Honey Gourami Seems Stressed

Hi! I have a 10-gallon freshwater tank with 1 honey gourami, 7 ember tetras, 1 nerite snail, and 6 amano shrimp. Everybody seems happy (and the tank parameters are great - 82 degrees F, no ammonia or nitrite, 5 ppm nitrate as of today, lots of plants, rocks, and a big log) except for my poor honey gourami.

He's been in the tank 10 days and still spends a good amount of time each day when the lights are on glass surfing. The tetras (who I got about two weeks before the gourami), the snail, and the shrimp all act normal.

Should I expect for this to go on longer, and/or is that normal?

He looks fine otherwise, is eating and pooping OK (although he often ignores flake food in favor of algae and such, he enjoys the frozen bloodworms), and has lots of places to hide if need be. I'm just worried for him.

 

Hi! I have a 10-gallon freshwater tank with 1 honey gourami, 7 ember tetras, 1 nerite snail, and 6 amano shrimp. Everybody seems happy (and the tank parameters are great - 82 degrees F, no ammonia or nitrite, 5 ppm nitrate as of today, lots of plants, rocks, and a big log) except for my poor honey gourami.

He's been in the tank 10 days and still spends a good amount of time each day when the lights are on glass surfing. The tetras (who I got about two weeks before the gourami), the snail, and the shrimp all act normal.

Should I expect for this to go on longer, and/or is that normal?

He looks fine otherwise, is eating and pooping OK (although he often ignores flake food in favor of algae and such, he enjoys the frozen bloodworms), and has lots of places to hide if need be. I'm just worried for him.

I wouldn't worry too much about it, they are pretty inquisitive fish and IME get bored and glass surf often. They prefer a small group of 3 but are fine on their own given there's other fish in the tank to interact with. My lone male is a wild type and actually hates other honeys so he just shares his tank with cardinal tetras these days. He gets his kicks from messing with them when he gets bored lol. You could try getting some floating plants for him to chill under, that may give him some more stimulation and also shade from the lights

 

This is a tough one because Fishlore seems okay with honeys in a 10g but my go-to source for information, seriouslyfish, which pulls info from biology journals, field notes, and local breeders, says 20g is the minimum. If yours is glass surfing with no apparent cause and otherwise seems healthy I would assume it doesn't like the tank

 

I wouldn't worry too much about it, they are pretty inquisitive fish and IME get bored and glass surf often. They prefer a small group of 3 but are fine on their own given there's other fish in the tank to interact with. My lone male is a wild type and actually hates other honeys so he just shares his tank with cardinal tetras these days. He gets his kicks from messing with them when he gets bored lol. You could try getting some floating plants for him to chill under, that may give him some more stimulation and also shade from the lights

Thank you for the vote of confidence, I appreciate it. Any suggestions on floating plants? I've been hesitant to get any because I've heard they over take the tank quickly (although I suppose with a 10 gallon it would be easy enough to just get rid of them whenever that happens)

 

True that, not enough cover could be the issue. thanks Fishstery I missed that. Salvinia is a good option, brazilian pennywort or water sprite floated is good too. Frogbit and red root floaters even. Basically anything lol, even duckweed would help a bit

 

This is a tough one because Fishlore seems okay with honeys in a 10g but my go-to source for information, seriouslyfish, which pulls info from biology journals, field notes, and local breeders, says 20g is the minimum. If yours is glass surfing with no apparent cause and otherwise seems healthy I would assume it doesn't like the tank

What are my options that case? I don't have room to upgrade to anything bigger than a 10 gallon

 

What are my options that case? I don't have room to upgrade to anything bigger than a 10 gallon

I would try the extra cover and see what happens first

 

Hi, for me social fish should ideally be kept with other fish of the same species. It may or may not be the case here that the behaviour you're seeing is a result of this.

As for tank size, a 10 would be the minimum I would suggest. This isn't so much that you wouldn't be able to keep a pair or even a trio in a tank this size, it's more about ideally you would want a group of 5 or so, which would be a squeeze in a 10 gallon.

 

Thank you for the vote of confidence, I appreciate it. Any suggestions on floating plants? I've been hesitant to get any because I've heard they over take the tank quickly (although I suppose with a 10 gallon it would be easy enough to just get rid of them whenever that happens)

