Possible cycle crash? Please help!

I had started a 10g fish in cycle about 3 weeks ago. Cycled with 2 guppies. Using TSS+ I was cycled in about 5 days (0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, .10 nitrates)
I have added 2 African dwarf frogs as of last week. 1 is very plump and active, the other very tiny and mostly hiding. Anyway, when I added them I added another 3 capfuls of TSS hoping it would help adjust the new bio load. 2 days ago, I noticed the guppies glass surfing and both frogs were hiding constantly. Tested water using API master kit. I had the following readings:
high level pH: 7 Ammonia: b/w 0.5-1.0 ppm Nitrite: 0 Nitrate: b/w 5-10 ppm. I promptly did a 50% water change with full dose Prime for the 10g. Everyone literally came back to life. Frogs out hunting, fish swimming and playing again!

I tested again today and the following readings:
Ammonia: 1.0 Nitrate:0 Nitrate: 0.5. I don’t have the regular pH test but used a strip and it shows a very week reading of about 6.0. I did a 30% water change with prime dosed (20 drops).
My long winded question is - did I crash the cycle?
Should I just continue testing and wc daily until the ammonia goes down? I find it alarming that it rose higher after the water change. My untreated water reads at 0 across the board so I’m confused.
lastly, is it too late to treat this as a new tank and add another whole bottle of TSS+? (I’m resisting the urge to panic and start adding a ton of stuff as my little frogs are sensitive)
Thank you in advance for any help

 

You cycled your tank to handle the bioload of 2 guppies. You now have a larger bioload and your biofilter (bacteria) can't keep up with it. You probably did not crash your cycle, it's just overwhelmed and needs time to grow enough to handle the new bioload. In the mean time, continue as a normal fish-in cycle.

With a fishless cycle you can grow the biofilter to handle any bioload you want, but with fish-in cycling you limited and must add new inhabitants slowly.

 

Using TSS+ I was cycled in about 5 days

I am suspicious of this assessment. Using TSS+ I was cycled only after 7-8 long weeks. It takes weeks to grow the second-stage of nitrifying bacteria. <1 week "cycle completed" stories are usually about people with tanks or filters that had been in use recently, and were already seeded.

You should expect to do 50% water changes up to 2x daily for several weeks until the cycle is complete, regardless of what bottled products you add (I believe they are a waste of money, after testing several). I am 6 weeks into cycling a 29G and nitrite still goes to 1+ every day, unless I do 2 water changes of 50% every day. This is expected. There's only one modestly sized fish in the tank.

 

Using TSS+ I was cycled only after 7-8 long weeks. I am suspicious of this assessment. It takes weeks to grow the second-stage of nitrifying bacteria. <1 week "cycle completed" stories are always about people with tanks or filters that had been in use recently, and were already seeded.

You should expect to 50% water changes up to 2x daily until the cycle is complete, regardless of what bottled products you add (I believe they are a waste of money, after testing several). I am 6 weeks into cycling a 29G and nitrite still goes to 1+ every day with just one non-large fish. This is expecte

Using TSS+ I was cycled only after 7-8 long weeks. I am suspicious of this assessment. It takes weeks to grow the second-stage of nitrifying bacteria. <1 week "cycle completed" stories are usually about people with tanks or filters that had been in use recently, and were already seeded.

You should expect to do 50% water changes up to 2x daily for several weeks until the cycle is complete, regardless of what bottled products you add (I believe they are a waste of money, after testing several). I am 6 weeks into cycling a 29G and nitrite still goes to 1+ every day with just one non-large fish. This is expected.

Okay. So first - thank you for your reply! Am I on the right track then?? Daily testing and water changes until I am registering 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and trace nitrates?

You cycled your tank to handle the bioload of 2 guppies. You now have a larger bioload and your biofilter (bacteria) can't keep up with it. You probably did not crash your cycle, it's just overwhelmed and needs time to grow enough to handle the new bioload. In the mean time, continue as a normal fish-in cycle.

