Really Unusual Bloating And Swim Bladder Issues

This particular betta I'm taking about I've had for a couple months now.

When I first got him I struggled with bloating problems with him. I was feeding dry pellets and almost every time I fed he would bloat. The bloating would range anywhere from very mild to extreme, and would come on very quickly, as well as go very quickly. He also has very large bowel movements. When the bloat would be more extreme, it would effect his swim bladder, making it difficult for him to get around, but beside trouble swimming, he never seemed in pain or listless during these bloats. Always still energetic and curious, so I wasn't too concerned about his health as I tried to fix it.

We tried a few things but ultimately I managed to get the bloating under control with a full protein diet of frozen bloodworms (after a pea and fast treatment).

Things were going fine and he was eating great and 0 bloats for a couple weeks. I was feeding him bloodworms every day, twice a day, without any fasting days but the schedule was seeming to help. I have heard around that a full protein diet is not that great though (? they are meat eating fish though so I don't understand the problem) and I wanted to try and introduce other foods to test him, so about 10 days ago I tried daphnia as one of his meals. He didn't like it as much but ate it and there were no problems at first. I did this two times, once on a Tuesday I think and then again on a Thursday

but this past weekend we had to go away for a couple days and I left my bettas alone. We were gone from Thursday night to Sunday night, so both my bettas got fed Thursday morning (with daphnia) and then again on Sunday night (small meal of bloodworms)

Since coming back from my trip, it's been bloat problems again.

He was ok for the first couple days but this Wednesday and yesterday were really bad even though I've fed him minimally. On Tuesday night he had a small bloat that cleared up by the morning so I fed him wednesday morning with daphnia. He bloated again on wednesday so I didn't give him his second meal. The bloat had again cleared by Thursday morning so I tried giving him another small meal that morning of bloodworms, and he of course bloated again.

This bloat was likely the worse he ever had. His stomach was huge. He was listless because he had such trouble swimming. He was just sitting at the bottom using a leaf of my plant to keep himself down. I was feeling very sorry for him so I was keeping a close eye on him. This is where things get weird and I get concerned.

In a matter of literally second, this huge bloat deflated (his bloats have disappeared quickly before but never where I could pinpoint the moment. I was literally watching him, turned away for 5 seconds, turned back and his bloat was gone. I did NOT find a bowel movement to accompany this disappearing bloat), and then I watched him sit on the gravel for a second and see stress colors take over his lower half. (He's mostly black and blue in his body, and his whole chin and belly went pale white). He started swimming around a little, but not like his usual self. He moved around the bottom of the tank very carefully, still stress colors, and it took a while before he would come up a little again. He seemed very caution. I went to bed when he normal colors started to come back and he was acting a bit more himself.

This morning, he's bloated again even though I didn't feed him for over 24 hours now. It's not as bad as yesterday, but the bloat is interfering with his swimming so he's using his leaf trick again. He's much more himself in behavior again so for now it's not in a state of emergency like it felt last night.

I really need help with this. Some opinions? I am baffled by this bloating issue, how quickly it can come on and go and how erratic it is. Nothing has changed in my tank so water, temperature etc shouldn't be an issue. The only difference from before when he had the bloats managed is the fast over the weekend and that I tried him on daphnia.

 

I would honestly just start feeding him less. Over feeding can cause issues with his swim bladder. If he's bloating that much and that frequently, that's the only cause I can come up with. You said you were feeding him dry pellets? How many would you feed him? And did you soak them in tank water for 10 minutes before giving them to him? The pellets expand a lot in size, so if they're not rehydrated before the betta fish eats it, they'll expand in him stomach causing bloating.

 

I would honestly just start feeding him less. Over feeding can cause issues with his swim bladder. If he's bloating that much and that frequently, that's the only cause I can come up with. You said you were feeding him dry pellets? How many would you feed him? And did you soak them in tank water for 10 minutes before giving them to him? The pellets expand a lot in size, so if they're not rehydrated before the betta fish eats it, they'll expand in him stomach causing bloating.

Really appreciate the response, but I went into a lot of detail in my post so I'd suggest maybe giving it a full read.

