Newbie, Tell Me If I'm Heading To Failure

First off, this is my first post on this forum. Been reading posts and learning as much as I can for the last several weeks. I admit I've been spending more time learning about fish species and compatibility than I have on the plant end of things. I've mostly just been writing down plants that I think look nice and would likely fit in my low-tech set up. I do not have any established tanks, haven't had a tank in almost 30 years and even then it was just a little 10 gallon. I'm taking a big first step here, so any advice would be appreciated. If you can't tell by many of my choices, this is to be a budget build with as low a maintenance requirement as can be expected.

Water specs per city disclosure, haven't tested for myself yet (7-7.5 pH, 16-18 dGH, 72ppm Calcium, 26ppm Magnesium, 4.7ppm Potassium, 91ppm Sodium)

Bold indicates I already have it or already on order.

• 72 gallon bow front (48" width)
  
• 48" chinese LED light ("rated" at 7200 lumen with 96x 10k white and 48x RGB LEDs)
  
• Sunsun HW-304b canister filter
• Aqueon Pro 250w
  
• Black Diamond substrate only, approx 2-2.5" thick (decided against a fertilized or clay based substrate, going ultra low-tech here)
  
• Granite and driftwood hardscape
• Seachem Flourish and Osmocote+ tabs
• Plan to go the fishless cycle route with some Seachem Stability to hopefully cut down the time

Stocking plan, this should leave me a little room for later additions.

• Honey Gourami - 3-4 (1 male)
• Praecox Rainbowfish - 10-15
• Harlequin and/or Lambchop Rasbora - 30-40
• Bolivian Ram - 2 (m/f)
• Peppered Cory - 6-10
• Nerite snails - 2-3

Plants so far

• Rotala Indica
• Dwarf Sag (2 sad little sprigs is all I could find)
• Ludwigia Ovalis and Ludwigia Repens
• Crypt WendtiI
• Trident Java Fern
• Anubias Nana
• Narrow leaf java fern (tiny guy on rock)
• S Repens
• Anacharis
• Amazon sword
• Bacopa Caroliniana
• Pennywort
• Java Moss
• Jungle Val

 

Wow that is quite some research you did there.

A part of me wonders whether the Assassin snails will make the MTS go extinct. I honestly think you don't want MTS in your tank because they can muliply pretty fast to the point you might regret doing this hobby. I also believe that snails tend to be polluters of the tank. I would probably not have snails right now unless you really want one.

As for the heater, it can be a total dice roll. Some brands are good and some are not. I start with maybe a middle road like Aqueon ( I think that's what mine are called). You don't need to spend more on a good one that does the same job as a middle tier one.

The 48" Chinese LED light, might be OK but I'm Chinese and I don't even trust my own people.

If your doing Anubias, java fern or amazon swords you might not need fertilizers. They are low light plants and will do fine with the LED set up. I would look to do the plants later on and focus on getting the tank started and add the fish one step at a time. Than when you think your ready and you have everything down and you have confidence get the plants.

 

Welcome!! Personally, I would advise getting yourself ( as it appears you are already doing) reacquainted, after your 30 year hiatus from the hobby, with cycling a tank, getting a healthy stock of fish established, and maintaining a good base for the fish before introducing plants. Maybe waiting 3-6 months until your tank becomes established before diving in to plants. The reason I state this is that maintaining the balance of needs between fish and plants can be quite complex and often, if not properly knowledgeable of these complexities, either the fish or plants will suffer. But, this is just my experience.

 

Plan to go the fishless cycle route with some Seachem Stability to hopefully cut down the time

Just wanted to mention some people do well with Stability, but TSS+ is another good option for BB.

Also, I don't know if you didn't list it because you have them already, but I would suggest the Frestwater API test kit or the separate API tests, as most people on this site use it. In case you also aren't aware, when you test nitrates, follow directions and beat on the bottle to get an accurate test. Also a thermometer. I like the little digital ones. For water conditioner - Seachem Prime

Sounds fabulous.

