Goldfish and Shrimp Conumdrum

Background: I've done plenty of tanks in the past, mostly simple river-like set ups before.

Now: I came to visit my parents and siblings before I ship for basic training and my little sister had won a goldfish. She has him in a large 2.5 gallon fish bowl with two stalks of bamboo and that was about it. So today we went out and got gravel, river stones and two plants. She chose Amazon swords (I told her they would get too big but she plans to move it to a larger 10 gallon soon.) and a water fern. We rearranged the bowl and headed back out to let the temperature adjust to the room. (We have a home water filter system that removed all impurities and chlorine and such) We picked up four ghost shrimp, one had eggs in its abdomin and we were excited to have baby shrimp. We also got a snail. I did a bunch of research and followed all directions toward the shrimp and after suspending the bag for a few hours and checking temps (around 70 degrees) I released them into the bowl. I've checked over and over and they've happily been swimming around and scuttling over the rocks and doing regular shrimp-y things. A few hours went by again and we followed the same procedure with the fish. We kept checking and the fish had no interest in the shrimp. Several hours and all was well still. I just went upstairs around midnight and all the shrimp were dead. One was still kicking it's legs and I didn't know what to do. Checked again and the last one died. I'm crushed. We can't figure out what we did wrong. My sister doesn't know yet because she's asleep but she will be super upset. I don't want to replace them for fear of more dying. Does anyone know what went wrong or how to fix it? What should I do next time?

 

Do you have a filter?

2.5 gallons is ridiculously small for a goldfish and you need to rehome him ASAP. Take him to your LST. He will not last long in that bowl.

Also no, 10 gallons is also too small for a goldfish. They produce a LOT of waste and ammonia will build up to critical levels very quickly unless you're doing 50% to 75% water changes three times a week WITHOUT fail and also have a good filter.

Another issue is that goldfish can grow over a foot long and keeping them in tanks causes stunted growth which is agony for the fish as they're internal organs keep growing but their bodies do not causing death. They can live 25-30 years in an outdoor pond but can barely make it to three in a tank.

The death of the shrimp is likely due to the bad quality of the water, I'm guessing you have no test kit? Shrimp are sensitive to water quality and the fact they all died so soon is very worrying to me. Plus you added a snail which have a heavy bioload to a tiny tank already with a fish who has a huge bioload and you've not mentioned a filter which means you have no BB (beneficial bacteria) to break down these toxins.

Please return the fish and snail, read up on the nitrogen cycle of a tank and do your research before this fish is belly up.

P.S you also did not acclimatise that shrimp correctly. Floating the bag only brings the water in the bag to the same temperature as water in the tank or in your case bowl, you need to acclimatise the shrimp to the different PH in your water to the water they're living in which can take several hours using the drip method. Please read up on this. This forum will provide you with all the infor you need.

Also, shrimp won't last long with a goldfish they will get eaten.

 

Goldfish do not have a labyrinth organ, therefore they can not breath from the surface of the water and NEED water agitation (filter) to circulate oxygen in the water. Goldfish are also a species of carp and get to one foot long. One goldfish needs about 50+ gal just for ONE. They are incredibly dirty and would probably need daily 50% water changes to keep toxins down if keeping in a small container, but again you should never keep them in a small container to begin with. I imagine the shrimp died from ammonia build up in the water or the cold temperature. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but most shrimp are tropical, needing 78-82 degrees, correct?

I work at a pet store and whenever people came in with their fair goldfish, I would let them know how difficult goldfish are to maintain and how cruel it is to keep them in little bowls, since they can't breath or grow, and encourage them to relinquish the fish (ALL Petco's take abandoned animals, just make sure it's one that sells fish so they have a setup to put him in, so any Petco should take your goldfish and put him up for adoption) and then get them setup with something that was suitable for a smaller tank. I don't reccomend keeping anything in a tank smaller than 5g, and something like 3 guppies are good for that size tank. Pet stores sell plenty of 5 gal kits that have everything in the them, like a lid, led lights, and filter. And children often love guppies because they are cute, small, and pretty! Plus they get more than one. And you can tell the child that the goldfish needs a big home in a pond where he grow huge and be with friends! That usually gets them excited about the guppies, just transfer their attention to something else. Relinquish the goldfish and in exchange they get 3 guppies in a filtered tank that they only have to change the water in about once a month. Nothing should really be kept in just a bowl, it's a very old-school line of thinking. Everything should have a filter to let beneficial bacteria buildup so the water quality stays much better for the fish. You could do one Betta in 5 gallon if she likes those instead. You will also need a heater for the tank though, as most fish in fish stores are tropical.

