NilocG Thrive Liquid plant food, Neon Tetras, cat,ottos

Hello,
Since I ran into an issue with CO2 Boost that killed one of my Neon Tetras the other day (after torturing it neurologically for 3 days before could not take it anymore and died) so I wanted to check on NilocG Thrive Liquid plant food. I have 6 live plants in my 55 Gallon freshwater tank along with 20 Neon Tetras, one Stick Catfish and 2 or 3 Ottocinclus. I have a gravel bottom tank, have filtered the light about 70% and run lights for approx 10 hrs each day. I have not had the best success with plants and currently have Jungle Valisneria that is not doing very well, Amazon Sword and Java Fern. I only have 1 Sword that is doing okay, and the Sword keep getting all sorts of black spots on the leaves and they eventually kill off the entire leaf. Anyway.... since the CO2 Boost tortured and killed one of my fish, the only thing I still add to the tank is the liquid NilocG Plant food.

Is this okay or also dangerous to the fish I listed?
I am about done trying to keep the live plants as I have tried everything. I had too much lighting, now filtered 70% and the Valisneria is turning nearly all see through. I ordered 3 more, but I doubt they will make it either. Sadly due to Snails I have to give any live plants a 1 to 20 quickly bleach bath, followed by a good rinsing before introducing to the tank. it does not seem to have ever bothered the sword or fern, but the Vallisneria is already quite thin leafed upon receipt. (Please reserve all "snail" comments as that is not part of this discussion)

Most important question is the NilocG Thrive liquid and the safety to the fish.

Thanks!

 

Most planted tank beginners are stuck in the middle between the two main approaches: low tech and high tech.

You are not using any pressurised CO2. But your lights still seem to be pretty bright....if your avatar is the tank you are referring to.

Black spots on leaves can occur when light is bright and the plant is unable to get the required CO2 to match this.

This is what the black spots are likely telling you. In which case plant food won't solve anything.

Plant decay triggers algae. The heater, bright lights and plant food will further benefit algae.

 

This is my tank. I have the light 70 % filtered. It's just enough so I can see how it looks currently which is not very bright. It's just enough to be able to enjoy the tank. If I go less what's the point I could never enjoy the tank? So it sounds like The plants would do well if I don't use any lights but what's the point I could never enjoy the tank.
I added I added live plants to the benefit of the fish. But I don't want to have a pitch black tank That I cannot enjoy looking at commercial the answer is artificial plants if I want to have fish and actually be able to see them.
In the fish And the fish food is a waste of time clearly so I will dispose of it

 

My tank lights are on for 12 hours, but never reach 20% of their full potential. But also because I like the look of dim tanks.

You can have it at 70% for sure, but only if, let's say, 90%+ of the plants are healthy and showing some growth.

Your tank is not in that stage.

 

Most planted tank beginners are stuck in the middle between the two main approaches: low tech and high tech.

You are not using any pressurised CO2. But your lights still seem to be pretty bright....if your avatar is the tank you are referring to.

Black spots on leaves can occur when light is bright and the plant is unable to get the required CO2 to match this.

This is what the black spots are likely telling you. In which case plant food won't solve anything.

Plant decay triggers algae. The heater, bright lights and plant food will further benefit algae.

Sorry to butt in - I didn't know that's what black spots meant! So if that's the case, how do you add CO2 without pressurized gas? I don't want to use that Aqueon stuff since it's toxic for our beloved beneficial bacteria in high amounts.

 

Sorry to butt in - I didn't know that's what black spots meant! So if that's the case, how do you add CO2 without pressurized gas? I don't want to use that Aqueon stuff since it's toxic for our beloved beneficial bacteria in high amounts.

You don't. Well, there are natural ways of course, like having a relative large water surface area and keeping your water surface crystal clear. And also by having some sort of carbon source in the substrate in combination with oxygen fed microbes.

But even then, CO2 levels will be fairly modest.... 8 ppm CO2 max? So, initially, you need to bring down light intensity. And you most likely won't need any plant food. Most plant food is in tap water. The rest in fish and plant waste.

Once your plant tank is occupied for 70%+ by plants, the tank becomes more tolerant and forgiving. Meaning, for instance, you can turn up light intensity. I keep my main (very low tech) tank in direct sunlight. It doesn't get brighter than that.

