Raising koi in a 30?

Jheila
  • #1
I ask about the tanks a lot, but never asked about my pond. It's way larger than a 10,000 gallon pond, and we've been able to keep koi in it. However, baby koi don't last, so we're down to 3 adult koi, along with many wild fish.

Would it be possible to keep "baby" koi in a 30 gallon tank until they are ready for the pond? Will the transition from a filtered to unfiltered, I would dare say even murky, pond be too much?

My 30 gallon currently has two betta (divided of course, though they actually like to switch sides and try to mate) which I'm planning on taking out. It's long and kinda shallow, and has two C4 filters running. It's kept at 80 degrees, while the pond fluctuates.

What size koi could even, for a short time, be happy in a 30? How many?


I'm not too hopeful on this idea, and would gladly make it a giant shrimp tank instead, I just wish our pond had more koi.
 
Bluestreakfl
  • #2
Id say maybe 2-3 at a time, and once theyre 3-4" it would be time to move them, as they could begin to become stunted. Dadio is our pond and koi pro here, so well see what he recommends.
 
Matt68046
  • #3
as long as the temp is the the same dump them in there when they get bigger. Sounds feasable enough to me.
 
Dadio
  • #4
Id say maybe 2-3 at a time, and once theyre 3-4" it would be time to move them, as they could begin to become stunted. Dadio is our pond and koi pro here, so well see what he recommends.

The first question I have is why they're not surviving in the pond as koi if their from a good stock or broodlings from a pair within your pond usually have a good survival rate if the pond parameters are good.

What kind of wild fish are in this pond?
Where are you sourcing your koi stock?
What kind of koi?
Are they generic or specific breed?
What size are the ones you try to introduce to the pond?
Does your pond have filtration or is it just a mud pond?

Depending on their age and under optimum conditions Koi can grow over 2 centimeters (almost an inch) per month or faster.

The most important factor when introducing new Koi into a pond is equalizing the temperature of the bag water with the water in the pond. A sudden temperature change will interfere with your Koi's metabolism and could possibly result in death or sickness being brought on. Slowly acclimating the fish will allow their metabolism to accommodate the change in temperature.

Koi can withstand around a 20 F degree temperature swing during acclimation. A larger difference in temperature should be avoided. It's easier for a Koi to adjust to a warmer temperature than for it to adjust to a colder temperature.

You could with a 30 gallon and heavy filtration keep not more than 12 fingerlings up to 6 months then transfer them to the pond once 1.5 - 2 in. If buying fingerlings you need to look for good body shapes and not skinny or out of proportion.

Feed them good food 2-4 times a day. I highly recommend HikarI as not only is it imo the best food, it also builds a strong immunity which is crucial in the early part of their growth. You need to keep their water clean and in good parameters to insure they get a good start.
 
hampalong
  • #5
A koi pond should be filtered. Maybe it's at its maximum stocking level for an unfiltered pond. This would mean fry don't survive. Or they could be getting eaten by the other fish.

Also koi fry need warm water for the first few weeks. I don't know where you are but it might be too cold?
 
Jheila
  • Thread Starter
  • #6
The first question I have is why they're not surviving in the pond as koi if their from a good stock or broodlings from a pair within your pond usually have a good survival rate if the pond parameters are good.

What kind of wild fish are in this pond?
Where are you sourcing your koi stock?
What kind of koi?
Are they generic or specific breed?
What size are the ones you try to introduce to the pond?
Does your pond have filtration or is it just a mud pond?
.
Our pond is basically a mud pond. We had it built a while back and it spans the entire width of our yard, which is two acres. It mainly has turtles, sunfish, and catfish. I myself blame the tutles, as no fish have made it to adulthood, except for the catfish which boomed last summer. Before, we would get our koi from a local feed store, they were I would say a foot long? Those guys survived until a heron came. Then we were left with I think 5 adultish koi. For a while, the babies would last until 6-9 inches, where they died when it got cold (I live in Florida, so it didn't freeze over) I think they're generic koi. I'm looking to raise imported ones in the 30.

