Neon tetra disease/ columnaris returns.

So a while back some of my neons had suspected neon tetra disease/columnaris. I euthanized the affected neons and all was good for 3 months until I noticed a white spot on one yesterday. It doesn't look like Ich at all and I read a similar thread about how the neons had the disease and DoubleDutch said it seemed like a virus. I'm starting to think thats what it is because all the neons that have gotten it would still eat and were active. The ones I eventually euthanized lived 2-3 months and were still eating and active. Its only affected my neons, no other fish have been affected. If I do euthanize the neons would I be able to get another type of tetra or will they become affected?

 

You'll probably be okay going with a stronger Tetra species. Buenos Aires, Columbian, Diamond & Black skirt Tetras are some of the most durable varieties.

 

You'll probably be okay going with a stronger Tetra species. Buenos Aires, Columbian, Diamond & Black skirt Tetras are some of the most durable varieties.

Would the black neons work or cardinal tetras?

 

Both are more durable than the modern day Neons. Hope things turn out better this time. Hang in there.

 

Both are more durable than the modern day Neons. Hope things turn out better this time. Hang in there.

Okay. I will euthanize the neons tomorrow. I quarantine all new fish for at least a month so hopefully by the time the new species of tetras I get are done with quarantine whatever this disease is will be gone. Thank you for the help.

 

Just be sure to hand pick each fish, selecting only the most vibrant & active ones. Ask the LFS employee to feed the tetras, just to make sure they're eating.

 

Just be sure to hand pick each fish, selecting only the most vibrant & active ones. Ask the LFS employee to feed the tetras, just to make sure they're eating.

Okay I will. The lfs I go to is in Nashville which is about a 30 mile drive from here called the aquatic critter and from what I've seen they have healthy fish. It will be a while before I purchase cardinals though as I still need to buy female guppies. Once again thank you for the help.

 

Where exact is the white spot located.
My virus suspecion is about the mouthulcers and I don't have any scientific proof.

If mouthulcers I don't see the need for euthanisation immediately.

 

Where exact is the white spot located.
My virus suspecion is about the mouthulcers and I don't have any scientific proof.

If mouthulcers I don't see the need for euthanisation immediately.

Its around the dorsal fin of the fish. The last fish that were affected like i said lived for around 3 months. This is what they ended up looking like at 1 month and I don't have any pictures at 3. When it hit around 2 months 1 developed an ulcer on the mouth. None of them died I just euthanized as I was advised to.

 

This looks like the Columnaris strain which only seems to possibly be solved by taking measures in the provided.environment.
Redshark1 has great info about that.

 

This looks like the Columnaris strain which only seems to possibly be solved by taking measures in the provided.environment.
Redshark1 has great info about that.

I figured it wasn't a normal strain of columnaris because I dosed kanaplex and furan 2 with no affect.

 

Although it might not even be necessary:

Would the black neons work or cardinal tetras?

Yes, if you take older ones. The bigger ones that are sold as "Jumbos" usually are healthier.

 

Its around the dorsal fin of the fish. The last fish that were affected like i said lived for around 3 months. This is what they ended up looking like at 1 month and I don't have any pictures at 3. When it hit around 2 months 1 developed an ulcer on the mouth. None of them died I just euthanized as I was advised to.

That looks like Columnaris on Neon Tetra. I have dealt with this and it is reversible with good care. However, you need to have the knack of providing optimum conditions which can take many years experience.

 

That looks like Columnaris on Neon Tetra. I have dealt with this and it is reversible with good care. However, you need to have the knack of providing optimum conditions which can take many years experience.

Okay. Are there any meds I can use? This disease has only affected my neons. On the previously infected fish I tried kanaplex, 4 courses of furan 2, and aquarium salt. Nothing showed improvement.

 

I don't use meds for this. I fix the problem that caused the disease in the first place which is disruption of the immune system. Meds don't fix the cause and can make things worse.

Neon Tetra Notes:

Due to the severe losses of Neon Tetras in the trade a study was commissioned to investigate what disease was responsible. As a result it is now well established that Neon Tetras are coming to us with a strain of Columnaris which is virulent (kills fish rather than merely living and breeding on them) and difficult to treat (with drugs).

The reason such an expensive study was commissioned for the humble Neon Tetra is that other forms of aquaculture are discovering they have severe problems with disease within their artificial environments. Aquaculture is a huge profit-making solution for producing food for the human population so there is a lot at stake.

Columnaris is a common bacteria found everywhere including aquaria. It is not usually harmful though it will opportunistically attack fish if their immune system fails to defend them, for example if they are poisoned by ammonia or stressed in some other way.

