Internal Parasites and PraziPro

alink

I apologize for this extremely long post but I am trying to provide as many details as possible so I can get the best help.

I got my Prazi Pro on Tuesday and added the first does Wednesday morning. Reading the label again, leaves me a little uncertain on if I dosed correctly and when or if another dose is necessary. The following is word for word from the bottle...


DIRECTIONS FOR USE: For treatment of praziquantel-susceptible disease conditions in freshwater and marine aquariums and ornamental pond fishes. AS A BATH: Start treatment with as large a water change as practical or start with new water. Any water used should first be conditioned with ULTIMATE(R) or a combination or Liquid Buffered ClorAm-X(R) and Stress-X(TM) to remove ammonia, chlorine and chloramines. Do not stop filtration, but remove activated carbon and stop foam-fractionation (protein skimming) and UV sterilization-failure to do so will render product ineffective. SHAKE VIGOROUSLY before use. Measure Liquid PraziPro(TM) at the rate of one (1) teaspoon per 20 gallons of water to be treated. (one (1) fl.oz.per 120 gallons) This produces a concentration of 2.5 mg/L. Distribute the proper amount around the edge of the pond or aquarium or directly in to the filter box to achieve the best overall distribution. A single treatment lasting 5-7 days is normally sufficient. Retreat as necessary, but no more than once every 3 days. May be used as a preventative, at the standard dosage, when disease is likely. Do not use with any other drugs or disease treatments. May cause noticeable temporary foaming. Over dosing will not speed impact.

I have always noticed some of my fish having long, white, stringy feces. The only fish that I haven't seen with it at one point or another were my Bumblebee Catfish (never seen them poop so idk if they do or not), Praecox Rainbowfish and Longfin Zebra Danios.

Everything else at some point has had it (tetras, rams, gouramis, plecos). Some fish have had it, then the next day its gone, then I'll notice it again in a few days, some fish have had it constant (going on 3 months now).

I haven't lost a fish in this tank since March 7th. I had ICH occur twice in this tank. First time I used the heat and water change method, Second time I couldn't do it (due to injury) so I used Kordon Rid Ich Plus. See below timeline...

Heres a calendar of my treatments, water changes, etc since I started treatment:
3-6: Tank finished cycling (0, 0, 10)
3-7: Did 50% water change (24 gallons removed, 25 gallons added) and removed all carbon from filters.
3-7: Added dose 1, round 1 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-8: Added dose 2, round 1 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-9: Added dose 3, round 1 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-10: Did 30% water change (12 gallons removed, 13 gallons added).
3-10: Added dose 1, round 2 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-11: Added dose 2, round 2 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-12: Added dose 3, round 2 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-13: Did about a 50% water change (25 gallons removed, 26 gallons added)
3-13: Added dose 1, round 3 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-14: Added dose 2, round 3 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-15: Added dose 3, round 3 of Rid-Ich Plus (12.5mL)
3-17: Did about a 60% water change (28 gallons removed, 30 gallons added) No signs of Ich.
3-18: Did another 60% water change to help clear out any leftover medication (26 gallons removed, 27 gallons added).
3-19: Added 1st dose of Tetra Parasite Guard (5 tablets dissolved in tank water)
3-22: Did about a 30% water change (12 gallons removed, 13 gallons added).
3-22: Added 2nd dose of Tetra Parasite Guard (5 tablets dissolved in tank water)
3-24: Did about a 30% water change (13 gallons removed, 15 gallons added).
3-24: Added 3 Praecox Rainbowfish and 1 Red-Tailed Black Shark (figured the 3rd dose would help make sure they didnt bring anything bad in).
3-25: Added 3rd dose of Tetra Parasite Guard (5 tablets dissolved in tank water)
3-28: Did about a 50% water change (21 gallons removed, 23 gallons added).
3-28: Moved BumbleBee Catfish from QT tank to main tank after being in QT for 1 month and showing no signs of illness.
NOTE: At this point I thought I was good. Some fish in question got noticeably better.
4-1: Noticed some fish still had the long white stringy feces.
4-4: Did about a 50% water change (24 gallons removed, 25 gallons added).
4-6: Did about a 50% water change (20 gallons removed, 22 gallons added) to remove any left over medications and get nitrates low so it would be good for the next dose.
4-7: Added 1st dose of API General Cure (5 packets) at recommendation from a member here.
4-10: Added 2nd dose of API General Cure (5 packets)
4-12: Did about a 50-60% water change (22 gallons removed, 25 gallons added).
4-19: Noticed Black Skirt Tetra has Popeye or something similar. Other fish still have long white stringy feces.
4-20: Did about a 50-60% water change (21 gallons removed, 24 gallons added).
4-21: Fed the tank flakes soaked in garlic juice (made the way suggested in the ICH sticky thread)
4-22: Added 2.5 teaspoons Liquid PraziPro to filter box in 50 gallon tank.