I'm trying to get something to filter the pond, but its really big. All the ones I've seen max out at around 1,000, so I would need around 15 of those.
 
Jheila
  • Thread Starter
  • #7
A koi pond should be filtered. Maybe it's at its maximum stocking level for an unfiltered pond. This would mean fry don't survive. Or they could be getting eaten by the other fish.

Also koi fry need warm water for the first few weeks. I don't know where you are but it might be too cold?

Hm, we live in Florida, but these past winters have been colder than usual?
I know that the wild fish are flourishing, mostly the catfish. I can't tell with the current fish we have, but maybe all the koi we have now are male or female?
 
Dadio
  • #8
Ok, so let me get my thinking cap on as I'm sure I will find a way to give it filtration without major major cost. Need photos of the pond.

As for getting too cold where you are, I'm in northern Alberta and my koi survive the winters here. So it's not the cold, Turtles are my guess and may a portion of the pond can be protected from them and other preds to raise the young koi till 8 ins or more before release.
 
Jheila
  • Thread Starter
  • #9
Ok, so let me get my thinking cap on as I'm sure I will find a way to give it filtration without major major cost. Need photos of the pond.

As for getting too cold where you are, I'm in northern Alberta and my koi survive the winters here. So it's not the cold, Turtles are my guess and may a portion of the pond can be protected from them and other preds to raise the young koi till 8 ins or more before release.


tumblr_nqrrdoFQcr1r9cb72o2_1280.jpg

tumblr_nqrrdoFQcr1r9cb72o1_1280.jpg

There are actually more koi than I originally thought! One of the oldest, which is around a foot and a half, and lots of young ones that are around 8 inches.

There were lots of minnows, maybe the baby koi are just unlucky?

Also I should note the pond is at an all time low, its usually around 3 feet higher
 
hampalong
  • #10
Don't forget the catfish. If they're flourishing they must be on a good diet.
 
Dadio
  • #11
View attachment 171916
View attachment 171917

There are actually more koi than I originally thought! One of the oldest, which is around a foot and a half, and lots of young ones that are around 8 inches.

There were lots of minnows, maybe the baby koi are just unlucky?

Also I should note the pond is at an all time low, its usually around 3 feet higher

Ok, so your main problem is no circulation, aeration or filtration of any kind, not even bog filtration from what I can see.

So, I'd be in heaven landscaping this. One of the first things I'd look at is creating a water feature that is practical and eye candy at the same time. Just adding a waterfall with a bog filter alone would greatly improve everything. Using a high capacity pump you can achieve this quite easily. You'd need to take in affect the low water line and build it up from there. Some pond liner, rocks, plants and it could be a waterfall into a flowing stream back to the pond. This could be built to hold a bog pond at the upper level flowing the water into the bog pond via the stream. Lots of things could be done simply but with a little back work. Point is, it needs aeration and circulation of some sort. Even if a jet feature was added to the centre via a large pump, that alone creates movement and aeration. But if you intend for koi there's a lot to think about, especially where you are and the local predators.
 
Jheila
  • Thread Starter
  • #12
Ok, so your main problem is no circulation, aeration or filtration of any kind, not even bog filtration from what I can see.

So, I'd be in heaven landscaping this. One of the first things I'd look at is creating a water feature that is practical and eye candy at the same time. Just adding a waterfall with a bog filter alone would greatly improve everything. Using a high capacity pump you can achieve this quite easily. You'd need to take in affect the low water line and build it up from there. Some pond liner, rocks, plants and it could be a waterfall into a flowing stream back to the pond. This could be built to hold a bog pond at the upper level flowing the water into the bog pond via the stream. Lots of things could be done simply but with a little back work. Point is, it needs aeration and circulation of some sort. Even if a jet feature was added to the centre via a large pump, that alone creates movement and aeration. But if you intend for koi there's a lot to think about, especially where you are and the local predators.

I'm not entirely sure what a bog filter is. From the pictures, its like a gravel filter?

