Salt For Fish Diseases

I have been searching around for salt to use in the future for any diseases to come along and I was hoping someone on here would help me out so I don't get the wrong kind and hurt or kill my little fishes.

 

Aquarium salt not marine salt. Pretty sure epson salt is ok too, not table salt because they have clumping agents in them.

 

I have lots of backup meds for just in case. I really have found no use for salt except epson salt dips if the fish is constipated, but that's it...

 

I appreciate it, I was wondering how salt would even help freshwater fish in the first place. I've was reading a lot of older threads and seen that some where using to help promote gill support and other illnesses.

I have lots of backup meds for just in case. I really have found no use for salt except epson salt dips if the fish is constipated, but that's it...

I appreciate the help. I was just curious if it really doesn't do anything to help than I'll just leave it at that.

I haven't used salt but there are a lot of threads regarding it here:

 

I appreciate it, I was wondering how salt would even help freshwater fish in the first place. I've was reading a lot of older threads and seen that some where using to help promote gill support and other illnesses.

salt is harsh on freshwater fish... I know a lot of people use salt to help kill ich or other parasites. the problem is it helps kill ich but also stresses you fish. I have just found there is usually better choice then salt.

 

I salt all my tanks. In my chiclid tank I use 1tbs epson salt 1 tsp baking soda and 1/4 tsp marine salt every five gallons. In my livebearer tank I use 1tbs aquarium salt per 5 gallons and my other tank that has otos and corys I use 1 tsp aquarium salt per 5 gallons. I find my fish live longer if I use salt so I do.

 

I appreciate the information, I think I'm going to leave the salt alone and stick to the recommended ich and parasites removers. I feel it'll be a lot better for the fish and less stressful on them.

I salt all my tanks. In my chiclid tank I use 1tbs epson salt 1 tsp baking soda and 1/4 tsp marine salt every five gallons. In my livebearer tank I use 1tbs aquarium salt per 5 gallons and my other tank that has otos and corys I use 1 tsp aquarium salt per 5 gallons. I find my fish live longer if I use salt so I do.

That's the main thing I was struggling with, I didn't believe putting salt in with freshwater fish would work out very good for the fish.

salt is harsh on freshwater fish... I know a lot of people use salt to help kill ich or other parasites. the problem is it helps kill ich but also stresses you fish. I have just found there is usually better choice then salt.

 

I would have to disagree that meds are better than salt. If salt will work that is clearly the best option to meds. What kind of fish are we talking about, that would determine if and how much salt to use. Ex. Mollies definitely would like salt. Neons would not.

 

I have cichlids, tiger barbs, rose barbs, small pleco, algae eater and rainbow sharks.

I would have to disagree that meds are better than salt. If salt will work that is clearly the best option to meds. What kind of fish are we talking about, that would determine if and how much salt to use. Ex. Mollies definitely would like salt. Neons would not.

 

some fish can tolerate salt more than others but if there freshwater fish I don't use salt. if they are in freshwater in the wild that means they would not come into contact with salt in nature so why would I add it.... catfish are suppose to be one of the worst when it comes to salt. I would not use it with my ottos.

ps, I have fish that all live without salt for a long time.... and I mean no salt at all.

it depends what were talking about meds wise....

internal paracites, salt will not help it takes meds...

ich, don't need any meds just warm water and gravel vacs.

constipation, I fast and feed peas, the epson is not even usually necessary.

fungus, I use maracyn yes a med. I have used this stuff with lots of fish and inverts. there is nothing I feel safer putting into my tank.

what other sickness do we need to cover?

 

If they are african cichlids they would like them not sure about the others. New world cichlids don't really need salt. Salt will promote slimecoat, and all fish need electrolytes (salt) just some not as much as others. South american fish do great with no salt for the most part.

 

I also salt my tanks.

 

I have South America cichlids. They are Bolivian Rams.

If they are african cichlids they would like them not sure about the others. New world cichlids don't really need salt. Salt will promote slimecoat, and all fish need electrolytes (salt) just some not as much as others. South american fish do great with no salt for the most part.

 

I understand your concern but I bought 5 otos all made. 6 corrys all made it. 4 synodontis multipunctatas all made it. They have all been alive over a year. And salt substitutes electrolytes so saying fish don't come into contact with it in the wild is wrong.

 

I'm going to go ahead and get some and keep it on hand. When it comes time to apply. I'll message you for tips on how to do so.

I understand your concern but I bought 5 otos all made. 6 corrys all made it. 4 synodontis multipunctatas all made it. They have all been alive over a year. And salt substitutes electrolytes so saying fish don't come into contact with it in the wild is wrong.

