Rams...spawning again.

dking271
  • #1
Rams...spawning again. Update w/ Pics

My Rams spawning as I type this thread. This will be their third attempt, but the first in their very own breeding tank. The first spawn resulted in 7 wigglers, one of which almost made it to free swimming. They were the result of removing approx. 15 eggs from the community tank. The second spawn was taken by my cories, which came from all sides and really stressed the parents. They both really seem to know what they are doing, which is often unusual with Ram pairs. I'm hoping this attempt in the tank by themselves will be successful and less stressful on the two of them. They are spawning about every eleven days.

Update:

I have approx 100-150 eggs. I have the main tank light off and have placed lunar lights on. I have found that running lunar lights makes them less prone to spook and eat their eggs during the night.
 
COBettaCouple
  • #2
Good luck with this spawning.
 
Lucy
  • #3
Wow, cool. Can you get some pics?
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #4
I'll try to get pics in the morning. I have the temp set at 83, so they should hatch a little quicker than they did in the community which is set at 81.
 
Butterfly
  • #5
Congrats! Do you find the wigglers and free swimmers to be smaller if the eggs hatch in a shorter period of time?
Carol
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #6
Congrats! Do you find the wigglers and free swimmers to be smaller if the eggs hatch in a shorter period of time?
Carol

No, they seem to be the same size. The slightly higher temps just help the eggs develop faster. If you boost the temp too high, you run into O2 problems. The biggest problem with the Ram fry, is their mouths are too small for BBS, and they have to be fed microworms and infusoria for the first few days.
 
Butterfly
  • #7
No, they seem to be the same size. The slightly higher temps just help the eggs develop faster. If you boost the temp too high, you run into O2 problems. The biggest problem with the Ram fry, is their mouths are too small for BBS, and they have to be fed microworms and infusoria for the first few days.
The reason I ask is that when the same is done for angelfish the wigglers and so the free swimmers seem to be smaller. Was just curious if it was the same with Rams.
The biggest problem with the Ram fry, is their mouths are too small for BBS, and they have to be fed microworms and infusoria for the first few days.
The one time I had Ram fry I found this to be too true.
Carol
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #8
Update 7/23:

Parents are much more relaxed this time around in the tank by themselves. They are not on constant guard and take turns fanning the eggs. I tried to get photos this morning and was somewhat unsuccessful. We currently have 100+ eggs that look to be fertilized. My only problem is with my weak cycle in the tank. My tank had just crashed the nitrites, when the two were ready to spawn. I made the decision to move the parents even though I would have liked a few more days, because both parents developed a fugus after the last spawn which I believe was brought on by stress.

My readings this morning were as follows:

Ammonia = 0
Nitrite = <.25 (color was barely off blue API)
Nitrates = 5

I elected to do a 50 % water change, which brought the nitrites back to 0. My bacteria colony for the nitrites is still a bit weak. I will continue to monitor this closely and provide water changes as necessary.
 
Butterfly
  • #9
Sounding good! Keep us up dated please and pics when you can
Carol
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #10
Update 7/24

We had about 40-50 eggs hatch out of this batch, and the remainder eggs turned white overnight. The female had dug a pit in the back of the tank in preparation for the young. All of the babies were moved into the pit and are being guarded by both parents. Unfortunately, she picked the one spot where I can not get a camera to easily.

As a side note, it appears the nitrite in my tank has stabilzed. Parameters this morning were as follows:

Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate <5 (almost 5)
PH 7.4
Temp 82.5
 
COBettaCouple
  • #11
Sounds good, I hope the fry have a really high survival rate.
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #12
Update 7/25 - Fry Day 2.

I had what appeared to be trace amounts of ammonia in the tank last night, and did a 50% water change just to be safe. My only guess is the added bio of the unfertilized eggs may have caused a small jump (<.25, perhaps none at all). All parameters are back to perfect and holding. I test the water 2X per day as a precaution.

Baby fry are doing great, both mom and dad are attending to them. All fry are still located in the pit dug by the parents, and they get real active every time either parent is close. I will begin feeding liquid fry food and microworms as early as tomorrow, and start to hatch BBS for early next week. From that point on, 50 % water changes will happen daily.
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #13
Update 7/26 - Fry Day 3

All fry are doing great. I fed them some liquid fry food this morning and this evening. They are developing quite nicely, with their eyes becoming much more visible. I can't really tell if the fry are feeding, but I would rather play it safe.
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #14
Update 7/27 - Fry day 4

Today I have free swimming fry. I squirt a drop of liquid fry food and they started popping up like popcorn. They swim around the parents, then the parents suck them up in their mouth, swish them around, and then spit them back in their pit.