Like these waterfountain filters? Just bigger I assume?
 
Dadio
  • #13
I'm not entirely sure what a bog filter is. From the pictures, its like a gravel filter?

Like these waterfountain filters? Just bigger I assume?

That type won't work for the size of the pond you have and you'd be cleaning it every other day. So, what you need is this



and for a pond pump, you would need this unit



You could also should add an aerator and large diffuser stone.

The waterfall weir handles up to a 10000g output which this pump will deliver.

A bog filter is just that, a type of porous gravelled planted area that allows flow threw it.

I've built waterfall features that incorporate in part a bog areas so there's a few ways you can go about this. The falls area can be surrounded by bog plants or a running stream can be built to also have bog plants along the edges.
 
Jheila
  • Thread Starter
  • #14
That type won't work for the size of the pond you have and you'd be cleaning it every other day. So, what you need is this



and for a pond pump, you would need this unit



You could also should add an aerator and large diffuser stone.

The waterfall weir handles up to a 10000g output which this pump will deliver.

A bog filter is just that, a type of porous gravelled planted area that allows flow threw it.

I've built waterfall features that incorporate in part a bog areas so there's a few ways you can go about this. The falls area can be surrounded by bog plants or a running stream can be built to also have bog plants along the edges.

Thanks for the links!

I'll be looking for a diffuse stone, do I need a airline tube like how it is for aquariums, or is the hookup direct?
 
Jheila
  • Thread Starter
  • #15
Would an air pump like this work?
 
Dadio
  • #16
Would an air pump like this work?

Yes, that will work and use the same rubber grade hose for aquariums.
 
Flowergarden129
  • #17
You might also try looking at Luc70's very lengthy thread on MonsterFishKeepers. He built a huge pond in Thailand, and talks in a lot of detail about the way he built his filters, including bog filters.
 
Dadio
  • #18
You might also try looking at Luc70's very lengthy thread on MonsterFishKeepers. He built a huge pond in Thailand, and talks in a lot of detail about the way he built his filters, including bog filters.

Read his thoughts, nicely done as well. Point with pond building is most dig a hole, hook up equipment and think it's all good, not so.

Using the equipment to go beyond it's normal setup is also part of it. Take my 3200g plus pond, it uses varying depths, grades and divisions providing an optimal flow/current to aid in filtration, but more so to create a healthy and stimulating environment for my koi. Koi are extremely intelligent, yet they give you the impression their not until they begin to trust you, once this bond is created they not only show you how intelligent they are, but will test your own intelligence on many levels. When I built my very first pond it was like 80% of what ponds are, a hole, a pump and a little water feature. Over the years I have played with many concepts, diy, and out of the box type of builds. When you achieve a pond that works for you and gives back the stimulI that the creatures you keep need the difference is a whole new world.

When I consult with people for ponds the very first questions I ask is about their views of family and life in general as this helps me see the long-term towards designing a pond for them. If I sense it's a dead-end pool so to speak I am quite honest with them and let them know a pond is not for them. Ponds done wrong can be a nightmare and your dealing with more then just a square glass enclosure as you've just made a large hole. So doing it right the first time will surely save you the headaches down the road.
 
Flowergarden129
  • #19
That's why I'm trying to set up an indoor-outdoor setup for my turtle (from other thread). I feel like she is entitled to have a more natural environment, where she has more area to roam and explore, and where she can move around different kinds of terrain of her own volition. I'm hoping eventually to set it up so she can also explore the garden protected but of her own free will (instead of waiting for us to take her out). I feel like that's the only way to have the keeping of caged animals be acceptable.
 

Similar Aquarium Threads

  • Locked
  • Toxickissez20
  • Koi
Replies
9
Views
1K
sranderson4
  • Locked
  • Flowingfins
  • Koi
Replies
16
Views
2K
Dadio
  • Locked
Replies
29
Views
3K
Dadio
  • Locked
  • xenabrat
  • Koi
Replies
18
Views
23K
Doug
Replies
30
Views
3K
Peacefantasy
Top Bottom