New tank, new water, unusual white sludge forming on hood above bubbler

So, I'm a novice aquarium guy, have had 10-55 gallon tanks all my life, fresh and salt water both. However, I've never had an issue with dying fish like I'm having recently, and a new tank upgrade has sent me for a loop.


We had an older 10 gallon, and received a marineland tank that was nicer than ours.

So, I set up the new tank, with biofilter, heater, new rock (rinsed it), and treated the water, and let it run for 24 hrs with a cheesy volcano bubbler to make sure I had good aeration.

We transferred the fish, a older cory cat, a tiger barb, and a tetra that we had forever. I knew there was a chance the shock to the new tank could do them in, but didn't have the ability to run two tanks for an extended time. Looking back, I should have introduced some media from the old tank, but I didn't started it off fresh. Within 72 hrs all fish were dead.

One item that I found peculiar, is on the underside of the tank hood, above the volcano bubbler, was a white film, that when I tried to wipe with my finger, had almost a cheese like consistency, not like a calcium build up. I was surprised to see any build up after only 24 hrs, but it was definitely centered over the bubbler. Does anyone know what this is, and is it concerning and or related to my fish dying off?

I again drained the tank, reapplied the proper amount of water treatment to the water, and letting the filter run, but this time with no bubbler, just the filter and biowheel running. Since it's a new tank now, guess I'm heading to get a few neons or danios to get the tank cycle running.

Can any of the expert identify this mystery substance? Is it something I need to be concerned about before adding fish? Thank you in advance for the insight! I look forward to participating in the forums!

John

 

Welcome to Fishlore

Is this new tank also a 10g? Did you happen to take a picture of this substance? Was this tank cleaned with any chemicals prior to adding fish?

I don't know if the substance would've been the reason behind the fish deaths but if you didn't move the old filter to the new tank, then the fish most likely died from being in an uncycled tank.

I suggest picking up a bacteria supplement that will help cycle your tank like Tetra SafeStart Plus or Seachem Stability. If you don't own a test kit, I'd also get the API Freshwater Master Test Kit.

If this new tank is a 10g, neon tetras and danios wouldn't be appropriate for that tank size as they need to be in schools of at least 6 each.

I'd look through this thread to choose suitable fish for a 10 gallon if you are going to do a fish-in cycle.

https://www.fishlore.com/aquariumfishforum/threads/stocking-list-for-10-gallons.207629/

 

Thank you for the response. I just downloaded the app, so it's much easier to include photos.

I am familiar with the cycling of a tank, and no, I didn't move the old filter media to the new tank as I began using a new filter, new everything.

I was surprised that the deaths occurred in 72 hours, with only three small fish, relative to the tank cycling. It seemed like they were affected the first day, and we lost one fish within 24 hrs.

The deposits seemed to be like a milk/cheesy type buildup, again, deposited right above the bubble ring. It's almost like something was being stripped out of the water with the bubbler.

When the bubbler was running, it looked like they were dispersed and carried back into the water. Once I turned it off, it left this residue. This is only after 24-48 hrs.

Thanks in advance for the feedback. I'll reference the list of stocking fish, thank you. We don't typically keep more that 3-5 small fish in this tank, due to its size.

 

This isn't "slimy" either, it's like a fat or maybe just a wet calcium deposit, just surprised to see it so quickly.

 

And yes, it's also a 10gallon.

 

Hmm.. do you know if the tubes or bubbler was cleaned with a soap or chemical? Maybe someone can identify what it might be.

How did you acclimate the fish?

 

So, I obtained a master test kit, as I had been using multitest strips in the past. Before introducing the new fish, I wanted to insure all seems well. After the last fish kicked the bucket Sunday, I replaced all the water yesterday. So, my pH should be identical to my tap water. Unfortunately, my pH found, was more basic, almost 7.6-7.8 vs a tap water pH of 7.0-7.2.

