Lost Cycle Dilemma

Keith83
  • #1
So I recently had to treat my tank for Columnaris with some bacteria killing Kanaplex. The good news is it saved my fish. No signs of it for almost two weeks. The bad news is I lost my cycle. Ammonia will go to 1.0. I do a water change, dose tank with prime and it reduces to .25-.50. The prime is effective for 48 hours. I test again and I'm back up to 1.0. I've repeated that 3 times and keep getting the same results. My dilemma is do I keep doing this until I'm cycled or is the prime every few days killing bacteria? Can I add Tetra Safe Start or Secham Stability after 48 hours dosing Prime to see if that bacteria will eat the ammonia or will my fish get sick? I've never had to recycle the tank. It's full of fish. Thanks in advance.
 
Lauren_
  • #2
From my understanding, Kanaplex is not supposed to adversely affect a tank's beneficial bacteria. At least, it never has in my experiences using it and when I've lent it to friends, they've have no issues either. Given that Columnaris is a pretty lethal infection, I would highly recommend searching around the tank and making sure there's not a dead fish somewhere in the tank causing the ammonia spike.

I'd check for that first and do a large water change to get that ammonia out of there. If you can't find anything, let us know and we'll see what needs to be done from there. Mind if I ask what size tank you have and what the stocking looks like as well?
 
LLL
  • #3
Tetra Safe Start or Seachem's Stability will not hurt if you care to add either. The other bottled bacteria starter that I can recommend is "Dr. Tim's."

Good luck with a partial water change and hopefully you find a source for the ammonia, ie a dead fish or snail, or a pocket of unbeaten food. Meanwhile, remember water changes won't hurt the development of your beneficial bacteria that grow on surfaces. So besides the prime, keep giving the fish fresh conditioned water until your beneficial bacteria communities get back up to the necessary levels.
 
LLL
  • #4
Uneaten*
 
ASHLEY R COOK
  • #5
Kanaplex is not suppose to hurt the cycle but it can. They say so themselves. It matters the duration of doses.
But I personally would use TSS+ bc I've had great results with it over and over and I haven't noticed anything with stability. Not that it didn't do anything. I just didn't notice if it did lol.
I'm not as experienced as a lot of people on here but that's what I would do
 
Wraithen
  • #6
Did you combine the kana with metroplex or furan-2? I did a three way aggressive tank treatment but only lost the part of my cycle that converts nitrites to nitrates somehow. Tetra safe start got me back on track within 2 days.
 
finnipper59
  • #7
So I recently had to treat my tank for Columnaris with some bacteria killing Kanaplex. The good news is it saved my fish. No signs of it for almost two weeks. The bad news is I lost my cycle. Ammonia will go to 1.0. I do a water change, dose tank with prime and it reduces to .25-.50. The prime is effective for 48 hours. I test again and I'm back up to 1.0. I've repeated that 3 times and keep getting the same results. My dilemma is do I keep doing this until I'm cycled or is the prime every few days killing bacteria? Can I add Tetra Safe Start or Secham Stability after 48 hours dosing Prime to see if that bacteria will eat the ammonia or will my fish get sick? I've never had to recycle the tank. It's full of fish. Thanks in advance.
Most medications advise that you remove carbon before treatment. You don't happen to have a hob filter that you completely removed the cartridge from during treatment do you?
 
Keith83
  • Thread Starter
  • #8
Most medications advise that you remove carbon before treatment. You don't happen to have a hob filter that you completely removed the cartridge from during treatment do you?
I have 2 hob filters. One has two compartments and the other has one so I had 3 carbon cartridges in all. I removed two of them and left one that was in there for 5 or 6 weeks believing that the carbon was no longer effective anyway. The other 2 had been in there for around 4 weeks. I also left all the bacteria holding inserts(3) in the filters. After the two treatments(2 doses 48 hours each) I put in one carbon cartridge to remove the meds as recommend by the manufacturer. I have done 3 large water changes over the past week and a half (1-50 and 75 percent). Each time dosing the whole tank with prime. The frustrating thing to me is that I've read that you can't add BB until the prime has run its course of 48 hours, but then it's time for another water change because the ammonia is still in there. I'm wondering if I skip the water change and add BB, will it eat up the ammonia or do I just keep doing water changes until it cycles that way?
 
ASHLEY R COOK
  • #9
I have 2 hob filters. One has two compartments and the other has one so I had 3 carbon cartridges in all. I removed two of them and left one that was in there for 5 or 6 weeks believing that the carbon was no longer effective anyway. The other 2 had been in there for around 4 weeks. I also left all the bacteria holding inserts(3) in the filters. After the two treatments(2 doses 48 hours each) I put in one carbon cartridge to remove the meds as recommend by the manufacturer. I have done 3 large water changes over the past week and a half (1-50 and 75 percent). Each time dosing the whole tank with prime. The frustrating thing to me is that I've read that you can't add BB until the prime has run its course of 48 hours, but then it's time for another water change because the ammonia is still in there. I'm wondering if I skip the water change and add BB, will it eat up the ammonia or do I just keep doing water changes until it cycles that way?
With a little ammonia in the tank it'll be ok to add TSS+ since you were cycled already it should just get you back on track IME.
I've used it once when I had .25ammonia for a couple days to get it going again.
 