With a fishless cycle you can grow the biofilter to handle any bioload you want, but with fish-in cycling you limited and must add new inhabitants slowly.

Thank you for your reply. Am I on the right track? Daily testing and water changes? (I do not plan to add any additional creatures. Two frogs, 2 guppies is all I wanted.)

 

I had started a 10g fish in cycle about 3 weeks ago. Cycled with 2 guppies. Using TSS+ I was cycled in about 5 days (0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, .10 nitrates)
I have added 2 African dwarf frogs as of last week. 1 is very plump and active, the other very tiny and mostly hiding. Anyway, when I added them I added another 3 capfuls of TSS hoping it would help adjust the new bio load. 2 days ago, I noticed the guppies glass surfing and both frogs were hiding constantly. Tested water using API master kit. I had the following readings:
high level pH: 7 Ammonia: b/w 0.5-1.0 ppm Nitrite: 0 Nitrate: b/w 5-10 ppm. I promptly did a 50% water change with full dose Prime for the 10g. Everyone literally came back to life. Frogs out hunting, fish swimming and playing again!

I tested again today and the following readings:
Ammonia: 1.0 Nitrate:0 Nitrate: 0.5. I don’t have the regular pH test but used a strip and it shows a very week reading of about 6.0. I did a 30% water change with prime dosed (20 drops).
My long winded question is - did I crash the cycle?
Should I just continue testing and wc daily until the ammonia goes down? I find it alarming that it rose higher after the water change. My untreated water reads at 0 across the board so I’m confused.
lastly, is it too late to treat this as a new tank and add another whole bottle of TSS+? (I’m resisting the urge to panic and start adding a ton of stuff as my little frogs are sensitive)
Thank you in advance for any help

As others have said, it seems that your bacteria aren't present in numbers to handle the increased bio load rather than a cycle crash. Be prepared for the nitrites to rise after the ammonia disappears. Keep dosing with Prime to protect the stock you have and stay on top of the water changes to keep the levels of both low.

 

As others have said, it seems that your bacteria aren't present in numbers to handle the increased bio load rather than a cycle crash. Be prepared for the nitrites to rise after the ammonia disappears. Keep dosing with Prime to protect the stock you have and stay on top of the water changes to keep the levels of both low.

Thank you for the reply! So you think once a day water changes if around 30% will be sufficient? Any thoughts on adding more TSS+ to the tank?

Thank you for the reply! So you think once a day water changes if around 30% will be sufficient? Any thoughts on adding more TSS+ to the tank?

I should also note - the tank is also moderately planted. I have quite a bit of floating plants (mini water lettuce and spirulina minima) as well as Java ferns and some moneywart

 

Thank you for the reply! So you think once a day water changes if around 30% will be sufficient? Any thoughts on adding more TSS+ to the tank?

I would aim for whatever water change keeps the levels of ammonia and nitrite under .25ppm. So if the higher of the two is .5, then a 50% water change (assuming your water is 0ppm) My nitrites went crazy when I first added stock (between 1-5ppm) and between the water changes and Prime I suffered no losses and my fish were in fact quite active. I used Dr Tims One and Only as well as QuickStart, and I didn't see any benefit. My tank took 4-5 weeks to cycle, just as it would have if I just dosed ammonia. If I start another tank, I'm going to go with seeded media and skip the bacteria products. I'm a newb, so if anyone disagrees with my advice, by all means listen, but this is MY experience.
EDIT: I have heard that TSS+ is the favored product when it comes to bottled bacteria, but I don't have any personal experience with it.

 

So I just came across another thread here about re-starting with TSS+ and I see that blue light can create issues with bacteria. I just got a NICREW light that has full spectrum LED and I have been leaving the blue light on overnight for my frogs. Could this be what is slowing up my bacteria????

 

I doubt the light is a problem. BBA lkes blue light, but it has to be bright. If it's a "moonlight" like some lights have, it should be fine.

Okay. So first - thank you for your reply! Am I on the right track then?? Daily testing and water changes until I am registering 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and trace nitrates?