 

I agree, this post is very cringey. Goldfish do not have a labyrinth organ, therefore they can not breath from the surface of the water and NEED water agitation (filter) to circulate oxygen in the water. Goldfish are also a species of carp and get to one foot long. One goldfish needs about 50+ gal just for ONE. They are incredibly dirty and would probably need daily 50% water changes to keep toxins down if keeping in a small container, but again you should never keep them in a small container to begin with. I imagine the shrimp died from ammonia build up in the water or the cold temperature. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but most shrimp are tropical, needing 78-82 degrees, correct?

I work at a pet store and whenever people came in with their fair goldfish, I would let them know how difficult goldfish are to maintain and how cruel it is to keep them in little bowls, since they can't breath or grow, and encourage them to relinquish the fish (ALL Petco's take abandoned animals, just make sure it's one that sells fish so they have a setup to put him in, so any Petco should take your goldfish and put him up for adoption) and then get them setup with something that was suitable for a smaller tank. I don't reccomend keeping anything in a tank smaller than 5g, and something like 3 guppies are good for that size tank. Pet stores sell plenty of 5 gal kits that have everything in the them, like a lid, led lights, and filter. And children often love guppies because they are cute, small, and pretty! Plus they get more than one. And you can tell the child that the goldfish needs a big home in a pond where he grow huge and be with friends! That usually gets them excited about the guppies, just transfer their attention to something else. Relinquish the goldfish and in exchange they get 3 guppies in a filtered tank that they only have to change the water in about once a month. Nothing should really be kept in just a bowl, it's a very old-school line of thinking. Everything should have a filter to let beneficial bacteria buildup so the water quality stays much better for the fish. You could do one Betta in 5 gallon if she likes those instead. You will also need a heater for the tank though, as most fish in fish stores are tropical.

I agree with mostly everything you said apart from a few things you didn't point out:

First, ALL fish need a filter even a Betta, unless I read it wrong it seemed you're suggesting Bettas don't? Which of course they do.

Second, not all shrimp are tropical, Aminos for example can thrive in colder water.

Third, guppies also need a heater.

But yes, OP swapping the goldfish for guppies is something could do. But you'll need a heater for them as they need warm water of about 25c (someone correct me if its higher, I'm not a fan of guppies so don't know much about them) plus at least a 10 gallon tank.

Also OP I'm sorry if your sister will be upset but she'll just have to learn that you can't keep goldfish in a small tank.

 

While I greatly apprciate the advice is like to point a few things out, this is a fish owned by a nine year old and we have tested the water. The water is extremely fish friendly and safe. I've done a lot of research and while most people dislike the bowl or 10 gallon tank it is doable. I've seen people who have had a single goldfish in a 5 gallon setup that lived for 15 years and didn't have a filter. Also, it's not my fish nor is it my setup. I don't have the money to invest in a larger tank, nor the equipment. I'm also only here for a week. Like I said, I'm about to ship for Army basic training. This fish isn't my first priority. It's kinda just a thing I'm helping my little sister with. Sorry if I'm not able to do a professional tank setup.

