Goldfish and Tropical Fish???

matthew2926

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I have gotten conflicting answers from my research. Can goldfish be kept with tropical fish? I am looking to add on goldfish of some sort (fancy, black moor, comet, etc.) to my tropical tank. I know that goldfish are cold water fish but everything that I have read says that they can live in waters up to 78 degrees. My tank is currently at 76. Can I add a goldfish?
 

Sayba

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I would say yes, as long as you have room. my grandad had a pond with koi and goldfish, in the summer it used to get really hot and the fish looked happier if anything.

Just remember fancies are slow swimmers and struggle to compete for food when living with faster fish.
 
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matthew2926

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I would say yes, as long as you have room. my grandad had a pond with koi and goldfish, in the summer it used to get really hot and the fish looked happier if anything.

Just remember fancies are slow swimmers and struggle to compete for food when living with faster fish.

What temperature is optimal? Keep in mind it would need to suit both tropical and goldfish. Also, would I need to feed the goldfish separate food?
 

Kiara1125

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I would also wholeheartedly agree. I keep my goldfish with a wide variety of tropicals. My goldfish are happier when in with other fish, along with being in warmer water. A lot of people, including me, can't provide cold water for their goldfish. So, I put my goldfish in my boyfriend's 55 gallon with his tropicals. They're very happy! Numerous catfish, tetras, danios, minnows, and livebearers are with the goldfish. There have never been any problems and I would definitely recommend putting goldfish with other species as long as they don't harm the goldfish. Also, like I said, I can't lower the temperature of my water. It's 82F constantly (tank is in Florida) and my goldfish love it. Think about ponds. They can get up to 90F and the goldfish/koi are always fine. They adapt, just like all animals do.
 
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matthew2926

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I would also wholeheartedly agree. I keep my goldfish with a wide variety of tropicals. My goldfish are happier when in with other fish, along with being in warmer water. A lot of people, including me, can't provide cold water for their goldfish. So, I put my goldfish in my boyfriend's 55 gallon with his tropicals. They're very happy! Numerous catfish, tetras, danios, minnows, and livebearers are with the goldfish. There have never been any problems and I would definitely recommend putting goldfish with other species as long as they don't harm the goldfish. Also, like I said, I can't lower the temperature of my water. It's 82F constantly (tank is in Florida) and my goldfish love it. Think about ponds. They can get up to 90F and the goldfish/koi are always fine. They adapt, just like all animals do.

I'm at 78 right now. Would that work? I can drop it 2 degrees or so if needed...
 

Kiara1125

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That's fine. As long as the goldfish and everyone else seem happy.
 
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matthew2926

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That's fine. As long as the goldfish and everyone else seem happy.

Is there any sort of goldfish that looks like a comet but doesn't get huge?
 

Sayba

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I don't think so. I think the smallest goldfish is the pearl scale... I think. None of the slI'm bodied goldfish are small, the slI'm ones should be pond only I think. I've been looking at goldfish myself, there are some really cute fancy goldfish out there.
 
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matthew2926

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I'm thinking about going with a Black Moor or Fantail myself. Do you think that adding a one will result in my tank being overstocked? I know that I have a pleco but I plan on rehoming him (the pleco) before he gets too big for my tank. Obviously I will not be keeping him if he is longer than 8" or so. Right now he is like 4" or 5".
 

Kiara1125

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Is there any sort of goldfish that looks like a comet but doesn't get huge?

Shubunkins. They get about 6-8" and are gorgeous.

Also, you can rehome your pleco and it won't be overstocked.
 

Kiara1125

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I think the smallest goldfish is the pearl scale... I think. None of the slI'm bodied goldfish are small, the slI'm ones should be pond only I think. I've been looking at goldfish myself, there are some really cute fancy goldfish out there.

All fancies get about the same size 6-8". The smallest single tail goldfish is a shubunkin.
 
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matthew2926

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Shubunkins. They get about 6-8" and are gorgeous.

Also, you can rehome your pleco and it won't be overstocked.

I think I'm gonna go with a Black Moor. Anyhow, if I get one, will my tank be overstocked? I don't want to get rid of my pleco right now because it hasn't outgrown my tank. Does goldfish+pleco=overstocked? Thanks in advance!
 

Kiara1125

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No, I have plecos and goldfish together. You can keep him for now. Plus, black moors and other fancy goldfish can take quite a while to grow. Depends on the water quality.
 
