Mollies laying on the bottom of tank

HI there!

I am very new to fish and my daughter has a 10 gallon aquarium with the orange and black mollies and two dalmation mollies...there's also a couple other fish. The mollies have ALL been laying on the bottom of the tank very lifeless and just when I think they are dying...I'll feed them and they come to life and eat...then back down to the bottom??? I've been around aquariums before, but I've never been responsible for one before and I don't know what to do?? The water is good...I completed changed/cleaned their tank last weekend. I don't know if they are dying, getting ready to give birth(but then why are they all laying down there???...just the mollies, though!)or what they heck is going on?! Any suggestions are greatly appreciated! ~Lisa

 

Hello and welcome!!

The way we help people here is by asking a LOT of questions and trying to get as much information as we can so we can give you the right answers... so please excuse all my questions!!

Do you know what kind of fish the other fish are? If the other fish can handle it, mollies like a little aqaurium salt in their water so that might help. You can find that at any fish/pet store.

What is the temperature of the tank?

How long has the tank been running? and how long have they been acting like this?

Since you are new to fish keeping, I'm going to have you read a little bit so you can get some help.
We have a great beginners section https://www.fishlore.com/Beginners.htm and also I would read this article about the Nitrogen Cycle https://www.fishlore.com/NitrogenCycle.htm which is the reason a lot of new aquariums have fish that end up dying.

I know you said that you cleaned your tank well this weekend, that's great. What are you feeding them?

I would invest in a Master Test Kit like this one this will help you a lot. Usually when people have a problem, the first thing that people on here ask is the water chemistry.

I hope they are going to be alright!

 

do you have any airstones in the tank?

 

do you have any airstones in the tank?

YIKES! I don't know what an airstone is, but I do have a "thingy"(very technical, I know ) that I put into the barrel that I have for them to hideout in...it oxygenates the water, I believe. It is a long thin tube that has something hard at the end that sits inside the...maybe an airstone??? Sorry, I know I sound ignorant...I truly am on this subject. I am trying!!!

Hello and welcome!!

The way we help people here is by asking a LOT of questions and trying to get as much information as we can so we can give you the right answers... so please excuse all my questions!!

Do you know what kind of fish the other fish are? If the other fish can handle it, mollies like a little aqaurium salt in their water so that might help. You can find that at any fish/pet store.

What is the temperature of the tank?

How long has the tank been running? and how long have they been acting like this?

Since you are new to fish keeping, I'm going to have you read a little bit so you can get some help.
We have a great beginners section Freshwater Aquarium Fish Guide For Freshwater Fish and also I would read this article about the Nitrogen Cycle Aquarium Nitrogen Cycle which is the reason a lot of new aquariums have fish that end up dying.

I know you said that you cleaned your tank well this weekend, that's great. What are you feeding them?

I would invest in a Master Test Kit like this one this will help you a lot. Usually when people have a problem, the first thing that people on here ask is the water chemistry.

I hope they are going to be alright!
WOW! Thanks for all of your helpful info. I'm a bit overwhelmed as this is so new to me. ANYWAY...I would like to know if I have males or females in the tank....how do I tell, please? I have one tiger barb that has survived several months(the remaining one after several others died and I didn't replace them because they are such bullies. I know he is meant to be with others, but honestly he does seem fine!) and one silverish fish with a black dot towards the back of the body towards the tail area...not sure what that is? Also...a plecostamus(sp?),aka algae eater, that I added with the dalamation mollies over the weekend. I saw some mollies in a tank when I went to get a massage this morning, and the receptionist said that the female hangs out on the bottom of the tank when she is ready to give birth. This was my first thought when I saw this behavior in my own tank, BUT why would BOTH orange/black mollies(maybe platys? now that I've seen some pics) be doing this same behavior? Thanks for your time...I appreciate it!

 

If you could get a good picture of the fish, we could probably help with identifying... In fact, there's an entire section on here devoted that, and loads of helpful people who will look things up if necessary.

As for gender identification, the male mollies will have a pointy/spearlike fin just at the base of their stomach, whereas the females have a fan-like fin there.

 

If you could get a good picture of the fish, we could probably help with identifying... In fact, there's an entire section on here devoted that, and loads of helpful people who will look things up if necessary.