 

Rehome the goldfish or give it back to the pet store. Goldfish need at least a 35 gal, with double filtration. But if you get a filtered heated 10 gal, you get 100-200 red cherry shrimp! Which is probably funner than watching a goldfish suffer in its own waste -_- and that goldfish that lived 15 years in a 5 gallon? That poor thing probably experience stunting, and died slowly of its own waste... and was probably a smaller variety of goldfish anyway, but that doesn't mean it should have been kept in a 5 gallon! :'(

 

Rehome the goldfish or give it back to the pet store. Goldfish need at least a 35 gal, with double filtration. But if you get a filtered heated 10 gal, you get 100-200 red cherry shrimp! Which is probably funner than watching a goldfish suffer in its own waste -_- and that goldfish that lived 15 years in a 5 gallon? That poor thing probably experience stunting, and died slowly of its own waste... and was probably a smaller variety of goldfish anyway, but that doesn't mean it should have been kept in a 5 gallon! :'(

Thanks for the advice. My dad eventually wants to put a pond in the garden do the goldfish will be rehomed to that sometime in the next few month. The shrimp idea is a good one. I've also heard of people doing a planted bowl that they added ghost shrimp to. Do you know how that would work if at all? The goldfish will be getting a larger home, that's not an issue, were mostly interested in turning our planted bowl into a shrimp bowl. I've seen a lot of people do it online. Like I said earlier, I mostly do river fish setups or outdoor pond work. It's been a really long time since I've set up a tank though. 5 years or so. The only fish I've ever lost is a Oscar that died due to a power outage when we weren't home.

 

Oh I forgot, my sister has been doing 50% water changes daily for the fish.

 

If you have tested the water what are the values for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrite? Have you used a liquid test kit not strips? Also a home filter isn't enough you still need to use water conditioner. There's no such thing as a happy goldfish in anything less than 29 gals. 29 is still debatable and it depends on the type of goldfish. That fish may live a long time. It will be suffering 24/7 for its whole life and have painfully stunted growth. If it lives for 15 years it was a long cruel life. If you don't have the money take it back. If you care about saving a life take the fish back. Tell her whatever you have to. It's already in great pain. It would be more humane to euthanize it than to keep it there. You have asked for advice and it has been given.

 

I'm highly doubtful the water is good quality if all the shrimp died, mate.

You came here for advice whether the fish belongs to you or not you know about it so evidently it's your responsibility now you know the damage you're doing.

Take it to your LFS.

 

Goldfish can live for 30 years, and grow huge
They're a type of carp like kois (and you wouldn't keep a koi in a bowl would you?)

Your fish will be horribly stunted and suffer all kinds of things from ammonia burns to nitrate poisoning
If you don't care about the fish why would you keep it and then ask for advice?

People here know what they're talking about, and if you research you'd know that while a goldfish can LIVE in a bowl, it can not thrive, neither will it be happy
It is merely surviving

You could keep a dog in a 4x4 cage, a rabbit in a box
Sure it would live if you gave it food, but it would be unhappy and deprived

Fish need good homes

 

I think the op is gonna put the goldfish in a pond soon right?.. Read post #7

I think Amano shrimp can be kept in bowls without a heater?? But you would need a sponge filter. I don't know much about shrimp though...

 

I think the op is gonna put the goldfish in a pond soon right?.. Read post #7

I think Amano shrimp can be kept in bowls without a heater?? But you would need a sponge filter. I don't know much about shrimp though...

Oh God bless
Still I'm angry about it anyway and it's annoying because goldfish are some of the most mistreated fish ever
It breaks my heart honestly
Sorry OP

No aquatic life should be kept in a bowl imo
I'm no shrimp expert either tho

 

No he's saying that his dad wants to build a pond and that when he does that the fish can go in there. But he will not be building it for a few months. Which is way too long for that fish to be in that bowl

 

Well a goldfish probably won't survive even a FEW months in a bowl..... So you should return it to the fish store

 

Welcome to the forum OP!
Chill out guys, I've noticed people have stopped welcoming new members and an increased number of people being flat out rude on this forum. I joined because this was a nice community that was very forgiving, not to watch people be yelled at because of beginner mistakes that they didn't know they were making. Honesty, it's played a huge role in why I haven't been posting much.
While I agree with most of what's been said, there are a couple things I want to point out.
I would get a large storage tub(30+ gallons) to hold the goldfish until a proper sized pond is built(200+ gallons). Your sister will have to do 75% water changes every 2-3 days to keep ammonia at a healthy level, as well as provide a filter for beneficial bacteria to grow on. You can definitely use the bowl as a shrimp tank! A small sponge filter would be necessary though.
Did you add water when acclimating the shrimp? They could have been shocked by a PH change, they are very sensitive. Do you have copper in your water?

