Need Help With Medication Choice For My Very Sick Betta

I Posted a couple of days ago with not much response about my sick Betta so I’m trying again here. About a month ago he presented with a case of Popeye. I used an herbal remedy which cleared it up within a few days but then it returned in the next eye a few days later. So I treated again with the herbal remedy which is called, Microbelift by Artemiss. It’s supposed to help with everything from dropsy to fin rot. The Pop Eye seemed to clear up but he never returned to his 100% self. Not swimming around a whole lot not flaring and not blowing bubble nests.
I have a 10 gallon bio and carbon filter system tank. I keep it at 80°F. I feed a variety of foods such as brine shrimp beef heart and Betta gold pellets. I have one tank mate for my betta it’s an African dwarf frog and they both get along famously. I just recently purchased some live blood worms they both have been enjoying them. I was wondering if perhaps he got some weird bacterial infection from the worms. His symptoms have worsened in the last few days.
He’s just floating kind of on his side and his floating log most of the time. I’ve been fasting him for two days now. If I move the log he comes out but then just go straight to the bottom of the tank. He seems to be able to ascend fine. But his gills seem to be working really hard and he’s losing his color.
I just started treatment with Furan 2. It’s been 24 hours and there was no change. Should I wait it out for a couple more days or should I try a different medication like a Kanaplex as suggested or should I maybe think about euthanasia? I hate to see him suffering so. Also I chose to remove the frog and put him in a quarantine tank much smaller and treat my large tank so as not to stress my betta who is already sick. Will I have to completely start over with my tank? Here are the current parameters as of the day before I started the treatment.
Ammonia 0 ppm
pH 8.2
Nitrite 0 ppm
Nitrate 2.5 ppm
I do 25% water changes weekly and clean any uneaten food or frog skin daily. I also do a deep gravel cleaning every 4 to 6 weeks. I have live plants. I’ve had the tank running for eight months now.

 

Are his scales pinconing at all? It looks like dropsy to me. Furan 2 and Kanaplex are my two favorite bacterial/fungal medications.

Carbon takes medication out of water, to give you a heads up. You might want to remove your filter cartilage while you treat with any medications. Do a water change every 2 days, with a gravel vac.

In my opinion, you should clean your gravel every week.

 

HI thanks for your reply. I’ve been looking closely at his scales but I don’t see the pineconing. Do you know, What’s the difference in the 2 medications- is one for gram positive or gram negative I mean?

 

I think Kanaplex is stronger. Though I use Furan 2 as well. If you already have Furan 2, use it. Though make sure to take the carbon out of your filter. And do many water changes.

Kanaplex says it treats dropsy, and I think that is what the symptoms match up closes to. Kanaplex is a good medication to have on hand, so maybe you should order some.

Furan 2 treats says it treats body slime, red sores, fin and tail rot, bacteria Gill disease, and red streaks.

In my opinion, in this situation Kanaplex would be better, and it is my over favorite medication, because it treats most diseases.

 

Ok thanks. I had already taken the carbon filter out. I just checked again and I could see some slight pineconing. I could only see it from his side while is was swimming by using a magnifying glass. Maybe it is dropsey. I’ve read on a site called Bettatalk that true dropsey always leads to death because the kidneys fail. It’s also the most common Betta disease and is often linked to live foods. I’m kicking myself for trying the live worms! To top it off my poor frog might die after an overheating in the quarantine tank. It was supposed to be preset to 77 degrees F but I checked last night and it had gone up to 95! He was cooking! I cooled him down slowly and he even ate this morning but he’s looking bloated now! I’ve seen zero improvement in my Betta since the medication was started. Have you had any luck with recovery from dropsey? I think if he doesn’t show signs of improvement by tomorrow I may euthanize. I’m so sad.

 

I have lost a betta to dropsy. I don’t see a lot of recovery from that. It might be best to euthanize him. I’m very sorry.

 

Thank you for your responses. It has helped ease my mind. The pineconing is worse now so I believe it’s time to let him go to Betta heaven.