As for gender identification, the male mollies will have a pointy/spearlike fin just at the base of their stomach, whereas the females have a fan-like fin there.

Ok...I took some pics, but I'm not sure how to attach them or post them so you can see? Also, the dalmation mollies are hovering near the top of the tank and they look like they are gasping for air. HELP!!!

 

If you could get a good picture of the fish, we could probably help with identifying... In fact, there's an entire section on here devoted that, and loads of helpful people who will look things up if necessary.

As for gender identification, the male mollies will have a pointy/spearlike fin just at the base of their stomach, whereas the females have a fan-like fin there.

Ok...I took some pics, but I'm not sure how to attach them or post them so you can see? Also, the dalmation mollies are hovering near the top of the tank and they look like they are gasping for air. HELP!!!

If the pictures are small enough, then just click the "Additional Options..." link right below the typing box. If they're too big, you can downsize them by following the instructions on one of the other sections in the forum, it's a sticky at the top of one of them, I think General Discussion. That will put them at the bottom of your post.

Have you gotten a testing kit to test what the water is like? If you have, listing off the numbers can help people on here figure out what might be going on.

 

Thank you! I'm off to pick up my daughter at school and I'm going to pick up a kit on the way. I posted the pics under the Sep 2007 fish of the month spot. It says "Lisa's mollies or platys". Notice how the orange/black ones are just laying there...so bizarre. AND the dalmation mollies are mostly at the top of the tank looking like they are gasping...is this ammonia, possibly?

 

It never hurts to do a 25% water change, when in doubt. Even if you don't have the test kit. When you get the kit, check it and then do water changes until the ranges close to 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and 5 nitrates. This will be hard to do unless the tank has completed it's cycle, but it is the only way to keep your fish healthy. Good Luck

Fish in the Frozen North

 

Oh OK, that clarifyes things a bit (gasping at the top). It could be one of the usual suspects (a'nia/n'ite/n'ate) ooooor the temp that's too high.

 

The temperature was "in the green" but I noticed that it was only 70 degrees! Poor fishies! I turned on their heater, but I think I'm too late. The silver fish with the black dot towards the tail(don't know what kind it is) appears to be bleeding internally. I feel so bad. :'( I also put in some ick medicine last night and took out my carbon filter because one of the lethargic orange mollies has the "sugar crystals white specs" on her). Both mollies(orange ones) are still very lethargic today...I think they are dying. I feel so bad.

Oh OK, that clarifyes things a bit (gasping at the top). It could be one of the usual suspects (a'nia/n'ite/n'ate) ooooor the temp that's too high.

Also, the only two gasping for air are the dalmation mollies(pair of them)the rest of the fish are now appearing ill, but not gasping for air. I feel so bad. An ex boyfriend set up the tank and promised to keep care of it for my daughter since I'm not a "fish person" and he has been out of the picture for a couple of months now. Anyway....fishies are suffering. :'(

 

Oh Lisac, how awful. You must feel really bad. Look, there's no saying that this is it. Let's try to find out precisely what is wrong with them. You'd be surprised how quickly they can recover from a really bad situation. All hope is not lost.

Right, the temp could definitely have stressed their organisms, leaving them open to infections. As could the nitrate/nitrite/ammonia increase. So when treating sick fish the first thing to do is to ensure that they are in optimal conditions, but please do so gradually. I'd go up by 1 degree C a day, whatever that works out in Farenheit.

I'd also do 50% water changes at least every 2 to 3 days to be sure those n'ites/n'ates/a'nia don't creep up. If other people advise you to do different frequency of water change, it doesn' matter. Try to hit it in the middle. Am just saying what I would do but it's not an exact science. When you do water changes, it's really important to put the water back in in a way that won't upset the fish, so the temp needs to be very similar to the tank's temp, as does the pH. I also use a watering can for pouring the water back in, as that stirs their water less, and is more pleasant for the fish (it's kind of like light rain for them, as opposed to tropical storm at each water change).

Now diagnosis: a couple of them nearly definitely have ich. So I would gradually increase the salt content of the tank (1: via the bucket water, not mixing the salt directly in the tank) (2: not kitchen salt, but aquarium salt) with your water changes, until you reach a concentration of about 1 tblspoon per 5G. (remind me: you don't have any inverts in that tank, do you? Just livebearers? This is important as salt can hurt some animals)

Unfortunately for diagnoses, sick fish frequently actually have 2 problems or more at the same time, as the first problem weakens their immune system.

