Ready for Fish?

After finding this forum, I decided to go for the fishless cycle method (despite various other sites promoting cycling WITH fish).

After 2 weeks, my ammonia rating is under 0.2mg/l (second lowest on the liquid testing kit)

Nitrite is at 6mg/l - 7mg/l (second lowest on test strip)

Nitrate is 0

I don't seem to be seeing any change. I am thinking I might add 4 harlequin rasboras to help the cycle along. Thoughts?

Also, in a few more weeks I plan to add 4 more rasboras (making 8 in total) - and then 8 neon tetra a few loaches and a betta. Do I need to add them slowly (i.e would 8 tetras at once be too much and upset the cyle?)

 

I personally prefer to fish in cycle oppose to fish-less cycle. So long as you're not adding too many fish at one time right off the bat, they generally do fine. Still, fishless cycling avoids the hassle altogether.

I'm assuming you started off with a base concentration of 4ppm ammonia? This is where you should be at after about 2 weeks. I would let it go for another ~2 weeks and THEN see if there isn't nitrate within the tank.

The cycle usually takes about a month to initially complete - you're waiting on your second bacterial colony to develop, these guys do usually take quite a bit of time to get going. After about a week and a half - the ammonia eating bacteria should finish their first initial growth spurt - and that looks like what's happened. I'd just wait it out a bit.

You shouldn't add any fish until the nitrite reading drops below .5ppm (at least - but .5ppm is the threshold for 'toxic') You could do a small partial water change to dilute a bit of the excess nitrite so that you can add fish - but I'd just recommend waiting it out.

This is the sucky part about doing a fish-less cycle, it can take a bit longer, but it's the trade for being 'cruelty free' to your fish.

Also - yes, you NEED to add fish gradually. The more you add at once, the larger the strain on your bacterial colonies, and the more likely you are to have an ammonia or nitrite spike (shortly after adding the lot of fish). However, adding 4 rasbora's weeks apart should be just fine. I recommend adding about 1/8th the total stocking limit at a time, and to do so at 1.5 - 2 week intervals. (the 1/8th thing is relevant - If it's smaller than 50G, I'd add no more than 3-4 at a time, larger than 55g, and 6-7 at a time shouldn't be too many either).

 

I personally prefer to fish in cycle oppose to fish-less cycle. So long as you're not adding too many fish at one time right off the bat, they generally do fine. Still, fishless cycling avoids the hassle altogether.

I'm assuming you started off with a base concentration of 4ppm ammonia? This is where you should be at after about 2 weeks. I would let it go for another ~2 weeks and THEN see if there isn't nitrate within the tank.

The cycle usually takes about a month to initially complete - you're waiting on your second bacterial colony to develop, these guys do usually take quite a bit of time to get going. After about a week and a half - the ammonia eating bacteria should finish their first initial growth spurt - and that looks like what's happened. I'd just wait it out a bit.

You shouldn't add any fish until the nitrite reading drops below .5ppm (at least - but .5ppm is the threshold for 'toxic') You could do a small partial water change to dilute a bit of the excess nitrite so that you can add fish - but I'd just recommend waiting it out.

This is the sucky part about doing a fish-less cycle, it can take a bit longer, but it's the trade for being 'cruelty free' to your fish.

Also - yes, you NEED to add fish gradually. The more you add at once, the larger the strain on your bacterial colonies, and the more likely you are to have an ammonia or nitrite spike (shortly after adding the lot of fish). However, adding 4 rasbora's weeks apart should be just fine. I recommend adding about 1/8th the total stocking limit at a time, and to do so at 1.5 - 2 week intervals. (the 1/8th thing is relevant - If it's smaller than 50G, I'd add no more than 3-4 at a time, larger than 55g, and 6-7 at a time shouldn't be too many either).

Thanks, I might give it one more week to see if there is any change going on. Patience is not my strength lol

 

Thanks, I might give it one more week to see if there is any change going on. Patience is not my strength lol

If patience is a problem, just something to think about. . .

I have nothing against fish-in cycles, but it requires MUCH more work and likely more patience than a fishless cycle. At least in my experience, I haven't noticed any or much of a difference in the time it takes to cycle when you're doing fishless vs. fish-in cycles.

The biggest difference is that you'll need to test your water parameters daily and will likely need to do partial water changes daily (if not daily, VERY often) when you're doing a fish-in cycle.

Edit to add: What are you using as an ammonia source?

 

What size is the tank?
And did you add a bacterial starter like Tetra safe start and an ammonia source to feed the bacteria?

