My new tank

Discussion in 'Freshwater Beginners' started by Angels4, Jun 13, 2016.

  1. Angels4

    Angels4Valued MemberMember

    Hi , I am setting up a new tank , it's been running for a week with just live plants .I ordered my fish and they will arrive tomorrow , I have 4 dime size Angels, 2 young German Rams and 2 young electric Rams .I want to add a few discus ? Their discus are also young they are 2 to 2 inches juveniles .would my tank be over stocked when everyone is grown?
  2. aliray

    alirayFishlore VIPMember

    Welcome to the forum and glad you joined us. You need to make sure your tank has been through the nitrogen cycle to make it safe for fish. Click on the words and it should take you to a link that explains it. Your tank would not be cycled yet. Hold off on any more fish and yes you would be very overstocked with discus. Since the fish are arriving tomorrow you will have to try to do a fish in cycle . The fish you have ordered are all very sensitive fish, with regards to water quality. I normally use Tetra Safe Start or Tetra safe start Plus , there start up versions, but I don't think it is going to work with the fish you chose. You need an API Master test kit for your water to check for PH, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Also set your heat to 80 degrees today to temp for the angels and rams. Also get a bottle of Seachums Prime to treat the water. I would suggest you use Stability to cycle the tank as you will need to frequent water changes with the baby angels. CindiL is my go to person to explain the Stability cycling. Hopefully she will see the mention and come to help. Alison:;hi2
  3. CindiL

    CindiLFishlore LegendMember

    Hi, welcome to fishlore :;hi2

    Is this your first tank or an additional tank? What size tank is it?
    aliray, covered it all.

    Whether or not you cycle with Tetra Safe Start Plus or Seachem Stability will depend on the size of tank but these are all very sensitive fish normally only added to a very stable tank, not a tank just starting out with fluctuating ammonia and nitrite levels.

    I think I can help you keep the fish safe and cycle the tank with Stability as long as you're willing to do quite a few large water changes when needed? :)

    You'll need at a minimum Seachem Prime, Seachem Stability and the API Fresh Water liquid test kit as strips will not be accurate enough to cycle with.

    Let us know the answers to these questions and Alison's and then we can go from there.

  4. aliray

    alirayFishlore VIPMember

    Thanks Cindi, I have never used the stability, only the TSS. I knew you could help her, I will follow the thread. Another question I meant to ask is does she know what kind of bag they are being shipped in but that will change how to acclimate the new fish. Alison;)

  5. CindiL

    CindiLFishlore LegendMember

    I just use it like only cycling with Prime and never exceed 1.0 in ammonia and nitrites. The stability just makes things go much faster by seeding the tank with bacteria and only need 24 hours or so to attach themselves onto surfaces. This means daily water changes are ok with the two products (if necessary).
  6. OP

    Angels4Valued MemberMember

    Thanks for all the response.I have added the water conditioner and also the ph stabilizer and flourish for the plants.I am using test strips because they seemed easier but will get something is 6.2,all others are in safe zone , very soft water .I was sent instructions from the store I purchased the fish from of how to acclimate them to the new tank .
    I also have coming the hydro pro 3 sponge filter for the bio it needs , I guess I should have ordered it first and had it going already.
    Tank temp has been set at 78 in the first part of week and turned up to 80 the last 2 days.What do I need to add or do now ?
    Thanks so much.

    I forgot to add , I am suppose to do 30% water changes daily for first week and then do I treat the water I put back into the tank ?
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 13, 2016
  7. CindiL

    CindiLFishlore LegendMember

    What ph stabilizer are you using? Where is your ph after using it? It will be very hard to cycle a tank with a ph of 6.2. I would not be using anything like PH up etc but any product that says it increases KH (alkalinity) would be a good product to use as it will increase ph and also the buffering ability to keep your ph from falling further. Seachem makes a good one called Alkaline Buffer or even plain baking soda is a great KH and ph buffer.

    Your sponge or any filter with foam or media will house the bacteria but you need something to seed your filter (it will speed things up since you will have fish). You didn't make a mistake because unless you had an ammonia source like fish or household ammonia, not much would have happened even with the sponge. The bacteria need a food source (fish, or fish food or ammonia).

    Will you give the most exact number that you can from the strips instead of "safe"? They should show some number. It will help figure things out :)

    When are your fish due to arrive? I think it can be done with help but the fish you are receiving are very sensitive fish and will die fairly easily without a cycled tank (ammonia and nitrites = 0). I'd read through the nitrogen cycle (in above post from Alison) to get a little information on what goes on inside your aquarium when you add fish.

