Have a look here and see what you think please Question

Discussion in 'Water Parameters' started by Reefdweller, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. Reefdweller

    Reefdweller Valued Member Member

    Guys,

    I told myself before I went back into SW that I was going to do it right this time. I have a JBJ 28G Nano Reef tank setup. It has been cycling for over a week now. It has 40 pounds of live sand, 35 pounds of live rock with plenty of circulation. From the "get go" the tank stays cloudy looking..... just not crisp and clean looking. I wrote this off as the cycling process. I decided I would get a couple little hearty fish to help the tank along with cycling. Nothing big just 2 damsels... I put them in the tank Monday night. One was dead less than 24 hours later and now the other one I can not even find so needless to say he is probably a goner too... I went ahead and did a 30% water change last night just to be safe on things.

    This morning here are my readings....

    PH - 8.2
    Nitrate - 0
    KH - 10
    Phosphate - 0.5
    Calcium - Off the chart and I mean way high so much that I can not even get a reading - how this happened I have no idea but lets see its well above 500.
    Temp. - 82.3
    Salinity - 22

    I use RO/DI water. I just have a couple corals in there and they look pitiful. Is too much calcium deadly to corals and fish?

    Everything looks great except the calcium and the cloudy looking water ugh.... I hope you guys can help me on what the heck is going on here. I am bummed over this..... :(
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2012
  2. ryanr

    ryanr Moderator Moderator Member

    Your tank has only been setup for a week? I would not have added any live stock until the tank had cycled completely.
    Ammonia, Nitrite readings? My guess is your cloudiness is a bacteria bloom, and your fish died from ammonia poisoning, and your corals are also suffering for the same reason. This also stands out given you don't have a nitrate reading.

    Two things also stand out to me
    - Temperature, is getting up there. I'd consider bringing it down to around 80 F.
    - Salinity - is this salinity or SG? 1.022 SG is fine for FO/FOWLR, but for a reef you want it up around 1.024/1.026. If it's salinity, 22 ppt, it's too low, and should be around 30-33ppt.

    What sort of corals do you have? Are you adding buffers (there's a lot listed in your profile)? If you're adding buffers, your Ca can rise if there aren't enough Ca hungry corals in the setup. High Ca could cause cloudy water, but it should settle within 24 hours or so.
     
  3. OP
    OP
    Reefdweller

    Reefdweller Valued Member Member

    See I was always told that adding LR to a tank cycling is okay and would help with the process. Now I am not so sure... The salinity was a typo - it is 1.022-1.024 range. I think you are right on the Ammonia because I thought the same thing by the behaivor of the fish last night after I found the one dead. What is the best way to bring the ammonia down? I do not have a test kit for Ammonia or Nitrite. You would think the Marine Reed Master Test Kit would contain those but they do not so I need to pick those two up asap. The temperature is a tad high and I have since dropped it down so we are good there. The only buffer that I am using is to build up the PH when it gets low while testing it. Some of those I have listed I have only used a couple of times to stimulate calcium. Man what a mess.... Okay so what do I need to do now to get things on track based on what I have hopefully answered for you. I appreciate your help.
     
  4. Eienna

    Eienna Fishlore VIP Member

    Haha, I think we have a misunderstanding here. Ryanr was referring to having added the damsels (live STOCK) not the live rock. The live rock is good to add during cycling.

    Yeah, you want ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate tests. Get the liquid ones ONLY.

    I don't know much about SW but the best way to drop ammonia in FW is water changes, coupled with extra Seachem Prime to detox what's left between changes. I imagine there might be other options in SW though, given how expensive water changes are in SW.
     
  5. kinezumi89

    kinezumi89 Fishlore VIP Member

    He said live stock, not live rock :) And you don't do anything to bring the ammonia down, you need to wait until the bacterial colony in the rock is large enough to process it on its own.

    Edit: oops, super ninja :p I blame the fact I'm typing with one hand because my cat is occupying the other. ;)
     
  6. ryanr

    ryanr Moderator Moderator Member

    Hi,
    Yep, I was referring to the fish ;)
    As for adding LR while a tank cycles, I prefer to add all LR in one hit, and let it cycle. When you add LR, you risk a potential mini-cycle as a result of the increased die-off.

    What to do next?
    If it were me.....
    - First stop any and all buffering/supplements
    - Establish stable temperature
    - Establish stable specific gravity at around 1.024 for reef (how are you testing SG? If hydrometer, ensure it is accurate)
    - Let tank cycle, it could take 1 week, 3 weeks, 3 months - every system is different. Your tank
    - Don't worry about pH - it will fluctuate while the tank cycles, and even when cycled, as long as it is stable at or above 8.0 you'll be fine. The actual number doesn't matter.

    Just focus on keeping the tank topped off with RO/DI, and cycling the tank (0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, some nitrates).

    Once you have had 0,0,some for 2 weeks, then add your live stock.

    EDIT: You can dose the tank every day with Prime if you have live stock/corals, as this will neutralise the ammonia/nitrites.
     
  7. OP
    OP
    Reefdweller

    Reefdweller Valued Member Member

    Okay - Yes I did read that wrong you did say LS not LR opps.... hehe okay I gotcha! I think it will be okay. It is looking better and the one missing fish that I assumed was dead is still alive! and eating very well so hey! Maybe not so bad after all.

    I use a Refractometer to test salinity so it should be accurate. The temperature does stay a tad high and I am not sure why... LED's are not suppose to generate the heat like other lighting systems and I have my heater set at around 80 but it stays at 83.... It would seem odd to need a chiller for a Nano 28 Gallon all in one system but maybe I am wrong. I did order my liquid test kits and skimmer last night from Marinedepot. I do still have some brown algae on some of the rock and even some on the glass I feel better that this is part of the cycling process.

    Ryan I did add all 35 pounds in one whack so thats all I am doing until this thing cycles. I got to be honest I was feeling a bit lousy there for a bit with this tank but all in all I am feeling better thanks to you guys. :;toast
     
  8. ryanr

    ryanr Moderator Moderator Member

    Assuming a glass thermometer, your heater may be slightly off (mis-calibrated), which is no big deal, just dial it down. But first, grab a second thermometer if possible and verify.

    Refractometer :;th

    Also, depending on what other equipment you have, that could heat the water too. Powerheads, pumps, skimmers, all use the water to cool themselves, and the heat transfer can heat the water, especially in a nano. I'd drop the heater down, and see what happens.

    If there's a hood, try leaving it open to let heat out.

    EDIT: And don't feel bad, slow down, take a breath and be patient. Nanos are difficult, but you'll get there :D

    Also, check out https://www.fishlore.com/nanocubereefaquarium.htm It's an article the JBJ 28G Nano
     
  9. OP
    OP
    Reefdweller

    Reefdweller Valued Member Member

    Good article Ryan. Thanks for sharing. :;toast
     
  10. RogueAgent94

    RogueAgent94 Fishlore VIP Member

    Any updates on the tank?
    Pictures are always good :whistling:
     




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