Is too much prime bad for slime coat?

  1. bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    Title says it all...

    I'm starting to be concerned that daily water changes with the python has caused issues with the Slime coat on my angel juvies.

    By using a python I have to dose the entire tank and if I'm doing daily water changes thats dosing the entire tank every single day.... I'm thinking that might have been too much and could have been causing the problem with my angels.

    I even captured a video of one of my angels shedding their slime coat.

    Due to some of my own scary unexpected health reasons I was unable to do water changes in those tanks all week. Suddenly the angels are appearing to improve... their bodies look much healthier and shinier and smoother...

    What do you guys think? Coincidence? Or is it really possible to overdose on Prime?
     
  2. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    Do you have to dose for the whole tank volume or can you dose only for the amount of water that you're replacing?
     
  3. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    If the water is going directly from the sink into the tank, which it is, you do have to dose the entire tank.

    When I did daily water changes on smaller tanks I wasn't using the python so I was only dosing the new water...and I never had issues then.
     


  4. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    What about carbon? If there is something left over in the tank after 24 hours perhaps that would take it out?
     
  5. TexasDomer

    TexasDomer Fishlore Legend Member

    I don't think carbon removes Prime...

    I would not fill it back up with the python and use buckets so you can dose the new water only.
     
  6. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    I wasn't thinking of it removing the Prime, but any products that result from its breakdown;)
     


  7. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    So with that being said...would the answer be yes? Yes, too much prime can have a negative impact on their slime coat...or maybe too much prime for too long of a period anyway?

    I don't really need to be doing daily water changes anymore anyway. I only continued as long as I did because I thought something was wrong with them. Come to find out...I was the one causing it and making it worse. 5 days without prime and I can see a big noticeable difference. So...dosing the whole volume of your tank with prime, while only changing 30% of the water.... on a daily basis... is a big NO-NO apparently!
     
  8. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    But are you sure it's the Prime? Is it possible that the problem is the result of something in the source water or in the Python itself?
     
  9. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    It is only affecting the angels in the tanks that are getting the daily water changes. The tanks getting weekly water changes with the same Python and the same water source are not having any problems....
     
  10. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    It was just a thought:-\
     
  11. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    I sent a message to seachem asking for their advice on the issue :) I'll let you know what I find out
     
  12. jhigg008

    jhigg008 Well Known Member Member

    Why is it that you have to dose for the entire tank? I dose for the entire tank when I use the python, but just curious as to why.

    Also with what Aquaphobia said about the python perhaps being the issue, I have noticed that sometimes I cannot get all the water out of my python and I wonder if it is bad. After I do a fill up I switch the python to drain and try to let all of the water left in the tube drain out through the faucet but sometimes I cannot get all of it out. Generally I dont think it matters because the next time I use it, it starts with a gravel vac so the leftover water gets pushed out, but I wonder if bacteria builds in the tube???
     
  13. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    I have 5 other tanks I use the same Python with....just not daily. So I know the python and my water source are not the culprit....

    I don't know the explanation as to why the whole tank has to be treated....I just know that's the way it is...lol

    I know what you mean about being concerned about build up in the hose. Every once in a while i'll just let hot hot water run through it for a few minutes. I try and do that every time I use it but sometimes I get lazy.
     
  14. sunshine2012

    sunshine2012 Valued Member Member

    I never use any prime ever with my water changes and my tank is always great.
     
  15. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    What does your water company use to treat your tap water?
     
  16. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    Me? I don't know...
     
  17. Aquaphobia

    Aquaphobia Fishlore Legend Member

    On second thought, since this has been going on only in this tank for a long time it's probably nothing to do with it, I just wondered if they'd added something different for some reason. But if they had I'm sure they would have ended up in your other tanks by now.
     
  18. TexasDomer

    TexasDomer Fishlore Legend Member

    I don't know for sure obviously, but if that's the only difference between the tanks then I would try changing that to see if it helps. It won't hurt them to try something different, so why not do it? It's a bit more work for you, but if it keeps your fish healthy, it'll be worth it.
     
  19. CindiL

    CindiL Fishlore Legend Member

    I'm not sure you actually have to dose for the full volume of the water, more just that it's easier to do it that way....I'll be curious what Seachem says, so let us know.

    My thought is if your tank water has already been dechlorinated with initial water changes and you dose for only the water you're putting in, there is still only that amount of water you are adding that would have chlorine and chloramines that need to be removed(if you have chloramines) so it should still be able to dechlorinate the water you've added in.
     
  20. OP
    OP
    bizaliz3

    bizaliz3 Fishlore Legend Member

    I got an email back from Seachem, here is what it said:

    "Thank you for your email. There is nothing in prime that would cause damage to slime coats with frequent water changes, even when dosed at elevated levels. I would suspect that the frequent water parameter shifts from the water changes are causing problems. May I ask why the tanks are getting such frequent water changes? Are you running into water chemistry issues that can only be solved with dilution?"

    I decided to call at that point because now that they are open again, I could speak to someone directly. They have been closed all weekend and yesterday as well (due to the holiday)

    The woman I spoke with was SO kind and SO helpful and VERY patient! I explained my situation to her so she could understand the reason for the water changes. I told her how at one point I suspected the "film" that I was seeing on my juvie angels was possibly ich or velvet or whatever, so I also cranked the heat. I told her that after lowering the temp and lessening the water changes, that film finally went away and they look like their old selves again.

    She thinks that most likely there was a bacterial infection of some kind that my juvie angels were ultimately able to fight off with no meds. She also said that raising the temp very high to kill off things like Ich is not as successful as it used to be years ago....The parasites have "adapted" and while their life cycle is sped up....they are also able to multiply faster...

    I assured her that my tanks have zero ammonia and nitrites and very low nitrates. (5-10) It most likely wasn't ick or velvet because it looked nothing like Ick and it had no other symptoms that would come along with velvet. The video I have of Charming shedding his slime coat was immediately after switching his tank which is very common.

    Basically, like I said, she thinks it was a bacterial infection. I asked her if it is normal for fish to be able to fight off bacterial infections without meds and she said absolutely. It is mostly just the really bad ones like columnaris for instance, that absolutely NEED treatment.

    I still find it odd that the problems went away as soon as I stopped the daily water changes. That seems backwards if you ask me!! I really hope this issue is behind us and I will not see this ugly film on their bodies ever again!!!

    I just have to say that this experience makes me love Seachem even more! Excellent customer service Seachem!! Thanks!!!