Thank you for your reply. Am I on the right track? Daily testing and water changes? (I do not plan to add any additional creatures. Two frogs, 2 guppies is all I wanted.)

Yes you are on the right track. The tests will tell you what to do.

 

So I just came across another thread here about re-starting with TSS+ and I see that blue light can create issues with bacteria. I just got a NICREW light that has full spectrum LED and I have been leaving the blue light on overnight for my frogs. Could this be what is slowing up my bacteria????

Nothing is slowing up your bacteria.. it just hasn't grown yet. You have to do lots of water changes, it is urgent for your frogs. When ever ammonia or nitrites go over .50 a water change needs to be done. You can't go by a % a day right now.

Don't worry about testing Nitrate right now. Water changes are going to keep it low anyway. It may be a couple times a day for the WC's.

Bottle bacteria is not "magic in a bottle" even though it says it is. No cycle will ever be complete after 5 days. (unless you added a whole seeded filter, or a good amount of media as other have said) You are just seeing what a uncycled tank does. 2 guppies probably didnt start to produce enough ammonia until after the 5 days. Then when more fish were added it started to build.

How did you come to the conclusion that it was cycled after 5 days? Just curious.

 

I would aim for whatever water change keeps the levels of ammonia and nitrite under .25ppm. So if the higher of the two is .5, then a 50% water change (assuming your water is 0ppm) My nitrites went crazy when I first added stock (between 1-5ppm) and between the water changes and Prime I suffered no losses and my fish were in fact quite active. I used Dr Tims One and Only as well as QuickStart, and I didn't see any benefit. My tank took 4-5 weeks to cycle, just as it would have if I just dosed ammonia. If I start another tank, I'm going to go with seeded media and skip the bacteria products. I'm a newb, so if anyone disagrees with my advice, by all means listen, but this is MY experience.
EDIT: I have heard that TSS+ is the favored product when it comes to bottled bacteria, but I don't have any personal experience with it.

I can't disagree with anything you said,. I did it the hard way many years back, waterchange water change water change, and when in doubt, waterchange again. watch the fish for any behavior change as a signal theres a problem and do a water change.

Now a days a single fish, dose the prime every 40 hours or so, just before hour 48, and do a water change anytime I'm getting close to hitting 1ppm which the prime covers. 1 month, 3 weeks if lucky and I can maintain pH8 and 82F. keeping it low is a small colony though, and again slow stocking, one fish here, one fish there. so the colony sizes up for the load without being overloaded. but at pH 8 and 82F, the colony is doubling every 15 hours as long as there's waste to feed it.

I know people like the fishless cycle, and in all honestly it's a better method than fish in cycle, easier for beginners and bigger colony at the end, But I wasn't raised or taught that way. I never used a bacteria booster, however I do jump start tanks off ot other tanks media nowadays and try to avoid the whole cycle thing completely.

 

Nothing is slowing up your bacteria.. it just hasn't grown yet. You have to do lots of water changes, it is urgent for your frogs. When ever ammonia or nitrites go over .50 a water change needs to be done. You can't go by a % a day right now.

Don't worry about testing Nitrate right now. Water changes are going to keep it low anyway. It may be a couple times a day for the WC's.

Bottle bacteria is not "magic in a bottle" even though it says it is. No cycle will ever be complete after 5 days. (unless you added a whole seeded filter, or a good amount of media as other have said) You are just seeing what a uncycled tank does. 2 guppies probably didnt start to produce enough ammonia until after the 5 days. Then when more fish were added it started to build.

How did you come to the conclusion that it was cycled after 5 days? Just curious.

I thank you for this. I don’t know how to ask for what I need to learn and I understand every tank is different. I feel like I just start to get it down and then I get lost in the forum and start second guessing myself.
Re: thinking I was cycled: I had a previous post where I questioned whether I might be cycled (I had 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and 10 nitrate holding steady for about 3 days) and a couple people said I was for the current load of 2 guppies. May I just ask so I’m clear in my mind: I test first thing in the morning, do a 50% wc. Should I test again in the evening before bed and do another wc? I ask because my mind tells me that Prime should have some time to work but I will clearly defer to your expertise. Clearly my own logic isn’t working for fish keeping!!!

