How many hiding places for Shrimp & Betta cohabitation

HI everyone,
I have that 16 galon tank, cycled (thanks to a culture of live bacteria), and with - I believe - all the right water parameters for this project.

It's currently home to a little less than 30 Red Cherry Shrimps (thanks to a very generous seller), one of which is bering. They spend a lot of time behind the mangrove root, under the marimo moss balls or hidden amongst the elodea. Though they do swim out in the open sometimes, someone looking at the tank too quickly might think there's only plants in it.



Still, it's pretty bare compared to other heavily planted tanks I've seen. You can see for yourself, a big open space in the middle, a tall column of water above it... Thus my question: if I were to add a Betta to this tank, would my shrimps be able to hide, assuming he's an aggressive type? Would this mean I'll never witness my shrimps swimming ever again? Or could he just eat them all so long as I don't cover the whole space with Java ferns?

Secondary question: I'm expecting for some shrimps to be eaten, but I'm aiming for their reproduction rate to be good enough so they don't go extinct. Is that a crazy goal with this setup?

 

It depends on the betta. Some may leave the shrimp alone, others may hunt them. I'd wait until you get a good amount of breeding going on and then try a betta. You could add a piece of driftwood or more plants as hiding places if you're concerned.

 

Thanks BriLandy. But that's my point, even if the Betta is aggressive, there's no way he'll get to the shrimps hiding out inside the smaller holes of the mangrove root. But for the other hiding places, I don't know how much a Betta can do. Roll a marimo? Get between glass and elodea? Should the hiding places be strongholds so he doesn't get to the shrimps or just numerous enough so he doesn't see the shrimps that often?

And for my second question, will the stress of have a predator slow the shrimps reproduction rate - besides the getting eaten part? And if so by how much?

 

Thanks @. But that's my point, even if the Betta is aggressive, there's no way he'll get to the shrimps hiding out inside the smaller holes of the mangrove root. But for the other hiding places, I don't know how much a Betta can do. Roll a marimo? Get between glass and elodea? Should the hiding places be strongholds so he doesn't get to the shrimps or just numerous enough so he doesn't see the shrimps that often?

And for my second question, will the stress of have a predator slow the shrimps reproduction rate - besides the getting eaten part? And if so by how much?

I would try to create "shrimp only" hiding places just in case. I've learned to never underestimate a determined betta.

Having a predator around will definitely affect their breeding (can't say exactly to what degree) as they will be on high alert and will be busy trying to not be eaten and won't devote as much time to baby making.

 

I would try to create "shrimp only" hiding places just in case.

So how narrow / deep / strong are "shrimp only" hiding places? I really have no idea what bettas are capable of. I wish I could have a trial fish, or just borrow one at the LFS I don't really have the space to relocate him to a personal tank if things don't go well. Well I do but I wish I don't have to!

 

I feel like as long as its smaller than the average betta but jump big enough for the shrimp to get through, you'll be good.

Worse comes to worse you can try to separate them with an in-tank divider!

 

Shrimp + Betta =

 

Nobody can definitively tell you how a betta will act because like I said, it all depends on the betta. So I can't tell you if a hypothetical betta would flip over a Moss ball or not. I would provide nooks and crannies that a betta would be unlikely to wedge into. Such as driftwood with bumps, grooves and holes in it for shrimp to hide in. I have shrimp that have evaded being a snack for cichlids by living in a patch of crypts, under rocks, and in driftwood that is lined with Java moss.

It is likely that shrimp would not be as social/active when sharing a habitat with a predator. I only see those shrimp in the cichlid tank once a week or so, usually at night.

You could place the betta with a few ghost shrimp and see what happens. Ghost shrimp are dirt cheap and it will let you know if you have a peaceful or shrimp-hungry fish before homing it with your other shrimp.

 

Cholla wood is amazing for this very purpose. But you can also look into schools of celestial pearl danios, chilI Rasbora, or ember tetras.

 

I'm with Kwig, is there a reason you're specifically looking for a betta instead of some smaller schooling fish that would be less likely to go shrimp hunting or just having a shrimp/invert only tank? My RCS use every inch of their 10g, just them and some snails, and they are almost always out and about.

I may be wrong, but if I remember correctly, Aquaphobia has a combo RCS and betta tank?

 

is there a reason you're specifically looking for a betta

Because I like bettas I like having a big + pretty + single + robust + predator fish on top of a shrimp colony.

 

Yup! I have RCS in my sorority and sometimes my Betta girls go hunting. I have loads of hiding places and plants and I started with a decent population of shrimp so I can afford to lose a few but I seldom see my shrimp out and about because of them.

 

but I seldom see my shrimp out and about because of them.

That's so sad though... So even when your bettas aren't in hunting mode, shrimps do hide? And here I was, thinking that if I get lucky with a nice (i.e., not aggressive) betta, I'll get to see my shrimps, but I guess I was wrong. Was I?

Thanks.

 

That's so sad though... So even when your bettas aren't in hunting mode, shrimps do hide? And here I was, thinking that if I get lucky with a nice (i.e., not aggressive) betta, I'll get to see my shrimps, but I guess I was wrong. Was I?

Thanks.

Yeah, they get really shy. I have a pretty heavily planted 5 gallon shrimp tank, and I added a betta to it, and the week it was in there the shrimp hid hard. Probably 100 shrimp in there as well. Would see 5 or 6, betta never showed much interest in them after the first couple of days, and he would still be in there if I hadn't forgotten to replace the saran wrap covering the big hole in the hood one day. Shrimp came back out 2 days after his death though.

