New here. Just a few questions

Hello everyone. My name is Kaldon. About a month ago I purchased a fish tank setup from my local pet store and started the cycle while deciding which fish I want to get. I got a 36 bow front and everything is going well. The filter system that came with it was not working properly so I took it back and upgraded to a Fluval C4 and it's working magically. I'm a little curious as to my fish selections compatability. I love these tiger barbs. I'm wondering if I can have tiger barbs with green tiger barb or any other barbs. Also can I have rainbow or red tailed sharks? And how about a couple clown loaches? My girlfriend really loves betta fish and she really wants to put just one in our tank. Iv been doing as much research as I can. Some say if you get tiger barbs that's all you can have. But I've also seen on YouTube and read tat you can have all those fish together as long as you have a big enough barb school a enough hiding spots and filtration. Any input would be appreciated since I've always wanted to start my own tank since I was a little kid. Thanks for your time!

PS. My tank has live plants

 

Welcome to FishLore! I don't know much about tiger barbs, but we have a good selection of fish profiles here that may help you.

https://www.fishlore.com/freshwaterfish.htm

Clown loaches wouldn't be suitable, they like to be kept in small groups and need a larger tank. Rainbow and red tailed sharks need larger tanks as well. Bettas are very iffy when it comes to tank mates. Some will tolerate them, some will not tolerate anything else in their tank. However, taken from the tiger barb profile... "Avoid keeping them with tropical fish that are long-finned and slow moving. They will most likely not do well with this fish." I imagine it's a given that you would quickly have a fight on your hands.

I'm sure others can give you some good stocking options, sorry everything you mentioned can't really work

 

My Tiger barbs are fin nippers - mainly anything that goes in front of it. I think it would be too tempting to do that with Betta's and their flowing fins. Right now I only have 5 barbs and plan on getting more to even out the school ( I have Zebra Danios that they love to chase )
I don't know about the other fishes but do know that loaches need larger tanks! Good luck with your stocking and great that you are reading up first. I made the initial mistake of not knowing what I was doing and ended up taking a lot of fish back to the LFS ( not to mention upgrading from a 5 gallon tank to a 36 gallon within weeks )
This is a great place to get info! Welcome!

 

Hi, Kaldon! Welcome to Fishlore! ;D

You can help us help you by filling out your tank information by going to "My Settings" on the top right of this page and then "Edit Profile" on the left side. Things such as your water parameters, substrate, plants, and existing fish will be readily available so we can help you quickly.

Bettas are happiest when kept alone. They are extremely personable fish and would thrive in a small 5 gallon setup you could give your girlfriend for the next big event. ;D It would be a poor idea to put one in with barbs, as jwebbe said, they will nip it's fins and they are aggressive enough that the betta will be stressed and probably die.

As Echo said, clown loaches prefer schools and will grow too large for your tank. Dojo (weather) loaches get about 10 inches. Yoyo loaches reach about 6 inches and prefer to be in schools as well. The only loach that comes to mind that would suit your tank is a khulI loach. They get 3-5 inches and need 20+ gallons. Keep in mind that they are bottom feeders and prefer sand substrates because they burrow.

If you have sand then you can look into cories as your tank is large enough for a school of 5-6 and they absolutely love sand. The more the merrier with these lil guys and your barbs shouldn't harass them.

Any sort of fast, schooling fish with short fins should be fine, as jwebbe mentioned. Danios would do great as they are lightning quick and will think the chasing is "fun". Crazy things...they will add a lot of activity to the upper levels of the tank so be prepared for that.

What colors do you like? What type of tank are you going for? These bits might help us suggest more fish for you!

 

Thanks for all the replys. The guy at the pet store said the sharks are a bad idea but I could get away with one loach. But after reading about how big they will get I probably won't get one. He told me I could have a pair of rams, I guess they are like minI cichlids? As long as they go in last and have a choice of hiding spots to call their own. So now I just need help deciding on some sort of bottom feeder to help control the waste or algae in my tank. I have blue and light blue gravel. I'm trying to get a picture of my tank on here but I'm on my iPhone/iPad and it doesn't seem to work. Any suggestions are much appreciated. I just want fish that are colorful and fun. I like the barbs because of their red fins and activeness. Thanks again guys !!

