Help sex my Bolivian rams

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Bomby

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I bought 2 Bolivian rams yesterday and my LFS tried to help sex them for me
Can you help me with sexing them

IMG_20200215_103354218_BURST000_COVER_TOP.jpg
 

Feohw

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Could you get a better picture of them? A clear picture of a side view is best for sexing, especially if you can get the breeding tube in the picture. So an angle like this would be best:
20190622_213340.jpg


From your picture, I'd say the front fish is a female. It has a feminine belly to it and from what I can see the breeding tube is quite thick too.
 

CichlidJynx

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I’d have to agree with Feohw, the front looks like a female but a side view would be awesome
 
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Bomby

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CichlidJynx said:
I’d have to agree with Feohw, the front looks like a female but a side view would be awesome
Feohw said:
Could you get a better picture of them? A clear picture of a side view is best for sexing, especially if you can get the breeding tube in the picture. So an angle like this would be best:

From your picture, I'd say the front fish is a female. It has a feminine belly to it and from what I can see the breeding tube is quite thick too.
 

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Feohw

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I'm seeing two females from those pics.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
I'm seeing two females from those pics.
One is bigger and more colourful

Also if they are two females should I get a male?

They are always together following each other
 

Feohw

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Bomby said:
One is bigger and more colourful

Also if they are two females should I get a male?

They are always together following each other
Size and colour aren't a very reliable way to sex. The head structure and chin/belly of those two are as they would be in a female. The most reliable way of sexing is the breeding tube, in the first picture in this thread the tube of the ram in front is feminine. In the third picture the tube on the left looks feminine too from what little can be seen. Other than that the tubes aren't easily seen. If there's one that you think is male can you get a picture of the tube? It should be much smaller. How many gallons is the tank and what are the dimensions? Depending on that then I'd say you could add a male.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
Size and colour aren't a very reliable way to sex. The head structure and chin/belly of those two are as they would be in a female. The most reliable way of sexing is the breeding tube, in the first picture in this thread the tube of the ram in front is feminine. In the third picture the tube on the left looks feminine too from what little can be seen. Other than that the tubes aren't easily seen. If there's one that you think is male can you get a picture of the tube? It should be much smaller. How many gallons is the tank and what are the dimensions? Depending on that then I'd say you could add a male.
My tank is 33 gallons

80cmx35x50

I have

5 bronze corydoras
2 Bolivian rams
8 black skirt tetras
1 BN pleco
1 l10a pleco

I also have a 20 gallon which contains guppies danios and Kuli loaches

I was thinking I could buy a male and then move excess female that doesn't pair to 20 gallon

IMG_20200215_162626388.jpg
 

Feohw

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Bomby said:
I was thinking I could buy a male and then move excess female that doesn't pair to 20 gallon
That would work fine, as long as the 20 can handle another fish. The male may get bullied a bit initially as he'll be entering their territory, but it usually calms a bit after a few days.

That's a very nice ram, but definitely a female. When you are looking for a male, look for one with a very small breeding tube. He likely won't be as heavy-set (males tend to have less of a belly) as your females and his head won't be as rounded and smooth. They have a slight bump to it. This is the tube that you should look for in a male:
Screenshot_20190627-015405.png

As you can see its a very small tube, whereas a female has a larger one.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
That would work fine, as long as the 20 can handle another fish. The male may get bullied a bit initially as he'll be entering their territory, but it usually calms a bit after a few days.