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matthew2926

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No, I have plecos and goldfish together. You can keep him for now. Plus, black moors and other fancy goldfish can take quite a while to grow. Depends on the water quality.

I'm sorry, I also meant along with my other fish. In my 29 gallon I have 6 black phantom tetras, 6 neons, 6 red minor tetras, 2 platys, 1 dwarf gourami, and the pleco. I am looking to add one black moor. The pleco will be rehomed when necessary. Will I be overstocked by adding one black moor?
 

Kiara1125

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I'm sorry, I also meant along with my other fish. In my 29 gallon I have 6 black phantom tetras, 6 neons, 6 red minor tetras, 2 platys, 1 dwarf gourami, and the pleco. I am looking to add one black moor. The pleco will be rehomed when necessary. Will I be overstocked by adding one black moor?

Of course! I have my goldfish with black phantoms, neons, von rios, and platies. I've had them with dwarf gouramis without any ill effects. I had (babies) 4 fancy goldfish (black moor, fantail, lionhead, and ryukin) in a 20gL with 3 black phantoms, 10 platies, danios, white clouds, neons, a dwarf gourami, and 8 female bettas. I'm not saying that it was a permanent stocking, but I'm just saying that, as long as you have an adequate filter, you can keep a black moor in with the pleco (rehoming) and the tetras, gourami, and platies. Adequate filtration should be something for a 40-50g tank. If you don't have this, you can add a lot of live plants to help absorb nitrates. Water sprite, hornwort, and ludwigia should grow fast. You can add the live plants in with the goldfish, my goldfish never ate live plants, just decaying leaves.

I added thestocking list to help. They only had 29gH, so that's what I put in. I also left out the pleco, but put in a black moor (baby) and had the filter as an Aqueon QuietFlow 55.

You don't have to listen to the temperature or the pH. As long as the fish are adapted to the pH in your area, everything will be fine. Trying to change it will cause more harm than good. I would apply the same advice with the hardness.
 

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matthew2926

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Of course! I have my goldfish with black phantoms, neons, von rios, and platies. I've had them with dwarf gouramis without any ill effects. I had (babies) 4 fancy goldfish (black moor, fantail, lionhead, and ryukin) in a 20gL with 3 black phantoms, 10 platies, danios, white clouds, neons, a dwarf gourami, and 8 female bettas. I'm not saying that it was a permanent stocking, but I'm just saying that, as long as you have an adequate filter, you can keep a black moor in with the pleco (rehoming) and the tetras, gourami, and platies. Adequate filtration should be something for a 40-50g tank. If you don't have this, you can add a lot of live plants to help absorb nitrates. Water sprite, hornwort, and ludwigia should grow fast. You can add the live plants in with the goldfish, my goldfish never ate live plants, just decaying leaves.

I added thestocking list to help. They only had 29gH, so that's what I put in. I also left out the pleco, but put in a black moor (baby) and had the filter as an Aqueon QuietFlow 55.

You don't have to listen to the temperature or the pH. As long as the fish are adapted to the pH in your area, everything will be fine. Trying to change it will cause more harm than good. I would apply the same advice with the hardness.

Thank you so much!! This is exactly what I was looking for. I will be buying a Black Moor then! Also, just for the record, my filter is a Marineland Penguin 200. I think it is rated for up to 50 gallons, so I should be good. As for the food, will the Moor eat he teopical food that I feed my other fish or will I need to buy separate goldfish food?
 

Kiara1125

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Thank you so much!! This is exactly what I was looking for. I will be buying a Black Moor then! Also, just for the record, my filter is a Marineland Penguin 200. I think it is rated for up to 50 gallons, so I should be good. As for the food, will the Moor eat he teopical food that I feed my other fish or will I need to buy separate goldfish food?

You're welcome! And that's perfect! The goldfish will eat tropical food and vice versa. My goldfish actually love tropical flakes and my tropicals love goldfish pellets. xD Good luck with your future black moor!
 
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matthew2926

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You're welcome! And that's perfect! The goldfish will eat tropical food and vice versa. My goldfish actually love tropical flakes and my tropicals love goldfish pellets. xD Good luck with your future black moor!

Thanks!
 

shelleyd2008

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Contrary to what others are saying, all goldfish get huge. Comets, commons, and shubunkins get at least 12" long. "Fancy" goldfish get a about as big as a softball with a tail and head (roughly 9" or more). I agree that a goldfish would be okay in a tank in the mid- to upper-70's but it would need to be a pretty big tank. Also, most tropical fish are pretty small and a big goldfish might eat them, so you should also consider that. Maybe get an 'orange' tropical fish like a pineapple swordtail instead of a goldfish.
 