Frogbit is the easiest and are easy to pull out when they start to grow too much. They are super cute and look like mini lily pads. An added bonus if frogbit that you won't get from red roots or others are the extremely long roots they grow quickly. You can keep the roots longer which your gourami will love, but you just pull the plant out, trim the roots to your desired length, and toss them back in. Usually they need trimmed every other week for me. As for the others comments, I can't say minimum tank size for them in regards to a 10 gal. I have kept a few different groups over the years but they were in my 12 gallon with a long foot print, so the tank is 3ft long but very shallow which is overly accommodating for gouramis. Truthfully I've kept the traditional honeys in groups of 3-4 in this tank and they were very happy with friends. But like I mentioned before, I finally got my hands on a wild type and he is extremely boisterous and would bully the heck out of the other gouramis so in the end I had to give him the tank by himself. I've tried a few times over the years with him to introduce new gouramis but it always ends in him stressing them out. If you are overly concerned with him you could do a group of 3 in a 10 gal but you'd have to rehome everything else due to the bioload. Just be prepared like bettas that some will work with others and some are just too aggressive for a group. Honey gouramis get a notorious rep for being extremely peaceful with tankmates and amongst themselves, but they are still gouramis at the end of the day and a group would be much happier in a larger footprint tank, doesn't necessarily need to be larger volume just dimensions (like mine). I'd say keep him how he is now, it could end up that you try a group and then the 10 gal is too small for each to have their own space and now you have 3 stressed out gouramis. Can you post a pic of the tank?

 

Thanks for the help and opinions all. Here is the tank:

https://imgur.com/a/rpB0kSF

My hope is to add five more tetras. I think I will also call the store and see their return policy just to know.

As you can see, there's plenty of cover and places to go in the tank. The bacopa is been in there about a week (everything else about 6 weeks since it all went in when I started cycling) and the gourami has taken to hiding back there sometimes, especially when the lights are out.

I really don't want to rehome the gourami but after having a DG die from DG disease, it feels like I just can't make them work in this tank - though I will try the frogbit first.

Can you post a pic of the tank?

Bumping with this because I'm not sure if I need to quote you for a notification now that this has been subcategorized

 

Not sure if there is a way for me to bump this to the top

 

Not sure if there is a way for me to bump this to the top

Sorry I didn't notice you posted a pic! I think your honey would be happier with some taller plants, maybe a Java fern mat in the middle background. There's some hiding spots down low but gouramis prefer to hang out near the surface as they are labyrinth breathers like betta fish, and the upper portion of the tank is pretty clear and open. I think a nice tall mat of Java fern and some floaters will make him more comfortable.

Edit: looking at the picture I can see a stress line going down his body, so there's definitely something that is causing him stress. Other than what else I mentioned to add i would keep an eye on the tetras just to make sure they aren't nipping him, as a lot of tetra species do as a way of communication and whatnot between the group.

 

Sorry I didn't notice you posted a pic! I think your honey would be happier with some taller plants, maybe a Java fern mat in the middle background. There's some hiding spots down low but gouramis prefer to hang out near the surface as they are labyrinth breathers like betta fish, and the upper portion of the tank is pretty clear and open. I think a nice tall mat of Java fern and some floaters will make him more comfortable.

Edit: looking at the picture I can see a stress line going down his body, so there's definitely something that is causing him stress. Other than what else I mentioned to add i would keep an eye on the tetras just to make sure they aren't nipping him, as a lot of tetra species do as a way of communication and whatnot between the group.

Thanks for the response! I was just afraid I had gotten locked away. I actually had to get rid of some java fern that died off (despite my other plants being fine) and just recently got the bacopa, so I'm hoping it will grow soon. I'm also planning on getting some frogbit on Wednesday.

https://imgur.com/a/asKuHns

I don't think the single horizontal stripe is a thing to worry about - from what I can tell that's just common gourami coloring. Unless there's something else I'm missing!

But no - I've never seen the embers interact with him period. They play with each other but leave the honey alone.

 

Thanks for the response! I was just afraid I had gotten locked away. I actually had to get rid of some java fern that died off (despite my other plants being fine) and just recently got the bacopa, so I'm hoping it will grow soon. I'm also planning on getting some frogbit on Wednesday.

https://imgur.com/a/asKuHns

I don't think the single horizontal stripe is a thing to worry about - from what I can tell that's just common gourami coloring. Unless there's something else I'm missing!

But no - I've never seen the embers interact with him period. They play with each other but leave the honey alone.

Like you said this isn't a "stress line" it's just natural colouring usually seen in Honey Gourami, more so the females.

I very much agree, taller or preferably floating plants are a good idea with any Gourami.

 

Thanks for the response! I was just afraid I had gotten locked away. I actually had to get rid of some java fern that died off (despite my other plants being fine) and just recently got the bacopa, so I'm hoping it will grow soon. I'm also planning on getting some frogbit on Wednesday.

https://imgur.com/a/asKuHns

I don't think the single horizontal stripe is a thing to worry about - from what I can tell that's just common gourami coloring. Unless there's something else I'm missing!

But no - I've never seen the embers interact with him period. They play with each other but leave the honey alone.