Odd, to say the least. Could the new rocks have some soluble content that could be affecting my ph? I rinsed them well before putting them in the tank, as well as now having a full water change since setting the tank up last week.

So? Full water change again or adjust the pH chemically and move forward? Thoughts? Thank you in advance.

 

It's very common to have differences in pH coming out of tap vs tank. This is due to the CO2 in the water. But your pH of 7.6-7.8 is just fine and I wouldn't try to lower it as most fish can adapt to it.

You may, however, want to test ammonia and nitrates coming out of the tap. If they're too high, you will want to adjust those.

 

Ammonia in tank and tap was under .25ppm
Nitrites in tank less than.25ppm in tap were zero.
Nitrates in tank and tap were effectively zero. This was using a brand new API master test. I threw all my older stuff out. I also bought some safe start plus. Although I've never used a bacteria starter, I'll give it a go. Thank you for the response. Have a great evening!

 

The ammonia in your tap will be processed once your beneficial bacteria is established.

That's great that you bought the TSS+! It should help you cycle in about 2 weeks and it's pretty simple if you follow the directions to the letter. Basically, once you have chosen 2-3 small fish, add the TSS+ and the fish 24 hrs after your water change. Then don't do any more water changes for the next 14 days. Test your water parameters after 14 days. If ammonia and nitrite are 0 and there are some nitrates, you're cycled!

Here's a thread for more info:

https://www.fishlore.com/aquariumfishforum/threads/q-a-with-tetra-about-tetra-safestart.58116/

 

I'm not sure what causes this but I've seen it as a water chemistry issue. It could even be a tap water problem. I've seen times when they are strongly treating the water for something it foams so bad you can't tell if you rinsed all the dish soap off stuff. Also more common in hardwater with high ph. It may be interacting with your water conditioner or organic materials left by the fish and their food to become thicker and leave a film behind. An established biofilter seems to take care of it. I'd fishless cycle to let the tank run without water changes until it's stable. Don't use an air driven item if possible until it's run it's course and then test it for foaming before adding fish, especially if you have to do a big water change at the end of the cycle to bring nitrates back down.

 

Thank you for the feedback, Kaliska. I've seen a few similar posts to mine, but none with a definitive answer on the deposits. I've got a few cherry barbs in their now, and they seem perfectly content in their new home. I'll follow the instructions on the safe start link provided, and keep and eye on levels. I'm glad someone from here wrote to them, the directions on the bottle are wildly different. Hopefully two weeks from now, we will be in a better place! I look forward to participating in the forums!

 

Thank you for the feedback, Kaliska. I've seen a few similar posts to mine, but none with a definitive answer on the deposits. I've got a few cherry barbs in their now, and they seem perfectly content in their new home. I'll follow the instructions on the safe start link provided, and keep and eye on levels. I'm glad someone from here wrote to them, the directions on the bottle are wildly different. Hopefully two weeks from now, we will be in a better place! I look forward to participating in the forums!

Cherry barbs are really not suitable for a 10 gallon as they would need to be in a group of at least 6 and need a 20 gallon min. Perhaps you can consider swapping them out after your cycle ends for some different type of fish listed in that stocking thread above?

 

Really? I would have sworn I saw them on that list and had them in the back of my head as a "hearty" fish to establish a tank. As far as numbers, isn't the rule of one inch of fish per gallon sufficient reference for sticking? So five 1 inch fish, would provide opportunity for establishing the tank and not exceeding its capacity to support growth? My apologies if I mis chose, but I would have sworn I got the idea from that list. I'll certainly consider swapping them out, but is there are reason 5-6 small fish wouldn't do well in a 10g?

Please don't feel like your banging your head against the wall, you've given me the references and I've somehow misinterpreted from all my information gathering. I appreciate your willingness to give me advice towards my tank and the success of our fish. Have a great day!

