Goldfish Interacting with White Mountain Minnows

  1. LWormy Member Member

    Hello! One of my goldfish recently died of mysterious cause in a 32 gallon tank populated by 2 (now 1) goldfish and some snails. The goldfish left is a fantail goldfish and he is now about 2" without tail (3" with tail). After his tankmate died, he had look very sad and only move when I am around the tank. I am thinking about adding a school of 7 white mountain minnows into the tank because I read that they are compatible. I am not so concerned about the goldfish eating them because 1) they are fast and 2) my goldfish is a pretty peaceful one, never eating anything other than his veggies, bloodworms, and pellets. I am however concerned about the white mountain minnows nipping the fantail's fin, since someone on another forum stated that his white mountain minnows attacked his black moors' delicate eyes. Do anyone have similar experiences like that? Will my tank be overstocked with 1 adult fantail and 7 adult white mountain minnows? I like the think ahead :lol There are probably plenty of flaws in my idea but please correct me.
     
  2. LWormy Member Member

    Also, will the goldfish interact with white mountain minnows or no? Will they keep him from boredom?
     

  3. poeticinjustices Well Known Member Member

    I'm fairly certain the reason minnows are considered compatible is because of their water parameter requirements.

    I have never tried it before, but I don't think I would. I'm not sure about the stocking needs of minnows but 7 minnows and a goldie in a 32g sounds a bit tight to me. A lone, slow, clumsy goldfish amongst a good sized school of minnows sounds, to me at least, like it has potential to go wrong. As you mentioned, aggression and fin nipping. There's also the fact that 7 little fish zipping all around the goldfish might now really be fun for the goldfish. And, of course, competition for food. Maybe if you had them with the faster, long-bodied goldies it would be different, or even if you had enough room to accomodate one other goldie as well. I don't think I'd do it otherwise.

    I'm a big believer that goldfish are happiest only with other goldfish MOST of the time. I believe there can be exceptions but, given the choice, I'd add another goldie before I added minnows. If you do decide to try it, observe carefully for any of the above and general unhappiness in your goldfish and make sure the goldie gets to eat. I would also have another home for the minnows at the ready in case it didn't work out.

    I hope someone who has actually done this can provide more relevant information but, if it were me, I'd just get another goldfish for him once the tank is 100% cleared of infection.
     
  4. LWormy Member Member

    I like the idea of adding a school of fish along with a centerpiece fish which will be the goldfish. I heard that white mountain minnow have a small bioload, so i will have a cleaner tank as well. Of course, I will do whatever is better for the goldfish. I just want to know if the goldfish will have a positive interaction with the minnows and "play" with them.

    p.s I know that a common with NOT work because they will definitely eat the minnows or out compete them for food. I saw a lot of people putting fancies with minnow because they will be fast enough to get some food but not all food. If the minnows are too fast I can always handfeed my goldfish. My fish and I both have lots of experience regarding that. Think about it, he was housed with a common twice his size ever since he was 2 month old.
     

  5. poeticinjustices Well Known Member Member

    Okay so food competition is easy enough to solve.

    But if I'm a slow, fancy goldfish that is normally very social and loves to play with other goldfish, I feel like a bunch of little minnows zipping around me would be annoying at the very least if not stressful.

    It's like sticking one adult in a room full terrible two year olds. Maybe interesting for a minute, but would grow old fast.

    Can't really keep up with them and they are schooling fish - they move as a single unit more than as individuals and goldfish are very unique and individual.

    There IS still the potential for fin nipping and aggression. If you try this, I would definitely make sure that you have a backup plan. I still think you'd see more personality and general happiness if your goldfish had another buddy.

    If you could fit two fancies and a school of minnows in a tank, I think it'd be a lot better than one fancy and a school of minnows. But no way a 32g will accommodate that. I don't know. I just really believe that goldfish belong with other goldfish above all else.

    Maybe Rivieraneo and HappyKnitter can weigh in, veteran goldie keepers.
     
  6. HappyKnitter Member Member

    Personally I would not put white clouds in with goldfish .They will get eaten.or worse for goldfish get stuck in the mouth. I would go with some dojo loaches, start with loaches a little bigger than the goldfishes mouth.
     
  7. LWormy Member Member

    I don't think that a 32 gallon is big enough for a fancy and a dojo loach. What do you think?
     