 

Noooooooooo! Dropsy isn't always fatile and I don't think it's due to live worms. I think you caught it in the very early stages because it is only pinconing a hair. I would check your parameters just to be sure and stop with furan and just use Kanaplex also do 25% water changes everyday. Repolie Fanatic help!

 

You need to make sure you know where your worms come from in the first place and know that they can bring stuff in. Dropsy only occurs when a betta has a compromised immune system. I have no idea what that herbal stuff does because popeye is a bacterial infection (most of the time) and needs to be treated with antibiotics. The herbal stuff also doesn't list ingredients, so he may have not fully recover from popeye. I have treated my betta successfully for dropsy and recommend Kanaplex. You can also use Maracyn 2 and do epsom salt baths for him to relieve some fluid pressure.

 

Thank you for the reply. I think you are right about the compromised immune system. He had something underlying and then probably picked up something else from the worms. There’s only one ma and pa store in town that offers the live worms. Not sure what to ask the pet shop or how to check if they are bad??
Sadly he was near death all day yesterday and not responding to the meds. I decided to put him out of his misery using pure clove oil tho it was extremely difficult for me, He didn’t put up much of a fight and it was quick and seemingly painless. Now I know to get Kanaplex right away. I keep my tank very clean but I guess it’s still possible for them to get sick.
I do have a question though if I want to start up a new tank do I need to get rid of everything substrate live plants etc. ? how do I sanitize and I do know that my nitrogen cycle will be compromised.

 

I’m sorry. If he struggled for that long, I think that was a good decision.

If you want to start fresh, you could take the whole tank down. Except I don’t think that is a great idea.

The way I would recommend is taking all decorations out, and with a gravel vacuum do a 80 percent water change. Leave your filter cartilage in. Soak decorations in hot water. As for live plants, I think a good rinsing with cold water will be good. Then add everything back in, and you should be fine.

You still have the African Dwarf frog right?

 

You can't really know which is bad or good, you just have to ask and search up if they're reputable and high quality. You don't have to get rid of everything, dropsy isn't contagious, but if you want to sanitize, here's a helpful guide:
For plants,
For the aquarium, hot water will do. You'll need to keep testing to see if you still have nitrates to know it's still cycled by leaving a source of ammonia. If you don't see nitrates after leaving some source of ammonia, gotta cycle it again.

 

Noooooooooo! Dropsy isn't always fatile and I don't think it's due to live worms. I think you caught it in the very early stages because it is only pinconing a hair. I would check your parameters just to be sure and stop with furan and just use Kanaplex also do 25% water changes everyday. Repolie Fanatic help!

Thank you for your response.. I didn’t get it until this morning and it was too late. It was a really tough decision but I think he was ready to go. I used the clove oil procedure and it was very quick and seemingly painless. I know now just to use Kanaplex and will have a supply ready if I see any of those symptoms in the future for any fish I have. Tho my tank is empty now. Do you have any advice for starting up my tank again? Should I replace substrate and live plants? How to sanitize. I plan to get another Betta after some healing time.

 

I’m sorry. If he struggled for that long, I think that was a good decision.

If you want to start fresh, you could take the whole tank down. Except I don’t think that is a great idea.

The way I would recommend is taking all decorations out, and with a gravel vacuum do a 80 percent water change. Leave your filter cartilage in. Soak decorations in hot water. As for live plants, I think a good rinsing with cold water will be good. Then add everything back in, and you should be fine.

You still have the African Dwarf frog right?

Ok I’ll do all that and keep using the same bio sponge filter but start fresh with a carbon filter. There is still some medication in the water and residue in substrate. After a good vacuum and running the new filter for a bit it, will it be ok to add the frog? I’ll be sure to add some nitrifying bacteria too.

 

Yes. It should be good.

 

Repolie said some very good information

You can't really know which is bad or good, you just have to ask and search up if they're reputable and high quality. You don't have to get rid of everything, dropsy isn't contagious, but if you want to sanitize, here's a helpful guide:
For plants,
For the aquarium, hot water will do. You'll need to keep testing to see if you still have nitrates to know it's still cycled by leaving a source of ammonia. If you don't see nitrates after leaving some source of ammonia, gotta cycle it again.