New Aquarium Owner Help (dead Fish)

Good evening,

My son and bought a 10 gallon starter kit from petsmart (topfin brand) with the hopes of transferring his betta into a community tank. Along with the purchase we bought 5 harlequin rasboras and four ghost shrimp. We set the tank up on Saturday evening. I made the rookie mistake of getting the tank up and running and immediately acclimated the fish to the water temp and dropped them in.

I used the appropriate amount of solution to clean my tap water. I rinsed all the decorations with water thoroughly as well as the rocks. I also bought a moss ball to help as I've heard they are good for your tank. I had the water temp at a stable 78.8 degrees.

When I got home from work today (Monday, two days after the set up) I noticed one fish struggling, swimming awkwardly inside one of the plants. I moved the plant a tad bit and the fish starting floating dead. I immediately checked the water with my test kit and the results:

PH: 7.6
Ammonia: 0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 0ppm

Now I have a total of 3 dead rasboras. The shrimp are still all alive. I have since moved all of them into a 2 gallon tank that I've had my betta in for a few months thinking that the new tank needs a lot more cycle time. I left the marimo moss ball inside the 10 gallon tank. This worried me because I didn't know how the betta would react the such change, he's actually fine. He's curious but no aggression shown. He's more curious about the ghost shrimp than the rasboras oddly enough.

Now my question is, I've already had fish inside my 10 gallon as well as a few feedings and a marimo moss ball is that enough to have started the cycling process? Should I do anything else besides just monitoring with the test kit? Also the water is just slightly cloudy for a couple days and hasn't cleared up yet (I've read that's normal and will go away after a short period in a new tank). I want to do the cycling process proper now that I'm more knowledgeable after reading a ton of information I didn't know before. I am also worried that my 2 gallon betta tank is a little crowed with 2 small rasboras, 4 ghost shrimp and an average sized male beta.

Currently I have my 10 gallon sitting with the filter turned on high to create as much surface disturbance as possible. There are no fish inside the tank at all. The marimo moss ball is still inside. There are also fish flake food remnants sitting on the rocks at the bottom of the tank from pieces the fishes didn't get.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

 

I’d like to suggest bottled beneficial bacteria if u can get your hands on some. Many people distrust it, but I personally had good results with it. Add it to your 10 gallon to “instant cycle” your tank. However I suggest waiting a day or two before adding your fish back. In the mean time, try not to feed much or at all in the 2 gallon so you don’t riskharming its ccycle.

Btw a cycled tank should show readings of some nitrates.

 

Welcome to FishLore!

The first thing I recommend is you read up on the nitrogen cycle:
Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle

The cycling process will start once there is ammonia in the water. (i.e. as soon as you add fish). It's a little surprising that after three days you were still reading 0ppm for ammonia. Are you using test strips? If so, I would highly recommend getting an API Master Test Kit for Freshwater. Test strips are notorious for being inaccurate, and if you can trust your test results, why bother testing?

Also, I wanted to mention that I believe the minimum recommended tank size for harlequin rasboras is 15g.

But I do not think any of the things I wrote about so far had anything to due with your fish deaths. I do not think the ammonia could have gotten high enough (if in fact you got faulty test results) to kill your fish. And being in too small of a tank would not cause the fish to die that quickly. Plus, from what I understand, shrimp are pretty sensitive to water conditions and they are doing okay.

It could be your acclimation process that was the problem. Many people acclimate by just floating the bag in the tank to equalize the water temp. But really you should float the bag to get the water temps equal, then pour smallish amounts of tank water into the bag every 15 minutes or so. Continue this process for maybe an hour and a half or so. This allowes the fish to more slowly adjust to the differences between chemistry of the water in the bag and the chemistry of the water in the tank. One thing fish do not tolerate well is rapid changes.

Best of luck!

 

Based on some of the things you stated it sounds like overfeeding because you measured no ammonia or nitrites. Fish don't do well when overfed. It can put pressure on their swim bladder which causes the strange swimming behaviors. A fishes stomach is roughly the size of their eyeball.

 

Thank you for the replies.

Let me add the day before the dead fish my test read this.


