No Pump Required?

ForceTen

This HOB trickle was mentioned and linked to in another thread. Plants. Hydro-culture?

In the picture below, I ask how is a pump connected to the intake tube? There is no mention of a pump in the "details".


Is this a gravity powered system or not? Gravity fed HOB filters were the only type of filters we had before Power filters. There was a time before power filters, yet I cannot find anyone on this professional site that can comment on them?
Is this forum only for millennial's?.........LOL

Seriously we used these gravity fed filters for years before the invent of the power filter. Almost identicle in appearance and the only difference was you needed no pump and you needed no electricity. Plus they are completely silent with the exception of the spillway.
 

mattgirl

This HOB trickle was mentioned and linked to in another thread. Plants. Hydro-culture?

In the picture below, I ask how is a pump connected to the intake tube? There is no mention of a pump in the "details".


Is this a gravity powered system or not? Gravity fed HOB filters were the only type of filters we had before Power filters. There was a time before power filters, yet I cannot find anyone on this professional site that can comment on them?
Is this forum only for millennial's?.........LOL

Seriously we used these gravity fed filters for years before the invent of the power filter. Almost identicle in appearance and the only difference was you needed no pump and you needed no electricity. Plus they are completely silent with the exception of the spillway.
I have checked out each thread where you have asked about this. I don't think anyone is ignoring your question. It just seems like no one here has ever used what you are asking about.

I don't think I am a millennial (whatever that means). I've never seen nor even heard of what you are looking for. Are you sure it wasn't just something that was DIY and never actually on the market?

Maybe you could design something like this and market it.
 

ForceTen

I have checked out each thread where you have asked about this. I don't think anyone is ignoring your question. It just seems like no one here has ever used what you are asking about.

I don't think I am a millennial (whatever that means). I've never seen nor even heard of what you are looking for. Are you sure it wasn't just something that was DIY and never actually on the market?

Maybe you could design something like this and market it.

Sorry about the picture.

A millennial is a person born 1997 and on.

It seems no one here is old enough to remember them? I mean I had more than one back in the day. I met one member a day or so ago who also had and remembered this type of HOB.

Let me be more clear. This type of filter used siphoning action to draw water into the filter box. It leaves via spillway just like a power filter does.. Maybe gravity was the wrong word to use.
You started it by filling the intake tube with water and held your finger over the end to hold the water. Then you had to get the end into the full filter box without loosing siphon.
This started the filter.
It would continue to run as long as you had water full in the tank.
 

mattgirl

Sorry about the picture.

A millennial is a person born 1997 and on.

It seems no one here is old enough to remember them? I mean I had more than one back in the day. I met one member a day or so ago who also had and remembered this type of HOB.

Let me be more clear. This type of filter used siphoning action to draw water into the filter box. It leaves via spillway just like a power filter does.. Maybe gravity was the wrong word to use.
You started it by filling the intake tube with water and held your finger over the end to hold the water. Then you had to get the end into the full filter box without loosing siphon.
This started the filter.
It would continue to run as long as you had water full in the tank.
I understand the concept. I have just never had, used or heard of one like it. I only replied so you wouldn't think everyone is ignoring your question or helping you with your quest.

I definitely am not a millennial Oops, I didn't mean this as a slur toward anyone so hopefully no one is taking it that way. I just mean I am OLD and have never used or heard of one of these.
 

ForceTen

Thanks.
 

John58ford

Only for millennials? I suppose this is an aggressive way to ask if anyone has believed in a reciprocal free energy machine since the Advent of Google?
No. No one has.
You could not power a filter using reciprocal siphons. You could use an air lift, or very inefficiently use heat.
I saw your question posted in the other thread and just finally got a minute to answer and I'm glad I found this thread. I would answer differently but you had to go and throw some age related shade out there. Physics says there's no free energy.

to answer the other portion of your questions.
that is an overhead sump. You put a small pump in the tank, a vinyl hose connects to the glass j-shaped tube. The pump pumps water up into the first compartment. Water spills from compartment to compartment either over or under the dividers that are user positionable. Then it spills back into your tank. There is no configuration I can dream up that would allow it to run gravity fed unless you manually primed it daily, with a bucket or 50 of water on a drip line.

sorry if I'm too young and closed minded with all my electricity and pumps and stuff. But there's no way I know or have seen anyone passively move water uphill even in a closed system without at least a heat source.
 