In sum: Low tech + bright(er) lights is possible in heavily and healthy planted tanks.
Not in scarcely planted tanks with algae taking over.

 

Question. Do you feel it would be better for me to just let this window light be my light source throughout the entire day? I could simply turn the lights on in the morning to feed them, turn them off when I leave for work, and turn them all for an hour when I return home for some enjoyment. That large window faces West so rarely is there any direct sunlight that hits the tank
In my And my goal is simply for the plants to survive, thrive and the fish be very happy and healthy
So it sounds like So it sounds like I can pitch the thrive nylocG liquid plant food?
And I also And I also have the caps but I have not used them for 3 months. Don't bother using the Caps Or liquid?

 

There are a few paths you can take.

1)
The one you suggest actually works for a lot of plant species. But not all. Period. Accept it. Crypts, and epiphytes, like ferns, buces, most mosses, should not be a problem.

Because of your algae-beneficial substrate, I would recommend lots of crypts.

By the way: I oftentimes refer people to this nice journal of a low (/no) tech planted tank, without even dedicated aquarium light:
Biotope in my study, a low-tech natural aquarium - tuncalik.com - Natural Aquariums and Sustainable Life

It's hardly different from my approaches, but he describes it nicely.

2)
The other approach is done by all seasoned planted tank owners, both low and high tech: Plant abundantly and instantly. Cover 80% of surface area with plants at once.

The only prerequisite: those plants must already be adapted to tank water. Otherwise you'll have massive plant biomass in decay. If the prerequisite is met and your tank is heavily planted and showing growth, you can keep the lights at 70%.

Because of the biomass, you likely need to add some plant food: Nitrate, Potassium (K) and Phosphates: NPK.

 

Okay. This is going to be the basic structure of my tank outside of a few more of the tall plants coming this week. Vallisneria.

1. I will leave the lights off during the day, and simply leave it to window lighting.

2. What should I use for the plants food and not hatlem the fish mentioned? Am I okay using the liquid nylocG thrive, and thrive g tablets as per Instructions on packaging?

 

All plant food is in your tap water....most likely. You can look it up.

You can dose pretty much whatever you want, just dose less than what is recommended on the bottle.

If the bottle has some advice for low tech / lean dosing regime, apply no more than 25% of this recommendation.

The plant food supplier has no idea how many plant biomass you have per gallon of water. Has no idea about the light intensity or CO2 concentration. Has no idea how many minerals and trace elements (plant food) is naturally present in your water.

 

Niloc G won’t kill your fish. Was the co2 booster API? I’ve never had a problem with that either. Some needed info would be how is your water? Ph,gh,kh and how much nitrates in it? How often do you change water and how much. Next what type of light are you using?
I’ve used your substrate with great results. This is my 15g shrimp tank. Aquascaping skills have escaped me.
this tank get no ferts and plants grow great. Lighting is on 24/7 mode. Different intensities all day. So it can be easily done. It does take time to get it right.
None of your plants are high tech. The swords were probably grown emersed. Roots in water leaves above. This looks best to sellers but doesn’t work for us. So tne round leaves will die off under water. Long thin ones will grow back. Val’s are notorious for melting when added to new tanks with different water. They melt but don’t remove the roots they will grow back. Most throw them away before they get a chance to grow back. And the Java fern is a very low light plant that I think like harder water.

 

That's a beautiful tank setup. I don't have those kind of skills, patience, expertise, technology to pull off anything like that. that's absolutely beautiful though. Thank you for sharing. I am as basic as it comes. I ended up purchasing this tank to rescue fish. The stick catfish was one of them I rescued along with ottocicclilus. So I am just trying to give them the best life possible. But when it comes to testing water, monitoring, changing and so forth I'm at a loss. But I do change the water 50% of it every week.

 

Ok that’s kind of what I’m saying. You don’t need much to grow plants. Take just one of the thrive tabs and put it directly under each sword plant. Ok first how many have you added already? Swords grab nutrients out of the substrate so that will help them. As ruud stated just dose the liquid once a week at about 3 squirts.
A test kit is needed just to successfully keep fish. API makes a reasonably priced master test kit. Check the internet for the best prices. How long have you owned the neons? How many died? How long were you using the co2 booster?