  8. HappyKnitter Member Member

    I come from the old school of fish keeping . I do the 10 gallon a fish rule. I have been doing it for years. But you got to understand that you might have to do an extra wc a week . If you have 32 gallons two goldfish would be fine. I myself would even have 3 goldfish but I know I have to make sure the tank is being cleaned regularly. It also depends on what kind of goldfish you have.
     
  9. LWormy Member Member

    I have a fantail goldfish, but I read that dojo loach go up to 1 feet and prefer to live in groups. I want whatever animal I have to live in the best condition that is possible so I will rather have him/her thrive in other people's tank then "survive" in mine. What kind of goldfish work best with a 2 inch (without tail) fantail goldfish? Will a ranchu or lionhead work?
     
  10. poeticinjustices Well Known Member Member

    Ranchu or lionhead should be fine.

    When mixing goldfish types, this is how I like to do it.

    Fancies are not to be mixed with commons/comets/shubunkins, this is generally accepted fact.

    Of the fancies, you have two types, the fat-bodied ones with wens and such - fantails, orandas, lionheads, ranchus, etc. Then you have the visually-impaired - celestials, bubble eye, moors, telescopes, etc. I don't mix the fat bodies with the visually impaired. I just forsee too many issues with food competition and potential for injury.

    Now, fantails are perhaps the least fancy of the fancies. They're pretty strong swimmers for a fancy. Ranchus and lionheads generally are not, they lack the dorsal fin and are rounder than fantails. So you might have to make sure everyone is getting fed properly but, beyond that, I'd say you're okay adding one of those guys in there. I have a fantail, oranda, ranchu and lionhead together in one tank and have had no problems. Granted, they are all itty bitty, I mean they are REALLY small (2" or less with fins and still not very filled out in body mass) right now but I haven't seen any problems.
     

  11. LWormy Member Member

    I really want a ranchu, but I am concerned about my filter being too strong. I have a Marineland Penguin 350 and will upgrade to a sump with 420 gph. Will that bother a ranchu too much?
     
  12. poeticinjustices Well Known Member Member

    The 420gph might be especially while they are young and small. You'd have to do some serious baffling I'd think. I have the same 350gph on my 29g with a ranchu and a lionhead and they do okay with the current from that, despite still being small,
     
  13. LWormy Member Member

    I am not going to have the sump for a while because I am building it. Will an oranda or ryukin work with a fantail though? They seems like fairly good swimmers and can stand up to my fantail. :)
     
  14. poeticinjustices Well Known Member Member

    Sure. Ryukins I think are among the hardiest of the fancy goldfish, can't recall where I read that though. It was a long time ago.

    Honestly, your ranchu would be fine, just make sure the current isn't too strong. My hobby-grade ranchus are actually surprisingly competent swimmers.
     
  15. LWormy Member Member

    OK, thanks! I think I will get another goldfish then! I'll do whatever's best for my fantail. :)
     
  16. poeticinjustices Well Known Member Member

    Good of you :)

    I think you'll get a lot more enjoyment out of your goldie with another fancy buddy rather than the minnows.

    Looking forward to meeting the new guy :)

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Fish Lore Aquarium Fish Forum mobile app
     
  17. Dark Sky Member Member

    Just thought I'd pop a quick comment in here, I've currently got White Clouds and Goldfish living together, and they seem quite happy. These Clouds were introduced when the Goldies were still too small to be able to eat them, so they've grown up peacefully together.
    The White Clouds don't really zipp about as much as something like Danios, they just kind of hang out, do a little patrol, then back to hanging out. I haven't seen any antisocial behaviours between the community, not good competition, everyone seems to get enough and be happy.

    Anyway, sounds like you've decided on another Goldfish, but I just wanted to chime in and say that, yes, for me at least, that pairing has worked well so far.
     
  18. LWormy Member Member

    Really? That sounds awesome! How many goldfish and minnows do you have together? My goldfish is not big enough to eat the minnows yet, so that might work too. What kind of goldfish do you have?
     
  19. Dark Sky Member Member

    There are five White Clouds, a Fantail and a Comet. When the goldfish grow a bit more it'll be over stocked, but by that time I'll be moving house and able to set up a larger tank. The Comet (Slim) actually doesn't act much like a comet, he's always been content bumbling alongside the Fantail (Tubs), and is always the first to hide, and the last to investigate good etc, when you'd usually imagine it to be the other way around.
     
  20. LWormy Member Member

    Will you recommend me getting a ryukin for my tank or 7 white mountain minnow? I just figured out that ryukins are aggresive and I am scared that he/she will kill my fantail. :( poeticinjustices! Do you think my fantail is in danger?