Red stem plant for high PH tank

Hi all. I've been trying to get a bright red stem plant to grow and keep its color. My tank has high light, CO2, I dose a liquid iron fertilizer, and I use root tabs. So far, I've tried rotala h'ra and a ludwigia (can't remember exactly which.) They both grow well, but they stay orange. It's nice but I want something RED to go with them. I think my high PH (7.8) and obnoxiously hard (150-300ppm GH, 180-300ppm KH) water is my problem. Anyone have any idea for a good red plant that'll stay red in my water?

 

Hi all. I've been trying to get a bright red stem plant to grow and keep its color. My tank has high light, CO2,

High light helps bring out the red, and CO2 makes it possible to go high light without growing too much algae. So far so good.

I dose a liquid iron fertilizer,

Plants need a little iron for health, but iron fertilization doesn't help turn plants red.

and I use root tabs. So far, I've tried rotala h'ra and a ludwigia (can't remember exactly which.) They both grow well, but they stay orange. It's nice but I want something RED to go with them.

If it isn't the ludwigia you already have, try Ludwigia natans 'super red' and/or Alternanthera reineckii.

I think my high PH (7.8) and obnoxiously hard (150-300ppm GH, 180-300ppm KH) water is my problem.

pH is fine. GH is fine. 300ppm KH is a bit high, but many/most aquatic plants should still be able to handle it (especially since you are injecting CO2). If used correctly, CO2 injection strengthens the plants. And, stronger plants can better deal with the stress of higher KH. I doubt your KH levels are responsible for your plants not turning red though.

Anyone have any idea for a good red plant that'll stay red in my water?

Like I suggested above, try Ludwigia natans 'super red' and/or Alternanthera reineckii.

Other things that could help:

1. If you don't already have some, get some nice RGB lights with adjustable colors. From my experience, such lights don't really effect the health of your plants much, but they do have a big effect on how your plants look. That is, high end lights can make your red plants appear redder.
2. Try and limit nitrogen. That is, try a lean dosing routine. From what I've read/seen, limiting nitrogen can make your red plants redder.

On a side note, the plants in your picture look, to me, more like plants grown in a low-tech tank. I'd double check to make sure the lights are really as high light as you're aiming for, and make sure you're consistently getting enough CO2 in the water.

 

Hey,

what light do you specifically have?

Also here's the catch: Ludwigia gets redder with a lot of nutrients, H'Ra gets redder with limited nutrients.

 

I have a fluval plant 3.0 and dose C02 through an in line defuser. I'll attach pics of my light settings and C02 drop checker. I'll also show a full shot of the tank.

Edit: the light is hung around 8-10in above the tank and is around 2 1/2 - 3 years old. Also added some close ups of the red tiger lotus to show its color better.

For fertilizer, I use AquariumCoop's easy green, easy iron, and easy root tabs. I dose easy green twice a week, easy iron once a week, and easy root tabs every ~4 months. Any more and I get algae. I try to keep nitrates around 20ppm.

Do the plants really need opposites? Woops
Addon: showing the color on the tiger lotus better.

 

I have a fluval plant 3.0 and dose C02 through an in line defuser.

I haven't used that light myself, but, from what I've read, it's a good light. You should be able to grow some good red plants with it.

I'll attach pics of my light settings and C02 drop checker. I'll also show a full shot of the tank.

If it were me, I'd increase my CO2 injection rate. You have a beautiful tank, but the stem plants look a little leggy to me. I'd like to see the drop checker fluid a little more on the yellow side of green too.

Edit: the light is hung around 8-10in above the tank and is around 2 1/2 - 3 years old. Also added some close ups of the red tiger lotus to show its color better.


For fertilizer, I use AquariumCoop's easy green, easy iron, and easy root tabs.

I doubt you need easy green and easy iron.

I dose easy green twice a week, easy iron once a week, and easy root tabs every ~4 months. Any more and I get algae.

Do you mean you get algae on hardscape and slow growing plants when you up the dosage? That's pretty normal. But if you're getting algae on the stem plants when you up the dosage, that makes me think the plant health may not be so good.

I try to keep nitrates around 20ppm.


Do the plants really need opposites? Woops

I haven't heard this before. I'm curious myself.