 

I understand your concern but I bought 5 otos all made. 6 corrys all made it. 4 synodontis multipunctatas all made it. They have all been alive over a year. And salt substitutes electrolytes so saying fish don't come into contact with it in the wild is wrong.

Freshwater fish are found in shallow wetlands, lakes and rivers, where the salinity of water is less than 0.05 percent

that is nothing... but yes some a tiny amount of salt.

there is copper in water.. and copper is deadly to inverts but they can live with it. its such a small amount.

obviously fish can live in salt but what is better? guess ask the fish lol... you won't convince me to add salt to my tanks. ps there is electrolytes in the new water I add during my weekly 50% water changes. also in the vitamins I add in vita chem.

 

Yes us who religiously change our water do replace electrolytes but most people don't do weekly 50% changes or even weekly changes for that matter. Not trying to convince you. There is another side though and most opinions here are of like mind to yours, so I have to argue a bit harder for my side to be heard.

 

Yes us who religiously change our water do replace electrolytes but most people don't do weekly 50% changes or even weekly changes for that matter. Not trying to convince you. There is another side though and most opinions here are of like mind to yours, so I have to argue a bit harder for my side to be heard.

that is true you deff have a uphill battle here lol. I do know there is a lot of people that do use salt. I actually used it on my first betta with no bad results. but I think I'm deff set in my ways now... if your fish are doing fine then go for it

 

. if they are in freshwater in the wild that means they would not come into contact with salt in nature so why would I add it....

That is just a false statement. Many fresh water fish are found in salty water. Some populations of Vieja Maculicauda in Costa Rica are found in complete salt water just to give an example.



Brian

 

That is just a false statement. Many fresh water fish are found in salty water. Some populations of Vieja Maculicauda in Costa Rica are found in complete salt water just to give an example.



Brian

I am not joking but seriously curious. If populations of the fish developed to live in complete salt water wouldn't that make them saltwater fish? Or are they just really good at osmoregulation?

 

That is just a false statement. Many fresh water fish are found in salty water. Some populations of Vieja Maculicauda in Costa Rica are found in complete salt water just to give an example.



Brian

sorry I forget how people act when you make a specific statement. should have been a broad statement so my bad.

"Only a few cichlids, however, inhabit primarily brackish or salt water"


here is a study on cichlids and how much salt some of them can tolerate.

https://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bits...d=120E32EC38E90293A41896C077AA4AA7?sequence=1

 

I really appreciate all the help, I didn't mean to cause such a ruckus. I have to say it's been fun watching.

 

sorry I forget how people act when you make a specific statement. should have been a broad statement so my bad.

"Only a few cichlids, however, inhabit primarily brackish or salt water"

here is a study on cichlids and how much salt some of them can tolerate.

I love being told I "act" a certain way because someone posts something worng and then calls me out on it, and then post a link to support exactly what I said.

I said certain populations of Vieja Maculicauda can be found in salt water not to act anyway but to actually provide an example.

this link was provided....
Not only does it support what I was saying in the article it talks about the same exact species.
from the article.....
the black belt cichlid (Vieja maculicauda) and
the Mayan cichlid (‘Cichlasoma’ urophthalmus) (Figure
1). In Belize the black belt has only been seen in fresh
water, but it is known to inhabit brackish water in Panama
(Greenfield and Thomerson 1997). It is restricted to
coastal habitats in Costa Rica (Bussing 1987), and has
been caught in the mangrove shorelines of Corn Island, 30
miles off the coast of Nicaragua in the Caribbean Sea
(Conkel 1993).

My information came from speaking with Ron Coleman while he was in town a few years back. When he spoke about them being found in Costa Rica on the Caribbean Sea side in water ways that ran right next to and into the Sea. He also noted these populations are only found in this salt water and if one were to go up stream in the river system 300-400 meters you would not find this population as they preferred the area by the Sea.

I would encourage anyone to email him if you have questions as he will not act in any way when he answers your emails.

Many and nearly all cichlids that have populations near costal waters are found in somewhat salty waters all the time. Although they many not take up residence there like some some species they are found there.

Ahhh yes wikipedia always a reliable source. Written by normal folks, and can be edited by normal normal folks. It is like a forum there without others watching all the time at what is posted. Not my favorite place to be pulling quotes from.


It isn't about acting a certain way by any means, it is about not giving others on the forum the wrong information. And if wrong information is giving others members are usually along quickly to point it out. No one is acting one way or another, that is just a forums wheels turning the way they were designed to.