Update - Fry day 4

Fry are swimming around like crazy. Mom and Dad are rounding them up and spitting them back in the pit. I have taken a few crappy pics, will try to get better ones as time permits.

Dad (Bowser)


628.jpg

Mom (Peach) w/ fry


629.jpg

GBR Fry


630.jpg
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #15
Update 7/29 - Fry day 6

Fry are still going strong. Both parents are still taking an active role in rearing the young. The fry follow the parents around the tank, but many get brave venture out forcing both to constantly chase down their young. We are still feeding liquid fry food supplemented with BBS.
 
platy ben
  • #16
Bowsers colours are stunning .

I would like to try breeding rams, what's the minimum tank size for a pair?

Good luck with this, hope all your fry live to be adults
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #17
Minimum recommended tank size is 20 gallons. Unfortunately, the picture does not do him justice. Here is a pick of another of our males that we are struggling to find a girl he will accept.


593.jpg
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #18
Update 7/31 - Fry Day 8

Well we are progressing with the fry, however they do not seem to be growing as quickly as I would like. I think the next couple of days will be crucial. I was hoping to cut back the liquid fry food this weekend, but it is still hard to tell if they are eating the BBS. I have a fresh batch of BBS that should be ready tomorrow afternoon, and will boost the BBS feedings to twice a day.
 
Butterfly
  • #19
Water changes will help them grow faster. Fry put off pheremones which are growth inhibitors and along with keeping Ammonia, nitrites and Nitrates in line it will dilute the growth inhibitors.
Carol
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #20
Update 8/1 - Fry day 9

Thanks about the water changes, we have been doing 50% changes daily. We had a freshly hatched batch of BBS ready today, and it was the first time we saw the fry eating them. Its tough to tell exactly how many babies are in the tank as they move around, but my guess is that we have about 30 +/- down from between 40 and 50. At least twenty five have eaten the BBS. I only see about a half dozen that don't appear to have eaten them.
 
Butterfly
  • #21
When angel fry eat the bbs you can look at them with a magnifying glass and see their tummys bulge and turn orange since freshly hatched bbs are orange. Check the Ram fry out and see if they are the same then share with us
50% water changes are good just thought I would share what I had read and seen to be true in my experience.
Carol
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #22
It is the same when the Rams eat the BBS. I see all but about five with stuffed orange stomachs. Tonight was the first time we actually had them eating the BBS. I feel much better now that I can see them eating. Up until now I could only assume they were getting their nutrients from the liquid fry food. I am confident that they will start to grow at a good pace now.
 
Butterfly
  • #23
That's really cool Thanks! I've been using vitachem in the water with my angel fry and I can really tell a difference in growth/survival rates from now and the past.
Carol
 
COBettaCouple
  • #24
Yea, the vita-chem does seem to help them out a good bit. Such a beautiful pair, those will be stunning fry.
 
lilsoccakid
  • #25
congrats!

I was in the same situation as you,, the corys ate the eggs a couple times from my pair, and really stressed the parents out. unfortunatly, none of the 150 fry per batch (about 5 batches) survived. The frozen BBS were too big, which I didnt know until after

good luck with yours!
 
dking271
  • Thread Starter
  • #26
Update 8/3 - Fry Day 11

What a huge difference in the last two days. The fry go bonkers when I put the BBS in the tank. They seem much more active and have started the growth spurt I anticipated. They are noticably wider and their shape is starting to become more Ram like. They are also starting to swim more freely around the tank at all levels. I would estimate there are still about 30 +/- fry alive and well.


I was in the same situation as you,, the corys ate the eggs a couple times from my pair, and really stressed the parents out. unfortunatly, none of the 150 fry per batch (about 5 batches) survived. The frozen BBS were too big, which I didnt know until after

lilsoccakid,

One of the hardest things with Rams, is the fry are so small BBS cannot fit in there mouths for a few days. I have found that liquid fry food, or home grown infusoria is the only way to get them to a size capable of eating the BBS. Also, I have not found a suitable substitue for live BBS, as they only find interest in the lively ones. It actually is amusing to watch the little guys chase down a BBS that has caught their eye. I have two homemade hatchers going at the moment starting a new batch about every other day.
 

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