Things to watch out for that will help you/us diagnose are:
- change of behaviour (obviously yes in your case)
- change of colour
- change of appetite
- red gills
- gasping
- upraised scales
- really swollen belly
- really sunken belly
- film on eyes (one or both)
- swollen eyes (one or both)
- funny poop. Stringy and transparent
- permanent poop hanging from the fish (constipation)

Remind me: how often do you vacuum the substrate?

 

Okay, from the pictures, you have three platies. The red and black one is a Red Wag, the other two look like Variatus Platies.

My suspicion is that it's your water quality. Even tanks that have been running for quite a while can be un-cycled. What you can do is get some Prime (it's a white bottle with a red label, should be with water conditioners) and dose your water with that. It won't solve the problem in the long run, but it might save the fish. Have you read some of the stuff on here about the Nitrogen Cycle? It's really worth reading. When I first started bumming about here, the way people kept plugging it was weird, but once you do, it explains so much about beginning fishkeeping. It's a little complex at first, but bear with it.

Water changes will also help, like Armadillo pointed out.

 

But Lisac, I thought you'd checked your water with the kit? Do you have the results yet?

 

Lisac, I am so sorry you have problems with your tank. The ich problem is very serious, if you don't start working with this before they are all covered with the "salt specks", it will kill your fish. Problem is they may have had it quite awhile, as it can infest their gills (causing gasping), long before you see it on their bodies. Ich responds to #1 Salt, (never table salt because it has iodine), Kosher salt is also ok, or aquarium salt. #2 Raise the temperature, try to hit between 82 and 84 degrees F, this can be done safely over a day. This kills ich, but it takes up to 2 weeks to rid the tank. #3 medication, problem with this is some can mess up your biological cycle. But if you want to use medication you should use a combination of ich medicine and an antibiotic as many times the fish are susceptible to bacteria infections if they are weakened by ich (a parasite).

So keep that temp up, and do the water changes. If you are doing daily water changes, remember to treat the new water to take out chlorine, and add salt or medication to it to keep up the therapeutic dose for AT LEAST 5 days, then you can start backing off on medication, keep up the salt and high temps for 2 weeks. Good luck, just remember EVERYONE gets ich now and again.........I just had a ram with it, tough little bugger, I treated him, and he's back in the tank all happy again.

Fish in the Frozen North

 

Just one thing, though, Sutsina Flower. What's 70F in Celsius? Isn't it a huge step up to go in one day from 70F to 82F? I'd try to do it in steps, rather than in one go. What do you all reckon?

 

OK....THANK YOU SO MUCH for all of your advice and help. I went to Petco and they tested my water...it's ammonia....probably from my very dumb move of completely cleaning the tank last weekend and then adding in the 3 new fish. I know...I know....NOT what I should have done, but...it's done and I'm really trying to save them, but it may be too late. I also got my own master testing kit and a book on beginning aquariums too. They advised me to get Wardley's 3-in-1 7.0ph water conditioner. I've added it (4tsp for the 10gallons) and I also added in another ick tablet. I treated for ick yesterday, but my poor little platys are still suffering hanging out toward the bottom. The plecostomus(sp) is dying too. I feel so bad. The temp was up this morning, but the thermometer says it is now 70 degrees again??? Does anyone know what direction to turn the dial is it generally counterclockwise or clockwise to increase temperature??? Thanks again...I know I'm ignorant on this subject and I appreciate you all being so kind and trying to help rather than make me feel worse for not knowing what I'm doing. My ex got these fish for my daughter and now that he's out of the picture...they are stuck with me as she is only 6 and is learning along with her mommy. THANKS! Lisa

 

The cool thing about this forum is that everyone here remembers that at one time, they were a beginner too. So you make mistakes. We all have. And, the fact that you're here and learning from it, means that someday, when someone posts about their fish hanging out on the bottom of the tank, you'll know what they're talking about, and how to maybe help them along too.

Does the heater have any sort of meter on the top, showing which side is more heat output? Mine turns clockwise, but I don't know if that's the general design.