 

Wow that is quite some research you did there.

A part of me wonders whether the Assassin snails will make the MTS go extinct. I honestly think you don't want MTS in your tank because they can muliply pretty fast to the point you might regret doing this hobby. I also believe that snails tend to be polluters of the tank. I would probably not have snails right now unless you really want one.

As for the heater, it can be a total dice roll. Some brands are good and some are not. I start with maybe a middle road like Aqueon ( I think that's what mine are called). You don't need to spend more on a good one that does the same job as a middle tier one.

The 48" Chinese LED light, might be OK but I'm Chinese and I don't even trust my own people.

If your doing Anubias, java fern or amazon swords you might not need fertilizers. They are low light plants and will do fine with the LED set up. I would look to do the plants later on and focus on getting the tank started and add the fish one step at a time. Than when you think your ready and you have everything down and you have confidence get the plants.

I've heard that Assassin snails will only kill the MTS that are a certain size, but you may be right and unless I'm getting a lot of gas build up in the substrate I may not even need them. I'll hold off until then, thank you. I'm thinking about going with an Aqueon Pro heater. Good advice on waiting for the planted, I failed to mention that in my post but those will wait at least 30 days until the fish appear to be doing well.

Welcome!! Personally, I would advise getting yourself ( as it appears you are already doing) reacquainted, after your 30 year hiatus from the hobby, with cycling a tank, getting a healthy stock of fish established, and maintaining a good base for the fish before introducing plants. Maybe waiting 3-6 months until your tank becomes established before diving in to plants. The reason I state this is that maintaining the balance of needs between fish and plants can be quite complex and often, if not properly knowledgeable of these complexities, either the fish or plants will suffer. But, this is just my experience.

You're absolutely right, I'll wait a bit before putting the plants in. Thank you!

Just wanted to mention some people do well with Stability, but TSS+ is another good option for BB.

Also, I don't know if you didn't list it because you have them already, but I would suggest the Frestwater API test kit or the separate API tests, as most people on this site use it. In case you also aren't aware, when you test nitrates, follow directions and beat on the bottle to get an accurate test. Also a thermometer. I like the little digital ones. For water conditioner - Seachem Prime

Sounds fabulous.

I forgot to mention those, I have the API kit being delivered today and I have a cheap glass suction cup thermometer also being delivered. I'll look at TSS+ if the Stability doesn't work out well. I also got a bottle of the Prime for the dechlor and emergency water situations.

 

I like Eheim Jager heater. They are very reliable, the local aquarium also uses these.
They need to be calibrated.

 

You sound like you are on a good path forward. I have MTS in my tanks, I like them, personal preference.

I have most of your plants and just use Flourish. I use TSS+ and it has worked great for me. I start with only a small number of fish using it, and gradually add more after a few weeks. I have never done a fishless cycle so cannot speak to that.

With a 75 gallon, if your budget supports it, a python is nice for water changes.

A net with a long handle, or find something in your house to extend it helps.

Enjoy the adventure!

 

Assassins will kill all sizes of MTS, by the way.

You have some issues with your planned stocking, if you'd like to discuss them! We can suggest some more appropriate options, if you're interested.

 

I don't see a problem with starting with plants. If you are doing a fishless cycle, I gives you something to look at/mess with in the tank until you get fish! Since cycling can take weeks, it gives you time to learn about thebplants, without worrying about fish yet. They also grow really well in the tank with the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate.
For liquid fertilizer I suggest Thrive. Flourish doesn't have everything in it; I learned that after I bought the big bottle. Osmacote root tabs, available on amazon, are much cheaper than the API or flourish tabs, and do the same thing.

 

Assassins will kill all sizes of MTS, by the way.

You have some issues with your planned stocking, if you'd like to discuss them! We can suggest some more appropriate options, if you're interested.