That's a very nice ram, but definitely a female. When you are looking for a male, look for one with a very small breeding tube. He likely won't be as heavy-set (males tend to have less of a belly) as your females and his head won't be as rounded and smooth. They have a slight bump to it. This is the tube that you should look for in a male:
Screenshot_20190627-015405.png

As you can see its a very small tube, whereas a female has a larger one.
my plan

in my 30 gallon im going to get anotherram which is a male

questions

will the fry survive with my bottom dwellers?

in my 20 gallon

stocking

5 zebra danios
3 guppies+fry
7 kuli loaches

im going to get a pair of kribs?

would these ideas work
 

Feohw

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Bomby said:
will the fry survive with my bottom dwellers?
Most likely not. For the first few spawns the rams will likely eat them themselves. After that they tend to get picked off in community tanks before long, even though rams are great parents. If you want to get into breeding then its best not to raise the fry in a community.
Bomby said:
im going to get a pair of kribs?
Tank size is a debatable topic, personally I'd say kribs would appreciate a larger tank (especially if its a tall rather than long 20). And I definitely wouldn't do a pair of kribs with a ram in a 20.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
Most likely not. For the first few spawns the rams will likely eat them themselves. After that they tend to get picked off in community tanks before long, even though rams are great parents. If you want to get into breeding then its best not to raise the fry in a community.

Tank size is a debatable topic, personally I'd say kribs would appreciate a larger tank (especially if its a tall rather than long 20). And I definitely wouldn't do a pair of kribs with a ram in a 20.
no what i mean

is do kribs,danios,guppies and kulis in 20 gallon and do 2 females 1 male rams 30 gallon
 

Feohw

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Bomby said:
no what i mean

is do kribs,danios,guppies and kulis in 20 gallon and do 2 females 1 male rams 30 gallon
In my opinion a pair of rams is the ideal amount for a 30 gallon. You could give it a shot to see how it works out. But I'd hold off on the kribs until you are sure. Ideally you would see how the rams get on, even when they breed before you get the kribs. That way if you need to separate you will have the 20 to put the lone ram into.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
In my opinion a pair of rams is the ideal amount for a 30 gallon. You could give it a shot to see how it works out. But I'd hold off on the kribs until you are sure. Ideally you would see how the rams get on, even when they breed before you get the kribs. That way if you need to separate you will have the 20 to put the lone ram into.
Perfect thanks

Feohw said:
In my opinion a pair of rams is the ideal amount for a 30 gallon. You could give it a shot to see how it works out. But I'd hold off on the kribs until you are sure. Ideally you would see how the rams get on, even when they breed before you get the kribs. That way if you need to separate you will have the 20 to put the lone ram into.
should i vent the rams to make sure and how?

will rams eat guppy fry?
 

Feohw

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Bomby said:
should i vent the rams to make sure and how?
Just look at the breeding tubes. A males will look small like this:
vent.jpg

And a female would be larger like this:
Screenshot_20190627-014930.png
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
Just look at the breeding tubes. A males will look small like this:

And a female would be larger like this:
they seem to follow each other and they are always together
 

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Feohw

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I'm still seeing two females. You can see that their tubes are larger. Rams are quite social which is why I like to recommend more than one. In the end of the day two females will do great together, you don't necessarily need a male unless you want to breed.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
I'm still seeing two females. You can see that their tubes are larger. Rams are quite social which is why I like to recommend more than one. In the end of the day two females will do great together, you don't necessarily need a male unless you want to breed.
i want to breed them

im just considering my options do i:
get 2 more rams and keep a group in my 30
get a male wait till pairs up remove other female and put in 20 gallon
move rams to 20 gallon and get apostos
 

Feohw

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Bomby said:
i want to breed them

im just considering my options do i:

get 2 more rams and keep a group in my 30

get a male wait till pairs up remove other female and put in 20 gallon

move rams to 20 gallon and get apostos
Ah okay. You could do any of those if you wanted and they should usually work out. With the first option you may need to rehome the extras eventually, especially if you want to breed them as successfully as possible in that tank.
 
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Bomby

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Feohw said:
Ah okay. You could do any of those if you wanted and they should usually work out. With the first option you may need to rehome the extras eventually, especially if you want to breed them as successfully as possible in that tank.
dont pairs usualy work better if you give a male choice

so if i get a male he will have a choice
 
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