 

Oh ya, WELCOME TO FISHLORE!

Sometimes I don't know if someone is new or not....

 

I don't welcome anymore so don't take offence OP.

 

I never know if someones new, mainly 'cause I'm on my phone most of the time
Still, OP says they've kept tanks before, and it's a general rule not to keep fish in small tanks, do research etc

 

I'm on mobile as well, and if you tap their avatar and name it shows how many posts they have.
Just because they have had tanks before doesn't mean they were well educated in it. My friends think I'm crazy that I keep my bettas in "such big tanks", it's still common practice to keep goldfish and bettas in bowls.

 

I agree Flowingfins I've been noticing people being downright mean to new fish owners and I personally don't thinks it's an okay thing to do. Everyone has made mistakes in their lives, don't harass others because they made their mistake after you made yours.

 

I'm just wondering when you refer to "Goldfish" are you referring to all species. I know a lot of people that keep Orandas, Bubble-eyes, Ranchus, etc in tanks. Are you saying all of these should be in a pond?

 

No, I'm assuming that since OP says it's a carnival fish that it's a common, which I shouldn't be. Either way it cannot live in a bowl. The absolute minimum for fancies is a 40 breeder in my book, comets/commons needing a pond.

 

**This thread has been edited**
Please do not be rude to other members. People come asking for advice not to be berated.
If some one cannot be polite in their response please do not respond.

The forum would not be what is at is today if all new members were treated this way.
It goes against why FishLore was created in the first place.

JulesNavarro welcome to FishLore!
The large plastic toke is a great idea until the pond gets built.
In the mean time have your sister keep doing the water changes.
I'm sorry I don't have an answer about the shrimp.

Good luck at boot camp.

 

I agree Flowingfins I've been noticing people being downright mean to new fish owners and I personally don't thinks it's an okay thing to do. Everyone has made mistakes in their lives, don't harass others because they made their mistake after you made yours.

Agreed. I am new here and am not liking how vicious or condescending it often is. People make mistakes. Help them.

 

Thanks Lucy!

 

Shrimp are sensitive, specially to dissolved metals like copper, so the tank would need to be cycled before acclimating shrimp and putting them in, sponge filter will prevent shrimplet fatalities.
I would suggest a plastic storage run with a filter for the goldfish until the pond is built, make sure pond is below freezeline or it could die. Build the pond a little bigger so you can give the goldie a couple buddies as they are social fish, but only after the pond is built. Water changes are needed ever couple days with goldies as they are heavy poopers. While most fish stores will say such and such fish can live in a bowl of small tank most will have issues with such a setup, I know the goldfish is a carnival fish so you didn't have anyone saying a bowl was okay for it. It needs a bigger evironment to thrive rather than just be alive. Try and advise to get the pond built sooner so your sister can have her goldie and a couple friends with it. Then focus on making a shrimp tank.

 

I feel the basics to take away from all this is nothing should be kept in a still water bowl. Everything will need either oxygen to put in the water from agitation, beneficial bacteria, or both. And almost everything needs more than 2.5 gallons. I don't reccomend keeping anything in a setup smaller than a 5 gal filtered and heated tank (heater is not necessary for some species of critters).

 

I feel the basics to take away from all this is nothing should be kept in a still water bowl. Everything will need either oxygen to put in the water from agitation, beneficial bacteria, or both. And almost everything needs more than 2.5 gallons. I don't reccomend keeping anything in a setup smaller than a 5 gal filtered and heated tank (heater is not necessary for some species of critters).

I would keep shrimp in a planted and filtered 2.5 gallon. But that's me I guess. And then only CRS or RCS. Five gallon gets interesting though. Check out sone of the newer nano tanks... have my eyes set on some Spec III and V.

One thing to remember is many things can survive in a still bowl. Very few things thrive. My opinion of a still bowl is grow moss or some plants... And nothing else. One reason I ended up with my wifes Comets in my community tank (until a better home is found but can last a few years if needed).

 

Ya, you should get a storage bin and a filter if possible.