I specifically said that it was weeks ago that I fed him dry pellets (started with them but stopped within a week when the bloating was a problem) and had pervious solved the problem with a diet change but now it's started again

 

Really appreciate the response, but I went into a lot of detail in my post so I'd suggest maybe giving it a full read.

I specifically said that it was weeks ago that I fed him dry pellets (started with them but stopped within a week when the bloating was a problem) and had pervious solved the problem with a diet change but now it's started again

I did read your entire post. I said you "WERE" feeding him dry pellets, as in past tense. Feeding just frozen foods like bloodworms and daphnia isn't healthy. Those are "treats." Which is why I asked if you soaked the dry pellets you were feeding him in tank water before you giving them to him. I would go back to the pellets but I would soak them beforehand. I would only feed 3 pellets a feeding since he bloats dramatically.

 

I did read your entire post. I said you "WERE" feeding him dry pellets, as in past tense. Feeding just frozen foods like bloodworms and daphnia isn't healthy. Those are "treats." Which is why I asked if you soaked the dry pellets you were feeding him in tank water before you giving them to him. I would go back to the pellets but I would soak them beforehand. I would only feed 3 pellets a feeding since he bloats dramatically.

It is not freeze dried food I am feeding, which is usually otherwise considered treats and causes bloating, it's frozen and thawed worms.

Obviously I tried soaking the pellets when I was first having the issues. I tried different foods as well including flakes and other types of pellets but I didn't have luck with anything and my pervious struggles with pellets and flakes quickly turned me off of them.

I didn't include these details since I don't consider them important to the current issue, since I'd managed his bloating for weeks with a diet change. It was only after the fast this weekend that the issue has started again

I'm aware that there should be variety in frozen diet which was why I was trying to introduce daphnia, but as far as I'm aware an exclusive frozen food diet is fine and my other betta, who I never fed pellets or flakes, is having no issues with the exact same diet).

 

Sounds more like he is dealing with an infection in his bladder or gut that he is fighting off. You might consider feeding him Oxytetracyline or metronidazole in his food.

 

Sounds more like he is dealing with an infection in his bladder or gut that he is fighting off. You might consider feeding him Oxytetracyline or metronidazole in his food.

thank you. I was wondering about bladder infections myself since the bloating was unusual from what I experienced before, but I wasn't able to find a lot of information about it (when you search information about bloating and swim bladders it all just chalks it up to diet). In the last few hours alone he's gone from bloated to not bloated about 3 times, and he hasn't been fed anything since his small meal yesterday morning so it's tough to say conclusively that it has anything to do with food.

Are those the active medical ingredients? I'm in sweden so some medicine is hard to find sometimes. Our most common universal antibacterial meds have the active ingredient Methyl orange. If that doesn't work I might have to go hunting at the import aquarium shops. Would some aquarium salt in his tank help to aid him as well?

 

Those are the names of the active ingredients and not product names.
You can use any of the tetracycline family, but be careful of tetracycline itself as it becomes toxic over time.
You can also use Kanamycin but it is stronger than the others.
His swim bladder is deflating and that is dangerous, because it will likely become permanent. You can use epsom salt baths to try to alleviate some of the symptoms till you are able to get the antibiotics

 

Those are the names of the active ingredients and not product names.
You can use any of the tetracycline family, but be careful of tetracycline itself as it becomes toxic over time.
You can also use Kanamycin but it is stronger than the others.
His swim bladder is deflating and that is dangerous, because it will likely become permanent. You can use epsom salt baths to try to alleviate some of the symptoms till you are able to get the antibiotics

upsetting, because I had suspicions that this was a swim bladder issue previously (when he would bloat he would also gulp air and I read that was a way that some fish try to equalize their swim bladders, the the air would always be glupped and then expelled immediately from his gills, but I didn't get a single comment about it possibly being a bladder issue previously when I mentioned this occurrence) but I'm glad to have someone say that there's at least reason to have suspicions of an infection. I'm really worried that it might already be a little late. It's clear that he's at least very sensitive now so there's likely already been damage done.

currently he doesn't look overly bloated (maybe just a tiny bit of a tummy bulge) but he is floating to the surface of the water and having to work to keep himself righted. Still his normal self behavior wise though.