 

I agree with what is said in the posts above. I'm a big fan of stability and prime in combination to keep your fish safe as the cycle is completed as well as hastened with the use of stability. You definitely have a mini cycle on your hands. I've been successful with the stability and prime combo every time.

Dose the stability every day and the prime every other day while doing water changes every 5th day. Test consistently each day. That's my advice. Good luck.

 

I thank you for this. I don’t know how to ask for what I need to learn and I understand every tank is different. I feel like I just start to get it down and then I get lost in the forum and start second guessing myself.
Re: thinking I was cycled: I had a previous post where I questioned whether I might be cycled (I had 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and 10 nitrate holding steady for about 3 days) and a couple people said I was for the current load of 2 guppies. May I just ask so I’m clear in my mind: I test first thing in the morning, do a 50% wc. Should I test again in the evening before bed and do another wc? I ask because my mind tells me that Prime should have some time to work but I will clearly defer to your expertise. Clearly my own logic isn’t working for fish keeping!!!

Yes you could do another water change in the evening if your ammonia and nitrite combined are over 1ppm. That means over .50 ammonia and/or over .50 nitrite. This is what the Prime will help you with. 1 ppm of combined. Anything over that will start to be harmful. Its all about your tests right now and changing the necessary water. With your frogs it is a little more crucial than it is for the guppies.

Did you test your tap water for Nitrate? Curious on that too.

 

I thank you for this. I don’t know how to ask for what I need to learn and I understand every tank is different. I feel like I just start to get it down and then I get lost in the forum and start second guessing myself.
Re: thinking I was cycled: I had a previous post where I questioned whether I might be cycled (I had 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and 10 nitrate holding steady for about 3 days) and a couple people said I was for the current load of 2 guppies. May I just ask so I’m clear in my mind: I test first thing in the morning, do a 50% wc. Should I test again in the evening before bed and do another wc? I ask because my mind tells me that Prime should have some time to work but I will clearly defer to your expertise. Clearly my own logic isn’t working for fish keeping!!!

You mentioned your previous post. If you recall, here’s what I said in that post. . . Even IF your tank is cycled, it’s only cycled to handle the bioload of 2 guppies. I also suggested you stock your tank slowly.

I’ve never kept frogs, so I have no idea how much waste they produce. That said, you potentially doubled (or more?) the bioload in your tank when you added the frogs. If that’s true, the beneficial bacteria just needs some time to catch up with the increased bioload.

For whatever it’s worth, I think you’re doing everything possible at this point. Continue to test daily and change enough water to keep the combined level of ammonia and nitrites at or below 0.50 ppm. As StarGirl pointed out, Prime is effective up to 1 ppm, but I like 0.50 ppm better.

Keep us posted and good luck.

 

Yes you could do another water change in the evening if your ammonia and nitrite combined are over 1ppm. That means over .50 ammonia and/or over .50 nitrite. This is what the Prime will help you with. 1 ppm of combined. Anything over that will start to be harmful. Its all about your tests right now and changing the necessary water. With your frogs it is a little more crucial than it is for the guppies.

Did you test your tap water for Nitrate? Curious on this too

I did test home water and all 0’s across the board. I just had a new hot water tank installed and I was nervous that there might be something show from that but as I say - everything reads zero.

You mentioned your previous post. If you recall, here’s what I said in that post. . . Even IF your tank is cycled, it’s only cycled to handle the bioload of 2 guppies. I also suggested you stock your tank slowly.

I’ve never kept frogs, so I have no idea how much waste they produce. That said, you potentially doubled (or more?) the bioload in your tank when you added the frogs. If that’s true, the beneficial bacteria just needs some time to catch up with the increased bioload.

For whatever it’s worth, I think you’re doing everything possible at this point. Continue to test daily and change enough water to keep the combined level of ammonia and nitrites at or below 0.50 ppm. As StarGirl pointed out, Prime is effective up to 1 ppm, but I like 0.50 ppm better.

