New Betta suddenly died even though water parameters are perfect.

Hey Everyone!
Got a new Betta couple of days ago but came to witness his sudden death. 5 gallon tank was set up more than a week before, all cycled.

Water is in good shape. pH is 7.8, temperature at 78F, no ammonia, filter running fine.
I had three small guppies in there to see if the water was good enough and they are doing just fine.
Betta on the other hand was a bit stressed when I just introduced him, but thats normal after travel and new tank. He was a bit sluggish and sticked around the top for the first day. On day two he came down and stayed in the corner at the bottom and swam up for an occasional gasp of air. On day three(today) he was passing around the tank and then suddenly drop down on his side and then pace again. At one point he would pace again and drop but not move at all. I thought he is just playing dead because I heard that they do this kind ot thing. An hour later he was still in the same position, gills and fins not moving. I tried to move him a bit with a net but no reaction.
I assume he is probably dead. Dose anyone has any idea what might have happened to him and what might have caused this?

 

5 gallon tank was set up more than a week before, all cycled.

Welcome to Fishlore!

Can you explain the part of your post that I quoted above?

How and for how long did you cycle this tank?

What type of filter are you using and how often have you done water changes?

 

Welcome to Fishlore!

Can you explain the part of your post that I quoted above?

How and for how long did you cycle this tank?

What type of filter are you using and how often have you done water changes?

I bought a new tank just over a week ago. I conditioner the water and introduced ammonia at the start and used live bacteria. Let it run for couple of days and then added 3 guppies. After that had a spike in ammonia, after which I did a 30% water change. Ammonia did fall a bit. I left the tank alone until next day after which ammonia was at 0 again. Guppies appear to be in perfect health.

Filter is a regular hang on back filter with internal pump. I also have a bubble wall buried at the back of the tank to help with the aeration.

Water was changed 3 days before I added the Betta.

 

I bought a new tank just over a week ago. I conditioner the water and introduced ammonia at the start and used live bacteria. Let it run for couple of days and then added 3 guppies. After that had a spike in ammonia, after which I did a 30% water change. Ammonia did fall a bit. I left the tank alone until next day after which ammonia was at 0 again. Guppies appear to be in perfect health.

Filter is a regular hand in back filter with internal pump. I also have a bubble was buried at the back of the tank to help with the aeration.

Water was changed 3 days before I added the Betta.

Unless you used filter media, substrate, something. . . from an already cycled tank, the cycling process typically takes 4 - 6 weeks. Did you use any of those things in this tank?

What kind of ammonia did you add when you started the tank (you said you introduced ammonia at the start)?

What are you using to test? And had you been testing every day, including the day your Betta died?

 

I bought a new tank just over a week ago. I conditioner the water and introduced ammonia at the start and used live bacteria. Let it run for couple of days and then added 3 guppies. After that had a spike in ammonia, after which I did a 30% water change. Ammonia did fall a bit. I left the tank alone until next day after which ammonia was at 0 again. Guppies appear to be in perfect health.

Filter is a regular hand in back filter with internal pump. I also have a bubble was buried at the back of the tank to help with the aeration.

Water was changed 3 days before I added the Betta.

It takes at least a month to cycle, not a week. Adding live bacteria does not shorten this time period. Even if you have no ammonia, you could still have the nearly-as-toxic nitrite or an excess of nitrates.

The guppies aren't the best indication that a tank is betta-suitable either. They're much more robust than bettas and can thrive in rather unideal conditions. By contrast, bettas are overbred disasters and alarmingly sensitive for a "beginner fish."

It's likely that your water quality wasn't actually perfect, and your betta wasn't in prime health to start with either. Most aren't.

 

Unless you used filter media, substrate, something. . . from an already cycled tank, the cycling process typically takes 4 - 6 weeks. Did you use any of those things in this tank?

What kind of ammonia did you add when you started the tank (you said you introduced ammonia at the start)?

What are you using to test? And had you been testing every day, including the day your Betta died?

It was DrTims aquatics 830 ammonium chloride for Aquariums. After that I added live bacteria and I’ve been doing it since then.