Brian

 

I said it was my fault. I should not say all fish.

so you disagree with very few cichlids live in saltwater? so you say most do? no...

just because some live in saltwater dose not mean there is any reason to add it to every tank. this is what were were talking about. and I made a broad statement while I was helping 2 people in pm's and lots of other post. sometimes we get busy and just miss type something. if you would like to be helpful instead of just pointing out my flaws then by all means add the the OP original comment. then maybe I wouldnt act a lil irritated.

not to mention were not talking about the few cichlids that like salt. even in that link they test to see how much salt before a fish dies. no I won't be adding salt to my tank....

 

It isn't about what you said or what I said really. This is a forum, and if someone says something false or makes a mistake because they are being so helpful to others and in a hurry, other memebrs will point this out. I didn't call you out however I didn't sugar coat my post either, which is what many people would like done, that just isn't me. Simply I said a statement is false and gave an example rather than just say that's wrong and walk away.

I too, although rarely, help other members and don't have loads of time to spend on one post, so I made a comment and moved along. My only intent was that other members didn't think freshwater fish are never found in salt conditions.
To make a statement like I forgot how some members act is a little out there. Sorry but I am not a member who runs around saying "+1" to all the posts I come across just to boost my post count.



Do I disagree with very few cichlids live in salt water? Do I say most do live in salt water?
No and no.
I will say very few cichlid populations, populations... not species as a whole, spend more time in salt than in fresh, very few. I will also say many cichlid populations can be found in water with a very high salt content, do they live in this water...I guess that is up to an individual and how they define live. but these populations are spending time in this this salty water yes. Is it on a daily basis or do they only come in contact with it on a weekly basis that depends on each individual population of a given species.

yes in the article they tested a few species to see how much they can tolerate. Being how diverse cichlids are I don't think it is fair to say cichlids can tolerate this much salt before something happens. I would believe more in something along the lines of these species can take this while these species can take this amount. The different populations of cichlids throughout the world are so broad it is hard to compare one to another, and they are constantly evolving.
And the person who wrote this article is far more educated than I am, just giving my opinion on what I have learned.

Just an example to do with South American cichlids, Gymnogeophagus they find many of the same cichlid species but in different parts of a certain country. They were thinking they were finding different species and discovering new species because 300 miles away from where they know a certain cichlid species is found they find another fish that looks very similiar but also has easy differences to recognise. Through further research they have found many of these to be the same species but a different population that has evolved to its surroundings.


Do I use salt yes. But for one reason and one reason only. I keep cichlids to spawn them, that's it the only reason. Their spawning behavoir to me is fasinating, no matter if they are egg layers, mouthbrooders, delayed mouthbrooders or whatever the case. I also only try to keep wild caught fish or as close to wild as possibly for a given species. So when I get them I don't want to lose them. When certain species spawn as many of us know the male will literally beat the snout out of the female during their courtship. Open wounds, missing eyes, I have had some females lose their lips while spawning, so after a "rough" go at spawning I will often salt the living out of a female to irritate here into over producing slime coat in the hopes of no secondary infections showing up. Does it always work, no. Salt is not a miracle drug. But I have had lots of success with this method.


I never post to just contradict someone or to call them out. I will post if the wrong information has been posted though. I mainly don't like being grouped into how some people act, so cheers and enjoy the night.
Remember it's a forum, we won't always agree, and a simple debate not only can be fun but informative. I enjoy getting other peoples views and opinions on how they keep their fish which is why I have stayed around the forum for as long as I have.




Brian

 

ok first off I'm sorry. I was deff a little irritated at the time and I let it show.


but when you jump in and just throw that fact out there makes me look like a idiot... I know how I said it was wrong. I would have liked it a little sugar coated, sorry.... at least give me some credit as most freshwater fish don't have a huge amount of salt where there from. go into some depth next time.
I feel like jumping in to straighten out a fact without expanded info is more posting for post count then other things. also can do more harm then good.

if I say betta sorority don't work, would you jump in and say that's not true see and show some video... no you would say that's not exactly true there are some rare cases where it can work, but I would not advise it. that's how a post should go especially if your straightening out another members statement.

actually what did my post say....

if fish are in freshwater in the wild why would I add salt they would not have salt in the wild... something like that..

that is a pretty true statement even with your cichlids. in that article it does not say they migrate into diff types of water. it says they live in that water... so in nature they are living and born in that water not fresh. my point is give them what they get in nature and these cichlids live in salt. I don't know how they would not be considered brackish...