 

No ...it doesn't ...just an arrow to turn left or right...so I suppose I should assume clockwise to turn up? What do you think?

Also...sucker fish is almost gone...he's still breathing(barely) and floating most of the time....feel so bad!

 

No ...it doesn't ...just an arrow to turn left or right...so I suppose I should assume clockwise to turn up? What do you think?

Well, either way you'd want to do it gradually, so you don't temperature shock the fish. 70 isn't ideal, but they're accustomed to it, and if all of a sudden their water is 82, that wouldn't be healthy.

I would try a fraction of an inch clockwise, and watch it. Does it have an indicator light, to tell you when it's going? Because if so, turning it up should make that light come on more frequently.

 

Another thing that has me concerned is that there is NO light coming on and I swear that there used to be one??? My 6 year old, who usually doesn't forget ANYTHING, swears there wasn't a light ever. I'm afraid it isn't working. NOW...the platys(except for 1 which is still on the bottom for most of the time)are mostly at the top trying to breathe. I was happy the orange platy was moving, but at the top? The test strip appeared wnl except the ph was 8.4 if I'm reading it right. OK...what about adding salt? My book says I can add table salt as long as it isn't iodized. I have morton's and it says that is is not a source of iodine. What do you think? I'm feeling so desperate. :'(

 

Do you have any instructions left over from the supplies? Or can you look up what type of heater it is online? The more you know, the more you can understand what is going on. It might have a light, but if it wasn't ever going on, then maybe it was just always set to off, hence the 70 degree water.

Your pH is pretty high... There are additives you can put in your water to bring it down, so that's an easy fix. You just have to be careful to do it gradually, like any changes with the water.

Salt isn't necessary, but it can help an ailing fish, like the ones with ick. Sustina_flower mentioned something about it earlier, and how you just have to be careful about the iodine, but if it doesn't have that, then it would help. I just don't know how much you would add... I believe you want your salinity to be about .20, but I don't know how you can measure that unless you have a test for it.

 

There seems to be a few issues going on here.

First is the testing. Test strips are notoriously inaccurate and to get your true pH, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates we'd recommend:
- the testing kit

Next is the toxins in the water. To protect your fish from the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates we'd recommend:
- the water conditioner
(It will also help build their slime coating.)

The heater that you have seems to be broken. This is the heater we'd recommend:
- the heater

Then there is the ick.. getting the temp up to 82-85 and keeping it there for 2 weeks is crucial. This med will also help and be safe for all the fish:


Hopefully those will all be available locally.

Here's what we'd do if it was our tank, since the situation seems to warrant it:
1) In the biggest bowl you can use for this, scoop out enough tank water to move the fish into it, then move the fish into the bowl and cover it about 95% with something like a towel. If you can, take the air pump and air stone and set it up so they'll have aeration in the bowl while you work on the tank.

2) Unplug the heater. If you have the visitherm heater, set it to 84-85. Turn the filter off and put the sponge from the filter in a cup of tank water to keep it wet. Then empty most of the water from the 10 gallon tank, leaving just enough to cover the gravel.

3) Fill the tank with water that's about 85 degrees or so. Then add the Prime (or other conditioner if you don't have Prime). Put a new bag in the filter (don't put any carbon in it) and put the sponge back in the filter after swishing it around in the cup. Start the filter back up and plug the heater back in. Move the air pump and air stone so that you can put the air stone back in the tank.

4) Next you'll want to float the fish in the tank to acclimate them to the temp. The way to do this would be to move each fish into a smaller bowl with some of the tank water from the big bowl, then every 10-15 minutes add a little tank water. Keep doing that until the water temps inside and outside of the small bowls are pretty close. Then the fish can be let go into the tank.

5) Add the recommended dosage of the Ich-Attack daily. After the first day, change out a couple gallons of water before adding the ich-attack.

Other things that could help would be:
- These liquid vitamins are something we add daily to our tanks.

- This digital thermometer is great for using when you acclimate the fish as well as letting you know where the tank water temp is at while you are adding water to the tank.

- Food especially for livebearers.

If you add salt to the tank, only use aquarium salt. I wouldn't worry about the pH at this point, keeping it steady is the best thing you can do for them.

