gemini's absolutely right.

 

I'm beginning to realize I shouldn't have said anything at all. I've been a bit idiotic the last couple of days. DUH. Right. Use the Prime. What I said about SafeStart stands, but I messed up on the rest of it. Gemini's absolutely right.

We collaborated lol

 

Haha yeah I suppose that works.
That's why it's a forum, I guess, so we can say 'hold up' if somebody goofed.

 

My conditioner is Kordon AmQuel. I have no idea if it just treats the ammonia and leaves it for the bacteria.

Is it okay to keep adding to the tank? Will it disrupt the cycling or no?

 

Don't use AmQuel. It can cause your tank's hardness to crash.

 

Don't use AmQuel. It can cause your tank's hardness to crash.

Could you explain that in newbie speak? Lol

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

 

Um, Hey just a thought here, That tank will not cycle. Ever. Too much ammonia. There simply isn't enough filtration or surface space for bacteria. I would think getting the largest plastic bin you have and filling it with dechlorinated water would be their best bet. It will need a heater as well.

100% WC on the small tank with prime in between. That clown loach is looking at a 125gal tank. With friends.

 

Hardness is the proportion of dissolved minerals in your tank. There are two types, called KH (carbonate hardness) and GH (general hardness). I'm not going to try to explain those because I'm not completely sure of them myself, but if the minerals get too low it can kill your fish. AmQuel water conditioner has something in it that binds some minerals and can over time deplete things to the point that they take a nasty dive and your animals die.

 

Eienna, I have been using Amquel+ along with NovAqua for about 4 years now without any issues. I've never heard anything about Amquel causing your hardness to crash. Where did you get this information from?

 

I have not had the issue myself, but at least two people on the forum have...lemme think...JoannaB and somebody else, if you want to ask her. Maybe I have the wrong brand but I'm almost sure it was AmQuel.

 

Um, Hey just a thought here, That tank will not cycle. Ever. Too much ammonia. There simply isn't enough filtration or surface space for bacteria. I would think getting the largest plastic bin you have and filling it with dechlorinated water would be their best bet. It will need a heater as well.

100% WC on the small tank with prime in between. That clown loach is looking at a 125gal tank. With friends.

My husband bought the loach and had NO idea that it got that big until I came home, looked in the tank and said, "What's that?!?!" and did some googling. The clown loach was a HUGE oops.

I'm going to get a bigger filter(s) with lots more space for bacteria to grow. I know that small tanks are harder to handle than large but right now we just don't have the space for a big tank. Bigger? sure.. and I'm working on that, but not as big as we need for certain fish. We might just have to find a new home for the loach no matter how much my husband adores him.

 

Yay for google XD
If you change the filter save as much of the filter media as you can to put into the new one until it's well-seeded or you'll lose your cycle and have to start over.

Eienna, I have been using Amquel+ along with NovAqua for about 4 years now without any issues. I've never heard anything about Amquel causing your hardness to crash. Where did you get this information from?

Here, take a look at this.
The AmQuel messed up her tank's hardness which caused her pH to crash, that's what happened.

 

And as another question... if I do manage to sell or otherwise find a home for the loach and get a better filter will my tank cycle?

 

It will be difficult with the waste output of the Platy, but it may. I think you're going to need a bigger tank period simply because the concentration of waste will build up too fast in one that small for the bacteria to catch up with if you keep the platy.
With enough water changes, however, it may be okay. I'm not sure. You'd certainly be closer without the loach.
Be aware that a killifish only lives for one year.

 

I asked why Joanna had the problem, and it was because she already had soft water. If you have enough carbonates in your water, IE your water is hard enough, then you won't have a problem.

I'm not sure about the Kordon products, but Prime only neutralizes ammonia up to 1ppm. If you use Amquel+, you need NovAqua+ too as they cover different chemicals. However Prime takes care of everything in one bottle.

I totally agree with SK. You unfortunately have too much ammonia production in too small of a tank. In a nutshell, there is simply not enough surface area in the tank to house the amount of bacteria you need to process that much ammonia.

 

Here, take a look at this.
The AmQuel messed up her tank's hardness which caused her pH to crash, that's what happened.

In the thread, there was a reference to another thread. In that second thread Kardon replied to the persons email stating that Aquel will not change the pH and it must be caused by something other than Amquel. The fact that I (and many others use it without any problems) leads me to believe that there was some kind of annomoly.

 

I am planning on making a sump with LOTS of flowing water (for oxygen) and sand and possibly even a wet/dry area for more bacteria and a refugium for live plants. I don't have the space in my tank for all that stuff. I can also move the filter I have and the heater to the sump to free up room for the fish to swim. Like I said, I don't have space for a big tank right now... or a stand to hold it for that matter but my husband and I are both looking at how we can rearrange things for a bigger tank. In the mean time I want to do what I can for the fish I have.

I already have the acrylic sheets, the weld-on is in the mail and I have my plans drawn up for the sump. I just need to get the pump and the overflow box.

I talked to my husband about selling the loach and he is against it. For some reason he loves that fish..lol.

I'm SURE a sump will help. I totally agree that the bacteria just aren't getting established as I STILL have 0 nitrates or nitrites. It will also increase my water volume which can be nothing but good for the fish.

The ammonia was down to .25 today and I think that's because of my treating my water changes with amquel.

The fish seem to still all be doing fine. They were a LITTLE inactive tonight (excpet the tetra.. he's always active). And my loach only makes one appearance a day at feeding time. Other than that he hides.

Do you think a wet/dry sump will help?

 

It could. Sorry I don't know enough about it to give you a definitive yes or no.

In the thread, there was a reference to another thread. In that second thread Kardon replied to the persons email stating that Aquel will not change the pH and it must be caused by something other than Amquel. The fact that I (and many others use it without any problems) leads me to believe that there was some kind of annomoly.

Well...I guess...don't use it if your water's on the soft side?
You say they said amquel will not change the ph. That's true. It didn't. It changed how hard the water was which, in turn, caused a pH crash. That enough people had had the issue to figure that out is enough for me to want to steer clear of the product and tell others that too, just because I wouldn't want to chance it if they were my fish.