Addon: showing the color on the tiger lotus better.

If you're happy with the reds you can see with the light you have, then there should be no reason to change it.

 

The light seems to be working well overall. I'll try to up the CO2 and try the Alternanthera Reineckii. I was actually looking at it before.

Don't know how much the easy ferts actually do, but I doubt they hurt and everything seems good except the reds so eh.

By algea I meant the glass if I dose too much green and I get hair algae on everything if I dose too much iron.

Thanks for the complement. I love the tank, I just want a few pops of red in the back.

I'm happy with the red on the lotus, just want a bit more in the stems.

 

Like I suggested above, try Ludwigia natans 'super red' and/or Alternanthera reineckii.

These are the plants that I grow for red colour. I find that the Alternanthera requires less intense light for bright red coloration. The only drawback is that it is quite slow growing for a stem plant and older leaves can be susceptible to algae.

 

Hey,

is that your 70 gallon?
If so, the strongest Fluval has is the 3.0 is the 59W, do you have only one?

If yes:

That is, fully cranked up and close to the water, 17 lumens per liter.
You have it running at 75%, which is around 13 lumens per liter.
Furthermore you have it 10 inches above the tank. So realistically this is equal to around 11 lumens per liter.

I'm afraid with that, you won't be getting any bright and full reds.
I'd consider that very low light.

 

It is the 70. I just have the one light. I've tried running it higer/closer to the tank but got algae issues. I can try upping it and see what happens. Would you recommend changing my fertilizers at all to help fight algae?

 

Hey,

what algae are you getting? Green or grey?
If just bringing the light close to the surface results in algae, it's usually way too much ferts.

In a low light setup, you usually don't need any fertilizers at all. Maybe, since you're using CO2, a hint of Easy Green every week.

 

Green on the glass and some brown. I'll up the light and play with the ferns to re-balance.

Thanks for the advice, to everyone in this thread

 

Hey , I’m not a plant expert at all but I will say that in my experience the blue on this light loves to grow algae. I see you keep your blue on all night. Do I have a scientific back up for this ? Nope. Just my experience.

This is my settings if it helps at all.. I had the whites higher but mine is set into my lid with clips so a lot closer to the water than yours.

 

Hi all. I've been trying to get a bright red stem plant to grow and keep its color. My tank has high light, CO2, I dose a liquid iron fertilizer, and I use root tabs. So far, I've tried rotala h'ra and a ludwigia (can't remember exactly which.) They both grow well, but they stay orange. It's nice but I want something RED to go with them. I think my high PH (7.8) and obnoxiously hard (150-300ppm GH, 180-300ppm KH) water is my problem. Anyone have any idea for a good red plant that'll stay red in my water?

Pick up a red tiger lotus plant for the background

 

Hey , I’m not a plant expert at all but I will say that in my experience the blue on this light loves to grow algae. I see you keep your blue on all night. Do I have a scientific back up for this ? Nope. Just my experience.

This is my settings if it helps at all.. I had the whites higher but mine is set into my lid with clips so a lot closer to the water than yours. View attachment 869425

I've read that as well. It's why my blue is lower then anything else. I think it's fine having the blue on super low at night. I don't have any proof it's not doing anything, but I don't tend to get algea unless there's something else going on. Ex. dosing too much iron.

Have you noticed plants/fish doing better with the extra timepoints, or does it just make the tank more interesting to you?

Pick up a red tiger lotus plant for the background

I have one, as pictured above. I'm looking specifically for stem plants to get a few "pops" of red across the background.

The lotus is the reddest thing in the tank though, so good suggestion. It also grows like crazy.

Behold, a totally accurate depiction of what I'm trying to accomplish.

 

Hey,

I think some cryptos and echinodorus would be the easiest.
You could check if you can get your hands on an Echinodorus "aflame"

 

Hey,

I think some cryptos and echinodorus would be the easiest.
You could check if you can get your hands on an Echinodorus "aflame"

I swear one of mine (I think it's the tall one and think the short is Echinodorus fancy twist. Not certain though.) was sold as "Amazon sword aflame" but when I google that everything that shows up is a "purple knight" and looks way more purple than mine. Echinodorus aflame gives me plants that look more red. Is it just a lighting issue after all, or is what I have something different? And note the tall sword has another fancy twist(?) in front of it: they're not just short leaves. And I know the green one is definitely an Amazon sword. It's the redish ones I'm not sure of now.