I have those 5 in 1 strips, as well as just ammonia testing kit. Also have two alerts (ph and ammonia) hanging inside the aquarium that change color depending on water conditions. I test water every day 2x a day.
I’ve tested the water right before I added the Betta and couple hours after. All showed 0 ammonia.

 

It was DrTims aquatics 830 ammonium chloride for Aquariums. After that I added live bacteria and I’ve been doing it since then.

I have those 5 in 1 strips, as well as just ammonia testing kit. Also have two alerts (ph and ammonia) hanging inside the aquarium that change color depending on water conditions. I test water every day 2x a day.
I’ve tested the water right before I added the Betta and couple hours after. All showed 0 ammonia.

I’d suggest you read this. . . Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle

Given how soon you added fish after starting the cycling process, you’re now doing a fish-in cycle. Because there are fish in the tank, I assume you’ve stopped adding Dr. Tim’s?

I’d also suggest you get the API Master Test kit to test your water parameters.

Read the link I provided above and come back here with questions?

 

Apart from the cycling issues, the flow from the HOB + bubbler could have been too strong for him and may have been pushing him around, especially if he was a longer finned betta. This would also significantly increase his stress.

 

Apart from the cycling issues, the flow from the HOB + bubbler could too strong for him and may have been pushing him around, especially if he was a longer finned betta. This would significantly increase his stress.

He is a short fin. I made a contraption for the HOB it redirects and reduced the flow so it’s not moving the water.
The bubble wall I only turn on for couple of hours just to put some more oxygen in the water. It’s off for the majority of the time.

 

One more thing to add. . .

“Perfect” water parameters are typically 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and some level of nitrates.

Although there are some exceptions to that general rule, I’m pretty certain they don’t apply to your tank.

 

In addition, 3 guppies and one betta in a 5 gallon tank is a bit overstocked, so even if you were seeing 0 ammonia adding all those fish in that small of a tank would’ve been too much for a week old bb colony to process

 

One more thing to add. . .

“Perfect” water parameters are typically 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and some level of nitrates.

Although there are some exceptions to that general rule, I’m pretty certain they don’t apply to your tank.

Thank you for your advice and knowledge! I’ll postpone any further additions to the tank and let the cycle to fully complete.
Thank you everyone for the advice!

 

Thank you for your advice and knowledge! I’ll postpone any further additions to the tank and let the cycle to fully complete.
Thank you everyone for the advice!

You’re welcome. Last piece of (important) advice. . .

Test your water parameters daily (especially ammonia and nitrites, though it might be too soon for nitrites) and change enough water to keep the combined level of ammonia and nitrites at or below 0.50 ppm.

You should also test your pH and post the results here. Good luck!

 

You’re welcome. Last piece of (important) advice. . .

Test your water parameters daily (especially ammonia and nitrites, though it might be too soon for nitrites) and change enough water to keep the combined level of ammonia and nitrites at or below 0.50 ppm.

You should also test your pH and post the results here. Good luck!

So I got a proper testing kit.

Test results are:
pH 7.6
pH (High range) 7.8
Ammonia 0 ppm
Nitrite 0.25 ppm
Nitrate 5.00 ppm

 

So I got a proper testing kit.

Test results are:
pH 7.6
pH (High range) 7.8
Ammonia 0 ppm
Nitrite 0.25 ppm
Nitrate 5.00 ppm

Your pH is fine for cycling a tank.

2 more suggestions. . . If you’re not already using it, I’d suggest you use Seachem Prime as your water conditioner. It will help protect your fish until your tank fully cycles.

I’d also suggest you test your water source for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. . , Let’s make sure none of your tank test results can be attributed to your source water.

When did you do the last water change? And how much water did you change?

 

Your pH is fine for cycling a tank.

2 more suggestions. . . If you’re not already using it, I’d suggest you use Seachem Prime as your water conditioner. It will help protect your fish until your tank fully cycles.

I’d also suggest you test your water source for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. . , Let’s make sure none of your tank test results can be attributed to your source water.

When did you do the last water change? And how much water did you change?

I’m currently using nutrafin aqua+plus as my conditioner.
I’ve tested the water from the tap I use for the tank, tests show 0 on all three.
Last water change was today. Did a 30% change also used a gravel washer to lift up any fish excrements.