Did you bury the Java fern in the substrate? And I know that to be a stress line at least in my experience with the sunset variety. Mine only displayed the line when they were stressed out. Here's pictures of my sunsets when they were comfortable and settled in to the tank (I've kept both sunset and wild varieties for the last 3 years)






The last photo are of my golden honeys which are what color variety I believe you have btw. I pictured all 3, sunset, golden, and wild

 

Bruhh. May I know where you bought your Honey Gourami? Please. I have a 10g and I want these fish so bad.

 

Did you bury the Java fern in the substrate? And I know that to be a stress line at least in my experience with the sunset variety. Mine only displayed the line when they were stressed out. Here's pictures of my sunsets when they were comfortable and settled in to the tank (I've kept both sunset and wild varieties for the last 3

No the java fern was glued to a rock - but it was from PetCo (before I discovered a much better place) so I think it was just suspect.

But...that's interesting. I really thought that was just normal coloration. I feel really sad now. I thought for sure a honey gourami would be OK in a 10-gallon but it seems like this is not a good home for him(/her? who knows)

Bruhh. May I know where you bought your Honey Gourami? Please. I have a 10g and I want these fish so bad.

Pacific Aquarium in NYC

Like you said this isn't a "stress line" it's just natural colouring usually seen in Honey Gourami, more so the females.

I very much agree, taller or preferably floating plants are a good idea with any Gourami.

just saw this as well, so I'm definitely confused

 

No the java fern was glued to a rock - but it was from PetCo (before I discovered a much better place) so I think it was just suspect.

But...that's interesting. I really thought that was just normal coloration. I feel really sad now. I thought for sure a honey gourami would be OK in a 10-gallon but it seems like this is not a good home for him(/her? who knows)

Pacific Aquarium in NYC

just saw this as well, so I'm definitely confused

Sorry, what did I confuse you about?

 

No the java fern was glued to a rock - but it was from PetCo (before I discovered a much better place) so I think it was just suspect.

But...that's interesting. I really thought that was just normal coloration. I feel really sad now. I thought for sure a honey gourami would be OK in a 10-gallon but it seems like this is not a good home for him(/her? who knows)

Pacific Aquarium in NYC

just saw this as well, so I'm definitely confused

I dont necessarily see an issue with the tank size itself, I just think you need some more background plants. In my experience with these guys they really do appreciate a densely planted tank, I'd imagine much like their natural environment in the wild. Before I rescaped my honey tank my Java fern had gotten so dense that the fish had to navigate through the roots and piles of leaves to get to the other side of the tank. It looked like a tight squeeze, but guess where my gourami always was? He always chose the planted portion over the open area part

Sorry, what did I confuse you about?

You making a comment about the stress line. Have you kept honey gouramis before?

 

I dont necessarily see an issue with the tank size itself, I just think you need some more background plants. In my experience with these guys they really do appreciate a densely planted tank, I'd imagine much like their natural environment in the wild. Before I rescaped my honey tank my Java fern had gotten so dense that the fish had to navigate through the roots and piles of leaves to get to the other side of the tank. It looked like a tight squeeze, but guess where my gourami always was? He always chose the planted portion over the open area part

You making a comment about the stress line. Have you kept honey gouramis before?

Ah I see
Yes I have, both wild type and Gold. It's really not a stress line, it's perfectly natural colouring.
Op, it's a her btw ; )

 

Thanks again for the help all. See I had thought it was a "her" because of the line, but the fins are pointed and that's generally a sign of being a "he".

One question I have - because I think I might try to get frogbit today - I see the gourami glass surfing towards the bottom of the tank. Is that indicative of it being another problem or might that be solved by getting some frogbit as well? (i.e., is the location of the glass surfing necessarily indicative of the problem)

 

Ah I see
Yes I have, both wild type and Gold. It's really not a stress line, it's perfectly natural colouring.
Op, it's a her btw ; )

I'd like another member to chime in because I completely disagree. Thats most definitely not a female. Females are straight up silver. It's pretty rare to find a female in a store and when you do find one you'll know. The lateral line on a female will pass from one end completely through the eye all the way to the mouth. Even then I bought 2 wild types from my LFS that I thought were possibly female because because had lines that went all the way through their eye but SURPRISE when i got them home and they settled in the line went away their yellow fins came through and I was surprised with 2 more boys.

Thanks again for the help all. See I had thought it was a "her" because of the line, but the fins are pointed and that's generally a sign of being a "he".

One question I have - because I think I might try to get frogbit today - I see the gourami glass surfing towards the bottom of the tank. Is that indicative of it being another problem or might that be solved by getting some frogbit as well? (i.e., is the location of the glass surfing necessarily indicative of the problem)

I'd just think the glass surfing is either boredom from not being stimulated enough or from stress of not having enough plant cover. Other than that I see a perfectly healthy tank! And I disagree with the other member OP, you most definitely have a male.

 

FWIW, this is two weeks ago when I got my gourami

https://imgur.com/a/5BFkBjW

 

Shape of the fins isn't really a good way of telling when it comes to Honey Gourami. Generally a good way is the colour of the trim on the dorsal and analfins, males: yellow and females: orange.