 

The inch per gal rule isn't a good guideline for stocking since it doesn't take into consideration bioload, activity level, adult size of fish among other things. Cherry barbs aren't on that list and with the size they get and the minimum of 6 recommended, they wouldn't be appropriate.

You can definitely do other nano schooling fish that are beautiful and definitely suitable for a 10 gallon like celestial pearl danios!

And there's no banging my head on the wall here! LOL Glad to help.

 

Wow. Just looked up that celestial pearl danio! What a beautiful fish! I also noted within the list, that many selections exceed my "rule of thumb", allowing more than 10 for stock of a 10 gallon tank. I'll look around during this time of tank setup and see if I can find a beautiful alternative that would fit a 10 gallon better. Thanks again!

 

Wow. Just looked up that celestial pearl danio! What a beautiful fish! I also noted within the list, that many selections exceed my "rule of thumb", allowing more than 10 for stock of a 10 gallon tank. I'll look around during this time of tank setup and see if I can find a beautiful alternative that would fit a 10 gallon better. Thanks again!

That rule may work with small schooling fish that don't surpass an inch. I think you can even do up to 12 CPD's according to Anders247.

 

The bigger and larger bodied versus length a fish gets the less accurate the inch per gallon rule becomes. You also have to take into consideration a basic amount of space that matches the activity level of the fish. Most fish are just too active for a 10 gallon or produce too much waste to keep the water stable. Really when you get experience you don't use any of those general rules because there are so many variables to each setup and every fish.

 

Wow. Just looked up that celestial pearl danio! What a beautiful fish! I also noted within the list, that many selections exceed my "rule of thumb", allowing more than 10 for stock of a 10 gallon tank. I'll look around during this time of tank setup and see if I can find a beautiful alternative that would fit a 10 gallon better. Thanks again!

The inch per gallon rule is very inaccurate. Celestial Pearl Danios would be a great choice. They're beautiful fish for sure.

 

Yep, up to 12 CPDs imo in a standard 10. But that's with no other fish.

 

We are not going for a maxed out tank, but schooling fish are neat, so as long as it's a healthy option, the fish are happy and my daughter is happy, that works great. I'll start checking the family owned fish shops in the area, but does anyone option to having fish shipped in if you cannot find them locally?

 

Just a thought here on the original problem, is the volcano ornament new? I've read mixed reviews on those decor, some say the white paint comes off leaving water milky and killing fish.

 

We are not going for a maxed out tank, but schooling fish are neat, so as long as it's a healthy option, the fish are happy and my daughter is happy, that works great. I'll start checking the family owned fish shops in the area, but does anyone option to having fish shipped in if you cannot find them locally?

If your LFS can't special order them for you, I'd check on aquabid, Trins Fish and msjinkzd.com.

 

Clk89- yes, everything ornamental is new; rock, volcano, Cheesy nemo figures. Quite honestly, I was concerned of the same thing, if any of the ornaments were causing issue. I could have been, I rinsed everything, but you never know what type of film or something may have been present. So, this being the third tank of water over them, the white deposits seem to have disappeared. So it was likely either a short term treatment of the water, or something as a side effect of the new rock or volcano, that stripped itself out of the water from the aeration.

El337- thanks for the links! My LFS seemed a little out of sorts the last time I was there, as I had to tell them they had a tank running over at about 2 gallons a minute into the floor and we were having to walk through lots of puddles up and down the store. I'll give them another chance and see if they can source them. Thank you again!

 

On a follow up conversation, should I check my levels every few days, to check progress of the cycle?

Also, after reading up on these cherry barbs, that will soon be rehomed, I realized my daughters pick of the "really red one" basically stocked my tank with a perfect breeder scenario. One bright red male, and 4 females. In taking this observation, I also note the females look like they have "birthing hips" . In all seriousness, I do have some concern that they could be potentially laying eggs.

Anything I need to do in the interI'm if that's the case? I've created quite the difficult scenario. If only my newbie self selected the right fish! Live and learn.