Funny you mentioned crypts because I was actually looking at Cryptocoryne Spiralis Tiger for in front of the swords. Might need to move the fancy twist(?) in front of the tall one for space though.

If it were me, I'd increase my CO2 injection rate. You have a beautiful tank, but the stem plants look a little leggy to me. I'd like to see the drop checker fluid a little more on the yellow side of green too.

Upped the CO2. It's definitely more green, but I don't know if it's light enough. What do you all think? Oh and I should have noted the picture was taken shortly after a trim that exposed plants that had been shaded.

Meanwhile, I upped the light to 100% on every setting but the blue. I'm planning on lowering it to 6 inches tomorrow and seeing what that does.

 

Upped the CO2. It's definitely more green, but I don't know if it's light enough. What do you all think?

I can't see much difference between the before and after pics. They both look dark green to me.

 

Sorry about that. It was hard to get the lighting right. Trust me the first is at least a little more blue in person. I'll try to get a better pic when the tank lights are on and the CO2's been running a while.

 

Is it just a lighting issue after all, or is what I have something different?

Hey,

imo even in low lighting, an aflame should at least give a bit of red. Maybe not the ultra dark reds you see in all those fancy pictures, but at least a bit.

If you get algae when upping the lights, I would also check why that is. A normal tank should take 17lm/l without any problems and algae growth, especially since you have quite some plants in there AND CO2.

 

* whispers it’s the blue *

nah I jest. Like I said I’m no plant expert it’s just what I noticed. I have a complete floating carpet of salvinia so I don’t really notice anything different in the additional time points anymore but I used to.
The detailed drawing makes your vision so clear, I wish you the best of luck with that

 

Hey,

imo even in low lighting, an aflame should at least give a bit of red. Maybe not the ultra dark reds you see in all those fancy pictures, but at least a bit.

If you get algae when upping the lights, I would also check why that is. A normal tank should take 17lm/l without any problems and algae growth, especially since you have quite some plants in there AND CO2.

Thanks. Made a separate post asking about the swords because now I'm curious.

Sometimes I wonder if algea is at least partly because of my obnoxiously hard water. I'm just using conditioned city tap water so im not sure EXACTLY what's in it. Not much of a choice now, although I've debated getting an RO unit. In the mean time, I'll keep playing with ferts.

 

Hey,

chiming in here.

Algae like blue light. That is correct. But so do plants!
"Blue light causes algae" is hovering around the fish tank scene since forever. And it is both correct and incorrect at the same time.

I'll try to keep it simple.

There are 2 things to know:

Light color:

- Red light makes plants grow long
- Blue light makes plants grow bushy and strong

Chlorophyll types:

- Chlorophyll type A can work better with blue light
- Chlorophyll type B can work better with red light

Our plants and algae are mostly type A with a bit of B. That means, they can use energy given by blue light way better.
So if you give plants and algae the same intensity of red and of blue light, the blue light provides WAY more energy to them.

So the algae grow more not because the light is blue, but because you're delivering way more energy to them.
That theoretically also combines with blue light penetrating the water a lot deeper, but in our usual fish tanks that is not of much relevance.

So if you get algae grow from blue light it's not because it's blue, but because you give more energy into the system which your plants are probably not able to use fully.

I mentioned the different growing schemes with different light color because it's very similar to pumping up the light. Most plants grow more bushy with more light given to them.

Hope that helps.

ometimes I wonder if algea is at least partly because of my obnoxiously hard water.

That surely plays a role. Plants can consume nutrients way better in acidic water than in alkaline water. Better nutrient uptake -> Healthier plants -> Less algae

Tanks with a low pH (I was running mine as low as pH 5.8) can handle A LOT more light and nutrients.

 

Ramp up the CO2.

 

Got it. This is the best image I can get. The CO2's seriously cranked and the drop checker is definitely green in person. Not super light though.

 

Got it. This is the best image I can get. The CO2's seriously cranked and the drop checker is definitely green in person. Not super light though.

That looks better.