Moving ram eggs and fry tank set up - advice needed urgently please!

May I ask for some urgent advice please? My ram's still have eggs which the male is fanning but the female is having a bit of a nibble. I'm setting up a 60 litre/14 gallon fry tank today, should I move the eggs (keeping them submerged) or leave them in hopes they hatch before being eaten and move the fry if they arrive? The eggs are on a piece of bogwood, it is possible. The other thing is that I have a hang on the back filter which is already matured and would do a great job in that tank but I'm worried about taking it off the tank it's on too early (external installed for 2 weeks or so now). If I move eggs in today or wigglers in early in the week is a sponge filter ok initially with the proper one going in when they're a bit bigger and producing appreciable waste? I have an air pump with two outlets I can use to run both the sponge filter and an airstone as I realise eggs need a lot of oxygen. Thank you!

 

Sponge filter yes and probably all that can be used around fry for a month ..
Separate the eggs ! Move the eggs to clean half filled bare bottom tank ..
The fry may be quickly eaten once they become wigglers and one of the parents move them ..
The female eating fry is pretty common and the male will do his best to keep her away in many cases .Sometimes even killing her !

 

Wow, ok that's what I was worried about, hence rushing out right now to get this sorted. I assume use water from tank they're in initially? Thank you!

 

Yea tank water should be fine ,then water changes with new clean for the fry as they eat and you feed them ..
Good luck !
I raise my fry in small 2.5 ,5,10 g tanks .
Keeping them close together and near the food is important for first 2 weeks free swimming .

 

You just answered my second question, my spouse will freak if I set up a 15 gallon on top of all the other tanks and I did kind of think that might be too big for them. I was looking to do that size as I have two breeding pairs of rams, a breeding pair of plecs, apistos that are likely to breed, other fish that may do so possibly inundated in the near future. I'll set up 7 gallon now and can add more little tanks if needed for other fry. Thank you!

 

Ah, should I put in an airstone as well? I have liquifry in hopes they hatch, any other recommendations for type of food and amount to feed?

 

Airstone yes right away and or little sponge filter after first week . Don't stir the fry up with it just keep surface moving ..Keep the stone close to surface for first week ..
I use the Aquatops CAF-10 as it is little and allows me to spray clean the sponge with my faucet while leaving the gravel in base still covered in bacteria for nitrogen processing .

https://www.aquatop.com/products/internal-sponge-filter-caf-10
The liquid fry may work , I use fresh hatched BBS.I hatch 3 times a day! I use 3 2 liter bottles with air line [rigid] just sticking out to gw=et air to bottom.
I like Golden pearls as a first prepared food and offer 50-100 micron around day 7 of free swimming..
I feed BBS as main food for first month or so but constantly trying to sneak prepared foods in from week 1 or 2 .
First feedings should be less then you probably think ..Like a drop or maybe 2 of the liquid fry or BBS..
Ram fry are very small so only a little food is needed per feeding.
Feeding as often as possible is a good thing but 2-3 times a day should work .
Rams are some of the hardest fry to raise so don't get discouraged ..14 days free swimming is a big hurdle !
I am on year 7 or so of learning about rams ..They are sneaky smart fish !

 

Thanks so much that's brilliant - managed to set up as suggested and move eggs so fingers crossed

 

Once again thank you, they hatched last night and I now have little wigglers. Most have managed to get off the wood and are on the bottom of the tank but I've left wood in for now.

 

Nice !
Moving them was perfect timing ..
Keep the bubbles going but make sure you are not stirring them up .
Temperature will dictate how long till free swimming but should be about 2-3 days ..
The wood can stay , they will find small bites to nibble on it in time .
Congrats !

 

Thank you - so relived I moved them when I did, they hatched earlier than expected and no way would the fry have survived the main tank! I'm using a suction attached bubbler which is easy, I stuck it near the eggs to 'fan' them until hatched and now it's near the surface for agitation and to avoid stirring the fry. A couple are still on the wood and the rest are wiggling along the bottom and trying to swim. Temp's just about 80 and I've put bits of liquifry on the wood and bottom of the tank - wood has a lot of biofilm as well. It's a HUGE piece, takes up the entire fry tanks and was a **** to get out of the main tank without exposing eggs to air. Guess I'll leave it until they're a little bigger to avoid risk of losing any then replace with a small hide and some bunched plants. Does that sound ok? I'll start setting up to hatch BBS, hopefully they'll hatch in time. My clown fish are also getting ready to lay so I'll be needing those on tap anyway lol. Are rotifers any good as first food for freshwater fish?