Kiara1125

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Swordtails are mean. Also, they want a *black* moor, not a *gold*fish. Also, goldfish are herbivorous. They have NEVER eaten any of my fish (even livebearer fry). Why do you think people put danios into ponds as dither fish? They don't get eaten. Plus, for the size issue, I've never seen a goldfish get THAT big, but my friend has a goldfish who is 7" and is in a 55g. That goldfish is 13 years old. I'm pretty sure she's not going to get any bigger. Plus, it took her years to grow that big.

You *could* upgrade if you wanted, but it's not a necessity. Besides, the rule is one goldfish per 20 gallon and then add 10 gallon more per goldfish. Now people are saying 30 gallon per goldfish, but you have a 29 gallon so that works out well. The tank isn't overstocked size wise (fish not being able to move around) and the filter is rated for a 50g, so that's not considered overstocked filtration wise. I honestly think that you'll be fine with a black moor in your tank.
 

shelleyd2008

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Swordtails are not mean And I missed the part about a black moor.

Goldfish are omnivorous, not herbivorous, and will eat anything that will fit in their mouths. As for their size, just because you haven't seen them that big does not mean they won't get that big. I have seen softball-sized fancy goldfish and seen 2' (yes that is feet) long common goldfish.

The *rule* about tank size isn't "20 (30) gallons for 1, 10 gallon more for each additional goldfish" along with other tropical fish, it is 20/30 gallons for one plus 10 gallon each additional. So for a 50 gallon tank you could keep 3 goldfish in it. That being said, you have to take into consideration the dimensions of the tank compared to the adult size of the fish. A tank that is only 12" wide (like a 29g) would not be very comfortable for a fish that is 12" long.
 

Kiara1125

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I believe that the OP will be smart enough to upgrade if the fish needs it. Also, all my swordtails are mean. xD

I'm sticking to the fact that goldfish don't eat other fish unless if they're dead. They'd much rather graze on live plants. Goldfish still take years to grow, so a 29 gallon is good for now. And, that still is the rule according to the goldfish experts on Kokos. I believe that it's fine to get a 2" black moor and have it into a 29 gallon for a few years and then upgrade it if the fish needs it.

Basically, it comes down to this being to OPs tank. If they want a black moor, then they can completely disregard what other people say and get one. I'm just saying that I have experience with goldfish and tropicals together and I believe they'll be fine together. Once again, if the fish becomes big and the OP needs to upgrade, then they'll either remove fish (I still believe one fancy goldfish into a 29 gallon is perfectly fine without anything else in there), upgrade the fish, or rehome it. It's their choice.

Also, as for the size, I have 5 goldfish into a 55g. They're not full grown, but it's going to take them years to get to that size. Yet, because of their future size and not their current size the tank is overstocked. I don't think that's right. I'd rather view the situation on how big the fish is now and work with that. Yes, keep in mind that they can get big, but it will take years for that to happen.

Why are you mentioning the commons? I know how big they get. The OP is asking about a black moor. The maximum size for a black moor is 8", although mine is only 5" and several years old. Commons are completely different. Plus, keep in mind that fancy goldfish are technically deformed goldfish. They're man-made and won't always reach their potential size. Goldfish will get round, yes, but more so round than long.

One more thing, have you ever seen a goldfish eat another fish? I've always seen them coexist perfectly with small schooling fish. Goldfish aren't predators and act more like grazing gazelle rather than lions or buzzards.
 

shelleyd2008

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Goldfish do not take years to grow, they grow very fast in the first couple years and extremely fast in the first few months. They grow about 1" a month until about 6-8 months old. A 6" goldfish at a year old is about right. I currently have 1 common goldfish that we've had since last July and she is about 7" long. She was not quite 2" when we got her.

One fancy goldfish would probably be okay in a 29 gallon tank for a while if it were by itself. The main reason for the huge water volume necessary for them is the fact that they are heavy waste producers. They will mess up a small tank very quickly and the larger tank allows for more water volume to dilute things.

A friend of mine used to have 7 fancy goldfish in a 75 gallon tank and had to do 50% water changes twice a week just to keep the ammonia levels under control. I don't think I would put goldfish with tropical fish in a tank so small.
 

