Just Making Sure... Updated

Lauradesu

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My 50 gallon tank has had no nitrites and nitrates for almost a week. First the nitrates dropped over night then the nitrites. Also I have 0 ammonia but a lot (but dropping) ammonium

My cycle didnt crash did it and if it did how do I fix it I have fish and they look fine and I also have rapidly growing plants.
 
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Lauradesu

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Mazeus said:
Perhaps you are still quite early in the cycle? Have you seen any nitrites?
Nitrites dropped a day after the nitrates there hasn't been any of either of them for almost a week and no ammonia either

Also I had high levels of nitrites and nitrates and ammonia for like awhile then they all started dropping and then there was none
 

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Well there are three possibilities.
1- Your cycle has crashed, but then I would expect higher ammonia reading. If you were changing your water frequently (like daily) this might have kept the ammonia down
2- Your plants are using up all your nitrates. When I had hornwort in my tank I used to have readings of 0 nitrates. That plant eats nitrates like crazy
3- there is a problem with your tests. The nitrate test on the API liquid kit is notorious for giving false results if bottle 2 isn't aggitrated enough.
 
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Lauradesu

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Mazeus said:
Well there are three possibilities.
1- Your cycle has crashed, but then I would expect higher ammonia reading. If you were changing your water frequently (like daily) this might have kept the ammonia down
2- Your plants are using up all your nitrates. When I had hornwort in my tank I used to have readings of 0 nitrates. That plant eats nitrates like crazy
3- there is a problem with your tests. The nitrate test on the API liquid kit is notorious for giving false results if bottle 2 isn't aggitrate enough.
I dont do daily water changes I do water changes every 7 days on both tanks. I was obsessively doing water changes but even after I had stopped doing that I still had nitrites and nitrates. And I literally shake bottle 2 so much it's like one of those cans of paints on a paint machine. My 15 gallon as nitrates that rise and after 7 days I do a 25% water change and it drops the nitrites to 0 and the nitrates to 5ppm. It could most likely be the plants because I dont see how they would survive or even grow the way they are growing now if the cycle has crash because all that's left is ammonium that drops very very very slowly
 

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IME plants won't be impacted by a cycle crash. they would still grow just fine. However, that being said if you are only changing water every 7 days. I think the mostly likely explanation is that your plants are using up the nitrates.
 
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Lauradesu

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Mazeus said:
IME plants won't be impacted by a cycle crash. they would still grow just fine. However, that being said if you are only changing water every 7 days. I think the mostly likely explanation is that your plants are using up the nitrates.
Any time I put something with nitrates in the tank they vanish within the hour.


I should mention I had two deaths in the 50 gallon two days apart of an unknown sickness with swollen gills that were pink on the outside. But my other two ryukin that I've had for nearly a month in a 15 gallon but was placed in the 50 gallon are perfectly fine.
 

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It’s very unlikely that the few plants you have are eating up all the nitrates, especially with you having goldfish. I have 3 fancies and bn pleco in a 55G and my nitrates are always at 40 at the end of the week before tank cleaning. I have a couple of big bunches of hornwort, several anubias, and a number of amazon swords. The pink swollen gills could be ammonia poisoning. I know on another thread you got some Prime. Be sure to use it daily until the tank cycles. Did you happen to wash your filter in tap water or use any meds that kill beneficial bacteria?
 

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Yes, that doesn't sound good. I wonder if there is a problem with your ammonia test and it isn't showing you quite how much there is in the tank.

Goldiemom knows goldfish (I've never kept them) so I'd take her word for it that the plants won't use up the nitrates.
 

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Mazeus said:
Yes, that doesn't sound good. I wonder if there is a problem with your ammonia test and it isn't showing you quite how much there is in the tank.

Goldiemom knows goldfish (I've never kept them) so I'd take her word for it that the plants won't use up the nitrates.
You were correct in the fact they eat nitrates. I just doubt they would be at 0 though. Something happened to kill the cycle.

You will need to daily water changes along with the Prime until you get the cycle back. Good luck!
 

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Goldiemom said:
You were correct in the fact they eat nitrates. I just doubt they would be at 0 though. Something happened to kill the cycle.
Yeah sorry, I am not wording my posts well tonight. I usually have very low nitrates in my tank because it is heavily planted and I have nano fish will a low bioload. What I should have said was that the plants in the OP's tank wouldn't be sufficient to use up the nitrates produced by goldfish.
 