 

If you can get temp up a little it would be good .
80f+ is best .
Careful adding food before they hatch it can foul quickly ..
The eggs touching air is not a concern!
Under 2 minutes exposure usually has no issues ..
Yes hatch BBS.
Rotifers are also a great food and the prefered food for clown fish [marine ] .
Most breeders fed freshwater fish saltwater live food [BBS] while marine breeders feed fresh water live food [rotifers].
My understanding of this is to control and limit the bacteria introduced to the fry ..
You see what ever may be in with the BBS will not live in fresh and what ever is in with the rots will not survive long in marine ..

 

That makes sense. I put a bit of liquify in when I saw wiggling, there is about 2 or 3 drops in there, suppose I should let them get that before adding more to avoid fouling the water? How soon should I feed brine shrimp hatchlings? I've seen instant ones, not sure if any good? Sorry for all of the questions, first fry for me apart from baby plecs which my **** betta girls ate before I realised they were there!

 

Don't feed till one day free swimming ,not even when they first swim . They do not eat yet at all.
They have an egg sac that nourishes them till swimming.
I have heard the intant BBS works if the fry will eat it .
Often it is the movement of live food that first catches the young fry attention .Sometimes without movement the fry will not know it is food ..

 

Ah cool thank you, should I try to scoop up the liquifry then? At least I have time to get BBS hatching, The set up looks easy to DIY, I've got egg/salt/micro algae mix on order

 

I use a rigid line that fits airline to syphon the fry tanks .
If hat is possible yea get it out ..
Good eggs are the secret to hatching IMO .
I have nothing special going for my BBS just good eggs .
I don't feed my BBS as I feed them all as soon as they hatch .
The longer you keep them the more they absorb their yolk sac which is what you want the fry to have ..

 

Once again thank you and sorry for even more questions! I've removed the Liquify with a syringe but the fry tank is testing between 0 and .25 ammonia. The tank that went in was on water change day and I'd had a dwarf gourami pass just before causing the very slight spike as I found it in the morning so likely after some hours. I had put a little Prime in the tank with the eggs yesterday and dosed again just now, is Prime ok for fry? Can I do a careful water change now or tomorrow if I match temperature, ph, kh, etc? would it be ok to add bottled bacteria to fry tank? I use Microbe-Lift Special blend, great stuff - even better than Stability. The little buggers are determined to exist - when I dropped some Prime in they actually swam up to the surface, thought that would take a few days!

 

You can change water without issue .
Just match it up .
I usually have to do more then 50% when they turn from eggs to wigglers to remove the methylene blue I use with the eggs .
The fry will be better in good clean water .
I use seachem safe so prime should be fine ..
I see no benefit to adding the bottled bacteria .
You will be changing water often enough to keep from having issues .
The 'cycled' filter is really only a comfort for the keeper. It increases the time between water changes ..
The fry need better water so it is like cycling with fish in .You are going to do 50% daily or every otherday if you want clean water .
It is nearly impossible not to overfeed fry and I always like to remind keepers that even food eaten turns to waste .The amount you feed has direct impact on the amount of water changes you will do ..
All the water changes are why small tanks rock also ! I have 2 1/2 -180 g.I don't raise fry in big tanks..Easy to change 50% + in smaller tanks IMO.

 

Awesome, thank you! I'll test ph in there to match and do that now. Assuming the Prime is ok?

 

Thanks again for all your help, the little ones are looking a bit more like tiny fish now and I have BBS on the go

 

That looks great for them ! I LOVE my 2 and 3 g tanks for fry .I get the best success with them .
Keep us posted on how they do .
NICE !

 

Ah cool, thank you. It's a 7 gallon to grow them out in a bit - I'll remove the wood when they're a little bigger and put a couple of small hides in and some bunched plants. Still tiny but they're getting bodies instead of egg sacks now and I can see little eyes. Hard to count but I think a couple of dozen are still wiggling, I'll be so happy if a few make it to adulthood. If any survive I have a good friend just now setting up a 55 gallon or so tank who already really wants rams, there's plenty of time for him to cycle and stock initially with less delicate fish while they grow and he's going to plan for them to come young so nothing that would eat juveniles. I have a few other friends and my dad in law with suitable tanks who can take some if this first lot goes well. If it keeps happening I'll have to bring them into the LFS I work in as a second job but then at least I know they won't be sold to people who don't know how to look after them, we're very strict with fish sales. No fish is sold to go into an un-cycled, unsuitably sized or stocked tank or in too small of a shoal.

 

Update on the little guys - all free swimming and shoaling around looking for food at 5 days old. They're picking at the algae on the wood and the filter sponge, presumably for microfauna. The brine shrimp hatched today and they've gone mad for them, it's amazing watching these tiny squiggles learn how to be predators. Camera battery died but I'll see if I can get video later

 

Hopefully this video link to FB works Abigail Ziering - German blue ram fish fry learning to...