Claire Bear

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I love Goldfish Matthew2926 and welcome! I think that you will be most happy with keeping the tropicals in your 29 gallon and perhaps getting a second tank - about that size for your two black moors! They are very nice fish and very friendly. However, I worry about the amount of waste they produce and your need to constantly change out water to avoid ammonia burn.
It sounds like others believe that the moors would be okay with all those tropicals but I honestly think the tank would get pretty nasty, pretty quick. Of course, they would be small at first and probably not be an issue but they would get much larger fairly quick.
They are usually not aggressive and that would probably not be a problem but the fact that the water would be a constant battle-not sure that makes for fun fish keeping.
Of course, it is your tank and if you are willing to keep up with all the upkeep, well, it is your decision.
Good luck and hope this all works out!
 

Makena95'GT

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I've witnessed multiple goldfish eat other fish. So that theory on them being strictly herbivores is false.

For example at work our figgest Oranda ate a Pleco and we ended up having to do fishy surgery to get it out of his mouth. I also can't but any of the larger (5" or more) goldfish with smaller fisb.. As they eat them. I tried housing some guppies with my goldies once temporarily till I could take them to the school. I watched the goldies eat mah babies!

Orandas maximum size is 10" and every one we get shipped to work (the "large") are minimum 6-7" already, and only take a few months to get bigger

Also.. OPs original post asks about ANY goldies.. Not just Black Moors.. So again the argument that all other goldfish are irrelevant is once again invalid. :3
 

notsocool

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Ive seen goldfish eat ghost shrimp b3fore chase it around until the poor thing died but it was karma since it was eating my bettas fins. Ive kept goldfish with tropical community fish with no problem at a temperature of 76°F. I started with a $.50 comet feeder and after 6 months they were barely 2" long. I lost them after resealing a leaking 30 gallon hex tank with ge 2 silicone instead of ge1. Before that they were in a 20galL. As long as you have proper filtration and water changes you can keep goldfish in 20 gallons per adult fish and 10 gallons per each additional. Definitely agree that you can start with a smaller tank but have or try to get appropriate tanks as they grow .
 

lala29

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Swordtails are mean. Also, they want a *black* moor, not a *gold*fish. Also, goldfish are herbivorous. They have NEVER eaten any of my fish (even livebearer fry). Why do you think people put danios into ponds as dither fish? They don't get eaten.



sorry, going to have to disagree with that statement. My goldfish didn't have a problem gobbling up my danios... Or a few guppy fry I gave them as a treat!
 

Beeker

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Goldfish eat anything and everything they can.
I make homemade food for my goldies and they are definitely omnivores. They have to have their fish. I have also been breeding my goldies for 15 years, and they do eat each other. I've seen a goldie quickly grab the head of it's sibling and snap it right off in the blink of an eye. If it fits in a goldies mouth, it is food. They also eat snails, shell and all. Also, goldies and tropicals cannot live on the same food. Tropicals tend to have a higher protein rda than goldies. Goldies are more balanced veggie to fish. To feed them all the same food will cause one or the other to be malnourished in one way or the other. I do not feed my tropical tank the goldfish food, nor vice versa.

Goldfish are coldwater fish. They will tolerate the temperature they are stuck with, but mid to upper 70's will make them uncomfortable, even sick. I have had experience with this too. Just because they are more active does not mean that they are happier. It could mean that they are uncomfortable.

They also are schooling fish. One goldfish, without a tankmate of its own kind will be miserable. They do get depressed and, believe it or not, fish can die of depression. If you have one, you need to get at least 2 more.

Goldies grow fast. I brought 6 Comets (feeders) home in a jelly jar. They were all smaller than my pinky finger. I placed them in a 10 gallon tank for a couple of months until I could get my 75 gallon tank set up and cycled. Unfortunately, I lost one, almost two of them, before the 75 was ready. They quickly outgrew the 10 gallon tank before the 75 was finished cycling.
They all reached about a foot in size, some larger. Yes, they do grow to be very large. That whole "growing to fit the size of the tank" is the worst lie and most cruel form of death for a fish. If they are stunted in their outward growth, their internal organs continue to grow until the fish becomes smothered by it's own internal organs and dies.
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If you want goldies and tropicals, get a cold water tank and a tropical tank, but don't try to mix incompatible fish.
 

Timthegoldfish

New Member
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Most tropical fish range with a temperature of 20-27 degrees Celsius.A black moor might survive the 22 degrees mark.You have to be careful of what tropical fish you are getting as these fish might bully others.
 

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