I might be able to go today to check for some medicine, as long as it's safe to say that it will at least do more good than harm to try?

 

Without antibiotics it is very unlikely that he will get better on his own. I suggest getting them as soon as possible.

 

Without antibiotics it is very unlikely that he will get better on his own. I suggest getting them as soon as possible.

I'm having trouble finding items with the active ingredients you listed at my usual places, unsurprisingly (a lot of the same medications are not available here unfortunately)

From your suggestions I'm looking for something good against general internal infections, though? There is one that used here pretty regularly for disinfecting and to help fight illness. Unfortunately it's also the only one of their many medicines that doesn't talk about the active ingredients. I'd likely have to get a box in my hand and read the label to see.



the other one was with the Methyl orange ingredient but seemed more geared towards external issues like skin ulcers, wounds and inflammation

 

Ektomor contains Magnesium Peroxide(health mineral) and sodium perborate trihydrate(Oxidation agent)
Methylene Orange is essentially the same as Methylene blue in application.
Unlikely to help much
What about Esha 2000? It isn't the best but I know how hard it is to get antibiotics there, maybe Coradee can help with suggestions for meds

 

Ektomor contains Magnesium Peroxide(health mineral) and sodium perborate trihydrate(Oxidation agent)
Methylene Orange is essentially the same as Methylene blue in application.
Unlikely to help much
What about Esha 2000? It isn't the best but I know how hard it is to get antibiotics there, maybe Coradee can help with suggestions for meds

I can get esha 2000, for now at least

 

Hi, meds really aren't my thing & we are limited here what we can get, but
along with Esha, Waterlife products I've heard good things of, there's a list of them & what they treat here that may help

 

Hi, meds really aren't my thing & we are limited here what we can get, but
along with Esha, Waterlife products I've heard good things of, there's a list of them & what they treat here that may help

Thanks, I know akvarielagret had some waterlife products but I won't be able to get out there until at least Sunday so unfortunately that's a little tough. I picked up esha 2000 for now and we'll see if it helps at all

 

It is not freeze dried food I am feeding, which is usually otherwise considered treats and causes bloating, it's frozen and thawed worms.

Obviously I tried soaking the pellets when I was first having the issues. I tried different foods as well including flakes and other types of pellets but I didn't have luck with anything and my pervious struggles with pellets and flakes quickly turned me off of them.

I didn't include these details since I don't consider them important to the current issue, since I'd managed his bloating for weeks with a diet change. It was only after the fast this weekend that the issue has started again

I'm aware that there should be variety in frozen diet which was why I was trying to introduce daphnia, but as far as I'm aware an exclusive frozen food diet is fine and my other betta, who I never fed pellets or flakes, is having no issues with the exact same diet).

I said "frozen foods." Not freeze dried. I'm just trying to help you, no need to get snappy with me

 

Ektomor contains Magnesium Peroxide(health mineral) and sodium perborate trihydrate(Oxidation agent)
Methylene Orange is essentially the same as Methylene blue in application.
Unlikely to help much
What about Esha 2000? It isn't the best but I know how hard it is to get antibiotics there, maybe Coradee can help with suggestions for meds

Hi, meds really aren't my thing & we are limited here what we can get, but
along with Esha, Waterlife products I've heard good things of, there's a list of them & what they treat here that may help

Little update

he was bloating off and on still yesterday but I dosed and fasted him. In the night the same thing happened as the pervious night. His bloat disappeared and he got some stress colors. This time I noticed that he was hanging out at the bottom likely because he was having the opposite problem, couldn't get air in his bladder to rise in the same way as he likely had too much in it before.

He recovered gradually and was able to get off the ground of his tank so I left him again for the night. This morning he is swimming more normally, no issues that I can see.

I dosed again as directed with esha, and will be keeping an eye on him today. as long as no more bloating shows today I will try to give him a very small meal tomorrow morning along with the third dose