Best of luck with your fish.

 

Thank you so much for your time and information. There is so much to know and learn. I really appreciate your words. Lisa

 

yea, the learning never stops and I just hope we can help those fish bounce back.

 

One last thing I would like to note, the Pleco is most likely suffering from the treatment for Ick. They don't have scales, and therefore sensitive to both salt and the medicines. Usually this is a good reason to treat ick with raised temps, and 1/2 dose medicine if you have any fish like loaches, eels, pleco's, ghost knife fish, and tetras (though they have scales, they also have problems with some common medicines....

Also pleco's need algae, driftwood, and if the tank isn't producing enough algae, you MUST feed vegetables, either squash slices, other vegetables suggested here, or algae wafers from the store. Your mollys also need a mostly vegetarian diet, with a few treats of frozen shrimp or bloodworms.

I agree with Dave, (FLBettaCouple), the water temp HAS to go up, and it really is ok to raise it gradually over an hour or hour and a half to the desired temp. Much easier by adding warm water like he described, than trying to let your heater do all the work. I find a small tank is extremely hard to regulate the temp in. If it doesn't have a glass cover especially, it tends to want to cool down.
Just think of a natural body of water, the temp goes up and down by several degrees every time the sun comes out or sets, so fish really can stand some fluctuation. Sometimes when I leave for 3 or 4 days, the temp goes down in my tanks to 60, (we are not on a power line, and have to run a generator for electricity), when I get home I always do a 25% water change with warmer than normal water to help bring the tank temp up. It has never caused any problems. I have healthy fish, and usually keep the temp up to 78-80. I had one outbreak of ick when I first got cardinal tetras, they were just covered with it, but with the medication, and raised temps. they all recovered, and I've never lost one!
Keep your chin up! It's one of the facts of starting out keeping an aquarium, that problems that you weren't expecting will crop up. It has happened to all of us. But you are doing the best thing by asking for help, and like was stated before, we have all been there, so don't feel anything but sympathy for you.

April

 

Just a couple of notes as you're in good hands:
- did you bring the pH down from 8.4 to 7.0 in one go?
- heater with no light does not equal faulty heater. It can mean your heater has reached its target temperature. It only comes on when trying to reach it.
- I totally concur with scaleless fish and medication, that is why I kept asking what else was in the tank.

Just one principle to bear in mind: fish do not like sudden change, so it could be doing it more harm than good by doing radical pH, salt or temp changes. Please do these gradually. One thing the fish will not mind, if done right, is very frequent water changes. By 'done right' I mean making sure that the temp/pH/salt contents dont' fluctuate at each water changes.

Kosher salt is not iodised I hear, see if you can find that?

 

Ich-Attack is an organic herbal med that doesn't harm the good bacteria and is safe for scaleless fish or fry. ;D

 

I am sorry to report that I've lost the plecostomus. I feel so bad about my ignorance and his demise. I'm off to get another heater. To raise the temp of the water....do you add tap and then the water conditioner of bottled water that's warmed??? What is best? Thank you! The platys/mollies are all now spending most of their time at the top of the tank...swimming, but constantly at the top.

Just a couple of notes as you're in good hands:
- did you bring the pH down from 8.4 to 7.0 in one go?
- heater with no light does not equal faulty heater. It can mean your heater has reached its target temperature. It only comes on when trying to reach it.
- I totally concur with scaleless fish and medication, that is why I kept asking what else was in the tank.

Just one principle to bear in mind: fish do not like sudden change, so it could be doing it more harm than good by doing radical pH, salt or temp changes. Please do these gradually. One thing the fish will not mind, if done right, is very frequent water changes. By 'done right' I mean making sure that the temp/pH/salt contents dont' fluctuate at each water changes.

Kosher salt is not iodised I hear, see if you can find that?

The ph is still just as high??? I checked it this morning...no ammonia, but high ph still. I switched the lever on the heater, but still no temp change...so I'll go buy another. What kind of water should I change for these guys(tap and conditioner or bottled?) THANKS!

 

Either bottled or conditioned tap works, but I've never seen the point of paying for bottled water when you have a source of water readily available. I would say condition the water first, and THEN put it in, then the fish have no chance of being exposed to chlorine.