Also according to the pet store guy ( this is a local store not commercial) he said my tank should be safe to start adding fish. Did multiple tests and today I had .25ppm ammonia and the nitrites and nitrates were at zero. It's been cycling for over a month now.

Hmm.. I made a post a few hours ago about my revised fish list and it said it needed admin approval but these posts seem to be working fine

 

Hmm.. I made a post a few hours ago about my revised fish list and it said it needed admin approval but these posts seem to be working fine

HI Kschab, welcome to Fishlore
I have approved your post above.

 

Thanks a lot Ryan!

 

Welcome, Kaldon!

If you have ammonia still in your tank, I would not add fish. How many plants do you have? You'll need 0 ammonia and nitrites and 5-20ppm nitrates for your tank to be cycled properly. What test kit are you using?

Don't believe everything the associates say. They told me I could not have a Ram Cichlid in with Black Neon Tetras because it would eat them or otherwise be a nuisance. They also said they should be with others their size. Ram Cichlids can be good in community tanks... and he was the first one to tell me I shouldn't do that. I didn't take his word since he neglected to include the Ember Tetras in that discussion of cichlid attacks (note: Ember Tetras are a little smaller than Black Neons)

In that size of a tank, I would do nerite snails and/or cory cats (x6). There are some really neat looking Cory catfish.

 

I know it's easy to believe fish stores, but remember that some employees just have one thought- "sell, sell, sell!" Don't add fish yet. Wait until the ammonia's completely gone. If you are going to have tiger barbs, I wouldn't mix the rams. I believe the rams would get picked on too much. If you want a tiger barb community tank, you can add small schools of other barbs. A school of danios are also a good choice. You can also mix the tiger barb school with the regular, albino, and green tigers for a more interesting school.

For the bottom feeders, I say go with cories. They are interesting little creatures and will add a nice amount of activity for the bottom of your tank.

 

Okay thanks a lot guys! I'm going to do a water change today and then test it tomorrow and if everything is 0 I am good to go? is it a must that I have nitrates?

 

If the tank is heavily planted, the nitrates can be none. However, ammonia is converted to nitrites and then that is converted into nitrates. Without nitrates, I would wonder whether the tank officially cycled.

Also, good to test the tap water you are adding to the tank before it gets treated with any water conditioner, etc.

 

Nitrates are usually a sign on whether or not the tank is cycled. Make sure to test your tap water, as escapay said. Some tap water contains low amounts of ammonia. If ammonia does show up, you can use Prime conditioner.

 

I have about 7 or 8 plants and they take up a fair bit of room. So I should just continue waiting until nitrates show up? What if they go away or don't show up? How can I make nitrates happen? Thanks again for the tips!

 

The nitrogen cycle will make nitrates show up eventually - it is a waste product of the bacteria that eats the nitrite. This is why we must clean our aquariums - otherwise nitrate will build up to unhealthy levels and cause health issues with the fish. (Maybe the plants too - but I'm not certain of that)

I would wait until nitrates show up and you have 0 ammonia and 0 nitrites.

Also, can't emphasize this enough - test your tap water.

Which fishless cycle are you doing to create the cycle?

 

I don't have any tests for chlorine but I'm told there is some in tap water so I let the water sit in a 20L bucket next to my tank for a couple days and before it goes in I put a cap of aqueon water conditioner in the bucket half an hour before adding to the tank. When I first got the tank the people at the store recommend I use a couple feeder minnows after a couple of weeks of running the tank. None have died due to water. Only one died because it got stuck to the filter inlet while I was at work. I understand now that this is not the recommended way to cycle on this website but I did not know very much when I got started

 

Oh I wasn't meaning to indicate water testing the tap for chlorine. I figured you were using a water conditioner. I meant for testing ammonia, nitrite (definitely shouldn't have this though), and nitrates. Like my tap water usually is 0.5ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrites, and 0ppm nitrates.

Thanks for letting us know how you started your cycle. There can be some good fish people at the stores, but it is just one person vs here where you can get a better idea since you'll get more opinions.

 

Yea that's why I joined! I figured instead of going to the store every other day and asking a bunch of noob questions I would join here! I bought an API test kit and my ph was a little high at 8.1 but that's just how the water is here and others I've talked to said even adding ph down or perfect ph doesn't change anything due to the carbonates we have so hopefully my future fish can adapt. My ammonia was .25 and everything else was 0. I will check it again tomorrow and hopefully get some fish soon because it's been close to 6 weeks now!!!