Keep us posted and good luck.

Thank you!! And yes, I swear I took heed of your advice in the previous post! I have admittedly gone too fast with stocking. I will say my 4 fin friends look no worse the wear for all my nonsensical moves. Everyone is eating and swimming casually. My one guppy is kind of my indicator though. He starts surfing the glass and that’s what prompted me to start the frequent testing.

I just tested again tonight and had another ammonia spike. Up to 1.0 ppm. Still 0 nitrites and now 0.5 nitrates. so I just did another 50 wc.

I also think I was miscalculating my prime doses. I have several sizes of syringes because I literally have a zoo in my house and have several sizes. I was using a small dose syringe of only 0.1 ml vs 1 ml. I have read that I can’t really over dose on the Prime so I added 1 ml to each of my gallon buckets each time and filled it.

I feel like I’m doing everything wrong again. I’m sorry to be a pain

 

I did test home water and all 0’s across the board. I just had a new hot water tank installed and I was nervous that there might be something show from that but as I say - everything reads zero.

Thank you!! And yes, I swear I took heed of your advice in the previous post! I have admittedly gone too fast with stocking. I will say my 4 fin friends look no worse the wear for all my nonsensical moves. Everyone is eating and swimming casually. My one guppy is kind of my indicator though. He starts surfing the glass and that’s what prompted me to start the frequent testing.

I just tested again tonight and had another ammonia spike. Up to 1.0 ppm. Still 0 nitrites and now 0.5 nitrates. so I just did another 50 wc.

I also think I was miscalculating my prime doses. I have several sizes of syringes because I literally have a zoo in my house and have several sizes. I was using a small dose syringe of only 0.1 ml vs 1 ml. I have read that I can’t really over dose on the Prime so I added 1 ml to each of my gallon buckets each time and filled it.

I feel like I’m doing everything wrong again. I’m sorry to be a pain

I don’t think you’re doing anything wrong. . .

Keep testing ammonia and nitrites at least once daily, changing enough water to keep the combined level at or below 0.50 ppm and dosing Prime based on the water volume of your tank.

Because you’re using bottled bacteria, don’t be surprised if your tests never show any level of nitrites. I’ve cycled several tanks using bottled bacteria and never showed any nitrites.

Again, keep us posted and come back here with questions.

 

I don’t think you’re doing anything wrong. . .

Keep testing ammonia and nitrites at least once daily, changing enough water to keep the combined level at or below 0.50 ppm and dosing Prime based on the water volume of your tank.

Because you’re using bottled bacteria, don’t be surprised if your tests never show any level of nitrites. I’ve cycled several tanks using bottled bacteria and never showed any nitrites.

Again, keep us posted and come back here with questions.

Thank you for being patient with me. I have Ms and today I am struggling with cog fog in the worst way.
could I trouble you to put my mind at ease with the dosing of Prime? Is it 1 ml for 10 gallons? And a 50 % water change would then be 0.5 ml, etc? (I fear I’ve just doubled my Prime dose to 2ml for 5 gallons. I am certain I’ve read this won’t hurt my fish/frogs and might even be good as my ammonia was so high?)

 

Thank you for being patient with me. I have Ms and today I am struggling with cog fog in the worst way.
could I trouble you to put my mind at ease with the dosing of Prime? Is it 1 ml for 10 gallons? And a 50 % water change would then be 0.5 ml, etc? (I fear I’ve just doubled my Prime dose to 2ml for 5 gallons. I am certain I’ve read this won’t hurt my fish/frogs and might even be good as my ammonia was so high?)

You’re welcome. Your questions are no problem at all! That’s why Fishlore pays us the big bucks.

At least while your tank is cycling, dose Prime based on the entire volume of your tank, not just the amount of water being replaced. So for your 10 gallon tank, dose 1 ml at each water change.

I don’t typically recommend more than a single dose of Prime, but I think your fish and frogs will be fine with your accidental double dose.