However, this strain on Neon Tetras is not found in the wild and has originated in the unhealthy conditions of fish farms where fish are kept unnaturally, densely populated and medicated and where conditions are ripe for the development of drug resistant and virulent mutations of bacteria.

LFS have posted on forums that 50 Neon Tetras a day can be lost from shop tanks. My own LFS says that either their shipments are healthy or they are all lost.

It is therefore quite likely that many hobbyists will purchase diseased fish as I have done.

I purchased my 30 Neon Tetras in March 2016 and lost six immediately. Being an experienced fishkeeper I provided tip top conditions for them and 18 months later I still had 17 of my original fish.

The quality of my fish leaves a lot to be desired in other ways including physical deformities that would surely be weeded out in wild stocks through natural selection. Farms require that all fish, perfect or imperfect survive to be sold. We can expect the quality to decline further I think until sustainably/unsustainably harvested wild fish become the only viable options.

I have posted on this subject many times before on this forum.

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Steps I have taken to try and give them the life of luxury have included:

Grow plants to enable them to feel secure, to hide if necessary.

Remove other fish that might compete with and stress them (they seem to be unafraid of Bristlenoses, perhaps as these occupy the bottom).

Keep the temperature at 74F as this is supposed to be the preferred temperature of Neon Tetras which originally came from cool and shady jungle streams.

Keep the aquarium cool (74F) in summer by reducing lights as necessary.

Increase aeration by allowing surface agitation.

Maintain a gentle current that is not too fast.

Find a variety of quality foods for the Neons and feed them twice a day.

If your water is hard collect rainwater and mix it with tapwater to soften it.

There's hope that your fish may live a while yet and you will be able to enjoy them.

 

I don't use meds for this. I fix the problem that caused the disease in the first place which is disruption of the immune system. Meds don't fix the cause and can make things worse.

Neon Tetra Notes:

Due to the severe losses of Neon Tetras in the trade a study was commissioned to investigate what disease was responsible. As a result it is now well established that Neon Tetras are coming to us with a strain of Columnaris which is virulent (kills fish rather than merely living and breeding on them) and difficult to treat (with drugs).

The reason such an expensive study was commissioned for the humble Neon Tetra is that other forms of aquaculture are discovering they have severe problems with disease within their artificial environments. Aquaculture is a huge profit-making solution for producing food for the human population so there is a lot at stake.

Columnaris is a common bacteria found everywhere including aquaria. It is not usually harmful though it will opportunistically attack fish if their immune system fails to defend them, for example if they are poisoned by ammonia or stressed in some other way.

However, this strain on Neon Tetras is not found in the wild and has originated in the unhealthy conditions of fish farms where fish are kept unnaturally, densely populated and medicated and where conditions are ripe for the development of drug resistant and virulent mutations of bacteria.

LFS have posted on forums that 50 Neon Tetras a day can be lost from shop tanks. My own LFS says that either their shipments are healthy or they are all lost.

It is therefore quite likely that many hobbyists will purchase diseased fish as I have done.

I purchased my 30 Neon Tetras in March 2016 and lost six immediately. Being an experienced fishkeeper I provided tip top conditions for them and 18 months later I still had 17 of my original fish.

The quality of my fish leaves a lot to be desired in other ways including physical deformities that would surely be weeded out in wild stocks through natural selection. Farms require that all fish, perfect or imperfect survive to be sold. We can expect the quality to decline further I think until sustainably/unsustainably harvested wild fish become the only viable options.

I have posted on this subject many times before on this forum.

Error - Cookies Turned Off

Muscle infections in imported neon tetra, Paracheirodon innesi Myers: Limited... | Request PDF

Steps I have taken to try and give them the life of luxury have included:

Grow plants to enable them to feel secure, to hide if necessary.

Remove other fish that might compete with and stress them (they seem to be unafraid of Bristlenoses, perhaps as these occupy the bottom).

Keep the temperature at 74F as this is supposed to be the preferred temperature of Neon Tetras which originally came from cool and shady jungle streams.

Keep the aquarium cool (74F) in summer by reducing lights as necessary.

Increase aeration by allowing surface agitation.

Maintain a gentle current that is not too fast.

Find a variety of quality foods for the Neons and feed them twice a day.

If your water is hard collect rainwater and mix it with tapwater to soften it.

There's hope that your fish may live a while yet and you will be able to enjoy them.

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I provided the other neons very stable conditions as well. Nitrates would never reach above 20 and ammonia and nitrites were always 0. They were the only fish in the tank and temp was at 76. Its strange how only my neons have been affected and how they lived for 3+ months before I euthanized them. I will try and save these fish as well, thanks for the information.