Also, I shouldn't have fallen to the marketing and used the rock vendor recommended 2lbs/gallon, so it's a little more rock than I likely need. Any downside to having a bit more rock in the tank? As long as I'm keeping the right balance of vacuuming the bottom at water changes, without disturbing all the bacteria, I should be fine right? No under gravel filter on this tank, just the hanging on the back of the tank filter. Thanks for all your insight! Have a great weekend!

 

Have you added the TSS+ yet?

I'm not familiar with cherry barbs and what to do if they breed and lay eggs. Hopefully, someone can come along and advise.

You can always take some rock out if you feel it's a bit too much. Most of the bacteria is in your filter media anyway.

 

El337-I added the tss before I added the fish. I'm amazed how different the bottle directions are compared to your link. Night and day. The bottle, just says add it at initial tank setup and if you do a big water change.

 

Does the bottle say "Start Up" in the front or "Monthly"? Yeah, unfortunately, they don't give you clear directions on how to use it.

Did you wait 24 hrs after your water change before adding TSS+?

 

Yes, it's "Tetra SafeStart plus Start-up". Since I have a small tank, I purchased the smallest bottle which will treat up to 100 gallons it indicates on the front.

The short directions say, "to start new aquariums, add entire bottle to aquariums up to 20 gallons. Aquarium is then ready for fish."

I added half the bottle, prior to fish addition, and yes, I allowed in excess of 24 hrs post water change to add the fish.

Again, I am amazed at the difference in direction. It's a disservice the the success of their product. At least, they could indicate to reference their website or do a small fold out to expand on directions.

So, should I be testing every few days to document the progression of ammonia, nitrate, and nitrite levels so that I know when my tank has "established" itself and ready for its initial water change?

 

I would've added the entire bottle. You can't overdose the stuff.

I wouldn't test until close to the 2 week mark. If you test earlier than that, you might start worrying that the cycle is not going as it should. Only test if your fish are acting "off".

 

So, figured it was time for a check. Fish have been happily swimming, although noticing a moderate cloudiness when daylight coming through the tank. Not really significant, just noted. Fish have been a bit erratic, but I think it may be attributed to mating tendencies of male cherry barbs surrounded by females. A few look a bit plump, but I don't see any body indications of pending births.

On to the tank setup.

Ph was a bit high, 7.7
Ammonia around 3 ppm
Nitrate around .5 ppm
Nitrite 0-.25ppm.

Nothing seems crazy off spec. No real presence of nitrites, so my assumption is that it's all getting converted to nitrates.

Time for water change or let it continue to chug along? Thank you again for your feedback. Greatly appreciated.

 

It's been more than 2 weeks since you added the TSS+, right? Ammonia really shouldn't be that high so I'm wondering if the TSS+ failed. Do you remember what the parameters were before you added the TSS+? And how many cherry barbs do you have in there? Did you do anything to the tank the past 2-3 weeks like add more fish or do water changes?

 

As of yesterday, it's been three weeks.

I posted the tests on the tank when I started back on the 17th. Everything was between zero-.25ppm. I tested the tap water, and tested the tank after it had run for 24 hrs with the tss in it.

 

5 cherry barbs, and haven't done anything other than light feeding since starting the tank. No new fish, no water changes.

 

Did you ever add the rest of the TSS+? I'm thinking with the bioload of 5 barbs and half the bottle of TSS+ dosed that your tank failed to cycle. Tetra recommends 1 small fish per 10 gallon and you would have wanted to add the entire bottle at least.

Right now, I would do some large water changes to get that ammonia down close to zero since at that level, it's very toxic to your fish. Then I would pick up Seachem Stability instead to help cycle your tank since you can do water changes with it when you see the ammonia and/or nitrite getting up too high. In this case with your barbs in the 10g, I think it's the better option.

 

Will do. Thanks for the feedback.