 

Buy a bottle of Seachem Stability and add your fish today.
Just read the directions.
You can actually add fish the very first day according to the instructions. It makes perfect sense. The bacteria needs a food source. Your fish will provide it.
I will never wait again for a tank to cycle.
I will fill it, start treating with stability and go get some fish and put them right in.

 

Tank is 90l. I've been adding food twice daily to create the ammonia. The tank was second hand so its possible that the gravel and filter already had bacteria in it? (or would it all have died or if the water)?

 

Tank is 90l. I've been adding food twice daily to create the ammonia. The tank was second hand so its possible that the gravel and filter already had bacteria in it? (or would it all have died or if the water)?

Maybe.

Was the tank empty or did it have fish in it when or soon before you got the tank?

If it was empty, how long before you got it was the tank emptied?

Sorry if this was already asked, but what is the pH of your water?

 

Not sure of how long the tank was empty. Couple of weeks maybe.

PH is 5

 

Not sure of how long the tank was empty. Couple of weeks maybe.

PH is 5

Your pH could be the problem. pH levels that low can stall or even stop the cycling process.

Have you heard about using crushed coral to increase and stabilize pH?

 

No, do you have a link? I have been told that water in my area is low PH (the aquarium store is as low as 2 naturally)
OK, looks like an idea.

Do I need to add the crushed coral regularly or just once?

50g looks like enough for 90litre tank?
OK, looks like an idea.

Do I need to add the crushed coral regularly or just once?

50g looks like enough for 90litre tank?

 

No, do you have a link? I have been told that water in my area is low PH (the aquarium store is as low as 2 naturally)

Add a small amount (half a cup or a cup) of crushed coral to a fine media bag, rinse it very well and place it in your filter.

Let it run for a day or so and test again. Add more if the amount you added hasn’t raised the pH closer to 7.

I just refreshed the crushed coral in my 75 gallon. The first batch was in there for about 18 months.

 

Ok before you start chasing your ph. What is the ph of the tap water?

 

Not sure, think it is low
My testing strips only go as low as 6.4 so I took a tank sample to the aquarium where he got a reading of 5. Its only a few miles away. He said their tap water is 2
Why add it to the filter rather than the substrate?

 

Ph of 5 and 2 are extremely low! Could he have been giving you gh or kh? Think you needs to get a api liquid test kit to get accurate tests.

 

Hi Welcome to FishLore!!

You have 3 threads going on about this tank cycling? It's best to stick to one. That way you and everyone else isn't jumping around to see what has been asked and what has been suggested.

I hesitate to merge since the replies would be out of sinc.

Looks like you're in good hands with the advice.
Patience has been mentioned. Cycling without bacteria boosters or seeded filter media can take 6-8 so hang in there!

 

Thanks, I did think 2 seemed ridiculously low.

Would adding the coral do any harm to stabilise the PH?

 

Thanks, I did think 2 seemed ridiculously low.

Would adding the coral do any harm to stabilise the PH?

As 86 ssinit suggested, I’d start by making sure you’re getting accurate test results.

 

Thanks, and sorry about that, please feel free to merge.

I've added a bacteria booster now. Will look into getting a liquid testing kit to add to the ammonia one I bought. Hopefully it gets a bit easier once the fish are in and the bacteria is up to speed

 

Ok I read your other threads. Lots of stuff. Looks like a 25g tank you got from someone with gravel and a filter. Did you rinse out the gravel and was the filter cleaned before reusing?
Nothing would live in that ph. So no you can’t add fish till you test correctly.

 

Rasboras live in as low as PH 4 in the wild, so not sure I agree that nothing would live in 5. Yes I did clean the gravel (probably shouldn't have, but felt slimey)

 

No cleaning the gravel was a good move. Did you clean the filter? Maybe in the wild rasboras live in that low of a ph but our store bought ones have been raised in a much higher ph. Where are you located?

 

West Yorkshire.

Yes I cleaned the filter. Do I need to change the actual filter pads? I had read to not put new ones in all at once (I have not yet opened the filter)

 

Ok so it’s a canister filter? You haven’t opened since you started the tank? But you cleaned out what’s in it before you used it?

 

Rasboras live in as low as PH 4 in the wild, so not sure I agree that nothing would live in 5. Yes I did clean the gravel (probably shouldn't have, but felt slimey)

Well, yes, but bacteria would take an extremely long time to establish in that ph. Anything below 6.8 and they start to slow down a bit, so 5 would be very tough for cycling.

Also, how do the fish at your store possibly survive with a ph of 2? Vinegar has a ph of 2!

 

Hello, welcome to Fishlore!

It's quite important that you are sure of your parameters and not just judging by what you think they might be. I'm not trying to be rude whatsoever, but I strongly recommend testing them yourself with a master testing kit. Sometimes you can have experienced fish stores test your water, but most of the time pet stores just use test strips that aren't entirely accurate and often don't provide all the test results that you need.