ForceTen

Only for millennials?

sorry if I'm too young and closed minded with all my electricity and pumps and stuff. But there's no way I know or have seen anyone passively move water uphill even in a closed system without at least a heat source.

Have you even seen a weir? A dam that produces electricity? Water does fall and falling water can be harnessed. This was the principle behind this type of filter. Not uphill. Downhill.
You clearly are to young to remember this filter.
No pump, no motor, no electricity.

Same exact principle as my examples above. These filters existed and like you, I could not find even one example to post.
But I can assure you they did exist. I remember having to hold my finger over the inlet tube to not loose the siphon. It then operated only on gravity.

Now here is where you and I differ. You trust a Google search with your life. I don't. Especially now that I cannot find an example.
 

rainbowsprinkles

HI I’m old. What you are asking is Not possible with laws of physics (I’m also a scientist). Some hob’s used to be air bubble driven. Maybe this is what you are remembering. Hydroelectric would not work without rainfall to bring water back up.
 

John58ford

Have you even seen a weir? A dam that produces electricity? Water does fall and falling water can be harnessed. This was the principle behind this type of filter. Not uphill. Downhill.
You clearly are to young to remember this filter.
No pump, no motor, no electricity.

Same exact principle as my examples above. These filters existed and like you, I could not find even one example to post.
But I can assure you they did exist. I remember having to hold my finger over the inlet tube to not loose the siphon. It then operated only on gravity.

Now here is where you and I differ. You trust a Google search with your life. I don't. Especially now that I cannot find an example.
I have 2 weirs in service in tanks, and have been to many, many dams.

How do you think the water gets above my weirs?
Or better, how do you think the water gets above a dam?

I could answer these for you but it's not worth typing.

The key here is for water to fall, *something had to make it rise*

To do what you want to do, you would have to store energy somewhere, this energy would run out and need re-priming frequently. You don't want to use a motor, airlift or heat to make water rise, and I don't know how to do it effectively. Nor do any of the manufactures, or even colleges, state and national research facilities, or hatcheries. If it was that easy don't you think one of these places that turns over millions of gallons a day might want to save a buck on electricity?

For the record though I know of a device that can almost do what you want. You can *Google* capillary water lift all on your own and find a diagram of a capillary wheel. This energy isn't free, reliable, or scalable. If you want to make a filter with tubes narrower than coffee straws, knock yourself out.

I don't think you see the value in what you can find on Google. It can pull up millions of returns for scientific studies by actual professors and universities. It can find you a picture of nearly anything ever photographed. Lock Haven University for example had a great (and simple enough to understand) study posted and publicly available about capillary wheels. I learned a new thing today and that makes me happy.

If you would adjust your tone a little and seem a bit less at your edge as far as wanting to berate those younger than you; I could have a lot more fun with this and probably help you have an "ah ha" moment. But I fear from your responses you probably won't read.

I've actually found posts from you where you specifically said you wouldn't read a long post so, I may be done here depending on your responses.
 

ForceTen

Yes. You're done and so am I.
 

Islandvic

I thought the HOB filters before being powered were operated via an air pump and lift tube?
 

John58ford

I thought the HOB filters before being powered were operated via an air pump and lift tube?
In the 1960's there was a company called halvin that made air powered hang on backs. Very cool devices indeed.
Here's a video:
 

ForceTen

Very cool. But I remember a HOB that required nothing but a intake tube, housing and spillway.
I cannot find a sample and I have been schooled on the physics that would be required for something like this.
My memory is putting the intake tube into the water to fill it. Then while holding your finger over the tube to hold the water, you inserted it into the filter housing. This started a siphoning action and water runs down the spillway. It took a couple tries to get it going as I remember.

Note: I do not remember using an air pump. But after all the searching with no results, I must admit it could be a distinct possibility. But clearly its not what's in the video above.
 

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