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Lauradesu

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Goldiemom said:
It’s very unlikely that the few plants you have are eating up all the nitrates, especially with you having goldfish. I have 3 fancies and bn pleco in a 55G and my nitrates are always at 40 at the end of the week before tank cleaning. I have a couple of big bunches of hornwort, several anubias, and a number of amazon swords. The pink swollen gills could be ammonia poisoning. I know on another thread you got some Prime. Be sure to use it daily until the tank cycles. Did you happen to wash your filter in tap water or use any meds that kill beneficial bacteria?
The ammonia right now is at zero or far below 0.02 and I use the seachem total and free test it's very accurate. I test for ammonia every day because I do have ryukins and I want to keep an eye on ammonia. Today it's well below 0.02 parts per trillion. Not million but trillion. Its extremely close to zero and I did use prime earlier afternoon yesterday say about 12:45. We just checked again it's still at the same ammonia levels....its been at this level before prime too it gets to the point where no ammonia just ammonium is detected. I have a new ryukin I dont want to start obsessively changing the water again because when I did that the last time two of my ryukin died.
Also no medication is ever added just a dechlorinator and sometimes plant food here or there like every other water change I use aquavitro seed in the filter media which I just switched to filter sponges two days ago with the fabric of the old Inserts to cycle the sponges. Also no I donf wash any of my filter media in tap water

Also below is the chemicals we use on both tests and the ammonia tester that we found on this forum that people swore by over the api master test




Furthermore I REALLY Dont feel comfortable doing daily water changes even if they are 30% because i did that for a week and it did nothing.


Also my two original ryukins have survived all this time for awhile and not even look poisoned or sick. They are active as usual and I had them in the tank before the two that died. They are just two fat healthy ryukins

I NEED SOME SERIOUS HELP HERE. I'm getting seriously emotional and full of anxiety with the thought of doing daily water changes knowing it will destroy the tank further or kill my fish whom I'm very much so attached to!.
 

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Goldiemom

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I don’t know what I was thinking and I don’t want to get you stressed. My mind short circuited for a while. Don’t do the water changes. The Prime will take care of the fish. Just be sure to dose daily and all will be fine. Hang in there.

If you didn’t wash your filter in tap water/ chlorine, I can’t figure out why you list your cycle.
 

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@Lauradesu , have you tested your pH level.

At a pH below 7.0 ammonia starts turning into ammonium. And by the time your pH gets down to 6.0 pretty much all of the ammonia has turned into ammonium. The good news is that ammonium is far less toxic to fish (some claim it is non-toxic). The bad news is that ammonium is a terrible food source for the ammonia converting bacteria. So what happens if you have all ammonium in the tank, the bacteria isn't processing it and turning it into nitrites, and since there are no nitrites, there is nothing for the bacteria to convert into nitrates. This would scale with the amount of ammonia vs amount of ammonium in the water. So very little ammonia-->very little nitrites-->very little nitrates which plants can easily absorb.

From your first post, I'm very unsure what your ammonia/ammonium levels are. But so long as you have 0ppm ammonia (or .02 ppt which is basically 0ppm) and 0ppm nitrites, I wouldn't worry about having no nitrates. The point of a cycle is to have 0ppm ammonia and 0ppm nitrites, it's not to produce nitrates.
 
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Lauradesu

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jdhef said:
@Lauradesu , have you tested your pH level.

At a pH below 7.0 ammonia starts turning into ammonium. And by the time your pH gets down to 6.0 pretty much all of the ammonia has turned into ammonium. The good news is that ammonium is far less toxic to fish (some claim it is non-toxic). The bad news is that ammonium is a terrible food source for the ammonia converting bacteria. So what happens if you have all ammonium in the tank, the bacteria isn't processing it and turning it into nitrites, and since there are no nitrites, there is nothing for the bacteria to convert into nitrates. This would scale with the amount of ammonia vs amount of ammonium in the water. So very little ammonia-->very little nitrites-->very little nitrates which plants can easily absorb.

From your first post, I'm very unsure what your ammonia/ammonium levels are. But so long as you have 0ppm ammonia (or .02 ppt which is basically 0ppm) and 0ppm nitrites, I wouldn't worry about having no nitrates. The point of a cycle is to have 0ppm ammonia and 0ppm nitrites, it's not to produce nitrates.
Ph is always at 7.4 so what does that mean.
 

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With a pH of 7.4, I would expect the ammonia in your tank to be all ammonia and not ammonium. To say below 7.0 ammonia starts turning into ammonium is a little simplistic although a good rule of thumb, water temp also plays a part in the ammonia into ammonium conversion, but with that said, I still would expect you to have more ammonia than ammonium.
 
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Lauradesu

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jdhef said:
With a pH of 7.4, I would expect the ammonia in your tank to be all ammonia and not ammonium. To say below 7.0 ammonia starts turning into ammonium is a little simplistic although a good rule of thumb, water temp also plays a part in the ammonia into ammonium conversion, but with that said, I still would expect you to have more ammonia than ammonium.
But we dont, we have more ammonium in a tank that is 24°c right now. The ammonia is low. My tank defies logic and basic understanding.
 
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