Sorry, I dropped off the thread here for a few days. Work has been nuts. My filter showed up today and I've got most of my hardscape done, so I'll be starting my fishless cycle tonight.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on my planned stocking. Granted it's changed a bit. Here's my current rough plan. 12 rainbowfish (6 boesemanI and 6 turquoise), 10 Rummynose Tetra, 2 Bolivian Ram, 2 Oto cats and 5-6 Cory cats. Once things mature a bit, I'll consider adding a few Siamese Algae Eater (if needed) and maybe a few Anglefish if I feel like it won't upset the balance too much.

 

What are cats?

 

Having 2 otos won't work, they prefer to be in groups of 6+ and, being fragile fish, too much stress may kill them.

 

Having 2 otos won't work, they prefer to be in groups of 6+ and, being fragile fish, too much stress may kill them.

I thought they were fine in lower numbers and that the corys needed the bigger group? Not disbelieving just new info.

 

So I've been a little busy with the aquascaping (if you want to call it that, it's like calling a 2 year old's scribbling with crayons "art") while I wait for the fishless cycle to finish. My nitrites have spiked and my nitrates are slowly starting to increase.

Last night I changed the scape around a bit and trimmed off some of the melted parts of my stem plants. Hopefully I didn't go overboard with the trimming... Oh don't mind the bladder snail bottle trap and the wife and kids happy vibes in wet erase marker on the glass. Rocks in the bottom pic are not in final position, just set them there until I can decide what to do with them.

Plants:
Rotala Indica
Dwarf Sag (2 sad little sprigs is all I could find)
Ludwigia Ovalis and Ludwigia Repens
Crypt WendtiI
Trident Java Fern
Anubias Nana
Narrow leaf java fern (tiny guy on rock)
S Repens
Anacharis
Amazon sword
Bacopa Caroliniana
Pennywort

 

It looks wonderful.

 

I think it looks very nice, but I see your problem, I feel like my tank sucks comparing them to the other tanks I see.

 

I think it looks very nice, but I see your problem, I feel like my tank sucks comparing them to the other tanks I see.

Thanks, once it fills in I think I'll be very happy with it.

 

Sorry, I dropped off the thread here for a few days. Work has been nuts. My filter showed up today and I've got most of my hardscape done, so I'll be starting my fishless cycle tonight.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on my planned stocking. Granted it's changed a bit. Here's my current rough plan. 12 rainbowfish (6 boesemanI and 6 turquoise), 10 Rummynose Tetra, 2 Bolivian Ram, 2 Oto cats and 5-6 Cory cats. Once things mature a bit, I'll consider adding a few Siamese Algae Eater (if needed) and maybe a few Anglefish if I feel like it won't upset the balance too much.

I would go with just Boesemani. Turquoise should be in cooler water, and don't have much overlap with rummynose either. With the Boesemani, I'd go with blue rams instead of Bolivians, and leave out the otos (need cooler water). I'd also go with more cories. Don't add SAEs to this stocking, they also need cooler water. You also don't need algae eating fish. You are the best at preventing, removing, and controlling algae. Don't get a fish to do that job.

So what about this for warm water:
8x Boesemani
10x Rummynose
2x Blue ram
10x Warm water cories (like C. sterbaI or C. aeneus or C. brochis, just one species)
1-2x Angelfish

And this for cooler water:

7x Turquoise rainbows
10x Serpae tetra
2x Bolivian ram
10x Otos
10x Cool water cory (so many options here, just one species)
4x SAE (get them because you like them, not because they'll eat algae)

 

I would go with just Boesemani. Turquoise should be in cooler water, and don't have much overlap with rummynose either. With the Boesemani, I'd go with blue rams instead of Bolivians, and leave out the otos (need cooler water). I'd also go with more cories. Don't add SAEs to this stocking, they also need cooler water. You also don't need algae eating fish. You are the best at preventing, removing, and controlling algae. Don't get a fish to do that job.