I know regular, green and albino tiger barbs can go together but what about the black ruby barb?

 

Tsaye's posts moved here

 

Look at my stock list on my 55 gal I have a couple kind of barbs shark etc no prob. A couple little tuffs between the male green barbs, and the shark will chase them to the other side once in a while. They say no slow moving fish like gouarmis with tiger barbs but I have a blue and they don't mess with her. Maybe its because I had her first and is twice their size.

 

I don't have any tests for chlorine but I'm told there is some in tap water so I let the water sit in a 20L bucket next to my tank for a couple days and before it goes in I put a cap of aqueon water conditioner in the bucket half an hour before adding to the tank. When I first got the tank the people at the store recommend I use a couple feeder minnows after a couple of weeks of running the tank. None have died due to water. Only one died because it got stuck to the filter inlet while I was at work. I understand now that this is not the recommended way to cycle on this website but I did not know very much when I got started

Welcome to FishLore!

I just wanted to help clear up a couple misconceptions.

Most municipalities now put chlorimine in the water instead of chlorine. The reason being is that chloramine stays in the water much longer than chlorine does. So while if you tap water does contain chlorine, letting it sit for a day or two will allow it to leave the water. On the otherhand, if you tap water contains chloramine then letting it sit a couple days is not helping at all.

But it's really a moot point since you are adding the Aqueon Water Conditioner which will remove chlorine, chloramines, heavy metals etc. But water conditioner work instantly, so the water can be added immeadiatly. And this is a good thing. You really want to keep your tank temperature consistant, and if you start adding room temperature water to a heated tank, the tank water temperature will drop, then reheat which can be stressful to the fish. So when I do a water change I use the hot and cold water from the tap to get the water to the same temperature as my tank, put in my water conditioner and put the water right into the tank.

Secondly, fish do not get stuck to the filter inlet and die, they die and get stuck to the filter inlet. Any healthy fish can easily swim out of the intake suction.

 

Oh well then I guess it didn't make it but none of the other have died they seem very happy playing in the bubbler and swimming through the plants.

So I should buy a second thermometer and try and get my new water as close to 77 degrees as possible, add water conditioner and then add it and not worry about having the water sit? Is there anything that I'm doing wrong here to stop the cycle?

 

Most people use a thermometer, but I've been pretty good at getting the temps right by testing the new water on my forearm. I do intend to get a thermometer, though.

Otherwise, yes, you can add the water immediately after treating it with the conditioner. There's nothing you seem to be doing that will stop the cycle.

 

Well should I start using that nutrafin cycle stuff?
Is it worth buying a big 10 gallon thing of pure or distilled water from the store for water changes to get rid of the chloromine? I just want to do this right and have happy healthy fish

 

I'm a little lost on how you are cycling your tank. In your original post you said you had let it cycle for something like 30 days, and from what I can gather at that point you added some fish. A lot of people get bad info from the pet store and think that letting a tank run without fish for some arbitrary amount of time is cycling a tank. But nothing could be further from the truth.

The nitrogen cycle is a biological process that begins once there is ammonia in the water. This process will start once you add fish to the tank, since fish produce ammonia. But since the ammonia and later nitrites are highly toxic to the fish, many people prefer to cycle fishless, since no fish are harmed. In a fishless cycle, you start the process by adding ammonia to the water. This can be in the form of pure ammonia solution (i.e. ammonia and water, no perfumes, surfacants, detergents etc), fish food which will produce ammonia as it decomposes or even a piece of shrimp which also will produce ammonia thru decomposition.

So what will happen is eventually (over the course of 2-3 weeks) the ammonia in the water will cause a bacteria to grow in your filter media that consumes the ammonia as a food source, but releases nitrites as a waste product. So after about 2 or 3 weeks of high nitrite levels a second bacteria will grow in your filter mediathat will consume nitrites as a food source and release nitrates as a waste product. Once you have enough ammonia consuming bacteria to consume all ammonia in the water, and enough nitrite consuming bacteria to consume all nitrite in the water, your tank is cycled.

