Help with marks on gourami

Vix1987

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HI
I’ve attached a couple of pictures as I initially thought it may have been damage to my Gouramis scales from them getting scratched on the bottom of half a coconut shell my fan shrimp keeps moving out of the gravel. So I’m not 100% sure If he’s just caught himself (as he tries to squeeze into tiniest of places to have a nose around). He’s not acting any differently and is eating well. I just want everyone’s advice
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EmbersToAshes

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I can't stress how important it is to isolate the fish to prevent spreading the infection until you identify exactly what it is. It could be coulumnaris, dwarf gouramI disease, "fish tb", or countless other infections, some can't be cured. How long have you had him?. Melafix might help, but it looks like a more serious infection and may need real antibiotics
 
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Vix1987

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EmbersToAshes said:
I can't stress how important it is to isolate the fish to prevent spreading the infection until you identify exactly what it is. It could be coulumnaris, dwarf gouramI disease, "fish tb", or countless other infections, some can't be cured. How long have you had him?. Melafix might help, but it looks like a more serious infection and may need real antibiotics
I don’t have option to quarantine just treat or euthanise if it is something serious. As I say character wise he’s fine atm it looks “cosmetic” . I’ve had him since ... January

ImpairedFish said:
I'd try out some Melafix
Any ideas what you think it may be? I’ve got some salt until I can get the shop tomorrow for something else (UK currently on lockdown)
 

ImpairedFish

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Vix1987 said:
Any ideas what you think it may be? I’ve got some salt until I can get the shop tomorrow for something else (UK currently on lockdown)
No clue mate, I'd let an expert answer that but I use Melafix every time my fish act weird, #staysafeuk
 
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Vix1987

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DoubleDutch said:
To me these are symptoms of Dwarf GouramI Disease. I doubt treatment will work. Melafix won't do a thing.
I’ll do some research because I don’t want to kill it yet if it’s not that
 

EmbersToAshes

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DoubleDutch said:
To me these are symptoms of Dwarf GouramI Disease. I doubt treatment will work. Melafix won't do a thing.
Sad but true. There are so many things that look like that and almost all of them are very serious. It's hard to diagnose specifically without lab tests or a necropsy. Even if diagnosed, treatment would require hardcore antibiotics probably prescribed by a vet, and often doesn't work anyway. It can quite possibly spread to your other fish and slowly kill all of them if you don't get him out of the tank. If you don't want to kill him he would be ok to live out his days with just a small tank by himself. Maybe he would make a miraculous recovery or it's a minor infection posing as a more serious one. Your other fish are closely related to gouramis and thus much more likely to contract a disease from him then other types of community fish. I'm very sorry. the choice is yours
 
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Vix1987

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I thought dwarf gouramI disease cannot be contracted by other fish ... hence the name... are you saying that is not the case?
 

jinjerJOSH22

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Vix1987 said:
I thought dwarf gouramI disease cannot be contracted by other fish ... hence the name... are you saying that is not the case?
I’ll preface this with I don’t know much about this and can only go by what I’ve read in the numerous threads that have discussed it.

Dwarf GouramI disease/Dwarf GouramI Irodovirus/DGIV isn’t actually a thing. They suffer from terrible genetics through inbreeding at the source.
The Irodovirus is a thing that appears to be prevalent in Dwarf GouramI and affects other GouramI species but I’m not sure about other fish.
 

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jinjerJOSH22 said:
I’ll preface this with I don’t know much about this and can only go by what I’ve read in the numerous threads that have discussed it.

Dwarf GouramI disease/Dwarf GouramI Irodovirus/DGIV isn’t actually a thing. They suffer from terrible genetics through inbreeding at the source.
The Irodovirus is a thing that appears to be prevalent in Dwarf GouramI and affects other GouramI species but I’m not sure about other fish.
What exactly do you mean with "it isn't a thing". If you've been on this (and other) forums over the year "it is thing" to which the linebred colortypes appear to be even more sensitive than the wild colortype.

