Really need to know why ??

  • Thread starter

Gargoyle

Well Known Member
Messages
611
Reaction score
2
Points
188
Experience
More than 10 years
Why do people say this ---> "the water doesn't contain any of the nitrifying bacteria"

I mean seriously ?? When you do your water testing what are you testing ?? And what are you testing it for ?? So how in the world can this --> "the water doesn't contain any of the nitrifying bacteria" be even close to true ??

I just have to call this one out...
 

COBettaCouple

Fishlore Legend
Messages
25,151
Reaction score
26
Points
508
Experience
Just started
The nitrifiers also known as the good or beneficial bacteria, which are present after successfully cycling a new tank, providing biological filtration, without which our tanks would turn into a "toxic waste dump".
Transforming ammonia to nitrite, and nitrite to nitrates. This bacteria settles on rocks, gravel, filter media, sand, biowheels and such.
Nitrifiers consist of two bacteria species. Both separate, but dependent. While the first strain settles as soon as ammonia is present, the second one settles as soon as nitrites are present.

Nitrifying bacteria are classified as obligate chemolithotrophs. This simply means that they must use inorganic salts as an energy source and generally cannot utilize organic materials. They must oxidize ammonia and nitrites for their energy needs and fix inorganic carbon dioxide (CO2) to fulfill their carbon requirements. They are largely non-motile and must colonize a surface (gravel, sand, synthetic biomedia, etc.) for optimum growth. They secrete a sticky slime matrix which they use to attach themselves.
Species of Nitrosomonas and Nitrobacter are gram negative, mostly rod-shaped, microbes ranging between 0.6-4.0 microns in length. They are obligate aerobes and cannot multiply or convert ammonia or nitrites in the absence of oxygen.
 
  • Thread starter

Gargoyle

Well Known Member
Messages
611
Reaction score
2
Points
188
Experience
More than 10 years
And in rebuttal....

Nitrifying bacteria are widespread in soil and water, and are found in highest numbers where considerable amounts of ammonia are present (areas with extensive protein decomposition, and sewage treatment plants). Nitrifying bacteria thrive in lakes and streams high imputs of sewage and wastewater because of the high ammonia content.
 

Butterfly

Fishlore Legend
Messages
22,864
Reaction score
117
Points
518
Experience
More than 10 years
When you test your water you are not testing for beneficial bacteria you are testing for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates.
These are the result of fish urine, feces, food etc.
The bacteria colonizes in the filter, in/on the gravel, on the glass and other decor in the tank and use ammonia as food converting it to less toxic nitrites and even less toxic nitrates.
I wouldn't say there absolutely, positively isn't ANY beneficial bacteria in the water, but I would say there isn't enough to make a difference when making a large water change or enough to warrant saving the water to put in another tank.
Carol
 
  • Thread starter

Gargoyle

Well Known Member
Messages
611
Reaction score
2
Points
188
Experience
More than 10 years
I can swallow that... Being that the life cycle of this bacteria is about 14 to 20 days for reproduction and during the first 3 or 4 days many of the cells may be suspended in the water column I can see that the levels may not be high enough to warrant using the old water. But on the same token it really could not hurt the cycle of a new tank either.

Obviously the gravel is where the largest colonization takes place besides the filter.
 

COBettaCouple

Fishlore Legend
Messages
25,151
Reaction score
26
Points
508
Experience
Just started
Butterfly, please correct me if i'm wrong.

The way that I look at the cycle is this:
i think that in a way these little pictures of the cycle make it look as if everything takes place out in the water and i visualize it more as a process taking place in the filter and along the surfaces in the tank.. as the water is moved through the filter and along the surfaces, the nitrosomonas and nitrobacter interact with the ammonia and nitrites in the water going by and end up releasing nitrates back into the water. New Nitrosomonas and nitrobacter will settle onto the nearest surface but as it's an ongoing process and they aren't immediately sucked to the nearest surface, you are going to grab some when you pull water out.

When you pull tank water from a cycled tank, you'll have small amounts of nitrosomonas, nitrobacter and nitrates present in the water. But like Butterfly said, it's a really small relative amount.
 
  • Thread starter

Gargoyle

Well Known Member
Messages
611
Reaction score
2
Points
188
Experience
More than 10 years
I agree with both of you.

My problem is with people that say this to new people that know no better ---> "the water doesn't contain any of the nitrifying bacteria". When in fact it DOES! The amount at this point is relative. The point is that there are nitrifying bacteria present in the water of cycled tanks.

So if someone asks --- Should I add water from my cycled tank to my new tank ? --- The answer should be --- Sure! Although you will get a greater benefit from adding some gravel from your cycled tank the water will not hurt you any. ;D

Anyway that is the point I am trying to make... ;D
 

Butterfly

Fishlore Legend
Messages
22,864
Reaction score
117
Points
518
Experience
More than 10 years
Understood Gargoyle I think when a new hobbyist starts out sometimes we try too hard to get things just right for them. Personally I don't advise using old tank water for a new tank. I feel the benefits of clean well oxygenated water far out weight the benefits of the small amount of beneficial bacteria contained in old tank water. but thats just my opinion.
Carol
 
  • Thread starter

Gargoyle

Well Known Member
Messages
611
Reaction score
2
Points
188
Experience
More than 10 years
One cycle and so many ways to get it done... LOL!!

It all sounds good to me.. One way is as good as the other in most tanks. I wasn't thinking of using 100% used tank water in a new tank though.. I was referring to those that ask about a few gallons here and there to help boost the cycle process.

In any event there would be benefits to new water as well. Honestly the only way I have ever cycled is from scratch and that has worked out well for me and I have read horror stories from others that try the same thing.

Thanks for the replies you two!! ;D
 

COBettaCouple

Fishlore Legend
Messages
25,151
Reaction score
26
Points
508
Experience
Just started
Well, the cycle is something i'm still learning about.. delving deeper into it.. i've even read of rna experiments with it.. ah, if only i could just buy endless pouches of bio-spira..
 

Butterfly

Fishlore Legend
Messages
22,864
Reaction score
117
Points
518
Experience
More than 10 years
Yep there are most always several ways to do just about anything Enjoyed the discussion- thanks.
Yes FLBettaCouple multiple bags of BioSpira would be wonderful.
Carol
 
Toggle Sidebar

Aquarium Calculator

Aquarium Photo Contests

Follow FishLore!





Top Bottom