 

Hi. I only have 2 remaining Amazon swords. 1 is doing good, and the other just okay. I have approximately 6 Java Fern. The ones on the driftwood seem to be doing OK but the ones near gravel do not. Most of those near the gravel have died. I have one vallisneria and 3 more arriving soon. 12". Here are photos showing all the plants.
Hi. I only have 2 remaining Amazon swords. 1 is doing good, and the other just okay. I have approximately 6 Java Fern. The ones on the driftwood seem to be doing OK but the ones near gravel do not. Most of those near the gravel have died. I have one vallisneria and 3 more arriving soon. 12". Here are photos showing all the plants.
And I And I will use the tablets every few months, and just a squirt or 2 of the liquid Each week

 

Ok Java fern doesn’t go in the gravel. Tie them to driftwood or any other ornament. They have a rhyizone not roots and if pushed into the gravel it will rot.
Plant the new Val’s in the back. Leave the one you have where it is for now. But move that sword next to it further into the tank. When they grow they grow big. What type of light do you have? Led or fluorescent?

 

Hi. Where the Vallisneria is located, is where the stick catfish hangs out. That's the section I would like the most plants for him to enjoy, And he likes the plants close to the glass. Could I move the large sword next to Vallisneria? And 1 or 2 of the news Vals in that same area?

Again, the plants in that area I would like really thick to were he can intertwine with them as he loves to hide in that area, but does not leave that glass unless a plant is really, really close to the glass.

 

It’s your call. I’m just saying for looks you’d like the larger plants in the back. But I’d leave the sword next to the driftwood alone. Plants don’t like to be moved. So yes you could plant the Val’s right next to the other Val. It’s your call! It’s your tank .
You don’t have a location with your name. Where are you located? I have plants I cut back regularly. If close. Can send them to you.

 

Thanks. I live in Illinois. The other problem with plants, is most have snails and/or snail eggs. Yes, I'm one of those ones who does not want snails in my tank. Just a personal preference so thank you everybody for respecting my likes or dislikes.
I wish the stick catfish would move off the front, right side near the bottom side of the tank, But he has always stayed in that area..

Either on the glass, or if the plant is touching the glass then he will go on to the plant, but I've been unsuccessful keeping plants alive in that area for him. Nearly all the plants I purchased was to try to get him a very large thick area of plant growth That touched up on the glass in that right hand lower corner. But I'm terrible it appears.

 

You don't. Well, there are natural ways of course, like having a relative large water surface area and keeping your water surface crystal clear. And also by having some sort of carbon source in the substrate in combination with oxygen fed microbes.

But even then, CO2 levels will be fairly modest.... 8 ppm CO2 max? So, initially, you need to bring down light intensity. And you most likely won't need any plant food. Most plant food is in tap water. The rest in fish and plant waste.

Once your plant tank is occupied for 70%+ by plants, the tank becomes more tolerant and forgiving. Meaning, for instance, you can turn up light intensity. I keep my main (very low tech) tank in direct sunlight. It doesn't get brighter than that.

In sum: Low tech + bright(er) lights is possible in heavily and healthy planted tanks.
Not in scarcely planted tanks with algae taking over.

Makes sense. Yeah, I knew about a large water surface for maximum O/CO2 gas exchange, and keeping the surface clear of protein buildup, and even about lowering light intensity, but I didn't know about not adding carbon in the substrate or fertilizers...

My most successful tank is a low tech 3 gallon, heavily-planted Walstad tank with 3 dwarf coral platies (it's the "family tank" they say, yet I'm the only one that feeds and does maintenance for the goldfish, bettas, toads, salamander, lizards, beetles, leeches, hamsters, gerbil, isopods, cats, crabs, and, of course, platies.) I've shared this a few times recently because it's an amazing tank really. I used Miracle Gro Potting Mix, a free full-spectrum LED from a friend, a $40 tank, and it's planted with massive Anubias barteri var. Nana 'Petite', Lysimachia nummularia 'creeping jenny' from a home improvement store, buces, crypts, Hydrocotyle leucocephala'Brazilian Pennywort', and Microsorum pteropus Windelov 'Lacy Java Fern'. It's been set up for about 5-6 months and has experienced TONS of growth. I haven't used ferts yet, and lighting is on the high end of low