PH: 7.6
Ammonia: .25ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 5.0ppm

I am using the API freshwater test kit which is very simple to read and use. To acclimate the rasboras I let them sit in the bag inside the new water for about 30min afterwards I dropped the fish in. With the shrimp I did water swapping as well as temperature acclimation.


My plan in the 10 gallon was to put a school of 5-6 small fish a couple ghost shrimp and after the tank was going for a while add in my beta. If you think rasboras are not good in a 10g, what would you recommend as a small schooling fish that will work with a betta in the near future?

Also, I'm very confident over feeding wasn't the cause of any of it. I fed the fish once per day just a small pinch of flakes, some would make it to the ground and the shrimp would take over from there.

How do I know when my 10 gallon is ok to start acclimating the fish?

Thanks for all the help.

 

Yeah, I would really doubt that .25ppm of ammonia would kill the fish. If I had to guess what caused their death it would either be do to not adding tank water during acclimation or they were just sick/weak fish you bought. I think that purchasing fish and adding them to your (the editorial your, not you specifically) is stressful for fish, and if the fish isn't healthy enough, it stresses and dies.

I would like to add that I am of the belief a betta should not have other fish as tank mates (I tried it once and all my cories got their tails bit off). Also, I'm not real good with stocking ideas, so hopefully someone else will give some input if you still want to try putting some other fish in with the betta (some people do manage to successfully do it)

 

I totally feel your pain. We did a similar thing with glofish tetras and they died within hours. Since you did a slow acclimation with the shrimp but not the rasboras, I'm guessing they simply died from shock due to different water parameters.

Since you have some amount of ammonia, I'd second getting some BB for the tank. I got Tetra SafeStart Plus after a week of cycling and it pretty much instantly cycled everything. To keep your ammonia up to help the BB colony settle, you can just feed the tank with flakes. Wait a day or two after adding the TSS before putting fish in and they should do fine. You're supposed to be able to do it right away, but I'd personally wait just a little bit.

So you have 2 rasboras still alive, correct? After doing the TSS, you should be fine to reacclimate them to the 10 gallon along with the shrimp. They're technically too big for the tank in a full school since they can get up to 2 inches, but you should be fine with them for the time being. With just the two, they may become aggresive (not sure if they do or not), so you might be able to just stick with the two or you may need to get more. If you need more, you'll probably want to upgrade the tank as they get bigger. There are some micro rasbora breeds that you could get to add to the tank without overstocking it if you want to just replace the other ones you bought. One such species is rasbora espei, though I don't think chain stores carry them.

I doubt it helps much, but we've got a goldfish, 5 ghost shrimp (maybe 4 now, but the 5th might just be good at hiding), and a snail in the exact 10 gallon you bought with plans to get a bigger tank for the goldfish later. We killed 10 glofish tetras before finally getting the goldfish and giving up on the "pretty pink fish" that my daughter wanted...

 

As a side note, I know nothing about bettas and what may or may not work well with them, I'm just giving a suggestion of a different type of rasbora that can school without overstocking the tank.

 

Personally, I don't think anything except a Betta and snail should be in a tank as small as 10g, it just doesn't feel right let alone a proper sized school of fish.

 

Personally, I don't think anything except a Betta and snail should be in a tank as small as 10g, it just doesn't feel right let alone a proper sized school of fish.

There's plenty of micro schooling fish that are perfect for a 10g. You just have to do lots of research and find them. They're not generally available at big box pet stores though.

 

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. When my tank is ready for fish what should my parameters read around?

 

There's plenty of micro schooling fish that are perfect for a 10g. You just have to do lots of research and find them. They're not generally available at big box pet stores though.

That's why I said personally. I'm sure there are lots of fish that can be in a 10 gallon and survive, but for me it just doesn't seem right to put a school of fish in a tiny 10gal tank. I won't use a 10 gal for any fish but that's just my opinion and I know others will disagree

 

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. When my tank is ready for fish what should my parameters read around?

It should read 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and some nitrate. To consider it cycled you should have had a nitrite spike at one point in the process.