again sorry I was snappy and still might be a little I have seen you around you seem very knowledgeable and have no doubt fishlore is better because your here. but if you don't want to sugar coat things you might have more conversations like this... I would think you would know that being you know how forums work so well

 

It's all good no worries and surely no need to say sorry to me.
See the problem is I don't sugar coat things, sorry but I don't see the need. Just to use this thread as an example, yes you messed up with your wording as you said, but what was said was....
if they are in freshwater in the wild that means they would not come into contact with salt in nature so why would I add it......
And that just isn't true, again you said you made a mistake, but I did not know this. I came in and said it is in fact wrong and gave an example to show why I said that. I only gave one example but I could have listed many, but I didn't see the point. So to my thinking while that isn't very in depth, it was better giving one example rather than simply quoting you and saying nope wrong.

With your Betta comment, truthfully I wouldn't have said anything. I don't care for those fish myself and you probably won't find me on the Betta forum section. I do see your point here though, but I still don't understand your statement about I should go in depth next time I respond. I can, and will gladly go on and on in every post I comment in if I think it is needed. In this case I didn't feel the need, that is false and heres an example. Not to show you up or make you feel like an idiot (dude we are both going to feel like idiots often on and off this forum, but I wouldn't do that to you on purpose in the open forum) but this was very black and white to me so I didn't elaborate.


I agree with you about the salt thing and the article. But they are classified by what they were first discovered in and classified as. should they be brackish, no I don't think so. I think you are confusing, I am assuming here and probably wrong to do so, populations of fish with the species. Even the example I gave this was with a certain population, and while what I said is true to this population it is not true for the species. Even concerning Vieja Maculicauda, would I say this species as a whole is found in brackish waters or water close to full salt, absolutely not. But I would with a certain population you know.


Again no need to be sorry, we didn't agree and that's cool. Chances are we may disagree again down the line and that's fine too. Like I said a debate where everyone might be able to learn from it is always good. Even though I "know the forum" I probably won't be sugar coating my responses, that just isn't me. Here is the info, I don't think we need to say I respectfully disagree every time we have a different opinion or fact with someone else.

Thanks for the kind words, but trust me fishlore would get along just fine with or without little 'ol me




Brian

 

I am not joking but seriously curious. If populations of the fish developed to live in complete salt water wouldn't that make them saltwater fish? Or are they just really good at osmoregulation?

No absolutely not they are fresh water fish. Did they elvolve to get into this salt water, yes to a certain extent. Why? who knows? Perhaps a new food source? Many of them don't "live" in salt water, they are often found there though, some for extended periods of time. Maybe not extended as in days, could be just an hour or two a day or maybe even every other day...... How long they spend there is anyones guess, more research would be needed on that one I guess.
But some that do "live" there this may not be fully salt water either, perhaps just brackish as bankruptjojo mentioned.



Brian

 

That is just a false statement. Many fresh water fish are found in salty water. Some populations of Vieja Maculicauda in Costa Rica are found in complete salt water just to give an example. BUT MOST FRESHWATER FISH INCLUDING THE ONES WERE DISCUSSING HERE DONT LIVE IN SALT. AND I ONLY USE SALT WHEN BREEDING CICHLIDS.



Brian

that is all it would have took but its more for public opinion then my feelings

and I'm sure there are tons of fish I don't know about. but I have always thought it was like 90% or more of freshwater fish have almost no salt. and like 10% in more salty or brackish water. I'm sure there is no exact number but what do you think or do you have a source on this?

 

No I don't have a number for that, and I think it would be very hard to put one on it. Again because of the species versus a population within a species.

If they said this certain species is not found in brackish/salt water, but what if one lonely population within this species has been found even only once in a salty enviroment, do you now classify the whole species in your percentage of groups that are found in salt? It would be hard to come up with a number, however I bet if we dig we could come up with someone's "educated" guess. I will look tomorrow, and email some people I might know and try and come up with some kind of number, but mine will more than likely be based on cichlids.



Brian

 

no problem no need to go to the trouble. there still finding new fish anyways, the whole thing sounds like a bunch of evolution to me. but I never did pay much attention in school.

I always laugh about the OP in heated discussion when there not in them...

I really appreciate all the help, I didn't mean to cause such a ruckus. I have to say it's been fun watching.

yeah your all good lol. I think were done now sorry for any inconvenience.

 

Good morning,

I do not advocate the use of salt in freshwater tanks. However, I did use freshwater aquarium salt in my tanks for many years until I joined Fish Lore 4 years ago. Since then, I have stopped using it and my fish are still thriving.