Nitrifin Cycle contains bacteria that consumes ammonia and also bacteria that consumes nitrite, But sadly those bacteria are not self sustaining and die off after about a week or so. (that is why the directions instruct you to add cycle with every weekly water change for the life of the tank). But while this bacteria is alive it is busy out competing the naturally forming, self sufficient bacteria you really want. As soon as you stop using Cycle, you are back to square one with an uncycled tank. So I would not recommend using Nutrafin Cycle.

There is no need to buy distilled water. Just using a water conditioner (like you are already doing) removes all chlorine, chloramines, heavy metals etc. Distilled water is actually worse for the fish, since it is missing all the trace elements that tap water contains and fish require.

 

Ok thanks I'll just keep doing weekly water changes and do its thing

Everything u said was right except I didn't let it run for 30 days before it was more like 7 to 10 days. I'v had 4 feeder minnows for over a month now

 

Welcome to FL!!
I have 9 Tiger Barbs (love these fish!!!) in a 55 gallon with two bonded Angel fish and an Opaline Gourami. The Barbs keep their squabbles to themselves, but I have to say that putting a Betta fish in is probably not a good idea. I have kept Tiger Barbs with Sword-Tails and Rainbow fish with no problem. I have always had a largish school though.

 

Thanks for the welcoming. I plan to have 8 to 12 barbs depending on the size of the other fish size that I get.

So I did another test and I'm still not getting nitrates. Nothing is changing. Still have about .15 ppm ammonia. And 0 nitrites and 0 nitrates. Is it because I have live plants that the bacteria isn't growing?

 

Live plants won't hinder the cycle, though they will help keep nitrate levels low since they use them as food.

The only thing you can probably add to help with your cycle is a bottle of Tetra Safe Start. I didn't use it so I don't know much about it, but people have used it very successfully. It has all the proper water-borne bacteria needed to cycle a tank. There are links, I believe at the top of this forum, discussing how to properly use it. Otherwise, it's water changes and patience for you for the time being.

 

Should I be doing water changes daily, every other day, or weekly?

 

If you currently have fish in the tank while not being fully cycled, you should be doing water changes every day to keep the ammonia and nitrite levels down. Once you're cycled, you test for nitrates to determine how often you need to water change. They're mostly safe up to around 40ppm, but most people change weekly to keep them from getting that high. I only let mine get around 20ppm before I do a change. Once a week is pretty much my rule of thumb for right now as I'm slowly stocking my tank.

If you are trying to cycle without fish, you'll need to have some type of ammonia source in the water. You can either use pure ammonia(no coloring, perfumes, surfactants or detergens in it), fish food or a raw shrimp(as these decompose, they'll produce ammonia which will begin the cycle).

You'll need to test the water daily for ammonia and nitrite first. It will take around 2-2.5 weeks for nitrites to start to appear and then in a few days you'll start showing nitrates when you test. You'll want to continue testing for ammonia and nitrites, though. When you hit 0 ammonia and 0 nitrites and some nitrates, you'll be safely cycled and ready to add fish.

 

I have consistently been having around .20 ppm of ammonia and nothing else with water changes at 8.1 ph with fish for about a month now

 

Have you tested your tap water to see if it has ammonia in it? That could be the cause. Do you, in fact, have fish in this tank? I'm still kind of lost as to whether or not you do. Pardon if you've said this a few times already.

 

Yes I have had 4 feeder minnows in my tank for a month now. I have not tested my tap water

 

The only thing I can think of is that the feeders are small and don't produce much refuse to create ammonia, so it's taking a while to build your bacteria colony.

 

Should I get a few more or maybe get some hardy fish?

 

Is it possible to return the fish somewhere and do a fishless cycle? I'd hate to put more fish into an uncycled tank.

 

I can take them back they are only 15 cents each but they will be sent to die in a Oscar or piranha tank. They are real happy in my tank. So basically I need to start the cycle over with raw ammonia? It's been almost 6 weeks and I really am not looking forward to another 2 month wait .

 

I'm not sure if this is an option, all things being as they are, but Tetra SafeStart may be a way to go with the fish in. I have never used it and don't know if the current situation in your tank would negate it, but surely someone with far more experience that I have can pop in and let you know if it's a feasible solution.

 

So it's been close to 2 months and my water isn't changing. Still .2 ppm ammonia and still no nitrites or nitrates...

 

What's your pH? When I was cycling, my pH dropped to 6.0 at one point and stalled my cycle.