 

That's why I said personally. I'm sure there are lots of fish that can be in a 10 gallon and survive, but for me it just doesn't seem right to put a school of fish in a tiny 10gal tank. I won't use a 10 gal for any fish but that's just my opinion and I know others will disagree

That makes sense. I love all things miniature, so I'm the total opposite. Though I still wouldn't want to overstock and make any fishies uncomfortable.

 

So I just tested the water again a little while ago.

Readings:

PH: 7.4
Ammonia: 0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 0ppm

The water has cleared up greatly as after the first night it was slightly cloudy. I'm concerned that my nitrate levels are not rising at all though since the first test on 8/19.

I did however check my 2 gallon betta tank and the readings read:

PH: 7.6
Ammonia: 0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
Nitrate: 20ppm

To my understanding 20ppm of nitrate is a good level for the tank?

I think I will go and by a bottle of quick start from a pet store to get the right bacteria going in my 10 gallon tank tomorrow.

Thanks for all your help guys.

 

Actually, 20ppm nitrates is the highest amount you want. It is recommended to keep nitrates under 20ppm (assuming you have 0ppm nitrates in your tank water).

Also, I haven't seen many (if any) members claim that Quick Start actually worked. But I have had success several times in the past with Tetra SafeStart.

 

You mentioned plants in your original post. Plants use Nitrates, nitrites and ammonia to feed. If the plants are eating your nitrogen compounds it would explain why you can't measure anything.

 

You mentioned plants in your original post. Plants use Nitrates, nitrites and ammonia to feed. If the plants are eating your nitrogen compounds it would explain why you can't measure anything.

Yeah, I never see nitrates in my 26g because it has lots of plants and only a few fish. Parameters are always 0/0/0. But my son's 10 gallon needs modest weekly water changes to keep nitrates under control because it has some plants but is pretty much fully stocked.

 

I'm not surprised that everything is at 0 now. As others mentioned, plants will eat it up, and it will all disappear if you're not adding something to bring up the ammonia levels.

 

Well the only real plant I have technically is the marimo moss ball. The rest of just fake plants.

 

Just a bit of a follow up, I added the API Quick Start to my tank a few hours ago. Hopefully that will start my cycle as I don't want to leave my other fish in this 2 gallon tank for much longer.

 

Another quick update, after adding quick start bacteria and putting in my 2 rasboras the fish seem much more comfortable. I put them in the tank and fed them as instructed. Performing another test today I still was reading 0ppm Nitrate. Could the moss ball I have be sucking up my nitrates? Also is it ok to be reading 0 nitrates?

 

The moss ball could be sucking up your nitrates, and 0ppm nitrates is not a bad thing.

 

Another quick update, after adding quick start bacteria and putting in my 2 rasboras the fish seem much more comfortable. I put them in the tank and fed them as instructed. Performing another test today I still was reading 0ppm Nitrate. Could the moss ball I have be sucking up my nitrates? Also is it ok to be reading 0 nitrates?

If nitrates are minimal, it's certainly possible. But most fish also don't contribute tons to the bioload, so it might also just be that enough ammonia hasn't accumulated to make a noticeable impact on your nitrate levels yet.

You also may want to overfeed a little for a few days to help push the cycle along, then stop once you see measurable nitrates.

 

I also feel your pain about losing fish, I too was just learning about a year ago. There is a learning curve and I believe so many people that have tried to keep fish have became discouraged after losing fish, and then gave up. But sadly, losing fish is just part of that learning curve. There is a lot to learn, water conditions, filtration, fish compatibility, tank maintenance, and the list goes on. So hang in there, and remember your not alone........lol.......

 

I also feel your pain about losing fish, I too was just learning about a year ago. There is a learning curve and I believe so many people that have tried to keep fish have became discouraged after losing fish, and then gave up. But sadly, losing fish is just part of that learning curve. There is a lot to learn, water conditions, filtration, fish compatibility, tank maintenance, and the list goes on. So hang in there, and remember your not alone........lol.......

100% agree. I will not get discouraged at all. In fact I have a second tank cycled now so much easier with all of your advice.

My first tank is now running great with 6 small rasboras and a beautiful blue beta.

My second tank I just added 5 small corys yesterday.

Thanks for all the help,