"Keeping the tank salty all the time will not help with disease resistance in freshwater fish; in fact, it will actually increase the fishes’ susceptibility to disease and parasites by keeping the fish somewhat stressed all the time, and this weakens the immune system. And at the low level of salt generally recommended for these so-called benefits, there will be no benefit that cannot be achieved solely with regular water changes using a good conditioner."

My opinion for the use of salt in a freshwater aquairum:

It simply isn't necessary.

Ken

 

Please noone get mad at my statement. I don't believe salt should be used unless nessessary. like bad ich. but then I'd just dip for 30 sec to a min. I would not add to the tank. I think adding salt to help the slime coat is like poking yourself in the eye because your eye is dry. ow!
I do know that many ca cichlids (like Brian was saying) appreciate salt. I had a JD and he would be so energetic and happy once I put the salt in. he'd go hover over it until it finished desolving like he loved breathing it in lol.
I have noticed that catfish generally hate salt and do not cope well with it in the water. Before I found this site I added aquarium salt to a tank with a school of pictus cats, needless and sadly to say, they all passed away within a few days
I use to occasionally dose my 55 with salt before I did research on it and I noticed that my featherfin would hide more and breathed harder when there was salt in the tank.
I hope you find the answers you were looking for
-Alyssa

 

Thanks JD, I appreciate the information. I was just wondering if was good to have it around in an emergency.

Please noone get mad at my statement. I don't believe salt should be used unless nessessary. like bad ich. but then I'd just dip for 30 sec to a min. I would not add to the tank. I think adding salt to help the slime coat is like poking yourself in the eye because your eye is dry. ow!
I do know that many ca cichlids (like Brian was saying) appreciate salt. I had a JD and he would be so energetic and happy once I put the salt in. he'd go hover over it until it finished desolving like he loved breathing it in lol.
I have noticed that catfish generally hate salt and do not cope well with it in the water. Before I found this site I added aquarium salt to a tank with a school of pictus cats, needless and sadly to say, they all passed away within a few days
I use to occasionally dose my 55 with salt before I did research on it and I noticed that my featherfin would hide more and breathed harder when there was salt in the tank.
I hope you find the answers you were looking for
-Alyssa

 

Please noone get mad at my statement. I think adding salt to help the slime coat is like poking yourself in the eye because your eye is dry. ow!
I do know that many ca cichlids (like Brian was saying) appreciate salt. I had a JD and he would be so energetic and happy once I put the salt in. he'd go hover over it until it finished desolving like he loved breathing it in lol.

-Alyssa

People don't get mad around here Alyssa

I never said it was a pleasant experience. When dealing with a large CA/SA I try to weigh things out. What the male does to many females in the larger fish would land them in jail in most States, it isn't a nice loving experience in many cases. She gets beat down, plain and simple, no other way to say and get the point across. So what would be better salt the mess out of her in hopes to keep bacteria away, or let if fester which in most cases it will lead to all sorts of problems. Then you are dealing with different problems for an extended period of time, which lets point out can't be comfortable on the fish either......
So that is why I use it, to irritate. And lets face it too, some of the pairs I have are $300-400, I am not going to let a female fade away to some bacteria infection that may have been prevented with a bit of irritation and discomfort.



Brian

 

People don't get mad around here Alyssa

I never said it was a pleasant experience. When dealing with a large CA/SA I try to weigh things out. What the male does to many females in the larger fish would land them in jail in most States, it isn't a nice loving experience in many cases. She gets beat down, plain and simple, no other way to say and get the point across. So what would be better salt the mess out of her in hopes to keep bacteria away, or let if fester which in most cases it will lead to all sorts of problems. Then you are dealing with different problems for an extended period of time, which lets point out can't be comfortable on the fish either......
So that is why I use it, to irritate. And lets face it too, some of the pairs I have are $300-400, I am not going to let a female fade away to some bacteria infection that may have been prevented with a bit of irritation and discomfort.



Brian

dont people use methylene blue for that? I know its good for keeping bacteria off eggs.

I'm going to be breeding angelfish soon (hopefully) and I was planning on using that with my angels.

not saying its better than salt. I'm sure some fish would handle them both differently.

 

I appreciate you guys keeping this thread alive. I have learned a lot from reading your posts.

 

dont people use methylene blue for that? I know its good for keeping bacteria off eggs.

I'm going to be breeding angelfish soon (hopefully) and I was planning on using that with my angels.

not saying its better than salt. I'm sure some fish would handle them both differently.

I have heard of using methylene blue for the eggs, but not for what I am talking about so I am not sure.



Brian