    I would pick up Seachem Prime, Seachem Stability and an API Fresh Water Liquid test kit still. With these three items we can keep your fish safe :)

    The information on doing 30% daily changes is not very helpful for you because you really won't know the parameters. Instead we'll use a simple formula if you pick up these items above.

    What is your current water conditoner? The reason I recommend seachem prime is because it will detoxify ammonia + nitrites up to 1.0 which you'll need while cycling. Amquel Plus also does the same thing, but is a big more expensive per gallon.

    Lastly, still need to know what size tank this is?
  8. OP

    Angels4Valued MemberMember

    The aquarium is 40g, the water conditioner is aqueon water conditioner .. It says detoxifies heavy metals ,ammonia and other elements from fish waste.The other is seachem neutral regulator.I added dosage on bottle and ph is still between 6.2 and 6.8.nitrate 20,nitrite 0,hardness very soft,chlorine 0,alkalinity 0.
  9. OP

    Angels4Valued MemberMember

    Do I still need the seachem stability and prime with the conditioner I have?i I am going today to get a new test kit....please let me know if I need the stability and prime.Thanks for all your help .
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
  10. CindiL

    CindiLFishlore LegendMember

    Good morning!

    I would still get prime and TSS+ or stability. So you'll have a 40g tank and the 6 small fish to start out with right? You said they are all young? You might be alright using TSS+ Tetra Safe Start Plus, I know most pet stores sell one or the other. TSS+ is really easy to use and I think will be alright for your size tank and fish if they're small. Make sure the bottle you buy is for a 40g tank or even one size tank larger. Make sure it is the + plus version and not the monthly version. Let me know which one you find and we'll go from there. I'd say TSS+ would be my first choice with your size tank to start out with.

    Once cycled you can use up your aqueon water conditioner with water changes so you don't waste it and then after that just use prime only.

    Unfortunately the neutral regulator they sold you is the wrong product and will not increase your carbonates which is exactly what you need. It actually softens water and we need your water harder because it is too soft. Even softwater fish need some minerals :)

    The best thing you can do I think is pick up some crushed coral, they sell 2lb jars by the betta section generally as crushed shells or you can buy a giant bag of it usually by the substrates. It will say crushed coral or there is also crushed aragonite. Sea shells work, limestone or limestone decorations will work also. The shells will slowly dissolve and increase your carbonates KH (preventing any PH crashes) and will raise your PH some, ideally it would be closer to 7.0.

    You can put crushed coral into a media bag that you can buy there and put the bag into your HOB filter or you can have the shells loose in your tank on the substrate, its up to you. Most people just put the shells in their filters, it can take the place of other bio-media like ceramics if you have limited room.

    When will your fish be arriving? I might have you use some baking soda if they're coming soon. You might want to purchase Seachem Alkaline buffer in the future but we'll see how the shells and baking soda do.

    Don't add in the bacterial additive until you add the fish. Are you familiar with the nitrogen cycle ? You should be able to click on the words in blue and it will take you to a link describing it.

    When you get home with the API test kit, measure ph, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates of your tap water. Measure ph and ammonia in your tank also. Its empty right now right?
  11. aliray

    alirayFishlore VIPMember

    In reading the first post, it sounds like 8 fish are arriving in todays mail. 4 rams of two different kinds and 4 dime size angel fish. If I read it correctly. The good thing is at least it is a 40 gal tank. Alison:;hi1
  12. CindiL

    CindiLFishlore LegendMember

    Oh ok, yeah I mis-read that. So four angels and 4 rams.

    I agree I would not add any discus to this tank. I am not a stocking expert but your angels will get very large. TexasDomer, el337
  13. TexasDomer

    TexasDomerFishlore LegendMember

    Unfortunately I think you're pretty stocked for a 40 gal. Discus need a 55 gal minimum, and I wouldn't keep them with other cichlids in a 55 gal. In bigger tanks, others have had luck keeping them with angels.

    When two of the angels pair up, you'll need to rehome the non-paired two. Your tank isn't big enough for two pairs.

    Same with the rams, unless you got 1 male and 3 females, then a harem might work.
  14. OP

    Angels4Valued MemberMember

    The babies have arrived and in the tank a few hours , I am in the way to Petsroee to get the corral and tss and prime , I have t added any baking soda yet .
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
  15. OP

    Angels4Valued MemberMember

    How do I post pics ?
  16. jdhef

    jdhefModeratorModerator Member

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