I understand that the wild fish may have been living in a lower pH level than most of us are accustomed to, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea to replicate that in the aquarium. The fish weren't caught directly from the wild, they have been bred many times and the offspring is what you are getting when you buy from a store. So, it's very important that the pH remains closer to a neutral level so that all the fish you plan to add to the tank are able to adapt properly to your water.

 

I wasn't meaning that 5 was the right level, just wanted to respond to the 'nothing can live' comment which is not true.

The store said they had to treat the water due to low PH so wasn't a tank of vinegar.

I washed the filter, didn't open it up so the inside bits will be as they were before I bought it.

Schoolboy error? What would you suggest I do with the filter?

No idea what make it is etc - tall light blue thing that attached to the side of the tank. Seems to be working fine in terms of water in and out, but obviously I am not sure about the inside bits
Interpet Internal Aquarium Fish Tank PF1 Power Filter, Cleans Water, for Coldwater & Tropical Aquariums Up to 68 Litre: Amazon.co.uk: Pet Supplies

The filter is this one I think
So plan of action

Test PH (Litmus paper does this right)?
If low, add Crushed Coral (50g)

Inspect inside of filter?

 

Ok your new. Yes things can live in some pretty amazing places and in some pretty harsh conditions. The average fish keeper doesn’t keep these types of fish. So when I said nothing I meant nothing we would put in a tank . Or your local pet store would sell.

Tap water is a lot different for people in the UK. Yours is the first I’ve heard of ph that low.

As to your filter you said you washed it. Was it takin apart and the media inside cleaned or replaced. Also clean out the impeller and the place where it spins.

That low of a ph is a problem it means you must add to the water to get the ph up. Whatever you add needs to keep it stable. So you will have to monitor the tank a lot. These products break down and your ph will drop. So it’s best to get a master kit for testing not the test strips. I would also talk to local fish keepers to find out how they do it and what’s best.

 

I'm now not convinced that the shop measured the PH properly. He claimed that their tap water was PH 2, that is illegal.

I'm going to buy a API testing kit and some new filters/carbons for the filter. When I cleaned it, I didn't pull it apart, I think I clearly need to do this. Am I right in saying that I shouldn't change all the filter pads at once?

Thanks for all the helpful advice

 

After finding this forum, I decided to go for the fishless cycle method (despite various other sites promoting cycling WITH fish).

After 2 weeks, my ammonia rating is under 0.2mg/l (second lowest on the liquid testing kit)

Nitrite is at 6mg/l - 7mg/l (second lowest on test strip)

Nitrate is 0

I don't seem to be seeing any change. I am thinking I might add 4 harlequin rasboras to help the cycle along. Thoughts?

Also, in a few more weeks I plan to add 4 more rasboras (making 8 in total) - and then 8 neon tetra a few loaches and a betta. Do I need to add them slowly (i.e would 8 tetras at once be too much and upset the cyle?)

I'm jealous

 

Well its like this the tank isn’t cycled anyway so changing them out doesn’t make a difference. Unfortunately you may be starting all over. But now you’ve got a better idea. Get what you need to start the filter new. Get your test kit and see how your water is. See how your tap water is. Do all tests on both. What comes out of the tap is your stable water what’s in the tank now may be what your water will be after how long you’ve had it running. So you will see what is changing from tap to tank over time. It’s always best to keep your tank water as close to your tap if you can. If you have good tap water. Now if your tap water isn’t good you will need to do stuff to make it work. But first the tests .

 

Thanks, I will change them all. I've also bought some quick start to try and speed things along

 

Update: Got a PH testing kit. Tap water is 6.8PH - Tank is 6.6 so no idea what the guy in the shop was measuring

 

Update: Got a PH testing kit. Tap water is 6.8PH - Tank is 6.6 so no idea what the guy in the shop was measuring

Maybe PH or GH?
Muriatic acid has a ph of about 2. I think your fish would disintegrate in that water lol

 

There you go . That pet store should now be avoided . Ok for more experimenting fill a bucket with tap water. Test it today and again 24 hrs later. With everything you added to your tank the reading can’t be trusted. And this will tell you if your ph is going up after sitting. A ph of 6.8 is fine and great for many fish. Your water with prime should be fine for your tank. Now it would be a good time to do a big water change 75%. Clean the media in the filter. If it looks shot replace. If decent keep.
I know the test kits get expensive. They are much cheaper if bought online. Did you buy the master set?

 

Not got the full test kit yet, bought the ammonia one, will use up the strips first then invest. Ordered new filter pads so will change with a water change when they arrive.