 

You’re welcome. Your questions are no problem at all! That’s why Fishlore pays us the big bucks.

At least while your tank is cycling, dose Prime based on the entire volume of your tank, not just the water being replaced. So for your 10 gallon tank, dose 1 ml at each water change.

I don’t typically recommend more than a single dose of Prime, but I think your fish and frogs will be fine with your accidental double dose.

Bless you for the quick reply!! And thank you for clearing this up. My poor brain wants to make this so complicated so I think no more internet for me tonight and I will be back tomorrow with my findings.
(I hope you do get some kick backs for this forum! Or if you do like donations, I’d be very happy to do so!!!)

 

Bless you for the quick reply!! And thank you for clearing this up. My poor brain wants to make this so complicated so I think no more internet for me tonight and I will be back tomorrow with my findings.
(I hope you do get some kick backs for this forum! Or if you do like donations, I’d be very happy to do so!!!)

No kickbacks or donations required. . . We do this because we enjoy it.

Look forward to hearing how things are tomorrow.

 

Update (April 20/22)
I tested as soon as my feet hit the floor this morning.
ammonia: 1.0 ppm
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: between 0-5 ppm
I did 50% wc with 1 ml Prime.
I see no ammonia burns on guppies. They’re being their usual weirdo selves. Brutus (the large ADF) came out for breakfast and to see what was going on. Little Foot seems to be growing and had a little full belly this morning but quickly hid. I found 3 tiny snails on the glass today - they’re really micro so I can’t tell what kind they are. They’re black in color. Kinda cute. Should I leave them?
I really thought with the double dose of Prime I might see less ammonia. Ive purchased some Stability and a whole new API kit as I just now realized I had the saltwater. (MS brain!!!!) I know I can still use it but the cards online weren’t printing out adequately.
some other questions I have: if my test strips for pH can be believed, my regular ph is very low (like 6.0). I’m confused about whether this will help of hurt with respect to ammonia. I’ve read that low pH helps lessen the toxicity in ammonia. Am I in the “safe” zone? Do I need to increase that pH? If so, would crushed coral be advisable with the frogs?
If my ammonia stays at this 1 ppm despite 2x a day wc…where do I go from there?
I’ve also purchased an electric gravel vacuum (Welheim) I know I’ve been over feeding because I’m trying to make sure the frogs are eating. Am I okay to use it after each meal?
so many questions - I’m sorry!!
Oh! And lastly - I’ve mentioned before that I do have plants. My water spangles and water lettuce are looking pretty rough. I also see my Java fern a are starting to develop roots. Any chance this could be creating more ammonia?
my filter is looking pretty funky. I haven’t touched it other than to clean the outside casing (it’s an elite mini submersible) Should I give it a swish in my next water change water?
I’ve attached a few photos of inhabitants. I wanted to make sure I wasn’t seeing ammonia burn in gills. I’ve also included a photo of aforementioned snails for identification!
I’ve also included a photo of my ammonia reading I took just now. This is after a 50% wc this morning around 830am.

 

*sigh* update to my update: my tiny little frog passed away. Flipper in Peace, Little Foot.

 

Only clean the media in your filter when the flow gets really low. Especially during cycling.

Well if your ammonia stays at 1 ppm you have to keep doing water changes. No ifs ands or butts. Part of a fish in cycle to keep your fish safe.

If you have 1 ppm ammonia and no nitrites the Prime should keep them ok. BUT you still have to change water. .50 ppm is way better.

Is your pH still running at 6.0? If so you may want some crushed coral (if safe for frogs) to try to get it closer to 7. Being so low at 6.0 it is helping your fish from the toxicity, but your cycle will take longer.

If you see dead leaves or plants I would remove them, because yes they will cause ammonia.

 

*sigh* update to my update: my tiny little frog passed away. Flipper in Peace, Little Foot.

Sorry the little guy didn’t make it. You still have 1 frog and 2 guppies?

In addition to the advice above from StarGirl, I’d suggest feeding the tank sparingly. How much have you been feeding and do you see any leftover food in the tank?