The thing is it isn't really a disease but a condition that "opens" the immunesystem and makes it vunerable for all kinds of issues and infections. Organs (kidneys) are attacked en faile after sone time.

There are hundreds of Iridoviruses and specific ones to other species. The latter seem have less impact on those fish than this one on DG's. And yes the excessive breeding (in tanks full of meds to prevent the secundairy infections) has caused and added to this issue. As soon fish from those thanks "hit" our water the "common / normal bacteria are allowed to get nasty cause they've near to none resistance.

This is also the reason why we shouldn't throw in meds without a clear diagnose and should stop the overuse of antibiotics ourselves.
 

jinjerJOSH22

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DoubleDutch said:
What exactly do you mean with "it isn't a thing". If you've been on this (and other) forums over the year "it is thing" to which the linebred colortypes appear to be even more sensitive than the wild colortype.
Just that, the Irodovirus isn’t specific to Dwarf Gourami, other species of GouramI at the very least can contract it.
That’s all I meant by it, there’s no question of the horrible state most DGs seem to be in.
 

DoubleDutch

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jinjerJOSH22 said:
Just that, the Irodovirus isn’t specific to Dwarf Gourami, other species of GouramI at the very least can contract it.
That’s all I meant by it, there’s no question of the horrible state most DGs seem to be in.
Ahhh okay. I still doubt that btw.
 

CichlidTai

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This isn’t the best place for advice,Most people come here to learn and have no clue but still throw in their 2 cents
 

EmbersToAshes

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CichlidTai said:
This isn’t the best place for advice,Most people come here to learn and have no clue but still throw in their 2 cents
Although this has been an informative thread, I'm glad you said this. I am not a doctor or biologist, and I don't think many (if any) people using online sources like this are. I used to work at a pet store and specialized in fish. People would often ask me what medications to buy for disease, and I often had to treat hundreds of sick fish in order to sell them. I consider myself to be fairly familiar with common diseases found in aquarium fish and can point you in the right direction, but I can't provide a diagnosis. Only a veterinarian or biologist can do that, and unless you have access to one you won't be able to properly identify and treat the problem. Anyone who says they can ID a specific species of microbe via a picture of the wound alone is most likely an internet liar. They are microscopic and manifest in a variety of ways.

Your fish is definitely infected in some way. The other fish are at risk of becoming infected. This doesn't mean they will get it, just that they might. To me, the wounds look like a more serious infection vs a more common bacterial infection that could be easily treated. That doesn't mean it COULDN'T be a minor infection. It's impossible for the average person to tell for sure without a microscope or lab tests.

I personally wouldn't want to kill the fish if it's acting normally, because it is possible it will make a full recovery, although I think it's unlikely. It is also possible that it's contagious. It may already be in the water or in your other fish, or it may infect them after a longer incubation period, or after the host dies. I personally wouldn't want to risk all my other fish to keep one alive either.

Setting him up by himself is really the only only way around either of those options. It doesn't have to be big or expensive. A tank can fit anywhere if you try hard enough imo. A 10 gal or maybe a 5.5 or a rubber tote with more maintenance would work for him. Just an inexpensive sponge filter or a cheap Craigslist grab would be ok too. That would allow you to see if he will recover without risking the other fish further.

I would treat him with the Melafix or another natural antibiotic after you separate him. It won't work if it's a serious problem, but if it's a minor problem it could help. If he continues to get worse, just stop treatment to prevent prolonging his suffering and euthanize if it is kinder.

I really wish I could tell you which meds would make him better, or give you a more defenative diagnosis or treatment method, but I cant. Only a microscope can. I wish you luck. Hope he pulls through. If you need anymore advice don't hesitate to ask
 
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Vix1987

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Thanks everyone for your input , a couple seem very contradictory but I can see you all mean well. I'm going to just keep the water pristine and monitor him for now to see if there is any improvement because I do feel it could be too rash to kill him yet. Fish are a minefield , it reminds me why I got rid of them now!
 

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