Thanks TexasDomer, I appreciate the input. I've changed my stocking plan around a little bit since first posting this, but unfortunately I had a pretty big setback over the weekend. My used 72 gallon bowfront had a seal let go. Came home in the afternoon to about 20 gallons on the floor with a pretty steady stream coming out the front. Ran out and bought a 10 gallon tank to keep the plants and filter bacteria alive while we did an emergency drain and clean up. All this before our anniversary dinner date...still made it out for sushI and bit too much sakI to forget the debacle.

At any rate, I'm giving up on this tank, I don't trust my ability to reseal it. So I went out and bought a 75 gallon set from Petsmart (on sale) and got it set up and planted over the weekend. Here's the new set up. Overall I'm happy to have a deeper tank and the scape feels a little more balanced and when the background "jungle" and front "carpets" fill in I'll be super happy with it. I don't think I lost any headway on my fishless cycle, still in a nitrite spike and nitrates are slowly climbing.

 

I'm sorry you had to go through that! One of my nightmares!

 

Thanks TexasDomer, I appreciate the input. I've changed my stocking plan around a little bit since first posting this, but unfortunately I had a pretty big setback over the weekend. My used 72 gallon bowfront had a seal let go. Came home in the afternoon to about 20 gallons on the floor with a pretty steady stream coming out the front. Ran out and bought a 10 gallon tank to keep the plants and filter bacteria alive while we did an emergency drain and clean up. All this before our anniversary dinner date...still made it out for sushI and bit too much sakI to forget the debacle.

At any rate, I'm giving up on this tank, I don't trust my ability to reseal it. So I went out and bought a 75 gallon set from Petsmart (on sale) and got it set up and planted over the weekend. Here's the new set up. Overall I'm happy to have a deeper tank and the scape feels a little more balanced and when the background "jungle" and front "carpets" fill in I'll be super happy with it. I don't think I lost any headway on my fishless cycle, still in a nitrite spike and nitrates are slowly climbing.

Love the aquascaping. Looks great!

 

I'm sorry you had to go through that! One of my nightmares!

Thank you, it wasn't a fun experience but at least I didn't have a fully stocked tank of fish to worry about. Just an expensive inconvenience really. Regarding your stocking suggestions, I've tweaked my stock plan to below. I'll keep the tank around 77-78 degrees, so I think the compatibility should work out well, aside from the unpredictability of living creatures and their personalities of course.

Stocking plan, this should leave me a little room for later additions.

• Honey Gourami - 3-4 (1 male)
• Praecox Rainbowfish - 10-15
• Harlequin and/or Lambchop Rasbora - 30-40
• Bolivian Ram - 2 (m/f)
• Peppered Cory - 6-10
• Nerite snails - 2-3

Love the aquascaping. Looks great!

Thanks, it's still very immature but hopefully it fills out to look like what I have in my head.

 

Peppered cories should be in 72 F or below. What about C. aeneus or C. splendens instead?

And in a 4 ft tank, I'm not sure I'd do 30-40 rasbora. I'd start with 15-20 and see how that goes.

 

Peppered cories should be in 72 F or below. What about C. aeneus or C. splendens instead?

And in a 4 ft tank, I'm not sure I'd do 30-40 rasbora. I'd start with 15-20 and see how that goes.

I had considered the C.splendens and C.aeneus due to the wider temp range, and I may still go that route but seeing them in person they are less attractive than the other options. I have recently seen the C.sterbaI show up in the LFS, so that may be the way to go, but dang they aren't cheap.

 

Don't tell my husband that seals break! Sorry to hear about the mess but glad to hear that you were able to get it cleaned up and there were no fish losses.

 

Don't tell my husband that seals break! Sorry to hear about the mess but glad to hear that you were able to get it cleaned up and there were no fish losses.

I can tell my wife got rather skittish with the whole big fish tank idea after this ordeal. Lots of reassurance and I think she's back on the train.

 

Great aesthetics!