 

Only clean the media in your filter when the flow gets really low. Especially during cycling.

Well if your ammonia stays at 1 ppm you have to keep doing water changes. No ifs ands or butts. Part of a fish in cycle to keep your fish safe.

If you have 1 ppm ammonia and no nitrites the Prime should keep them ok. BUT you still have to change water. .50 ppm is way better.

Is your pH still running at 6.0? If so you may want some crushed coral (if safe for frogs) to try to get it closer to 7. Being so low at 6.0 it is helping your fish from the toxicity, but your cycle will take longer.

If you see dead leaves or plants I would remove them, because yes they will cause ammonia.

Thank you StarGirl!
I am of course prepared to keep doing water changes for as long, and as many times, as is necessary. I hope my questions didn’t imply otherwise. My question I guess should have been more clear on the ammonia issue; let’s say I continue with the 2x a day water change for 7-10 days and I’m still seeing high levels. What would be a next step remedy? (I ask for preparedness only)

Sorry the little guy didn’t make it. You still have 1 frog and 2 guppies?

In addition to the advice above from StarGirl, I’d suggest feeding the tank sparingly. How much have you been feeding and do you see any leftover food in the tank?

And thank you Dunk2!
Yes, I still have 2 guppies and 1 frog remaining. The little guy was a surprise to my order and was a step away on some plants. He was very emaciated when I finally discovered him and I suspect he just wasn’t eating.
As for my feeding, I was offering a pinch of crushed freshwater flakes, 4-5 frog bites soaked and mashed mid morning and some defrosted brine shrimp in the evening. I kind of let stuff sit to make sure the frogs were eating and then go in with a Turkey baster and pick up stuff I found floating around, siphoning through my net. I also spot clean throughout the day if I see stuff floating around. The fish appear to eat all of it, as was the large frog. She’s always out hunting and eating.

 

Thank you StarGirl!
I am of course prepared to keep doing water changes for as long, and as many times, as is necessary. I hope my questions didn’t imply otherwise. My question I guess should have been more clear on the ammonia issue; let’s say I continue with the 2x a day water change for 7-10 days and I’m still seeing high levels. What would be a next step remedy? (I ask for preparedness only)

And thank you Dunk2!
Yes, I still have 2 guppies and 1 frog remaining. The little guy was a surprise to my order and was a step away on some plants. He was very emaciated when I finally discovered him and I suspect he just wasn’t eating.
As for my feeding, I was offering a pinch of crushed freshwater flakes, 4-5 frog bites soaked and mashed mid morning and some defrosted brine shrimp in the evening. I kind of let stuff sit to make sure the frogs were eating and then go in with a Turkey baster and pick up stuff I found floating around, siphoning through my net. I also spot clean throughout the day if I see stuff floating around. The fish appear to eat all of it, as was the large frog. She’s always out hunting and eating.

Just keep doing water changes when necessary. Thats all the preparedness you need. It will cycle when it cycles there is no set time or days. Every tank is different. Getting the pH up some will help though I think.

 

Just keep doing water changes when necessary. Thats all the preparedness you need. It will cycle when it cycles there is no set time or days. Every tank is different. Getting the pH up some will help though I think.

Okay. Just got my new API freshwater kit. My regular pH is at 7.4! Those strips are just awful!!
I added a 3/4 full bottle of TSS+ around 1pm.

Just tested ammonia again and it’s back up to between the 0.5-1.0 ppm. Given that I’ve added the BB - should I still do the huge water change again tonight?

I also purchased stability. I plan to start using it as well. If I am understanding directions, I can use Prine and Stabikity together, correct?

 

Okay. Just got my new API freshwater kit. My regular pH is at 7.4! Those strips are just awful!!
I added a 3/4 full bottle of TSS+ around 1pm.

Just tested ammonia again and it’s back up to between the 0.5-1.0 ppm. Given that I’ve added the BB - should I still do the huge water change again tonight?