Well I'm not sure what the actual issue is but having frogbit or more plants certainly won't harm the situation.

I'd like another member to chime in because I completely disagree. Thats most definitely not a female. Females are straight up silver. It's pretty rare to find a female in a store and when you do find one you'll know. The lateral line on a female will pass from one end completely through the eye all the way to the mouth. Even then I bought 2 wild types from my LFS that I thought were possibly female because because had lines that went all the way through their eye but SURPRISE when i got them home and they settled in the line went away their yellow fins came through and I was surprised with 2 more boys.

I'd just think the glass surfing is either boredom from not being stimulated enough or from stress of not having enough plant cover. Other than that I see a perfectly healthy tank! And I disagree with the other member OP, you most definitely have a male.

Sure, though this is definitely a female.
Wild types can be a little tricky the lateral line can be tricky to judge.
Golds however are similar in colour as males, though a little paler. They also don't have that strong orange around the back and analfin. The dorsal fins are quite a good way of telling.

 

Shape of the fins isn't really a good way of telling when it comes to Honey Gourami. Generally a good way is the colour of the trim on the dorsal and analfins, males: yellow and females: orange.

Well I'm not sure what the actual issue is but having frogbit or more plants certainly won't harm the situation.


Sure, though this is definitely a female.
Wild types can be a little tricky the lateral line can be tricky to judge.
Golds however are similar in colour as males, though a little paler. They also don't have that strong orange around the back and analfin. The dorsal fins are quite a good way of telling.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree then

 

So, at this point...if the frogbit doesn't work do I just have to plan on bringing my gourami back to the store? Should I just forget about the frogbit and take it back anyway?

 

chromedome52
Any opinion on the stress line/sex and reason for glass surfing? It was my thought that the golden variety doesn't show a line so it would appear to be a stress line in this variety. I also think OP has a juvie male, aren't juvie males and females difficult to differentiate from in this color morph?

 

Fishstery you are incorrect here. I have 2 females that are super bright yellow and have the stripe from time to time. Its only the wild type females that are silver. The golden variety is easy to sex, just look at the dorsal fin colouration.



Bright yellow and in 2nd photo showing stripe

 

So, at this point...if the frogbit doesn't work do I just have to plan on bringing my gourami back to the store? Should I just forget about the frogbit and take it back anyway?

Give it time to settle, the plants will be good either way = )

Fishstery you are incorrect here. I have 2 females that are super bright yellow and have the stripe from time to time. Its only the wild type females that are silver. The golden variety is easy to sex, just look at the dorsal fin colouration.
View attachment 785494View attachment 785495
Bright yellow and in 2nd photo showing stripe

Thanks for posting with your lovely girls = )

 

With golds it’s more difficult to determine sex due as most gold honeys don’t have visible lines from the eye to the caudual peduncle.
While I do agree that OP’s fish is female I have kept female honeys that have successfully spawned without lines.

Here is an old picture of one of my old female honey that passed.

 

Thanks for the help determining its gender.

Unfortunately the pacing and surfing has just gotten worse all day now, out of nowhere.

 

Thanks for the help determining its gender.

Unfortunately the pacing and surfing has just gotten worse all day now, out of nowhere.

Turn the lights down and get a black background on the tank while you try and sort new plants

 

Turn the lights down and get a black background on the tank while you try and sort new plants

thank you. the light is already as low as it goes. unfortunately I think I'm just going to have to decide whether spending a bunch more money to try and get my gourami to *maybe* calm down is the right move.

 

Thanks for the other users that breed chiming in---i was mistaken about the gender. That's why I tagged chromedome, i know they have bred honeys in the past. I think everyone is in agreement though that more plants may ease the situation!

Fishstery you are incorrect here. I have 2 females that are super bright yellow and have the stripe from time to time. Its only the wild type females that are silver. The golden variety is easy to sex, just look at the dorsal fin colouration.
View attachment 785494View attachment 785495
Bright yellow and in 2nd photo showing stripe

That's a gorgeous tank btw :O

 

Unfortunately I've decided to take the gourami back to the fish store, who confirmed they will take her. It's gotten much worse today and I *just* bought that bacopa so I can't afford to keep spending more money on plants to hope that it works out. It makes me sad, but I'm very appreciative that people took so much time to help me.

 

Unfortunately I've decided to take the gourami back to the fish store, who confirmed they will take her. It's gotten much worse today and I *just* bought that bacopa so I can't afford to keep spending more money on plants to hope that it works out. It makes me sad, but I'm very appreciative that people took so much time to help me.

If you aren't in a position where you want to spend more money on plants, and also like your tank how it is now instead of planting it more, I think this is a responsible decision unless you want to wait a few more days and see if she calms down.