Extra info:
My nitrates have never gotten above the 40 mark on my API liquid test kit. Maybe if it was a digital read, it might have showed it, but it definitely wasn't 80. Haven't had any Ammonia or Nitrite readings since the cycle finished.
All water changes done with Prime.
All water changes included at least gravel vacuuming of 50% of substrate and rinsing of one filter (of the 3, 1 in the Fluval, 2 in the Penguin).
All water changes included a dose of Seachem Stability.

Foods:
Flakes: TetraColor Crisps, Omega One Veggie Flakes, Cobalt Flakes
Pellets: Aqueon Sinking Shrimp Pellets, TetraVeggie Algae Wafers
Other: Frozen Brine Shrimp, Frozen Bloodworms, Freeze Dried Bloodworms
Veggies: Cucumber and Zucchini

Feeding Schedule:
Monday: Flakes, 5 pellets, 3 algae wafers
Tuesday: Flakes, 5 pellets
Wednesday: Bloodworms (mix frozen and freeze dried), 3 algae wafers
Thursday: sliced veggies only
Friday: Flakes, 5 pellets, 3 algae wafers
Saturday: Brine Shrimp, 5 pellets
Sunday: Flakes, 5 pellets

.
Lights are on for about 12-14 hours a day. On between 8 and 10 am and off between 9 and 11 pm.

I was going to return my Black Skirt Tetras and Clown Plecos on Monday but the LFS wants them healed before they take them, which is understandable.

So based on the directions above, and all the other information that I have provided, and the fact that the feces problem is still occurring and I don't have a QT tank anymore, do I add a 2nd dose on the 24th/25th which would be 3-4 days from the 1st dose, or do I wait a week and then dose again? Do I do a water change between the doses? In the last 2 days I have seen 3 Tetras, 1 Gourami, 1 Ram, 2 plecos and my RTBS have the white stringy feces. I want this gone, I'm sick of having my fish being sick when I try so hard to care for them the best I can.

Thank you for your time and help. If there's any possible information that I left out or you would like, ask for it. Click my name to see current tank setup. It is 100% accurate as of right now.
 

junebug

IME, a single 5 day bath to start with is best. Prazipro stays in the water column fairly well, unlike many other meds.

After that, if additional treatments are necessary, make sure to leave three days between treatments with no meds in the tank. This will mean a water change, and adding the carbon back to the tank between treatments.
 

alink

IME, a single 5 day bath to start with is best. Prazipro stays in the water column fairly well, unlike many other meds.

After that, if additional treatments are necessary, make sure to leave three days between treatments with no meds in the tank. This will mean a water change, and adding the carbon back to the tank between treatments.

Thanks Junebug!

So then I'm looking at letting it work until Monday, then do a water change.

You said to add the carbon back in between doses. The carbon I had, I'm sure is no good since it has been out of the tank for almost 2 months.

So I can get another pouch, but would the pouch that goes in my Fluval 70 be sufficient?

The Penguin uses cartridges and so in order to put the carbon back in there I would have to replace the filters, and then remove it again for each subsequent dose, would get to be a pain and expensive, not to mention what it could do to my cycle.