 

Thanks Aichmalotizo, that's a very informative story. I do have 2 questions about it though:

• Do you think the shrimps would have gotten used to him after a while?
• Do you think a greater volume of water (my tank is 16 gallons) would have made a difference?

 

Thanks Aichmalotizo, that's a very informative story. I do have 2 questions about it though:

• Do you think the shrimps would have gotten used to him after a while?
• Do you think a greater volume of water (my tank is 16 gallons) would have made a difference?

Possibly. Your tank is also far less densely planted than mine though. I doubt they would have gotten used to him, cause even after he mostly left them alone, he would still go for any that got to stupid near him. He could never get close, just to slow with those fins, but it still stressed them a good bit. Had a few climb out using the air pumpline, forgot to mention that. Never happened before the betta, hasn't happened since. I would definitely get more wood, and plant it a bit heavier. I must mention, I didn't mind the losses, it is to be expected, and with a dense enough population, they can't all truly hide. Half the time the betta would start chasing one, only to get distracted by another. Why he eventually stopped for the most part. I would want a pretty heavy population though, cause the betta was definitely catching the shrimplets.

 

I highly doubt they will ever scamper around freely, even a mellow betta who doesn't hunt them down is likely to snap up a baby that he swims past. His very presence is enough to put them on alert. That's just how it works when you have fairly defenseless prey animals living in close quarters with predators.
I would say it depends on what your goals are. If it is a priority to see the shrimp and observe their natural behavior, don't get a betta. If the priority is the betta and you wouldn't mind the occasional glimpse of your hidden clean up crew, by all means, get a betta.
I have a shrimp tank with celestial pearl danios and my shrimp are all over the place. But I will be getting a scarlet badis here soon and will have shrimp with him too, for cleaning and plant maintenance, and also so their young can provide a constant live food source for him since they have a strong preference for live food.

 

With no predators, mine are out and about almost constantly. The babies are more active than the adults, but even the adults are starting to realize that it's safe for them to be swimming all around the tank.

 

That's so sad though... So even when your bettas aren't in hunting mode, shrimps do hide? And here I was, thinking that if I get lucky with a nice (i.e., not aggressive) betta, I'll get to see my shrimps, but I guess I was wrong. Was I?

Thanks.

That's just it though. Bettas are always in hunting mode, given the opportunity I almost never see my shrimps and when I do my attention is often drawn to it by the bettas gathering like a wolf pack around it

 

Aquaphobia, you're destroying all my dreams of a peaceful world

 

"...Nature, red in tooth and claw"~Tennyson

 

Peaceful and betta don't really usually belong in the same sentence, haha.

 

Well... I did make a tank with a part that is an "upside down aquarium" held by vacuum but with air cycling to prevent asphyxiation — which is not something I have seen anywhere else on the internet. Nothing is impossible! (half bragging half being delirious)

 

HI everyone,
I have that 16 galon tank, cycled (thanks to a culture of live bacteria), and with - I believe - all the right water parameters for this project.

It's currently home to a little less than 30 Red Cherry Shrimps (thanks to a very generous seller), one of which is bering. They spend a lot of time behind the mangrove root, under the marimo moss balls or hidden amongst the elodea. Though they do swim out in the open sometimes, someone looking at the tank too quickly might think there's only plants in it.



Still, it's pretty bare compared to other heavily planted tanks I've seen. You can see for yourself, a big open space in the middle, a tall column of water above it... Thus my question: if I were to add a Betta to this tank, would my shrimps be able to hide, assuming he's an aggressive type? Would this mean I'll never witness my shrimps swimming ever again? Or could he just eat them all so long as I don't cover the whole space with Java ferns?

Secondary question: I'm expecting for some shrimps to be eaten, but I'm aiming for their reproduction rate to be good enough so they don't go extinct. Is that a crazy goal with this setup?

Are the tall plants java ferns? I want that in my aquarium.

 

Are the tall plants java ferns? I want that in my aquarium.

No, they are Elodea.

They grew quite well in my low tech 2 gallon before (only had an airstone in there, marimo, 2 shrimps and Elodea). So I thought I'd try them in this tank and see if they can lower my nitrates. My Japanese Hairgrass and my Dwarf Baby Tears are carpeting well and fast, but don't seem to eat up enough nitrates.

I like Elodea because when it's too tall or starting to ramify, you can just clip it and plant it back. Makes quick work of planting a whole forest of it.

 

No, they are Elodea.

They grew quite well in my low tech 2 gallon before (only had an airstone in there, marimo, 2 shrimps and Elodea). So I thought I'd try them in this tank and see if they can lower my nitrates. My Japanese Hairgrass and my Dwarf Baby Tears are carpeting well and fast, but don't seem to eat up enough nitrates.

I like Elodea because when it's too tall or starting to ramify, you can just clip it and plant it back. Makes quick work of planting a whole forest of it.

That's exactly what I need. Thank you

 

I currently have a stocked 20 planted (swords, anub, java moss, etc etc) Just added Ludwigia. We got 8 RCS from a seller (full setup) w/ 6 fancy guppies, and a 1/3 dozen glo light tetras. After the tetras were removed we usually saw our shrimp. 3 weeks later we ended up dividing the tank temporarily and adding shrimp, currently (4 berried shrimp). Since we have seem them all over. All over our wood, our gravel, etc. I would say it doesn't matter how peaceful any given fish is. And also I would worry about ANY fish eating baby shrimp.

Currently 23 Shrimp, 4 berried, we see them molting, eating a wafers, and swimming from side to side, and being a lot more in the open. Glad we gave our guppies away. =]

Goodluck!

Oh, and to add into the plants reducing Nitrates, my tank can go a week and gain approx 2ppm Nitrates.