I also purchased stability. I plan to start using it as well. If I am understanding directions, I can use Prine and Stabikity together, correct?

Do you have any decorations in this tank?

StarGirl and I talked about this in another thread. . . Your tank seems to be producing a high level of ammonia. More than I’d expect from your stock and why I asked about your feeding routine earlier.

 

This is my tank.
All decor is aquarium grade.
I had to clip back some of the water lettuce roots as they were getting really scummy
This is the filer I have. I went small and submersible for the frogs because I understood they didn’t like a strong water movement or heavy vibration. This is little but strong. I knew I’d have to rinse the internal filter frequently given it’s size. I do have the original HOB filter that came with this top fin tank. Maybe I should install that instead?
The other two items I’ve shown are things I ordered off Amazon that I couldn’t get at Petsmart; the fine grain white sand and this mushroom decoration.
I can‘t for the life of me think of why this might be occurring.
I’m just gonna keep plugging along and hope.

 

Update #2: I decided it couldn’t hurt to uptake my filtration on the tank. I added the HOB that came with my top fin and am running it simultaneously with the little submersible. I rubbed a bit of the current filter on the new one and then added Stability to the canister as well after I did my 50% water change this morning.
(Ammonia was back up to 1.0 when I tested this morning)

I think I will try to get my hands on some Anubias and hopefully some seed media from a LFS I discovered in town this morning! (as opposed to Petsmart)

As for my snails, I think definitely bladder type. There are 10 in there now but I’ve moved them over to the vampire crabs water
Update #3 - ammonia is still sticking hard at 1.0 ppm. I change it, test it, goes down to 0.5 and then when I test again 6 hours later, it’s back up to 1.0. Change it again

It’s got to be something in my tank right? Would anybody start taking decor out just yet? I thought maybe trying taking out 1 piece a day and seing if that might be it?

does it matter where you take your water sample from in terms of depth of water? I’m taking it from the top where I have floating plants. Could that be it???

I realize this will take some time; that there is no magic solution. I just love these little guys so much and want them to survive!

I hope the bigger water filter will help. I’ve added a sponge to the bottom to keep it down as much as possible for the ADF.

 

I am suspicious of this assessment. Using TSS+ I was cycled only after 7-8 long weeks. It takes weeks to grow the second-stage of nitrifying bacteria. <1 week "cycle completed" stories are usually about people with tanks or filters that had been in use recently, and were already seeded.

You should expect to do 50% water changes up to 2x daily for several weeks until the cycle is complete, regardless of what bottled products you add (I believe they are a waste of money, after testing several). I am 6 weeks into cycling a 29G and nitrite still goes to 1+ every day, unless I do 2 water changes of 50% every day. This is expected. There's only one modestly sized fish in the tank.

I have not had that experience with TSS+. I have always had a cycled tank at the 7 day mark using TSS+. That being said, the water and what is in it can have an effect and my water may be healthier for the BB than someone else’s but it’s not impossible for this to happen or even rare.

Another aside, when using bottled bacteria it should not be used until 24 hours after using dechlorinator and should be left alone to do it’s job with the fish in to feed the bacteria. Dechlorinator will harm the bacteria if still active which is why they say to leave the water alone and don’t change or even test it for 14 days after adding the bacteria.

 

Another aside, when using bottled bacteria it should not be used until 24 hours after using dechlorinator

For my current fish-in cycle this would be impossible to achieve - my 29G needs 80% water changes 1-2x daily to prevent the fish from choking on Nitrite. Those water changes necessarily come with dechlorinator, there's no way to avoid it short of using RO/distilled.

 

For my current fish-in cycle this would be impossible to achieve - my 29G needs 80% water changes 1-2x daily to prevent the fish from choking on Nitrite. Those water changes necessarily come with dechlorinator, there's no way to avoid it short of using RO/distilled.

Not really. You would just need a trash can or buckets for water changes. You add the water, dechlorinate and allow it to sit for 24 hours. You can then do your water change, add the water that has already been declorinated and immediately add the TSS+ and be done for 2 weeks. Cycle complete!