Could I get 2 pouches of the Fluval carbon and put one in each filter and just remove that when I add 2nd dose, storing the pouches in tank water while medicating?
 

junebug

You can always cut open the foam on the cartridges and replace the carbon. But I don't even do that anymore for my HOBs, I just use media bags. But I also buy my carbon in bulk jars and only use it when I need to remove medications.

Really either way works fine, just do whatever is easiest for you.

As far as storing the carbon in tank water in between treatments, that would serve no purpose. Let it dry out if you want, the carbon still works after it's been wet and dried.
 

alink

Okay cool! I was under the impression that the carbon, once wet, had to remain wet or it would lose its ability to work the way its intended. I don't know where I got that idea lol.

Thanks again! I really hope this PraziPro does the trick..
 

CindiL

Hi, PrazI Pro is active in your tank for about 3 days, that is why they say to not repeat it more than once every 3 days. You could do a 5 day round though I find 7 day rounds the easiest so I guess it depends on how many water changes you want to do. I think with PrazI Pro and what you're seeing, I would do 4-6 weekly rounds. It is very gentle and will pick up any new parasites hatched. The extra water changes get rid of eggs so it depends on whether or not you think there is a parasite (like ich would do) with eggs or some type of larvae in the tank. The seven day rounds give them a break in between the medicine working.

I am treating my whole tank right now also as one of my fish has something going on with clamping, hiding out some and white stringy poop. Better to treat all of them. It will knock back other parasites too like flukes. There are some medicated foods with praziquantel in them which you might want to use also or in addition to the liquid if you don't see enough change in the right direction. I think peabodys maybe here?

Sorry for all your frustration in all of this. It gets old I know when you have sick fish and take away some of the fun of the hobby.
 

Rivieraneo

Hello alink, I think your fish need a break from medication. White feces in itself is not an indicator of internal parasites. Both Tetra Parasite Guard and API General Cure have praziquantel as one of their main ingredients, so using HikarI PrazI Pro is all in the same. Best of luck.
 

alink

Hello alink, I think your fish need a break from medication. White feces in itself is not an indicator of internal parasites. Both Tetra Parasite Guard and API General Cure have praziquantel as one of their main ingredients, so using HikarI PrazI Pro is all in the same. Best of luck.

Well what the heck?? Why was I told by multiple people on here that it was?? So you're saying I have been wasting my time (AND MONEY!!) on this when it wasn't even necessary?? aarrggggh!
 

CindiL

White poop can be a sign of internal parasites but it can also be a sign of not eating enough or a sign of constipation. Sometimes its hard to tell the difference so you have to look at the other signs of the fish, like are they clamped up with fins tucket in? are they flashing and rubbing? are they hiding or lethargic? Are they getting skinnier while eating? Those type of signs help determine what's going on since you see them day in and day out.

Sometime it is prudent to treat, which you have done, especially praziquantel which has been in a number of medications and won't hurt your bio-filter and eradicates a number of pests including flukes. After numerous treatments its probably safe to assume if there is a problem, its not that.
 

alink

White poop can be a sign of internal parasites but it can also be a sign of not eating enough or a sign of constipation. Sometimes its hard to tell the difference so you have to look at the other signs of the fish, like are they clamped up with fins tucket in?
No.

are they flashing and rubbing?
No.

are they hiding or lethargic?
Hard to say if its normal behavior or not because its all I know them to do. My Bolivian Rams hide in the back most of the time, and the Tetras have their own small areas they typically just sit in all day, every day. If one gets too close, they chase it away.

Are they getting skinnier while eating?
There are 2 of my tetras that appear to be really skinny, but they eat every day. Every body else seems to be fine though.


Note: This morning I woke up to find one of the Bolivian Rams sucked to the filter intake tube gasping for air. I quickly netted it and have it at the top of the tank in the net with the light off to see if it recovers or dies. I don't see any injury (other than bent spine from the filter) so not sure what happened..
 

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