Wraithen
  • #10
I have 2 hob filters. One has two compartments and the other has one so I had 3 carbon cartridges in all. I removed two of them and left one that was in there for 5 or 6 weeks believing that the carbon was no longer effective anyway. The other 2 had been in there for around 4 weeks. I also left all the bacteria holding inserts(3) in the filters. After the two treatments(2 doses 48 hours each) I put in one carbon cartridge to remove the meds as recommend by the manufacturer. I have done 3 large water changes over the past week and a half (1-50 and 75 percent). Each time dosing the whole tank with prime. The frustrating thing to me is that I've read that you can't add BB until the prime has run its course of 48 hours, but then it's time for another water change because the ammonia is still in there. I'm wondering if I skip the water change and add BB, will it eat up the ammonia or do I just keep doing water changes until it cycles that way?
You can generally be fine if you wait 24 hours after adding prime to add the bb. I've also used stability in place of prime when I couldnt use prime due to what I was doing with the tank. I can't recall exactly what I was doing, but prime would have cancelled it out, so the recommendation from seachem was to use the stability instead. You can safely use stability with tss+, or any other recommended bb.
 
Keith83
  • Thread Starter
  • #11
From my understanding, Kanaplex is not supposed to adversely affect a tank's beneficial bacteria. At least, it never has in my experiences using it and when I've lent it to friends, they've have no issues either. Given that Columnaris is a pretty lethal infection, I would highly recommend searching around the tank and making sure there's not a dead fish somewhere in the tank causing the ammonia spike.

I'd check for that first and do a large water change to get that ammonia out of there. If you can't find anything, let us know and we'll see what needs to be done from there. Mind if I ask what size tank you have and what the stocking looks like as well?
Its a 55 gallon. 7 giant danio, 7 Venuzualan Corys, 3 Platys, 1 rubbernose pleco(small) and one medium pearl Gourami (the one that was sick). I do fish counts every day and all are alive.
 
Keith83
  • Thread Starter
  • #12
You can generally be fine if you wait 24 hours after adding prime to add the bb. I've also used stability in place of prime when I couldnt use prime due to what I was doing with the tank. I can't recall exactly what I was doing, but prime would have cancelled it out, so the recommendation from seachem was to use the stability instead. You can safely use stability with tss+, or any other recommended bb.
Yes ive read that prime will kill BB if you does at the same time, but if your ammonia is let's say 1.0 and under, stability will make it safe for fish?
 
finnipper59
  • #13
I have 2 hob filters. One has two compartments and the other has one so I had 3 carbon cartridges in all. I removed two of them and left one that was in there for 5 or 6 weeks believing that the carbon was no longer effective anyway. The other 2 had been in there for around 4 weeks. I also left all the bacteria holding inserts(3) in the filters. After the two treatments(2 doses 48 hours each) I put in one carbon cartridge to remove the meds as recommend by the manufacturer. I have done 3 large water changes over the past week and a half (1-50 and 75 percent). Each time dosing the whole tank with prime. The frustrating thing to me is that I've read that you can't add BB until the prime has run its course of 48 hours, but then it's time for another water change because the ammonia is still in there. I'm wondering if I skip the water change and add BB, will it eat up the ammonia or do I just keep doing water changes until it cycles that way?
You need to get beneficial bacteria growing asap. Try switching from Prime to Aqueon water conditioner. It works quicker and you can add BB within on hour after a water change with it. If you can't find the Aqueon, use AmQuel (not AmQuel Plus) as your conditiioner.
 
Keith83
  • Thread Starter
  • #14
You need to get beneficial bacteria growing asap. Try switching from Prime to Aqueon water conditioner. It works quicker and you can add BB within on hour after a water change with it. If you can't find the Aqueon, use AmQuel (not AmQuel Plus) as your conditiioner.
I have some Tetra AguaSafe on hand that I used to use until learning that Prime also made ammonia and nitrates safe for 48 hours. Will that work? If not I'll run down to Petco to see if they have the Aqueon or AmQuel.
 
Keith83
  • Thread Starter
  • #15
Thanks everyone for your responses. You guys are great!
 
Wraithen
  • #16
Yes ive read that prime will kill BB if you does at the same time, but if your ammonia is let's say 1.0 and under, stability will make it safe for fish?
I can't recall that correctly. Just that I had to use it as a water conditioner for the treatment I was running.
 
finnipper59
  • #17
Yes, as long as it's not too old, go ahead and use it an pick youself some Aqueon when you get the chance.
I have some Tetra AguaSafe on hand that I used to use until learning that Prime also made ammonia and nitrates safe for 48 hours. Will that work? If not I'll run down to Petco to see if they have the Aqueon or AmQuel.
 

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