I'm sorry about the pleco, losing fish is hard.

 

OK...pleco removed, new heater installed, 20% water change done and I increased the temp to 75 degrees with the water change...using bottled water....didn't want to take a chance, but next time I'll use tap and condition it and then add it. Everyone looks good so far....I hope this helps these guys. I also installed a new filter(it's the kind with the carbon already in it).

 

OK...pleco removed, new heater installed, 20% water change done and I increased the temp to 75 degrees with the water change...using bottled water....didn't want to take a chance, but next time I'll use tap and condition it and then add it. Everyone looks good so far....I hope this helps these guys. I also installed a new filter(it's the kind with the carbon already in it).

Sounds great! Those water changes do so much good!
The good news is that while getting the tank to balance is a challenge, once the tank has cycled and the the fish have settled in it gets way easier. In an established tank your fish will each show their personalities and charm

I agree with the above comment that we were all new to this once, and completely understand the worry. Your experience now will be something you can call upon to help out other people in the same situation later. Invaluable!

Glad to hear they are doing well today!

--R

 

So what's the pH of the new water (bottled) you've put in. I am still concerned about large shifts in pH. I really wouldn't try to bring it down in one big change, but gradually.

What salt did you end up using? And at what concentration?

Is the new heater responding better than the last one? Same remark as pH. Could you please make sure you don't go up in temp too quickly but spread it out. I realise your fish are sick and need urgent help, but maybe spread it out over a couple of days.

I am sorry about your pleco, please don't feel bad. You sound like you're putting in so much time and effort. This is definitely not from negligence, but we all thought at one time or another that all fish needed was water. You really deserve that your mollies all pull through with all this heartache and hard work. Will keep wishing you and the mollies well.

 

OK...pleco removed, new heater installed, 20% water change done and I increased the temp to 75 degrees with the water change...using bottled water....didn't want to take a chance, but next time I'll use tap and condition it and then add it. Everyone looks good so far....I hope this helps these guys. I also installed a new filter(it's the kind with the carbon already in it).

Don't forget to look at your ick meds to see if it says to "remove all carbon filters" or something similar, because most medicines will be absorbed by the carbon.

 

I've lost one platy and the rest of the fish are at the top of the tank constantly. I am so frustrated. The temp is up to 78 degrees now. The heater raised it quicker than I thought. I don't know what to do for them!?!

 

Haven't heard from you in a day, how go things with the tank? I'm sorry to hear about the platy...

Have you tested the water yourself yet?

 

it takes temps of 82 or more to go after the ich. that's the reason for that plan of attack that I posted.

 

UPDATE: Water Levels Added - What's Wrong with my Fish??

UPDATE: Okay, I just tested the water, and these were the parameters:

Ammonia: 2.0
Ph: 8.4
Alkalinity: 300
Hardness: 25 (we have a water softener)
Nitrite: 0.5-1.0 (it was in between the two, but I'd say closer to the 0.5)
Nitrate: 40-80 (again, it was in between the two, so I'm guessing in the 60 range since the color seemed directly between the two)


Yesterday I noticed a couple times our Molly. Was up near the surface almost vertical , but didn't stay there and was still active and eating. Saw it again today. But now tonight, it's laying on its side on the bottom, looking like it's breathing fast.

Ph: 7.6
Temp: 79
Last water change: Saturday, 25%, water treated with Fluvall Biological Enhancer and Water Conditioner
Tank set up: Dec 31

I don't know the ammonia etc... Levels, I was going to buy the test kit tomorrow.

Is there anything we can do? All other fish are active and normal.

ETA: He just moved around some. Is now resting on the bottom on his belly (upright, like in the position he'd be if he were swimming), and has completely turned himself around so he's facing the other direction.

ETA: He just swam to the other side of the tank, hovering very close to the bottom, he looks a bit wobbly, but he's remaining upright resting on the bottom.

 

If other fish aren't picking on him you can't do much. Tank may be cycling so check ammo, nitrite and nitrate. Bring in a water sample to fish store , wright down their reported levels then double check against your kit. If ammo is high water changes can lower it but might slow down cycle. Good luck.

 

ammonia/nitrite/nitrate levels would be really helpful, and how many fish do you have in that tank? are you aware of the nitrogen cycle?